View Full Version : Maths Exam
Valerie Campbell
08-May-08, 18:48
My son sat his standard grade maths today. He did the credit paper this afternoon only to realise that half the paper included work not covered in the class. He wasn't the only one from his class either. Two of his classmates came out and said the same thing. The teacher had said that certain things wouldn't be in the exam so not to revise it, and she blatantly said trig graphs wouldn't be in it and didn't even bother to teach the kids it. Guess what? Yip, these graphs were in the exam. Obviously we'll be taking the matter further but I am so annoyed at this situation which affects not only my son, but other children, who put their faith in the local school. This isn't Wick or Thurso High schools I should point out.
Em Valerie, Was it definately the credit paper he got, or a mix up, if not then your right to expect he was taught the content of the exam. Sometimes it makes you wonder if the education system chances its hand what with all the league table stuff that goes on in the teaching profession these days.:(
If I remember correctly, for the credit exam you do part A , part B and whatever bit of part C your class covered. Not all of it. The other credit class does the other part. Chances are the stuff wasn't covered in thier class because they weren't meant to do it.
Well from what I mind doin it was just paper a and paper b, one was calculator one was non calculator, for credit and the same for general. you should definately complain, I remember being told what to concentrate on the most, with the theory that if it was in the last years paper then it wasn't likely to be in this years one, but still had to revise everything just incase.
My son sat his standard grade maths today. He did the credit paper this afternoon only to realise that half the paper included work not covered in the class. He wasn't the only one from his class either. Two of his classmates came out and said the same thing. The teacher had said that certain things wouldn't be in the exam so not to revise it, and she blatantly said trig graphs wouldn't be in it and didn't even bother to teach the kids it. Guess what? Yip, these graphs were in the exam. Obviously we'll be taking the matter further but I am so annoyed at this situation which affects not only my son, but other children, who put their faith in the local school. This isn't Wick or Thurso High schools I should point out.
Well that's one side of the story but it would be interested to hear the other side. Long experience of things in education not all what they seem when recounted by a child to an adult and then by an adult to all and sundry. The school and teacher are innocent until proven guilty!
My son was told by his maths teacher that the credit papers were the hardest they have seen in 10 years. One of the questions was a definate "higher" standard question.
I have been told by maths teachers that the paper 1 (non calculator) was exceptionally hard - however if this is the case and the chief examiner agrees, then the pass mark may be lowered. Paper 2 was fine.
With regard to children being told not to revise certain topics then I find it hard to believe. The teacher has a syllabus on what to cover and anything in that syllabus can be tested in the exam, so a teacher should leave nothing out. The time to cover a course is very tight (expecially in Higher) and sometimes somethings are not covered 100% and it is up to the teachers experience of previous papers, that will decide the depth that that topic is covered. A teacher can suggest what might come up in a paper looking at patterns of past papers (which the pupil can also try to work out), but they can never say this will not come up. The teachers do not know the content of the exam until the exam is finished.
dragonfly
10-May-08, 09:59
yes, my daughter came home saying she showed her paper to her maths teacher after the exam and he said it was more like a higher paper - but as said above if exceptionally hard the pass rate will be lowered accordingly - fingers crossed!!!
I think that the higher question in the paper was
x^2 - 10x + 18 = (x - a)^2 + b
Find the values of a and b.
Lets see how many of you orgers can do it.:eek:
Bobinovich
10-May-08, 22:03
a = 5
b = -7
I don't understand modern maths (and I did A level Pure Maths in 6th form but I don't suppose anyone now would understand that!). What does ^ mean? Even though Bob's given us the answer I'd like to try it.
I don't understand modern maths (and I did A level Pure Maths in 6th form but I don't suppose anyone now would understand that!). What does ^ mean? Even though Bob's given us the answer I'd like to try it.
x^2 = x squared
I don't understand modern maths (and I did A level Pure Maths in 6th form but I don't suppose anyone now would understand that!). What does ^ mean? Even though Bob's given us the answer I'd like to try it.I thought today's school maths was supposed to have been dumbed down when compared with the implausibly high standards of the distant past. I hadn't realised completing the square was modern maths. That's priceless. :lol: [lol]
I was taught to complete the square in Standard Grade at THS. I didn't do Maths Higher.
Moi x
Ha, that was pretty easy to be fair.
It's been about 8 years since I sat my Standard Grade and am just about to graduate.
