The Parliament Building

[JAWS]

Take a look at this site and see what you think now it's nearly finished
http://www.scottish.parliament.uk/holyrood/index_6.htm

It's going to be as impressive as the Sydney Opera House.

[AR]

But a huge waste of money! (ours, the tax payers)

[JAWS]

I wondered why I hadn't seen many pictures of it in view of it's importance and the fuss made over it's wonderful design.

I Know it's not finished but it will certainly be outstanding when it is.
Just asoutstanding as a huge boil on the end of somebody's nose, you won't be able to miss it.

It's only a personal opinion but here goes:-

The outside view of the Debaiting Chamber reminds me of Bart Simpson's haircut.

The MSP's offices make me think a Borg Cube has landed. "Resistance is Futile!"

There's a building behind the picture of the Tower Roofs which looks like either a mock caterpillar or scrap part of the Millenium Dome which somebody has smuggled onto the site. I've seen poli-tunnels which looked more impressive.

All I can say about the views from Salisbury Crags is that a fantastic view of some beautiful old stone buildings has been ruined by an unsightly concrete and glass mess.

The worst thing is that I suspect in twenty or so years time it will look like a mixture of delapidated tower blocks and 1960's concrete underpasses.

It looks about as inkeeping with the rest of what I remember of the centre of Edinburgh as a moustache dawbed on the Mona Lisa!

[rich]

Thank you, Jaws, for showing us the full magnitude of the disaster.
It looks like corporation flats.
It is so tacky.
It looks like something left over from the Millenial celebrations.
There is only one solution.
Bllow it up!

[brokencross]

Heavens above, who on earth gave the original planning permission for that monstrocity! When I was at college at Leith I stayed at the Claymore Hotel in Royal Terrace. It used to be such a lovely drive down the Royal Mile and around Arthurs Seat. An unadulterated waste of public money to satisfy the inflated egos of "alledged" public servants. When will it end, maybe one of the MSP's sitting in their private "pods" can tell you!!

[simian sally]

Ahem........

I beg to differ. I drive past there often and I have been watching the scaffolding come down for some months now. It is high quality impressive. Not to everyone's taste, but high quality nonetheless.

The "mock caterpillar" is Dynamic Earth and is not part of the complex.

I think it'll be ok in 20 years because of the quality of the build, but only time will tell.............

[golach]

Ahem........

I beg to differ. Not to everyone's taste, but high quality nonetheless., but only time will tell.............

Well simian sally, not bad 3 out of 4 statements and I agree with them!!!!!!
1: I beg to differ
2: Not to everyone's taste
3: But only time will tell
these I agree with
But as I live in close proximity to this abomination and see it more times than I like, how much of the £500 million has been wasted and how much did it actually cost?
So "but high quality nonetheless" I disagree with. This is Edinburgh the "Athens of the North" so who needs this concrete and glass edifice in the centre of our most world famous street? Ok it has fancy granite sticky on bits, how long will they stay on?
What was wrong with the Royal High School building, St Andrews house and the rest of Waterloo Place, that whole area could have been turned into a showpiece site at a fraction of the cost

Golach

[rich]

To gauge the extent of this architectural fiasco consider this point:
Scotland can no longer afford to govern itself, or take steps to becoming a sovereigh nation because of all the capital wasted in this folly.

There's been nothing like this since the Darien Scheme.

And we could blame that on the English and the Spanish.

(The cheesiest bit of it is the free standing concrete thingies with the cut out patterns...)

[simian sally]

What was wrong with the Royal High School building, St Andrews house and the rest of Waterloo Place, that whole area could have been turned into a showpiece site at a fraction of the cost

Former Royal High: proportions all wrong, too small anyways.

Old St Andrews House: horrible thirties architecture, horribly redolent of Stalin's Moscow, Hitler's Berlin and Mussolini's Roma. That's my personal opinion.

I have no time for the "modern is bad" blanket assumption when it comes to architecture. I think the parliament and the surrounding area will be superb. It ought to be too, it cost enough.

