BREXIT / Germans get "tough"

[rob murray]

So EU powerbroker Germany is now talking tough : Chancellor Merkel whose position on Friday was the EU's calm voice, has now seemingly ruled out any negotiations, informal or otherwise, with London until Downing Street triggers the article and officially starts the exit procedure.
While Mrs Merkel has said that there's no need to "be nasty" to Britain, all the indications are from senior political voices in Berlin that Germany is preparing to talk tough.
MPs of almost every political party have made it clear that the UK is in for a rough ride when it comes to negotiating its exit from the EU. Just hope ol Boris has a few thought out tricks up his sleeve, as his lack of BREXIT : decoupling strategy could bite him ( and us ) !

[tonkatojo]

So EU powerbroker Germany is now talking tough : Chancellor Merkel whose position on Friday was the EU's calm voice, has now seemingly ruled out any negotiations, informal or otherwise, with London until Downing Street triggers the article and officially starts the exit procedure.
While Mrs Merkel has said that there's no need to "be nasty" to Britain, all the indications are from senior political voices in Berlin that Germany is preparing to talk tough.
MPs of almost every political party have made it clear that the UK is in for a rough ride when it comes to negotiating its exit from the EU. Just hope ol Boris has a few thought out tricks up his sleeve, as his lack of BREXIT : decoupling strategy could bite him ( and us ) !


Why panic, look at the trade figures and see who will be cutting their noses off to spite their faces, Merkel is a shrewd politician and far from daft. It is just a week since a report was the German trade minister was wanting a special arrangement for the UK.

[rob murray]

Why panic, look at the trade figures and see who will be cutting their noses off to spite their faces, Merkel is a shrewd politician and far from daft. It is just a week since a report was the German trade minister was wanting a special arrangement for the UK.

No panic seems the 27 will now give UK some time to trigger Article 50 now, as they want so see how things pan out ( badly as it seems post BREXIT ) to act as a deterrent to their own anti EU right wing parties

[theone]

No panic seems the 27 will now give UK some time to trigger Article 50 now, as they want so see how things pan out ( badly as it seems post BREXIT ) to act as a deterrent to their own anti EU right wing parties

It's not about "giving the UK some time".

Nobody can trigger article 50 other than the UK.

It is understandable that the EU want it done as quickly as possible, and perhaps to be expected that the will try to block any discussions until it is. But once article 50 is in place it's course is no longer 100% under the UK's control.

I would suggest it is not in the UK's interests to trigger article 50 until it is ready to do so. Stability within the government, the opposition and an agreed way forward/plan from the UK parliament should be in place first. Until we have a new prime minister or even general election, I can't see Article 50 being announced.

[Fulmar]

Stability in Labour will be a long time in coming and again, another opportunity for the SNP to step up to the mark in Westminster as seemingly have more of their act together than the other parties just now.

[rob murray]

It's not about "giving the UK some time".

Nobody can trigger article 50 other than the UK.

It is understandable that the EU want it done as quickly as possible, and perhaps to be expected that the will try to block any discussions until it is. But once article 50 is in place it's course is no longer 100% under the UK's control.

I would suggest it is not in the UK's interests to trigger article 50 until it is ready to do so. Stability within the government, the opposition and an agreed way forward/plan from the UK parliament should be in place first. Until we have a new prime minister or even general election, I can't see Article 50 being announced.

Yes thats true but tone of EU was "make it hard" on UK ie implied threats, trigger article 50 asap or things will be made difficult for UK.Seems to be softing. Anyway news stories on a possible election and referendum re run based on what out will really look like ?

[sprint95m]

Nigel Farage may gain big headlines today but it is worth noting also the reaction to Alyn Smith's short speech?

Brexit vote: Bitter exchanges as EU parliament debates Brexit - BBC News (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36648664)

Standing ovation for SNP MEP Alyn Smith's 'I beg you' speech - BBC News (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-36649450)

[rob murray]

Nigel Farage may gain big headlines today but it is worth noting also the reaction to Alyn Smith's short speech?