I couldn't remember any of techniques taught but it was a pretty easy thing to work out.
x^2 - 10x + 18 = (x-a)^2 + b
x^2 - 10x + 18 = (x-a)(x-a) + b
(x-?)(x-?) + ? = (x-a)(x-a) + b
(x-5)(x-5) + (-7) = (x-a)(x-a) + b
Bobinovich
11-May-08, 08:14
I don't understand modern maths (and I did A level Pure Maths in 6th form but I don't suppose anyone now would understand that!). What does ^ mean? Even though Bob's given us the answer I'd like to try it.
As an aside, for anyone needing those special characters such as °, ², ³, ¼, ½, ¾, ±, ©, ® and the like, the Windows Character Map is an invaluable utility. Usually found in Start > All Programs > Accessories or Start > All Programs > Accessories > System Tools it gives access to a wide variety of useful characters, as well as keyboard shortcuts which are useful to learn for those you may want to use on a regular basis.
I got told about this in maths on Thursday (I'm doing higher) and we were given the questions to do. We did them fine, but with what we learnt this year.
There was also a question about exponential functions, which would have been difficult, but not impossible as a bit of the exponential graphs was taught at standard grade.
It was definitely more difficult than the 2007 paper.
My son sat his standard grade maths today. He did the credit paper this afternoon only to realise that half the paper included work not covered in the class. He wasn't the only one from his class either. Two of his classmates came out and said the same thing. The teacher had said that certain things wouldn't be in the exam so not to revise it, and she blatantly said trig graphs wouldn't be in it and didn't even bother to teach the kids it. Guess what? Yip, these graphs were in the exam. Obviously we'll be taking the matter further but I am so annoyed at this situation which affects not only my son, but other children, who put their faith in the local school. This isn't Wick or Thurso High schools I should point out.
Teachers usually read through past papers and find out which questions are not common in the exams and advise pupils to focus less on these questions as they rarely appear in the exams. You will probably find that the work was covered in the class but possibly very briefly. Teachers usually advise pupils on whether to take the foundation/general exam or the general/credit and pupils who are cabable of doing credit maths will usually find that although certain things were only briefly covered in class, if they are at credit ability then they will be able to answer the question without much trouble at all. It is unlikely though that one question in the exam is going to alter the final grade. It is possible that your sons class focused more on general work than credit according to their ability and teachers expectations.
Valerie Campbell
13-May-08, 10:51
Well, things have kind of sorted themselves out. For the life of me I will never understand the exam system. When I was at high school, everyone sat the same O Grade with everyone doing the same work. Anyway the maths teacher has reassured us that this was an exceptional exam with work that was only touched on due to lack of class time. She reckons my son has passed but his prelim can be used to appeal the level. Bring back the old O Grades and Highers please!!!
Valerie Campbell
23-May-08, 18:15
I heard on the radio that the SQA have had a lot of complaints about this year's maths exam but they refute the claims. A teacher pointed to a question that appeared in a paper 9 years ago and another had complained that some Higher work was there. Interesting...This should bring the pass mark down I guess.
I heard on the radio that the SQA have had a lot of complaints about this year's maths exam but they refute the claims. A teacher pointed to a question that appeared in a paper 9 years ago and another had complained that some Higher work was there. Interesting...This should bring the pass mark down I guess.
They can't really complain about a question that was in the paper 9 years ago. Teachers should be teaching what is necessary for the curriculum and everything in the exams are covered by the Scottish Education Curriculum. If the teacher hasn't taught specific sections, it is their choice but also their responsibility when it comes to the exams.
Credit maths is very challenging for standard grade pupils and the SQA will lower the passmark, only if they find that the average pass rate is lower than the original. The SQA will take a record of all pupils results and determine a pass mark in relation to these marks. If for example, the paper was out of 90 and the average rate for pupils was 40, the SQA may lower the pass mark to 40. Usually if a pupil achieves a credit grade in standard grade maths, this means they are able to sit higher maths the following year. If a pupil achieves a general grade, they will sit intermediate 2.
Having said this, I must admit that this years intermediate 2 exam was a huge amount harder than the past papers as far back as 2000. It was a challenge getting through the paper but at the same time, it was possible and all work in the exam is covered in the intermediate 2 course. Again, if they find that the majority of pupils struggled with this paper, they will again, lower the pass mark. Each year, the SQA review questions and form reports to say which questions pupils did not perform well on for future reference and exams.
One thing I did hear, not the SQA but down in England, this years music exam had the answers printed on the back! You would think they would double check the papers before being sent out.
VC mentioned an appeal if her child doesn't do so well in the exam - this does not always happen, and I heard on the grapevine that schools are clamping down on the number of appeals, and an appeal will only be made if the child does not appear for the exam and has a med cert. Too many children are now assuming if they do well in the prelim they need not work so hard for the actual exam as if they do poorly then the school will appeal.