Any idea what the Cockburn Association thinks?

I like the Parliament. It has connotations of the Jewish Museum in Berlin, with a touch of the Guggenheiim in NYC, but with the gravitas of the Reichstag's Dome. It beats Paris's Pompidou hands-down. Edinburgh has enough owld stuff. The new part of the courts, and the Museum of Scotland in Chambers Street may be fine traditional buildings, but not all new buildings have to be like that. Look at the Festival Theatre.

I know the Parliament area well, I used to live nearby. It used to be a dump. Now look at it. New flats, new hotels, new eateries, new Moray House bulidings, the Scotsman, Dynamic Earth, and probably a few I've forgotten. It's no longer the World's End, but that's still around the corner.

It'll soon be time to stand up and be proud of our Parliament as we promulgate our presence on the International Stage.

Where next? Aberdeen? Glasgow? I can talk for just as long about their archictecture, or lack of it, too. Please just don't get me started

Not rising to Rich's crude bait. Ye'll be needan' better 'an deid wormies Buyee.

[JAWS]

You make some good points there simian sally, it could be a building anywhere in the world.

There would appear to be nothing about it that shouts "This is Scotland!" and that is surely what they were aiming at.

The whole thing was created so MSP's could feel important on the world stage by astounding everyone with an impresive display of architecture.

Sorry to disillusion them but buildings do not make good governments.

What will make Scotland important on the world stage will be the policies and decisions made by the people inside the building.

How many people were impressed by a building on Robin Island?

The Titanic impressed everyone with her fixtures and fittings but I'll bet there were hundreds of passengers who wished that a little more time had gone into providing lifeboats and a little less on trying to impress the plebs.

[golach]

The whole thing was created so MSP's could feel important on the world stage by astounding everyone with an impresive display of architecture.
Sorry to disillusion them but buildings do not make good governments.
What will make Scotland important on the world stage will be the policies and decisions made by the people inside the building.

Jaws, how very true but still sadly we have been lumbered with what I consider a white elephant of a building.
When the "Scottish Office" moved to the all singing all dancing building on Victoria Quay it also was custom built and would be the envy of all. But its falling apart already, staff are complaining about the humidity & lack of air-conditioning,the swimming pool for staff has been closed for years because of cracks and leaks, had nobody the foresite to listen to the Environmentalists reference "Global Warming" and the forseen changes in the climate of this country?
A perfect example of the lack of thought in a similar situation is the lack of air-conditioning in Edinburgh's state of the art "New Royal Infirmary", which last summer nearly closed down because the staff were dropping like flies because of the heat. Ok they are going to add air-circulation upgrades, at what cost to us again?
So how long before our Concrete and Glass monstrosity starts cracking and warping? The main contractor "Bovis" does not have an exemplary record for even house building
Golach

[simian sally]

My Dear JAWS, we were talking about the building itself, not the reasons for building it. Those are less clear, to say the least. You clearly haven't visited Robben Island. There are some wonderful buildings there. Nice climate too. Why not spend some time on it and find out for yourself?

Golach, I agree with you on the new ERI. But that was built on the cheap with PPP money, where "on the cheap" doesn't mean that it didn't cost a lot.

The question that needs asking about the Victoira Quay bulilding is:-

What was wrong with the Royal High School building, St Andrews house and the rest of Waterloo Place, that whole area could have been turned into a showpiece site at a fraction of the cost

Personally, I would have built the Scottish Parliament a little further west. There's a nice space on the other side of Dumbarton Road from the Western Infirmary. It's close to the park and not too far from some awesome shopping.

[JAWS]

You're right simian sally I only saw it from the sea. Mind you it was still in use at the time.

When one particular resident there whispered much of the world stopped to listen. The man, the words and the ideas were listened to by most of the world's leaders.
He certainly didn't need an over-expensive pile of building materials to gain attention or to secure his place in history.

I have no general objections to modern buildings provided they are in the right location. This one isn't. Buildings can be impressive without being obtrusive. One which just screams "I'm here, look at me!" is just vulgar.

