Calder Brothers - Achinrole/Acharole/Auckingill

[Lucy8]

Hi

I'm trying to find the parents of three Calder brothers:

Donald b abt 1702 Achinrole, Auckingill
Alexander b abt 1708 Milton, Archingale or Miletown, Archingeil
and David b abt 1706 Acharole, Aukingill.

Donald Calder married Katherine Sutherland
Alexander Calder married Margaret Clacher
David Calder married Margaret Henderson or Margaret New

If anyone has any info about who the parents are or could be, or any other brothers or sisters, I would really like to hear from you.

Lucy

[Kingetter]

Hi Lucy,

Is this your Donald perhaps?

> Donald was born about 1707 in Achinrole, Caithness <

James.

[Lucy8]

Hi James

Yes it is my Donald, sometimes the records show abt 1702, sometimes abt 1707 as his year of birth (I think it's the fact that a 2 can be easily mistaken for a 7 and vice versa).

Do you know who his parents are?

Look forward to hearing from you.

Lucy

[Kingetter]

Not yet but do have -
Offspring of Alexander Calder and Margaret Clacher -


Alex. CALDER b: in of Ceylon c: 21 May 1749 in Caithness, Scot.
Sydney CALDER c: 6 Apr 1753 in Caithness, Scot.
Isabella CALDER c: 1 Nov 1754 in Caithness, Scot.
James CALDER b: in of Ceylon c: 23 Jul 1758
Catherine CALDER c: 2 May 1762 in Caithness, Scot.
Elizabeth CALDER
Margaret CALDER b: 3 Aug 1740 in Caithness, Scot. c: 8 Oct 1740 in Caithness, Scot.
Donald CALDER b: 12 Apr 1747 in Watten, Caithness, Scot.


Still working on it.

James.

[fred]

Hi

I'm trying to find the parents of three Calder brothers:

Donald b abt 1702 Achinrole, Auckingill
Alexander b abt 1708 Milton, Archingale or Miletown, Archingeil
and David b abt 1706 Acharole, Aukingill.

Donald Calder married Katherine Sutherland
Alexander Calder married Margaret Clacher
David Calder married Margaret Henderson or Margaret New

If anyone has any info about who the parents are or could be, or any other brothers or sisters, I would really like to hear from you.

Lucy

Are you sure you have your place names right? Acharole is in West Watten and there is an Achingale nearby which was owned by the Calders.

[Lucy8]

Hi Fred

I've been sent an old document by a direct descendant of Alexander Calder which shows - Alexander Calder of Milton, Archingale - and states that he has two brothers, David and Donald. I am going by what he has told me in the emails about the marriages.

So if Acharole is in West Watten and Achingale is nearby, is it actually in West Watten? Perhaps you could also tell me where is Milton/Miletown and Auckingill?

Do you think he has put the wrong brothers with Alexander?

I'd appreciate your help.

Thanks

Lucy

[fred]

Hi Fred

I've been sent an old document by a direct descendant of Alexander Calder which shows - Alexander Calder of Milton, Archingale - and states that he has two brothers, David and Donald. I am going by what he has told me in the emails about the marriages.

So if Acharole is in West Watten and Achingale is nearby, is it actually in West Watten? Perhaps you could also tell me where is Milton/Miletown and Auckingill?

Do you think he has put the wrong brothers with Alexander?

I'd appreciate your help.

Thanks

Lucy

Auckingill or Auckengill is a long way off on the Wick John O'Groats road, I think it is just a miss spelling of Achingale.

If you take a look at the old map below the mill just to the west of Achingale is Milltown and the burn it is on is the Burn of Acharole. To the west is Newton of Achingale, to the north of the loch is Lynegar and to the south east where it says Strath is the Strath of Bilbster.

Now if you go to http://www.graven-images.org.uk and download Henderson's Caithness Family History then use the bar at the bottom to go to page 209 there are three chapters about the Calders who lived in those places.

http://www.graven-images.org.uk/temp/watten.jpg

[Kingetter]

Hi Fred

I've been sent an old document by a direct descendant of Alexander Calder which shows - Alexander Calder of Milton, Archingale - and states that he has two brothers, David and Donald. I am going by what he has told me in the emails about the marriages.




These marriages - have any dates been given you?
Have you any idea of the source/s of the information that is being given you by the descendant? Is it from IGI, Scotlands People, or another source?

James.

[Lucy8]

These marriages - have any dates been given you?
Have you any idea of the source/s of the information that is being given you by the descendant? Is it from IGI, Scotlands People, or another source?

James.
Hi James

I have the dates of the marriages and all the descendants of Alexander and Donald Calder, it's the parents of Alexander, Donald and David that I'm looking for, but if you have any information on David I'd really appreciate that.

