Fathers Support Group

[thegreenman]

Hi,

I'm new here and thought I'd start my first post to ask if there is a support group for fathers in Caithness? If there is, great. Can somebody point me in the right direction. If not would anybody be interested in getting together to start one?

I'll give you a brief reason why I'm asking below. I'm hoping that this isn't the start of some flames (as I know the .orgers can get quite het up!). I'm trying to be honest and I'm opening myself up a little so please, no flames.

I'm the father of a 8 year old boy who lives in Caithness with his mother (his mother and I are separated). Since I got remarried earlier this year my contact with my son has almost disappeared - we didn't see him at all during the summer holidays and we haven't seen him since before Xmas - he still has all of his presents here waiting to be opened. We only live about a mile away from him but I need to be careful as I know she will scream 'harassment' if I go around there to ask to see him or phone her to speak to him.

I've never been violent or abusive. I've never been arrested. I've got no court orders against me. We both work for a living. We get by every month (just). We're good people. But I get no explanation from his mother as to why she is doing this. I know there are some parents who are a danger to their kids and that is an entirely different situation, but we don't fall into that category.

My new wife and I just never see my little boy. Any arrangement we have had in the past is broken when his mother feels like it. We don't get a phone call or an explanation. He just doesn't come out of the house and we're forced to just drive away after half an hour or so. It breaks our hearts to know the damage it is doing to him. We're adults, we can deal with the rejection and the hurt is causes. My son is only 8. He doesn't understand. He loves both my wife and I and has a great time when he's with us. If I had one wish it would be that we all got on amicably and he grows up as a well balanced individual.

Anyway, I didn't come on here to give you all a sob story. I came to see if there are any other dads in the same situation who'd like to get together and talk about what is going on and see what we can do to try and help each other. We all need to remember the kids in this, this is the top priority. The fathers get forgotten about though and we need somebody to talk to as well. What is happening is simply wrong and we need to fight it.

This is obviously a touchy subject and private one so please drop me a Private Message and I'll get back to you with my email address and we can take it from there.

Please, no flames.

Alan

[angela5]

Sorry to hear that, have you been in contact with a solicitor to arrange regular access?

[mccaugm]

Its gratifying to hear of a father who wants to have contact with his son. :lol:

My ex rarely bothers and sees them once a year for a week or a fornight.

Good luck and never give up.

[thegreenman]

Sorry to hear that, have you been in contact with a solicitor to arrange regular access?

That was a quick reply!

Unfortunately we can't afford a solicitor for court. We did have one but my ex was giving us the run around so much that unfortunately that bill has cleared us out - at £125 + VAT per hour you can understand why. It was £75.00 a letter to update us on the situation!

We don't qualify for Legal Aid either (on the edge apparently) so my ex-partner can effectively do as she likes as I don't have a legal avenue to challenge her. I did try mediation (it's free!) but she refused to go.

I suppose why would she go as she knows she can do as she likes and I can't challenge it. If she goes she may have to agree something and that would take away some of her control over my son.

[paris]

Hi there thegreenman , im jan a mum to 4 grown up kids and 3 grandsons, 1 of whom lives with me . my son is his father and has now a new partner , they have 2 sons together. I have taken on the roll as mother to our 7yr old as he didnt get on with my sons new partner at first and his natural mother didnt want him, sad i know but thats the way it is . He lived with his mother for about 1 1/2 yrs and she asked us to have him or he would of been adopted, my son was working full time and at first was unable to take care of him. My son comes to our house every day to see him and he goes there , not alot but he goes. Just before xmas we had a letter from a solicitor stating the natural mother wants contact BUT its not my son or me thats said no its our grandson doesnt want to see her. I am now being taken to court so she can have access. He was in a right mess when we got him ( mother is a prostitute/ drug user ) . I have been advised that whatever she does she will still get access which to me is very wrong.
I hope you get to see your son but i do feel the only way is via the courts. Lifes a bitch sometimes, good luck jan x

[Camel Spider]

I know how you feel mate.

Been there and done that, my Xmas presents were given to my children but they were told they were from their mums boyfriend. From the tone of your post you have the right attitude of rising above her pettiness. I would go through the courts.