A building should have manners and this one doesn't, it is mearly a loud, uncouth exibitionist.

[simian sally]

Lo JAWS!

I am ROFL here because I am reading your last post in a Mandela accent.

I have no general objections to modern buildings provided they are in the right location. This one isn't. Buildings can be impressive without being obtrusive. One which just screams "I'm here, look at me!" is just vulgar.

A building should have manners and this one doesn't, it is mearly a loud, uncouth exibitionist.

Once again, it is perfectly clear that you haven't seen the building or walked around the surrounding area. The Parliament fits in perfectly with its neighbours, the ones I listed above. Ok, so the Scotsman Building is a teenie weenie bit old fashioned, but what do you expect from Neil's lot? The rest are modernism personified. Oh yes, and there is a palace of some sort nearby, but that's hidden behind trees, high walls and grassy banks.

Methinks thou dost but spout building envy.

Ok enough jousting. Where would YOU host the Scottish Parliament? What sort of building do you think would be suitable? I assume modesty would be the order of the day.

Glolach has given his opinion. I challenge you to come up with a different solution.

[JAWS]

I'm glad it doesn't ruin the view from the palace but is it hidden from the castle?

It's a long time since I was in Edinburgh but Glasgow still had trams at the time and Waverley Station was full of steam trains.

Why does it have to be crammed into a small site in the city centre. There must be plenty of open spaces in the Edinburgh area, and no I don't mean somewhere nobody else would touch.

Somewhere on the main transport routes with plenty of space for expansion should it be necessary in the future. Somewhere with easy access for the public and for the people employed there. Somewhere where people have a dramatic view and approach to it and where it can be seen from a distance with nothing in competition.

I admit that I am no architect so just what the design should be would be best left to others. (I never did get the hang of creativity, just demolition I'm afraid)

I thought the whole idea was that the building should make a statement that "This Is Scotland" not "Where did you say it was?"

Where any Scots at all involved in the design or construction? I mean other than workers just being told to 'get on with it' or MSP's and Civil Servants squabbling over it.

I can only hope that after almost half a billion pounds has been spent on it that once it is completed it doesn't become famous for being a 'joke'.

[golach]

I would have sited the abomination on the old Ravenscraig Steel works site that would make it very central, and a fitting place for regeneration
Golach

[Partan]

I would have sited the abomination on the old Ravenscraig Steel works site that would make it very central....

Remembering that this is a Caithness Forum, central to where?

Partan

[golach]

Partan, if you want it you have it, it would fill the empty space at the Caithness Glass site
Goalch

[George Brims]

That thing is HORRIBLE. It is a hodge-podge of clashing shapes, with no unifying theme, like the Getty museum in LA. At least the Getty is all finished in one pleasant stone, instead of a child's crayon box of colours.

Why on earth have they put a modernistic mish-mash of a thing like that in a region of traditional architecture? The houses right next to it were built in the 70s yet were designed to complement the older buildings of the area. JAWS, I have seen the Sydney Opera House and it is impressive, not only in its striking form but because it sits isolated on its peninsula and doesn't clash with anything else.

And before anyone thinks I'm an old f*rt who desn't like modern architecture, I just love the new Disney Theater in LA, by the same architect as the Guggenhaim Museum in Bilbao, Frank Gehry.

[Anonymous]

I think this is a wee bit of cunning electioneering.
There is no way that the people of Scotland would allow such a carbunkle to be planted within the walls of Auld Reekie without a fuss. Thank goodness for local planners. Obviously this is a well executed piece of doctored photography to fool us simple people into believing this is a real building.
This building actually exists in the latin quarter of San Fransiso and has been cunningly placed to look as if it is in Auld Reekie
If you look closely, there is clearly Elvis and Maryln Monroe at a second floor window. Good but not good enough.
No matter how many times you try and tell us folk south of the border, no way has that much money been wasted in a building. We have seen the parliament on telly.They've got a building......why would you need another?
Phew thank goodness for common sense. Just come clean. You've spent the money in Irn Bru research