Many thanks
Lucy

[Lucy8]

Auckingill or Auckengill is a long way off on the Wick John O'Groats road, I think it is just a miss spelling of Achingale.

If you take a look at the old map below the mill just to the west of Achingale is Milltown and the burn it is on is the Burn of Acharole. To the west is Newton of Achingale, to the north of the loch is Lynegar and to the south east where it says Strath is the Strath of Bilbster.

Now if you go to http://www.graven-images.org.uk and download Henderson's Caithness Family History then use the bar at the bottom to go to page 209 there are three chapters about the Calders who lived in those places.

http://www.graven-images.org.uk/temp/watten.jpg
Hi Fred

I'm so glad you think it's a miss spelling too, I was beginning to wonder if the info I'd been given was correct. Thank you so much for the link and pointing out where all the places are. I'm working my way through the Henderson Book to try and find a link there too - what a find!

Very many thanks for your help, I really do appreciate it.

Lucy

[Tricia]

Quote from James:
Not yet but do have -Offspring of Alexander Calder and Margaret Clacher -
Alex. CALDER b: in of Ceylon c: 21 May 1749 in Caithness, Scot.
Sydney CALDER c: 6 Apr 1753 in Caithness, Scot.
Isabella CALDER c: 1 Nov 1754 in Caithness, Scot.
James CALDER b: in of Ceylon c: 23 Jul 1758
Catherine CALDER c: 2 May 1762 in Caithness, Scot.
Elizabeth CALDER
Margaret CALDER b: 3 Aug 1740 in Caithness, Scot. c: 8 Oct 1740 in Caithness, Scot.
Donald CALDER b: 12 Apr 1747 in Watten, Caithness, Scot.
Still working on it.
James.



Isabella Calder b 1 Nov 1754 m 22 oct 1781 Alexander Cormack inWatten.
Tricia

[Peterd500]

What is the nature of the evidence that the three CALDER gentlemen in the first post to this thread are brothers? I would love to see it, all I have seen so far regarding them is patron-submitted data in the IGI which is merely estimated birth years with no hint of any relationship, possibly these patrons feeding off each other's reverse extrapolations.

I am a descendant of Alexander CALDER and Margaret CLACHER via their daughter Isobel CALDER bap 1754 Watten who married Alexander CORMACK (Alexander was described as from Halkirk at marriage) in 1781 at Watten. The CORMACKS had a number of issue at Watten parish where Alexander was a miller but Alexander was at Reigill in Latheron parish when he died. A lot of progress has been made on their CORMACK issue in recent times. Isobel's brother Donald CALDER has a truckload of descendants in the south of New Zealand (a fair few are at Genesreunited). Their sister Margaret CALDER probably married Magnus PLEWMAN as that marriage makes sense in relation to a passage quoted below. Their sister Sidney CALDER's name was passed on by Barbara to her daughter Sydney who married Donald BREMNER and lived at Achow Swiney in Latheron (near Reigill where her father was when he died). The name Sydney/Sidney continued in at least two further generations of descendants. The two CALDER tea planters that one sometimes sees mentioned in a database or two are mentioned in the passage quoted below.

As far as I know Achingale was the name for the wider area before Watten village took off. These days on maps Achingale is shown as a specific place not far from Watten village. Miletown will be Millton / Milton etc. Achingale Mill is very close to Millton. Auckengill is probably Achingale. Acharole is not Achingale.

Thomas CALDER M.A. Edin. wrote a series of letters to the editor of the Northern Ensign in the period 1889-1893, in relation to the succession of the earldom of Caithness, and one of the letters contains the passage below. 'Mrs CORMACK, Reiss, aged 85' in the text is Elizabeth SINCLAIR, the eldest daughter of John SINCLAIR & Barbara CORMACK, Barbara being a daughter baptised 1786 to Alexander CORMACK & Isobel CALDER who were then at Oldugle (which must have been along the Allt Dhugaill burn which issues from its shallow gully opposite Milton).

