Another hole in Alex's argument........if you can call it that

[weezer 316]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...al-expert.html

Makes many of the points I aint eloquent enough to make!

[Kells]

" Prof Bogdanor, whose most famous former student is David Cameron" That says it all for me. lol

[Walter Ego]

" Prof Bogdanor, whose most famous former student is David Cameron" That says it all for me. lol

If that 'says it all' to you, then that's one hell of a set of blinkers you've got strapped to your head.

I'd be more interested in how much experience the man has in these matters.

[weezer 316]

" Prof Bogdanor, whose most famous former student is David Cameron" That says it all for me. lol

Probably does sau it all for you, and thats the issue with scotland! This man worked on the split of Czechoslovakia, Montenegro and Kosovo. I seriously doubt there is a more qualified person alive to pass judgement on scottish independence.......

But why let the truth get in the way of perfectly good narrow mindedness eh!

[NickInTheNorth]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...al-expert.html

Makes many of the points I aint eloquent enough to make!

Seems to me that he makes the same point several times, and not very eloquently at that.

The point would appear to be that he is a constitutional expert and unless he says that Scotland can have independence then it cannot.

Hang on a few hours, doubtless there will be another expert along to state precisely the opposite...

[Dusty]

The Prof. also appears to have some difficulty in differentiating between independence and separatism.
Also from the Telegraph:
"For all those who know Scotland and all those who think they know, please visit youtube and search for Precious Few Heroes .
A short ,well made film , interesting and educational.
Enjoy".

[Walter Ego]

Seems to me that he makes the same point several times, and not very eloquently at that.

The point would appear to be that he is a constitutional expert and unless he says that Scotland can have independence then it cannot.

Hang on a few hours, doubtless there will be another expert along to state precisely the opposite...

I'd say that the point is that Independence is not just a quick vote and a scribble on a bit of paper, like many appear to think. It's going to take a lot of careful work right from the outset and could easily get bogged down.

[John Little]

The Prof. also appears to have some difficulty in differentiating between independence and separatism.
Also from the Telegraph:
"For all those who know Scotland and all those who think they know, please visit youtube and search for Precious Few Heroes .
A short ,well made film , interesting and educational.
Enjoy".

I found that film useful to a point. I think that Scotland could make it alone and that if `Scots want it then they should.

But the film lost me in logic when they started talking about independence from Britain.

I do not follow that.

Can England be independent from Britain too?

Or the perception that somehow Scotland was a colony in the empire which she part owned and built up. Can Scotland be independent from something she herself is a part of? Can the head be independent from the body?

I'm getting the distinct impression that the rationale for independence is of the heart, for I have seen little of the head.

That in no way invalidates it but it means that I am never going to understand it.



and as an afterthought- would the dastardly English navy have blockaded the Darien coast if the Stuart woman had not ordered it for fear of competition with royal possessions in America? It might have been the damned English (undemocratic) parliament that forced the Act of Union, but the ruling dynasty was a Scottish house I think...

[oldmarine]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...al-expert.html

Makes many of the points I aint eloquent enough to make!

This is too political for an outsider like me to get involved.

[Kells]

If that 'says it all' to you, then that's one hell of a set of blinkers you've got strapped to your head.

I'd be more interested in how much experience the man has in these matters.

I do not wear blinkers on my head or in my mind and yes I am more interested in how much experience the man has in these matters rather than who his former student was. My point entirely.

[Kells]

Probably does sau it all for you, and thats the issue with scotland! This man worked on the split of Czechoslovakia, Montenegro and Kosovo. I seriously doubt there is a more qualified person alive to pass judgement on scottish independence.......

But why let the truth get in the way of perfectly good narrow mindedness eh!

He is but one expert with one opinion about what Scotland.s future should be. He was one of many experts on Contemporary Law who worked on the split of Czechoslovakia, Montenegro and Kosovo and certainly an outstanding man in his field but I believe that the only people who have the right to decide or sit on judgment of scottish independence are the people of Scotland.

[Walter Ego]

I do not wear blinkers on my head or in my mind and yes I am more interested in how much experience the man has in these matters rather than who his former student was. My point entirely.

Engage reverse...


...and pedal

[Walter Ego]

He is but one expert with one opinion about what Scotland.s future should be. He was one of many experts on Contemporary Law who worked on the split of Czechoslovakia, Montenegro and Kosovo and certainly an outstanding man in his field but I believe that the only people who have the right to decide or sit on judgment of scottish independence are the people of Scotland.

I don't beleive the gentleman was saying that he should decide the future of Scotland.

He was pointing out the difficulties likely to be encountered. As John Little rightly pointed out, there are many of our countrymen and women who are thinking with their heart
- but not much use of the head. As Al Murray would say "They haven't thought it through"

IF the vote goes for Independence - and I seriously doubt that it will - the route to Independence will be a long and potentially messy road. If every single issue isn't hammered out in fine detail then Scotland will never be taken seriously as an independent nation, we'll be a half-arsed hotchpotch Federal state.

And that fine detail isn't going to be easy to sort out.

[Corrie 3]

The answer is easy Walter....If you are happy being Governed by the likes of Blair, Brown, Cameron and Clegg then you just vote NO when the time comes !

I don't think anyone has claimed that its going to be easy to breakaway from the UK, there is a lot at stake and a lot to sort out but for those that want it this could be our only chance to rule ourselves and prove to the World that we can be a great little nation instead of a country that's just stuck onto the top of England on a map!!!

C3.....

[John Little]

"If you are happy being Governed by the likes of Blair, Brown, Cameron and Clegg..."

I must point out though C3 that two of those are Scots and one is of Scottish descent...

[Corrie 3]

"If you are happy being Governed by the likes of Blair, Brown, Cameron and Clegg..."

I must point out though C3 that two of those are Scots and one is of Scottish descent...

I am fully aware of that fact John, and not one of them did a lot for Scotland in their time.
Time to give the alternatives a go, a party with fire in it's belly!!

C3.....

[John Little]

So all those Scots like Broon and Blair, instead of cutting a figure on the Westminster stage, will now give their energies to Scottish politics.

Fair enough...

[Kells]

Rubbish......... I am able to spot a badly written article and name dropping at the start of one is a clear sign of trying to gain credability, but obviously you are unaware of that.

[pmcd]

It's "Auld Cynic" time....

1. Interesting that currently more English want Scotland to be independent than Scots do. Wonder why?

2. Alex will burn the midnight oil bigging up the Independence issue only to try to squeeze the max. out of the UK (Union) government. That's why he wants the referendum later, rather than sooner.

3. David C only has to sit tight whilst the promises of Council tax freezes, no Uni fees, no care costs, all mount up to become an embarrassingly large bill which he will then wave in the faces of the Scottish people saying "this is how much its cost us - and if you want independence, then this much is going on the bill!" .

The non-cynical part of me hopes that the combination of off-shore, renewables, proper banking, and self-confidence makes Scotland proudly ready to manage our own destiny.

[bekisman]

"If you are happy being Governed by the likes of Blair, Brown, Cameron and Clegg..."

I must point out though C3 that two of those are Scots and one is of Scottish descent...

Ah The West Lothian question
Tam Dalyell: "For how long will English constituencies and English Honourable members tolerate ... at least 119 Honourable Members from Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland exercising an important, and probably often decisive, effect on English politics while they themselves have no say in the same matters in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland?"

Things may change