Brexit vote: Bitter exchanges as EU parliament debates Brexit - BBC News (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36648664)

Standing ovation for SNP MEP Alyn Smith's 'I beg you' speech - BBC News (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-36649450)

Yep Smith has got good coverage, Farages coverage shows just what a self centered clown he is...who's laughing now eh ?? pathetic

[tonkatojo]

Yep Smith has got good coverage, Farages coverage shows just what a self centered clown he is...who's laughing now eh ?? pathetic


I was very embarrassed by the bloke Smith, almost on his knees whinging and begging in full public, I fear Scotland will have to get used to that position if she ever gets EU membership, talk about ridiculing yourself in public, come on, where has the backbone gone.

Fargage opens his mouth yet again and didn't engage his brain, but he is quite correct they did laugh at his past speeches and few are laughing now it is so serious for the EU and they know it, but Farage should keep his own council now he has what he wanted.

[rob murray]

I was very embarrassed by the bloke Smith, almost on his knees whinging and begging in full public, I fear Scotland will have to get used to that position if she ever gets EU membership, talk about ridiculing yourself in public, come on, where has the backbone gone.

Fargage opens his mouth yet again and didn't engage his brain, but he is quite correct they did laugh at his past speeches and few are laughing now it is so serious for the EU and they know it, but Farage should keep his own council now he has what he wanted.

Farage is playing to type, opening his mouth without engaging his brain is par for the course

[rob murray]

I was very embarrassed by the bloke Smith, almost on his knees whinging and begging in full public, I fear Scotland will have to get used to that position if she ever gets EU membership, talk about ridiculing yourself in public, come on, where has the backbone gone.

Fargage opens his mouth yet again and didn't engage his brain, but he is quite correct they did laugh at his past speeches and few are laughing now it is so serious for the EU and they know it, but Farage should keep his own council now he has what he wanted.
Seems EU will "entertain" Scotland's case for continued EU involvement : First Minister Nicola Sturgeon will now meet European Commission president Jean-Claude Juncker on her visit to Brussels to discuss Brexit.
Ms Sturgeon has arrived in Brussels and will also hold talks with EU Parliament president Martin Schulz and MEPs. She said she was "determined" to protect Scotland's interests in Europe. The first minister had been hoping to talk to President of the European Council Donald Tusk but he said it was not appropriate at this time.Talks with Mr Juncker had been expected in the coming weeks, but a meeting has now been scheduled for Wednesday evening.

[tonkatojo]

Seems EU will "entertain" Scotland's case for continued EU involvement : First Minister Nicola Sturgeon will now meet European Commission president Jean-Claude Juncker on her visit to Brussels to discuss Brexit.
Ms Sturgeon has arrived in Brussels and will also hold talks with EU Parliament president Martin Schulz and MEPs. She said she was "determined" to protect Scotland's interests in Europe. The first minister had been hoping to talk to President of the European Council Donald Tusk but he said it was not appropriate at this time.Talks with Mr Juncker had been expected in the coming weeks, but a meeting has now been scheduled for Wednesday evening.

You need to hope she doesn't be obliged to be in the bent over assumed position for begging as introduced by the bloke Smith, but then again she might as well start as she means to go on, it will be the norm if her plans come to fruition.

[rob murray]

You need to hope she doesn't be obliged to be in the bent over assumed position for begging as introduced by the bloke Smith, but then again she might as well start as she means to go on, it will be the norm if her plans come to fruition.