"Of his father John, born 1795, and an uncle James, born 1799, a descendant in Devonshire of John Tulloch, Lord Haimer's factor, sends the information that they had "a straight upright bearing, and seemed rather different in their ways from the other people about;" curious testimony of them having traditions above the plain lives which injustice forced them to lead. Their mother Elizabeth Sinclair was born in America, daughter of an officer in the Independence War of 1776, son of James Sinclair, factor, Ulbster House. The factor was married to Christina Sinclair, sister of Donald the Sailor's wife Catherine, and thus the American officer was first cousin to "Saltie," the Broynach earl. Both Mrs Cormack, Reiss, aged 85, and Margaret Sinclair, Wick, baptized November 7th, 1809, the daughter of Francis in Sarclet, previously in Jibedale Farm, the Ulbster factor's eldest son, and of Elizabeth Plowman, assert this cousinship of the families as a certainty. Margaret says that one of her three Sinclair uncles, who were all in the army or navy, heired his superior officer. Admiral Sinclair, a Broynach, as is supposed ; and she adds that Sir Tollemache Sinclair is still drawing the interest of the admiral's money. Some relative made inquiries through the Swedish consul at Wick a few years ago as to the point, without success. The admiral was illegitimate, his mother being Margaret Clacher, and his father, some suppose, the John Sinclair of or in Watten, of whose family Henderson tells so much in his "Notes," pp. 314, 315 and 316, not a Broynach presumably. She afterwards married Alexander Calder, miller and innkeeper, Achingale, and their daughter Margaret was the mother of the above Elizabeth Plowman. During the Lord Nelson period at the beginning of the century Lieutenant Plowman commanded a British warship, and the varied naval connections seem to attach him to Elizabeth as a relative. She was first cousin to Barbara Cormack, wife of " Long John Sinclair," Reiss, whose mother was Isabella Calder, wife of Alexander Cormack, Reisgill. The wealth of the admiral, and also of two Calders, sons of the Achingale miller, East Indian tea-planters, is thought to be recoverable by the living heirs of Barbara and the Ulbster factor's son. In James's " Naval History," Lieutenant Arthur Sinclair, United States navy, appears in 1807 opposing British search for deserters on American vessels, one of the causes of the bitter naval war from 1812. He commanded in it a 16-gun brig, built at Boston in 1799, the Argus, 120 men, under Commodore Rogers; and in July, 1814, he became admiral of a fleet on the Canadian lakes, his ships the Niagara, the Ariel, the St Lawrence, the Caledonia, the Scorpion, and the Tigress. It is not certain that he is Margaret Sinclair's admiral, nor is any portion of the subject quite ripe for discussion, even if it does appear to have relation to the earldom issue."

I can be contacted at
peterd500@yahoo.co.nz

Peter Dillon
Christchurch, New Zealand

[Lucy8]

Peter

I will ask permission of the person who sent me the document if you may have sight of it.

The whole point of this exercise is to try to establish or confirm the link, not to make it up - what would be the point of making it up?

Lucinda

[Lucy8]

Peter

The relative of David Calder, who is a great and dear friend of mine, will be forwarding you the document you have asked to see, and you should receive the same in the course of the next few days.

For the record, this information is not from LDS/IGI it is from one of the relations of David Calder originally from Scotland whose relative, Harry Calder, was a highly respected master at Mount Albert Grammar School in Auckland, both of whom spent time in Caithness gathering information. They also visited the Scottish Record Office in Edinburgh.

In my opinion, I would have thought for such a man as highly respected as Harry Calder was (he appears to be a stickler for facts and not fiction); if he had thought it was rubbish as you are suggesting, he would have thrown it in the bin or excluded it. If he had thought it was dubious, he would not have passed it down the family from generation to generation. What would have been the point?

Lucinda

[Peterd500]

Hi Lucy

I apologise for any possible ambiguity in the first paragraph of my previous message but you read things into it that aren't there.

I didn't comment on the quality of your information, I said I would LOVE to see it. Precisely because of the difficulty of establishing anything from the dubious IGI data I'm looking forward to seeing the fresh data to establish a connection between us. Even without your data those people were contemporaries of each other and it is a good possibility that they were connected. Correspondents have occasionally suggested that they were brothers or cousins on the basis of the IGI but of course it isn't enough to go on.

Peter

[Peterd500]

Hi Lucy

I apologise for any possible ambiguity in the first paragraph of my previous message but you read something into it that isn't there.

I didn't comment on the quality of your information, I said I would LOVE to see it. Precisely because of the difficulty of establishing anything from the dubious IGI data I'm looking forward to seeing the fresh data to establish a connection between us. Even without your data those people were contemporaries of each other and it is a good possibility that they were connected. Correspondents have occasionally suggested that they were brothers or cousins on the basis of the IGI but it isn't enough to go on.

Peter

[Lucy8]

Peter

In your earlier communication, you specifically mentioned the possibility of “…these patrons feeding off each other’s reverse extrapolations.” I see nothing ambiguous in your wording here. Beyond your own scepticism, you had no reason whatever to put forward such a derogatory suggestion. The more courteous, reasonable and less judgemental course would have been merely to request sight of the information. However, adding (as you did) the said derogatory suggestion after the words, “…I would love to see it …” inevitably had the effect of casting doubt on the existence of the evidence you now have, to the point of outright sarcasm.

Consequently, with respect, I don’t think your apology goes nearly far enough; since all you have thus far apologised for is a claimed ambiguity over your choice of words and not the sentiment behind them.

Lucy