Teachers surely cannot appeal if the paper was exceptionally hard (if that is the case then the whole of Scotland will be appealing as they all sat the same paper!!!) or they have not taught the whole course.
VC mentioned an appeal if her child doesn't do so well in the exam - this does not always happen, and I heard on the grapevine that schools are clamping down on the number of appeals, and an appeal will only be made if the child does not appear for the exam and has a med cert. Too many children are now assuming if they do well in the prelim they need not work so hard for the actual exam as if they do poorly then the school will appeal.
Teachers surely cannot appeal if the paper was exceptionally hard (if that is the case then the whole of Scotland will be appealing as they all sat the same paper!!!) or they have not taught the whole course.
Teachers tend only to appeal if they are certain that a pupil has not reached their full potential in the final SQA exam. For example, if a pupil achieved a credit grade in the prelim and only a low general or foundation grade in the final exam, then they would appeal.
They therefore have to consider why they went from credit to low general or foundation - was the prelim too easy, did the child just not bother to work after the prelim thinking they didn't need to? Some people do just assume that if they drop a grade or two then an appeal is automatic - this just isn't the case, and they should be aware of this!!
They therefore have to consider why they went from credit to low general or foundation - was the prelim too easy, did the child just not bother to work after the prelim thinking they didn't need to? Some people do just assume that if they drop a grade or two then an appeal is automatic - this just isn't the case, and they should be aware of this!!
Usually they tend to find that a pupil has dropped grades in the final exam due to recent illness or just general lack of concentration on the day of the exam- nerves, etc. If a pupil achieves a credit grade in the prelim and then fails the general paper in the final SQA exam then it is unlikely this is due to the lack of work/ revision since it is such a drop. If they passed the general paper and achieved a general grade 3 then it is unlikely they will appeal as this could well be lack of revision. They do tend to make prelims more difficult that the final SQA exams though.
day old blues
24-May-08, 18:43
My son was told by his maths teacher that the credit papers were the hardest they have seen in 10 years. One of the questions was a definate "higher" standard question.
When i sat my higher physics paper there was an "advanced higher" question in the paper, but these questions are only worth about two marks and there to see who knows there stuff two marks wont make much a difference to the final outcome of someones grade anyway.
Took advanced higher this year aswel and still couldn't do the question though.
I also having just finished school this year don't belive that a teacher purposly told their pupils not to revise something that she thought might be in the exam.
I am a retired maths teacher, specialising now in private tuition, in particular preparing students for Scottish Standard Grade, Intermediate and Higher exams. I have an intimate knowledge of these exams back to 1990 when Standard Grade was first introduced and Higher was in the process of being revised.
I have also devised my own maths exams for teaching purposes.
In 30 years of teaching, I have never seen a maths paper so poor as Credit Maths 2008.
The SQA has a duty to produce fair and relevant examination papers. In my professional opinion, they have manifestly failed to do so.
The mistakes in this exam (and I include both papers) are numerous, but can be thought of broadly as errors of content and style.
It has been widely pointed out that Higher elements have been included which is obviously inappropriate, but since maths in Scotland has always been applied rather than theoretical, the question regarding a broken telegraph pole is a rather pathetic way of examining the cosine rule when numerous relevant examples from architecture, navigation or surveying spring to mind. Who cares about a broken telegraph pole???
In the same context is the cliff/horizon question cynically lifted and adapted from the 1999 General paper (Q18). As if we wouldn't notice.
By style, I mean the way this exam differs from past papers. As I worked through both papers, I expected to find the usual steadily increasing level of difficulty, the hardest question being the last. Not so. No such pattern at all. In paper II the highest degree of difficulty was Q9 (the clock). Not Q10 (car hire) or 12 (tan graph). Also in terms of style, the circle question (5) bore no resemblance to past paper questions.
I have spoken to a representative of the SQA about all this and was assured that my criticisms would be taken on board.
She also said it takes twenty people to make a maths paper.
By style, I mean the way this exam differs from past papers. As I worked through both papers, I expected to find the usual steadily increasing level of difficulty, the hardest question being the last. Not so. No such pattern at all. In paper II the highest degree of difficulty was Q9 (the clock). Not Q10 (car hire) or 12 (tan graph). Also in terms of style, the circle question (5) bore no resemblance to past paper questions.
Or like the two ridiculous questions in this years physics prelim-
One was a huge question about the force that "poo" went through a waste chute in anb aircraft. It was like.. Measure the force the waste goes through the chute as the toilet is flushed.
