Decriminalising drugs

[orkneycadian]

Its a pretty sad day when the only apparant way to deal with the soaring rates of crime in relation to drugs is to decriminalise them;

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-50262647

I guess when we are at it, we could have Europes lowest level of knife crime, by decriminalising knife crime. We could have a zero level of road traffic offences - if only we did away with road traffic laws. In fact, lets just get rid of all laws. Then we would be the most crime free country in the world!

[Alrock]

Decrimalising for personal use...

Knife crime is already perfectly legal for personal use, you can stab yourself as much as you like without breaking the law.

[Goodfellers]

The article doesn't really say why decriminalising would help, other than to reduce the 'stgma' of being a drug user. Police wont know if you are a user or a dealer, so your still going to be searched. Maybe the law should say that in your own home it's ok, but if you are out in a public place, it's still an offence. Dealer then has to deliver to your address. Or maybe that's what the saferoom strategy is about, dealers deliver direct to the room and you can only use there. Will make intelligence gathering rather easy though.

[orkneycadian]

Decrimalising for personal use...

Knife crime is already perfectly legal for personal use, you can stab yourself as much as you like without breaking the law.

I suspect that if I went out into the town with a 12" carving knife, saying to passersby, "Don't worry, I am only going to stab myself", I'll still end up in the dock for breach of the peace at the very least.

[orkneycadian]

Shocking to hear more about the circumstances surrounding the murder of Jodie Chesney in the news today, and the drugs culture that (mistakenly) led up to it. A culture we can well do without.

[Alrock]

...the drugs culture that (mistakenly) led up to it. A culture we can well do without.

Yep, something has to be done about the gangland culture surrounding drugs. Reminds me of the gangland culture that surounded prohibition in the USA...

Legalise, Regulate, Control... Just like alcohol (a legal drug) today.

[mi16]

If alchohol was new to the scene today it would never be allowed on the shelves.
Between that and tobacco more folk are killed than any other drug

[Alrock]

If alchohol was new to the scene today it would never be allowed on the shelves.
Between that and tobacco more folk are killed than any other drug


What about Coffee (caffeine), Chocolate (anandamide), Cheese (psychoactives)... etc

[Fulmar]

What about Coffee (caffeine), Chocolate (anandamide), Cheese (psychoactives)... etc
No, I don't think so.

[orkneycadian]

In the news again today.....

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-50993073

Tory MSP urges PM to make Scots drugs deaths a priority


with a reported 1187 drug related deaths in Scotland in 2018, giving Scotland the unenviable reputation of having the highest level in the EU.

Meanwhile, in the same Scotland, in the same year, 160 people died in road accidents. 1/7.5 of those that died in drug related deaths.

The push seems to be to decriminalise drugs, and that will somehow make it better. It will certainly make the crime stats an awful lot better. Overnight, drug crime will be eliminated.

So lets do the same with road traffic laws. Instead of penalising drivers, lets support them. Instead of fining them for speeding, lets send them on courses to enable them to drive fast, safely, paid for out of the public purse. If someone is caught driving home from the pub, lets not punish them, instead, lets support them. The police could give them a free run home and make sure they get tucked up safely in bed. The roads will be much safer, thanks to "Police-Uber" and our drink driving stats will look excellent.

Sounds daft doesn't it? Yet, thats what is being proposed for the "drugs emergency"

[Goodfellers]

When I was growing up, everyone knew that one kid who 'did' drugs. Nowadays it seems it's 'normal' What happened.

Just googled my own question, this seems an official site. https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201919/cmselect/cmscotaf/44/4405.htm


14.The single biggest structural driver of problem drug use is poverty and deprivation.35 (https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201919/cmselect/cmscotaf/44/4405.htm#footnote-371) Problem drug use is more prevalent “among people from more deprived area



If people are in poverty, how do they afford this habit, I understand some turn to crime, but if all drug users in poverty turned to crime, then surely there would be a permanent crime wave?

[Gronnuck]

Drugs legislation is a reserved matter. We would hope that Westminster would attempt to address the issue. But it hasn't so far. Decriminalising drugs use is fraught with problems. Since orkneycadian,you have raised the issue I wonder what solutions you might have?

[orkneycadian]

Enforcement of the laws we already have would be a good start. For far too long, enforcement has been near on non existent. The police know who is out there using and supply drugs, but don't do anything (or much) about it. Far more lucrative crimes to go chasing.

If anyone is caught with drugs, confiscate them. Then confiscate non essential luxury items like mobile phones, tablets, TV's, X Boxes and the likes that these supposed poverty stricken crims have. Say to the value of 10 times the value of the drugs. Without having to feed a drug habit, or renew the Sky TV subscription, then maybe they will haul themselves out of poverty.

Make there a deterrent. At the moment, there is none.

[mi16]

Enforcement of the laws we already have would be a good start. For far too long, enforcement has been near on non existent. The police know who is out there using and supply drugs, but don't do anything (or much) about it. Far more lucrative crimes to go chasing.

If anyone is caught with drugs, confiscate them. Then confiscate non essential luxury items like mobile phones, tablets, TV's, X Boxes and the likes that these supposed poverty stricken crims have. Say to the value of 10 times the value of the drugs. Without having to feed a drug habit, or renew the Sky TV subscription, then maybe they will haul themselves out of poverty.

Make there a deterrent. At the moment, there is none.

And how do you prove what is owned by the “offender” because you can bet when they are in court that anything they have that would be deemed luxury would be borrowed from a mate

[mi16]

The war on drugs is one that cannot be won. Drugs are as common to today’s youth as alcohol was to my generation.
Decriminalisation and regulation is the way forward, make money out of them and drive the dealers out of business.

[orkneycadian]

Gambling is both decriminalised and regulated, but still those who indulge in it have difficulty controlling themselves, as was mentioned so much on the news yesterday.

Decriminalising drugs would simply be an admission that the justice system is broken beyond repair and paving the way to decriminalising all other crimes.

[orkneycadian]

And how do you prove what is owned by the “offender” because you can bet when they are in court that anything they have that would be deemed luxury would be borrowed from a mate

Just get tough and stop all the pussy footing around. It's that pussy footing that had allowed the drugs culture to expand. Moral of the tale will then be if you lend luxury goods to your druggie mates, so they can spend their income on illegal drugs, then you may well lose your goods.

I think if I lend a car to a friend, they drive it without insurance, they get caught and the car gets crushed, I have no comeback on the law for crushing it.

[mi16]

yes because you as the car owner knowingly let someone drive it without adequate cover, makes you as guilty as the driver.

Not the same as having your telly and xbox confiscated because your flatmate was caught with some drugs is it?

[mi16]

Gambling is both decriminalised and regulated, but still those who indulge in it have difficulty controlling themselves, as was mentioned so much on the news yesterday.

Decriminalising drugs would simply be an admission that the justice system is broken beyond repair and paving the way to decriminalising all other crimes.

Some have problems with gambling yes, some have problems with alcohol addiction also, sex addiction too. But the majority can partake in a bet, drink or boning session without being addicts.
Same story for lots of drugs, loads of people take cocaine or whatever on a weekend and function perfectly normally Monday to Friday.
then there are the drug addicts that would sell their gran to get a hit.

No different really just an alternate addiction.

[mi16]

regulation so the drug user can get good quality drugs, free from contaminants at a safe dose and a healthy dollop of tax for the coffers is the way forward.