Depending on what you read / believe... apparently " a string of overseas administrations indicated that they believe Scotland's EU status remains an internal issue for the UK, with only Slovakia emerging as a surprise potential ally, the "majority of EU states hold the view that as there’s no legally binding decision about the independence of Scotland on behalf of the Scottish people... questions remain theoretical and premature." ( The Herald ) Cameron banging on about BREXIT being for the entire UK as well. Can see many hurdles ahead, at least she's trying but I rather suspect that order of play will be BREXIT or, and I doubt it a second referendum, followed potentially by indy2 in Scotland. Like it or not we are part of UK, BREXIT has to play out, EU will not become involved in an internal UK matter, BREXIT will eat up parliamentary time by the bucket load, tories have the powers, and could have more if a snap general election is called, and we will have to wait in line before we can have indy 2. So stuck with UK for at least 2 years, then if its positive, indy status followed by laborious process of EU entry, with an element of uncertainty between leaving UK and entering EU. Not an easy quick fix and assumes an indy win, 2 years is a long time and we unfortunately don't have a crystal ball to see 2 years ahead.

[tonkatojo]

Depending on what you read / believe... apparently " a string of overseas administrations indicated that they believe Scotland's EU status remains an internal issue for the UK, with only Slovakia emerging as a surprise potential ally, the "majority of EU states hold the view that as there’s no legally binding decision about the independence of Scotland on behalf of the Scottish people... questions remain theoretical and premature." ( The Herald ) Cameron banging on about BREXIT being for the entire UK as well. Can see many hurdles ahead, at least she's trying but I rather suspect that order of play will be BREXIT or, and I doubt it a second referendum, followed potentially by indy2 in Scotland. Like it or not we are part of UK, BREXIT has to play out, EU will not become involved in an internal UK matter, BREXIT will eat up parliamentary time by the bucket load, tories have the powers, and could have more if a snap general election is called, and we will have to wait in line before we can have indy 2. So stuck with UK for at least 2 years, then if its positive, indy status followed by laborious process of EU entry, with an element of uncertainty between leaving UK and entering EU. Not an easy quick fix and assumes an indy win, 2 years is a long time and we unfortunately don't have a crystal ball to see 2 years ahead.


I think you have summed up the position precise and exact, it will be interesting to hear what she says on her return, if she tells us the outcome, I doubt we will hear the full story but edited favourable highlights to kee the faithful happy. Never mind it will all come out in the wash as they say.

[roshep]

god forbid that ever happens.

[rob murray]

Latest : The French president and Spanish prime minister have both said they are opposed to the EU negotiating potential membership for Scotland.
Spanish premier Mariano Rajoy said he "believes everyone is extremely against it" and that "if the UK leaves, Scotland leaves". ( is he really speaking on behalf of everone..or protecting Spain from Catalonia separatists ?? )
President Francois Hollande of France insisted the EU would make no advance deal with Scotland. ( why doesn't this surprise me ? )

Looks like a very tough road ahead, but again at least sturgeon is trying to keep scotland in EU, EU bureaucracy cannot / will not bend I will predict, and no special deal will emerge for Scotland, they've bigger fish to fry with negotiating the fine detail of BREXIT. There is limited time available and Scotlands case will go to back of queue, come and talk / apply when your an independent country....as everthing outwith that is theory and speculation, that seems to be the emerging case.

[Fulmar]

Entirely what I expected anyway.

[tonkatojo]

Latest : The French president and Spanish prime minister have both said they are opposed to the EU negotiating potential membership for Scotland.
Spanish premier Mariano Rajoy said he "believes everyone is extremely against it" and that "if the UK leaves, Scotland leaves". ( is he really speaking on behalf of everone..or protecting Spain from Catalonia separatists ?? )
President Francois Hollande of France insisted the EU would make no advance deal with Scotland. ( why doesn't this surprise me ? )

Looks like a very tough road ahead, but again at least sturgeon is trying to keep scotland in EU, EU bureaucracy cannot / will not bend I will predict, and no special deal will emerge for Scotland, they've bigger fish to fry with negotiating the fine detail of BREXIT. There is limited time available and Scotlands case will go to back of queue, come and talk / apply when your an independent country....as everthing outwith that is theory and speculation, that seems to be the emerging case.


Marie Le pen has said if she gets power there will be a French referendum,now if that happens the excrement certainly will hit the fan.