Another was a man getting thrown off a horse, over a wall, into a pool of water and there was such a pathetic quote from the horse that said "neeeyyy wayyy" Don't know how long it took them to come up with that!
One was a huge question about the force that "poo" went through a waste chute in anb aircraft. It was like.. Measure the force the waste goes through the chute as the toilet is flushed.
I remember that question. I found it quite easy.
As for the maths question that was posted. We learnt that at higher. Our maths teacher gave us the question so that we could do it (which wasn't a problem as we had learnt how to do it) but it would be exceedingly difficult to do at standard grade. But it was a problem solving question.
In my standard grade exam I had a question that could only truly be solved using differentiation. Something which we only did again at higher. But never the less it was possible to do. It was extremely difficult, but still possible given what we had done in class. The same applies to that question.
In ever paper there is a question like that. All exam questions have a 'weighting'. e.g. how many people are expected to get it. If all the questions were easy then everyone would get full marks and the qualification would be worthless?
By the way: if anyone wants to try some of this years higher maths questions then just let me know. :lol:
Edit: That also goes for Higher Physics.
Valerie Campbell
26-May-08, 11:04
Well for what it's worth, I e-mailed the SQA about the exam, raising my concerns. For too long I've sat back and just accepted things but this has niggled me from the beginning. I hope if you've found exams, let me say odd,(ie rfr10's comments about the horse in physics - do the SQA think students are 4 years old I wonder?!!) then maybe you should do the same.
I haven't seen the standard grade credit papers but a pal's son did higher maths and she showed me those papers. As I said before, I didn't do higher maths at school so I don't have any experience of it but I took it up again at university and I am fairly unique amongst sociologists in having a uni maths education.
I thought the higher maths exam was little more than an obscure extension of standard grade maths in a direction that isn't very useful in more advanced applications. Most of the questions were about cartesian coordinates in one form or another, irrespective of whether they were testing algebra, vectors, geometry, trigonometry or calculus. There wasn't much in either paper that tested concepts and I didn't see anything on exponential growth, a subject that very few .orgers seem to have any grasp of. I was very disappointed with both papers.
I didn't see anything on exponential growth
We had logarithms? Which is the closest related topic? The reason that logs is in it and exponentials wasn't is simply because logs are more difficult.
Functions f,g and h are defined on suitable domains by
f(x) = x2 - x + 10, g(x) = 5 - x and h(x) = log2x
(a) Find expressions for h(f(x)) and h(g(x)).
(b) Hence solve h(f(x)) - h(g(x)) = 3.
Edit: As hard as I tried I just couldn't get the board to do subscripts or superscripts...
Further Edit: Question 19 on paper 1 was on exponentials.
We had logarithms? Which is the closest related topic? The reason that logs is in it and exponentials wasn't is simply because logs are more difficult. They are? Why? :confused:
Are you sure it's not because you personally find logs more difficult?
Functions f,g and h are defined on suitable domains by
f(x) = x2 - x + 10, g(x) = 5 - x and h(x) = log2x
(a) Find expressions for h(f(x)) and h(g(x)).
(b) Hence solve h(f(x)) - h(g(x)) = 3.Edit: As hard as I tried I just couldn't get the board to do subscripts or superscripts...
Further Edit: Question 19 on paper 1 was on exponentials.Sorry, I didn't see that question when I scanned through the papers quickly.
Is that log(2x) or, more likely, log_2(x), where '_2' represents a subscript 2?
I can't persuade the board to do subscripts either, I can get them into my text but the preview removes them.
Well finding x^5 is easier than log_5 of 100?
Logs require a slightly different way of thinking compared to normal maths as you have to work backwards. I know that there are some people who will disagree with that though. And its log to the base 2 of x.
Have sent you a pm.
I get x = -10, 3. Do you agree?
Moi x
Moi pointed out to me that I got my powers the wrong way round and wrote a polynomial instead of an exponential.
It should be 5^x. My mistake. Thanks for correcting me!!
As for the answers.... I can't remember what I put. But I'll have another go just now. Pretty sure I got 3 for part b though.
Good, you'll go far young man. ;)
Good, you'll go far young man. ;)
Thanks!.....
wee sparkle
08-Jun-08, 17:34
My boyfriend sat that physics exam, and i remember him mentioning the "poop" question to me! I cant believe how they word some of the questions?
Must be running out of ideas:lol:
Bobinovich
08-Jun-08, 18:50
For anyone struggling with special characters I can confirm they do work - you can copy & paste from this post (http://forum.caithness.org/showthread.php?p=393502) if you want to try it yourself.
Power of 2²
Hey, it works now. Thank you Mr Bob.
Moi x
Powered by vBulletin® Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.