Have you tried Families need Fathers ?? .. http://www.fnf.org.uk/ .. they gave me some good advice.

Best of Luck.

[thegreenman]

Its gratifying to hear of a father who wants to have contact with his son. :lol:

My ex rarely bothers and sees them once a year for a week or a fornight.

Good luck and never give up.

Thanks for the support. It does mean an awful lot. I'm sorry your in the other side of this boat.

I can't imagine not seeing my son only once or twice a year. However difficult my situation, I do see him more than that.

What irritates me is the number of stories I have read where mothers (and it is generally mothers who have the kids so I'm not picking on one parent!) stops the father from seeing kids and the father jumps through so many hoops to get that contact with all the financial and emotional problems that causes while other mothers are desperate for the fathers to be involved in their kids lives and instead of those fathers being involved, they take the easy way out and walk away. The rest of us good fathers get tarnished by the same brush.

One thing I will never ever do is give up. My son means too much to us both.

[thegreenman]

Hi there thegreenman , im jan a mum to 4 grown up kids and 3 grandsons, 1 of whom lives with me . my son is his father and has now a new partner , they have 2 sons together. I have taken on the roll as mother to our 7yr old as he didnt get on with my sons new partner at first and his natural mother didnt want him, sad i know but thats the way it is . He lived with his mother for about 1 1/2 yrs and she asked us to have him or he would of been adopted, my son was working full time and at first was unable to take care of him. My son comes to our house every day to see him and he goes there , not alot but he goes. Just before xmas we had a letter from a solicitor stating the natural mother wants contact BUT its not my son or me thats said no its our grandson doesnt want to see her. I am now being taken to court so she can have access. He was in a right mess when we got him ( mother is a prostitute/ drug user ) . I have been advised that whatever she does she will still get access which to me is very wrong.
I hope you get to see your son but i do feel the only way is via the courts. Lifes a bitch sometimes, good luck jan x

Hi Jan,

If your grandson does not want to see his mother surely it is going to cause him distress to see her? Is that not grounds for at the very least limiting contact to just supervised visits?

I have read a lot about the role of the family court system and it's cases like this that just baffle me? If the role was reversed and it was your son in the mother's shoes, I would wager that he wouldn't get access.

[thegreenman]

I know how you feel mate.

Been there and done that, my Xmas presents were given to my children but they were told they were from their mums boyfriend. From the tone of your post you have the right attitude of rising above her pettiness. I would go through the courts.

Have you tried Families need Fathers ?? .. http://www.fnf.org.uk/ (http://forum.caithness.org/go.php?url=http://forum.caithness.org/go.php?url=http://www.fnf.org.uk/) .. they gave me some good advice.

Best of Luck.

I haven't tried FNF but will give them a look. I have had a lot of good advice from F4J.

How did you get on? Did you eventually settle everything with your ex?

[Bobinovich]

Hi Alan and welcome to the Org. I can't begin to imagine your plight but there has got to be something in law which protects both parents rights. Can you not apply to the courts without the need for an expensive solicitor?

[paris]

I know what your saying as ive also been trawling the net for infomation. All we can do is wait till we go to court. One good thing ive done is keep a day to day diary of the phone calls from her to us calling us all sorts of things and her so called friends telling us what state she was in on such and such a night after her drug taking , oh and i have a few crafty photos i managed to aquire that will certainly make the judges eyes bulge ;) Im not stupid here, just cant wait to have my say in court. Its not about her and us its a little boy who need a decent up bringing and believe me i intend to make sure he gets it . i was adopted so know the hurt of not being wanted, nows my time to look out for someone else. jan x

[Camel Spider]

Thanks for the support. It does mean an awful lot. I'm sorry your in the other side of this boat.

I can't imagine not seeing my son only once or twice a year. However difficult my situation, I do see him more than that.

What irritates me is the number of stories I have read where mothers (and it is generally mothers who have the kids so I'm not picking on one parent!) stops the father from seeing kids and the father jumps through so many hoops to get that contact with all the financial and emotional problems that causes while other mothers are desperate for the fathers to be involved in their kids lives and instead of those fathers being involved, they take the easy way out and walk away. The rest of us good fathers get tarnished by the same brush.

One thing I will never ever do is give up. My son means too much to us both.

In my experience it is only a small number of fathers who just walk away.

Most (like me) are simply drained emotionally and financially and cut contact to save themselves the stress. I will not be attempting to contact my children any more as it is just a stick for my ex to beat me with. I cant take anymore of her sniping without retaliating. The ironic thing is that after years of trying and her finding any excuse to keep me away from the kids I am now apparently a "Feckless Dad" .. I cant win.

[thegreenman]

In my experience it is only a small number of fathers who just walk away.

Most (like me) are simply drained emotionally and financially and cut contact to save themselves the stress. I will not be attempting to contact my children any more as it is just a stick for my ex to beat me with. I cant take anymore of her sniping without retaliating. The ironic thing is that after years of trying and her finding any excuse to keep me away from the kids I am now apparently a "Feckless Dad" .. I cant win.

I do agree it is only a small number who walk away but it is those ones that the media love to highlight and call them "Feckless Dads". They rarely highlight those fathers who do fight and they never highlight those mothers/fathers who use their kids as pawns.

[thegreenman]

Hi Alan and welcome to the Org. I can't begin to imagine your plight but there has got to be something in law which protects both parents rights. Can you not apply to the courts without the need for an expensive solicitor?

Thanks for the welcome.

There is little in law that protects a fathers rights for access. The way the courts work is the bias is immediately placed with the mother in these cases. While I have Parental Rights and Responsibilities it is little more than a piece of paper.

I can apply to the courts without the need for a solicitor. Unfortunately court is such a complicated procedure that I wouldn't know where to start. In England it is much easier. However in Scotland, I believe, everything is performed in a legal latin that makes these sort of things very difficult for the layman. It is a road I am going to have to go down (as I don't have any other route open to me really) but I don't expect it to be quick.

In the meantime however we don't get a chance to see my son or him to see us ...

[thegreenman]

I know what your saying as ive also been trawling the net for infomation. All we can do is wait till we go to court. One good thing ive done is keep a day to day diary of the phone calls from her to us calling us all sorts of things and her so called friends telling us what state she was in on such and such a night after her drug taking , oh and i have a few crafty photos i managed to aquire that will certainly make the judges eyes bulge ;) Im not stupid here, just cant wait to have my say in court. Its not about her and us its a little boy who need a decent up bringing and believe me i intend to make sure he gets it . i was adopted so know the hurt of not being wanted, nows my time to look out for someone else. jan x

Hi Jan,

As you said it's your little boy that's the most important thing here. He needs good role models, a sense of right and wrong and a loving family around him. It sounds like to me he has everything he needs there with you and your son.

Have you recorded the phone calls?

[Coach]

Hi there thegreenman , im jan a mum to 4 grown up kids and 3 grandsons, 1 of whom lives with me . my son is his father and has now a new partner , they have 2 sons together. I have taken on the roll as mother to our 7yr old as he didnt get on with my sons new partner at first and his natural mother didnt want him, sad i know but thats the way it is . He lived with his mother for about 1 1/2 yrs and she asked us to have him or he would of been adopted, my son was working full time and at first was unable to take care of him. My son comes to our house every day to see him and he goes there , not alot but he goes. Just before xmas we had a letter from a solicitor stating the natural mother wants contact BUT its not my son or me thats said no its our grandson doesnt want to see her. I am now being taken to court so she can have access. He was in a right mess when we got him ( mother is a prostitute/ drug user ) . I have been advised that whatever she does she will still get access which to me is very wrong.
I hope you get to see your son but i do feel the only way is via the courts. Lifes a bitch sometimes, good luck jan x

Hi Jan,

My two neices were used as pawns by my "own brother" when their mother left him and took up safety with Womans aid etc. We sided with my sister in law (reason for this, trust me) and my parents and I put our weight behind her and the girls and insisted our lawyer induce a request of the court to have a court officer appointed to visit both homes and speak to the girls when in company of both parents in each of their homes and observe. She also took notes from meetings with my parents and myself and my brothers neighbours too. She reported back to the Sheriff Judge. He then requested a private meeting with the girls in his chambers (removing his wig and gown in the process so not to frighten them at age 10 and 6). After two meetings the judge agreed that the girls did not wish to see him every week etc and arranged that the girls should be encouraged to see him once a fortnight but if they did not wish to go then they should not be forced. He eventually faded out of their lives realising they did not wish to be around him.!!!
Why not get the boy to write a letter to the local sheriff court for the attention of the judge asking personally for the judge to review the matter and put in his letter the reasons why he does not wish to see his mother. You never know - the simplest things sometimes work!
Good luck!
Coach

[Julia]

Thegreenman - you did not mention whether or not you support your son financially?

[paris]

thegreenman...yes i have used a dicta-phone to record all sorts of things but have been told were not allowed to use it in court,

coach... I'm hoping the judge will have a talk to our grandson then he can decide from his comments what to do . We have never said a bad word about his mother when hes about. Our whole town know what she does as its her mother, grandsons grandmother who runs/owns the brothel. Were trying to protect him from all this but one day someone will say something and he will find out. How embarrassing for him . Jan x

[Fran]

Would the Citizens Advice Bureau be able to help you?

[Camel Spider]

Thegreenman - you did not mention whether or not you support your son financially?

Ah .. the old chestnut .. what difference does it make ?? .. should he only see his son if he pays ??

I have been treated as a walking wallet by the CSA for years now, if a Goverment agency hounded women like that there would be an outcry from the Minister for Women. Unfortunately us men dont have a Minister for Men to complain to .. there isnt one. If there was I wouild be asking why Fathers dont have equal rights to their children as a matter of course.

Isnt Equality wonderful ??, apparently we are all equal .. just some more than others.

Yet men who fathered children while unmarried to the mother have no parental rights at all unless the mother consents to it !! .. and yet they are treated as an "Absent Parent" by the CSA.

I Wonder why that is ?? .. could it be because we are regarded as nothing more than a piggy bank ?? .. I think so and my experience with them backs it up.

If more men were treated as Fathers and a necessary part of their childrens lives then they would be more likely to contribute. Many dont as it is the only way to hit back at someone who is using the children against you backed by a system that is biased towards mothers at every level. I am NOT saying its right but us absent fathers are so powerless under the law that sometimes it is all we have.

Link .. http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2006/apr/10/childrensservices.freedomofinformation (http://forum.caithness.org/go.php?url=http://forum.caithness.org/go.php?url=http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2006/apr/10/childrensservices.freedomofinformation)

Interesting to note that according to the CSA's own figures the percentage of absent parents who dont pay is 30% for Men and 31% for Women .. They kept that quiet didnt they ??

[_Ju_]

Ah .. the old chestnut .. what difference does it make ?? .. should he only see his son if he pays ??



The difference it makes is that a child cannot choose not to eat, be clothed or housed on the days the money runs out. When relationships break down who ever (mother or father) has to provide sustenance for that child. Sustenanace should include being a presencial parent, but unfortunately that too often does not happen.

I don't know exactly what the laws are here, but from what I gather, they are very different from Portugal. A child has the right to know who are each of his parents, regardless of the wish of the mother. If the mother refuses to name the father, they have to prove that they cannot do so.
Once parantage is established, the custody, parenting responsibilities and costs for the child are divided by the two. Both parents are as responsible as eachother, no matter their marital status. This money is for the cost of raising the child . Anyone thinking that the "fortunes" meted out by the CSA for absentee parents to pay is some sort of extra paid to the custodial parent to fleece out their piggy banks is not very rational. To often the non custodial parent does not contribute enough to buy a pair of shoes.

Now returning to the original question: What difference does it make and should he only see his son if he/she pays? Well, I would put the question differently: would a parent that feels the need to be with his/her children regulary, that wants to be a part of their lives and that cannot conceive being deprived of them....would that parent be comfortable with the fact that his/her children were deprived of a healthier diet, better education and/or basics because they were not contributing economically to their kids lives? To use visitation as a weapon against any parent, especially a caring one, is wrong in my opinion. But if someone does use it, say to extract payments, only works on a caring parent, who I don't think, would be negligent in paying in the first place.

[thegreenman]

Thegreenman - you did not mention whether or not you support your son financially?

Why is that relevant? Is that what children have become reduced to in this society, pound signs?

We're talking my son who is being stopped by his mother from seeing myself and my wife. We are talking about my son here who misses us both. We're talking about my son here whom we haven't seen since before Christmas.

I support my son emotionally, financially and any other way I can. The CSA get the payments.

[thegreenman]

thegreenman...yes i have used a dicta-phone to record all sorts of things but have been told were not allowed to use it in court,

Hi Paris,

Family courts are different from criminal courts. There is no jury and evidence can be presented without being questioned and taken at face value. While the Sheriff may not allow your recordings, he has the power to and may well do so.

I'd record them anyway. If you have them the Sheriff may use them. If you don't have them then he has no choice in the matter.

[thegreenman]

Would the Citizens Advice Bureau be able to help you?

Hi Fran,

Unfortunately the Citizens Advice in Caithness has nobody that can help. They could only provide a list of local solicitors which I can't afford.

[starry]

I don't understand parents who use their children like this, I also don't understand parents who don't contribute with realistic maintenance.


Is there any chance your wife would go to family mediation ? Even if she won't they may be able to offer some help and support to you, they were really good supporting myself and my son even though my ex didn't take part.

If I was you I would try my hardest to keep communication open with your son, drop the pressies round of give them to someone to give to him. Write to him, get him a mobile if he doesn't have one so you can text.
It is so unfair that you want to be part of his life and can't.

I know at least one of their counsellors visits Thurso on a regular basis.

Family Mediation Highland62 Academy Street InvernessHighlandScotland01463 71210001463 717994

[thegreenman]

The difference it makes is that a child cannot choose not to eat, be clothed or housed on the days the money runs out. When relationships break down who ever (mother or father) has to provide sustenance for that child. Sustenanace should include being a presencial parent, but unfortunately that too often does not happen.

It does all too often happen, unfortunately. However what you're focusing on is the financial side of things when a relationship breaks down. The financial aspect is one side of the equation and both parents have a resonsibility to provide for the child.

However what I am talking about, and we've lost it somewhat in the melee that's started, is the mother in this case shirking her responsibility to ensure my son has a balanced and happy life with both of his parents. It matters not whether I pay £1 or £1 million, my son is the one is not seeing his father.

The CSA and the media tell you every day about the 'Feckless Dads' who never pay for their kids. What they don't tell you about is why these 'Feckless Dads' won't pay. They also never mention the 'Feckless Mums' who every day use their kids as pawns against their fathers. Some fathers do it too and they are just as bad, but in this country the bias for residency of kids is with the mother. That's why the CSA is pursuing 'dads who don't pay' and why the majority of parents who use their kids as pawns is the mother.

If it were equal then the CSA would be pursuing 'parents who don't pay'.


I don't know exactly what the laws are here, but from what I gather, they are very different from Portugal. A child has the right to know who are each of his parents, regardless of the wish of the mother. If the mother refuses to name the father, they have to prove that they cannot do so.

The law here is changing, slowly and in the wrong way. Children here have a right to know who their parents are too. However only if the mother (generally) allows. I've yet to hear of a case where a father goes to court to enforce the right of their child to know them.


Once parantage is established, the custody, parenting responsibilities and costs for the child are divided by the two. Both parents are as responsible as eachother, no matter their marital status. This money is for the cost of raising the child . Anyone thinking that the "fortunes" meted out by the CSA for absentee parents to pay is some sort of extra paid to the custodial parent to fleece out their piggy banks is not very rational. To often the non custodial parent does not contribute enough to buy a pair of shoes.

If only the laws in the UK were heading in the same direction as Portugal.

You paint a picture of fathers complaining that they are being fleeced by the CSA. Fleeced means 'ripped off'. Nobody that I have heard from complains that the CSA is fleecing them. What I heard and read about is the CSA using fathers as wallets and only interesting in making their balance sheet balance.

The CSA were introduced due to the number of single (mainly) mothers who were on state benefits. What they thought they could do was get these 'Feckless Dads' to cough up and take the burden off the state. This is all fine in theory and I don't think anybody argues with it.

Unfortunately the reality of the situation is that the CSA was a huge failure, mainly due to the workload they created for themselves (bad policies, incorrect calculations and the majority of their staff being temporary workers who were not civil servants) and their failed computer system. It had little to do with fathers not paying up (by Camel Spiders stats the majority did).

If it was only down to the 'Feckless Dads' not paying then why would they abandon it (or rename it). Surely they would blame those 'Feckless Dads' and go after them with the full support of the media? They renamed it in much the same way as the Queen Mother changed her name at the start of WW2 to Windsor. It was a PR stunt designed to make us all forget what they were before.

Now the soon to be CMEC (Child Maintenance and Enforcement Commission) is to take over the role of the CSA and have more powers. What they didn't do when re-inventing it was any kind of contact or access arrangements being tied it to maintenance payments. Soi we have the same situation as now. They are only interested in collecting money. Being interested in ensuring that children have access to both parents is too much like hard work which is why they left that out. It's easy to collect money. You just give the bad people a name ('Feckless Dads') and turn society against them. They are not interested in the welfare of children.

So we have a failed government department with a new name and new powers that is replacing an old failed government department.

There are no stats on it but from my own reading and listening, fathers are forced to pay for children who they have no access arrangements with through no fault of their own. Women are using the their kids as pawns and being told it's okay to do so by the government who hand them the cash the 'Feckless Dads' have paid.

Fathers don't just not pay up because they can't be bothered.


Now returning to the original question: What difference does it make and should he only see his son if he/she pays? Well, I would put the question differently: would a parent that feels the need to be with his/her children regulary, that wants to be a part of their lives and that cannot conceive being deprived of them....would that parent be comfortable with the fact that his/her children were deprived of a healthier diet, better education and/or basics because they were not contributing economically to their kids lives? To use visitation as a weapon against any parent, especially a caring one, is wrong in my opinion. But if someone does use it, say to extract payments, only works on a caring parent, who I don't think, would be negligent in paying in the first place.

What you seem to be suggesting is that while you agree that using your child as a weapon is wrong, you agree that any parent who uses is for extracting payments would never have to as only a caring parent would care enough in the first place?

That doesn't make sense and doesn't actually come down to reality.

To ask you a question. Do you think a parent who cares about their child would use them as a weapon to extract money? Do you think that same caring parent would use their child as a pawn to punish the other parent?

I would ask you what is more important, a new Nintendo Wii or the love of a father? How much is that worth? £200? £300? £1000? How much is each visit with your child worth?

A parent who wants to be involved in their childs life will pay what they can. If you were in the position where you paid, let's say £100.00 a month for your son or daughter but you rarely see them because the mother is a bad one and neglecting her responsibilities to your child, what would you do? The mother never tells you why she does what she does. She never talks to you. She never even tells you when your child is ill. Is that a good mother?

You can't go to court as you can't afford it. The mother can get legal aid as she is on benefits.

She won't sit down and talk to you and you can't force her.

She won't tell you why she's neglecting her responsibilities to your child. She can and she just does. You need to just live with it.

The only thing you have is the money you pay her. That's your only weapon. You know it's wrong to do it. You know that the mother rarely spends it on the child anyway. You know what she is doing is wrong. Nobody wants to help. Few listen as they think you're just a 'Feckless Dad'.

What would you do?

I'd be glad to know as I'm fresh out of ideas.

My opinion on it is that it doesn't make any difference if you pay £1 million of £1 for your child. He or she has a right to have a father and that father has a right to see the child. If you don't think your ex is paying enough go to the CSA. They'll sort it out. Using your child as a pawn is neglecting your responsibility to that child. Not paying for the child is also neglecting your responsibility.

Can we get back to my original question ... any Fathers in this position like to get together?

[Margaret M.]

I think Julia's question is very relevant since not contributing a fair amount to the cost of raising a child can be a real bone of contention.

[thegreenman]

I don't understand parents who use their children like this, I also don't understand parents who don't contribute with realistic maintenance.

Hi starry,

I fail to understand it too. I have tried but it just goes over my head. I was told by mediation when I contacted them some time ago to try and see it from her position. Obviously my view is obviously bias, but I have tried so hard to try and see it from her point of view. I just can't. It doesn't happen. I try to put myself in her shoes but I always come back to me trying to be amicable as my son would be the most important thing and his happiness. It is made all the harder as she doesn't tell me what the problem is - as I said at the start of the thread I'm not violent, abusive, a bad influence etc. etc. I'm married, have a loving wife etc. There is nothing that I can think of that you could say would be bad for my son.

The most important person is the child. The adults can argue and bicker until the cows come home, but the child needs to have a stable and loving upbringing. That's more difficult when both parents are separated but it needn't affect the child if they can be amicable. It's easy done.



Is there any chance your wife would go to family mediation ? Even if she won't they may be able to offer some help and support to you, they were really good supporting myself and my son even though my ex didn't take part.


I tried mediation but she refused to go.

I did speak to mediation about this at the time and they were very good. But once she told them she wouldn't go it just kind of ended. Could you possibly PM me and tell me how they were of help to you if you don't mind. Maybe they could still provide support in ways I hadn't thought about.



If I was you I would try my hardest to keep communication open with your son, drop the pressies round of give them to someone to give to him. Write to him, get him a mobile if he doesn't have one so you can text.
It is so unfair that you want to be part of his life and can't.


I don't go near the house as I know my ex will scream harassment or something worse. I also don't know anybody who knows her to take them.

What I do do is keep a little diary and write to him in that so he can at least see it when he is older.

My wife has suggested I get him a mobile but his mother would just take it from him.

[starry]

Will pm you the details.

[thegreenman]

I think Julia's question is very relevant since not contributing a fair amount to the cost of raising a child can be a real bone of contention.

Hi Margaret,

I believe Julia's question puts pound signs on children.

It can be a real bone of contention between parents, but that's where it should stay between - parents. Being a bone of contention is far different from using your child to extort money from the other parent. A bone of contention can be discussed, sorted out or, in the case of money, referred to the CSA. As my ex will not go to mediation to discuss anything you kind of assume from that she is simply using my son as a pawn. If she talked and I knew what the issues were thwn that would be an entirely different matter.

A childs right to have a relationship with it's parents has nothing to do with money. They don't say 'dad you can see me if you give me £50'. Kids need love, attention and support.

This isn't about parents having a right to see their children. Parents have no such rights. Children have rights to see their parents. Unfortunately they are unable to exercise those rights themselves and rely on their parents to do it.

One parent has no right to stop their child from having a relationship with the other parent because of money. How could anybody justify that?

If the problem with money comes up, the other parent can go to the CSA. That's what they are there for. The bone of contention about money then goes away.

If I didn't pay a penny towards my son, should he be stopped from seeing me?

[_Ju_]

I am not talking about buying a new nintendo wii. I am talking about getting shoes, eating healthy, having a good education. I know I don't make sense to many, but I didn't think I was that bad!

The only people really hurt in the war of seperation are children. What came first, the egg or the chicken: do I stop contributing financially because ex won't let me see kids. Did ex stop me seeing kids because I wouldn't contribute financially. The answer is that the kids do without and that someone scores points against the other. No matter what the situation, for consistency, both have to take care of the physical needs day to day. In court, if it comes to that, a consistent parent will be highly regarded and considered accordingly.. At least that is what should happen.

[young]

I think Julia's question is very relevant since not contributing a fair amount to the cost of raising a child can be a real bone of contention.

From what i gather here is that the mother is on benefits so any money thegreenman pays to the CSA will not go to the child but straight into the CSAs bank account as if you are on benefits you dont get the money from the CSA what the father pays.
Also as the man is not allowed to see/go near his child and lets just say he started giving the said mother money for the child how can he guarantee that the money is actually being spent on the child?????

i Know of one father who is in this situation and is not allowed to see his child, but he pays money to the CSA and he has opened a bank account for his child and puts a fair amount in each monthfor his sons future.