The Org Poll on Independence

[Even Chance]

Can only ask guys! Respect to you though. :)
Theres been violence on both sides. Awful really, but its instigated by numpties, usually hell bent on some vendetta regardless. All they need is a difference of opinion about anything to spark it. Its also human nature unfortunately. As they say, some folk are just eejits, full stop.

[teenybash]

This is worth a read...Was not written by me, but think everyone should go over this before Sept 18th.

I'm not taking any credit for this, I just saw someone's post on the Vote NO to Scottish independence and protect the union (https://www.facebook.com/VoteNo2014) page and I thought it was genius!!
"I always find that if you flip the debate around with a no or undecided voter it always has the desired result. Try this next time you speak with a no voter, ask them how they would vote in this situation.....there can only be one outcome.
Imagine Scotland was already independent and we were about to have a referendum on whether to join a union with the rest of the UK.
Could the Pro-union side convince us that getting together would be better when we were told what would happen to Scotland after such a union? Some bullet points from the campaign…
-Your main Parliament will move 600 miles away, and your MPs will be in a tiny minority & will therefore have limited ability to effect policy on your behalf
-Scotland will get a government it didn’t vote for.
-All of your oil and gas revenues will be handed over to the treasury in London.
-Even though not 1 inch of track will touch Scottish soil your taxpayers will contribute £4.2bn to the HS2 project.
-Your taxpayers will also subsidise the crossrail project to the tune of £4.2bn
-The biggest nuclear weapons facility in Western Europe will be built on the river Clyde, just 30 miles from your largest city.
-Even though you only have 8.2% of the UK’s population you will contribute 9.9% of the UK’s total tax take yet will only receive 9.3% of that tax take back to spend in Scotland (you will lose £4.4bn per year to the UK treasury)
-You will devolve all of the economic levers you have used to shape your economy directly to London and will now only have control of 7% of your economy
-Even though 79% of your MP's voted against it we will privitise your publicly owned mail service
-Even though 91% of your MPs voted against the bedroom tax in your parliament, we will impose it.
-Even though 82% of your MP's believed that a VAT increase would be detrimental to your economy, we will impose a VAT increase.
-You will join a country whose health and education services are rapidly being privatised.
-Now and again you’ll get dragged into an illegal foreign war.
-An austerity budget will be imposed from London cutting jobs and threatening vital public services even though 81% of your MP's voted against the cuts.
-The financial regulation system will be so weak and so lax that your whole economy will be brought to the brink of collapse.
-The most weak and vulnerable in society, instead of getting the protection and support they deserve will be interrogated and humiliated in an effort to get them off the meagre levels of support to which they are entitled.
Who in Scotland would vote for such a package?
Who would vote for that union?
So why would anyone vote to remain in such a union now?
This is about democratic ownership, social responsibility and the fact that Scotland on its own will be economically stronger from day one of independence....."

[Gronnuck]

I'm not becoming more positive in favour of a yes vote, I still don't believe it is the best thing for the nation. I'm just accepting it is a real possibility.

As I say, if (when) the negotiations are completed and the reality, as opposed to the promises, become apparent, I predict trouble. I hope I'm wrong.

The same could be said of the aftermath of the 2015 General Election; a hung parliament with a major schism in the Tory party and a dispute as to which parties will form an administration. The question of an in out referendum on the EU. Meanwhile UKIP with a few more seats contibuting a load of hot air and labour sulking but making a lot of noise hoping someone will listen.
Trouble? We've already got trouble.

[David Banks]

Sorry for being unable to reply in depth to any questions it would appear each time I attempt a detailed post the system logs my out, yesterday for some reason the system refused to accept my username and password and the admin had to be contacted to reset this. I am unsure why this problem only seems to occur on this Org but if you feel there is political bias being shown on this org I suggest you contact Better Together Media Team 0141 332 4634

Don`t worry. Nothing nefarious is going on here.

Just check the Remember Me box when you sign in -- I had the same problem (years ago), and a friendly orger helped me out.

[Moira]

Either you're not ticking the Remember Me box under the username when logging in, or possibly you have set your cookies not to be stored - either one will most likely cause you to log out in between posts unless they're close together...

Good advice Bob.

I'm still here and posting with no problems, apart from my own dodgy internet connection. I'm a definite NO btw.

[Tubthumper]

I think Jim Murphy would make a good first minister of an independent Scotland.

[Rheghead]

I think Jim Murphy would make a good first minister of an independent Scotland.

It depends on where his allegience lies upon a Yes vote.

[Rheghead]

It seems that oil reserves worth £trillions have been underestimated by 100%. West of Shetland can provide energy for at least 100 years.

http://www.oilandgaspeople.com/news/1039/scottish-west-coast-untapped-oil-and-gas-reserves-worth-trillions/

[Heisenberg]

It seems that oil reserves worth £trillions have been underestimated by 100%. West of Shetland can provide energy for at least 100 years.http://www.oilandgaspeople.com/news/1039/scottish-west-coast-untapped-oil-and-gas-reserves-worth-trillions/ Can yer nae just shuttit about the wretched oil man, yer like a broken record.

[Tubthumper]

Now now Heisenberg - back in yer box. Oh wait, that was Schrodinger wasn't it...

[Heisenberg]

Now now Heisenberg - back in yer box. Oh wait, that was Schrodinger wasn't it... oh you mean Erwin, I'm Wolfgang, also he was Austrian and I'm German, but I will get back In my box.

[Rheghead]

Can yer nae just shuttit about the wretched oil man, yer like a broken record.

Nothing to see here, move along.

[Heisenberg]

Nothing to see here, move along. right back atcha rhegs, nothing to see here move along, I would add in agreement with theone, and your self, " ne sutor ultra crepidam" as I'm sure you know means (generally) don't give opinions outside your knowledge or judgement.

[richardj]

Is it not time for someone (admin) to start a New Poll - to see how people now stand for the Yes/No vote - I personally have not changed my mind - still No, but it has wavered in the last week or two. I personally have not been impressed with Darling on the TV debates, I agree with him, but not impressed. The one thing that may still swing my vote is the Nuclear/Trident Free Scotland. I try and not be naive about deterrence and as I get older (not saying wiser!) I have come to think that deterrence with Trident is necessary. When I was younger I definitely was anti-bomb.

Anyway - how about a NEW poll to see how people now feel now that we are only days away from the vote?

[squidge]

It was interesting to Hear Margaret Beckett on Radio 4 talk about her own personal move away from uni;ateral disarmament which was, of course the labour party position on nuclear disarmament for a long time. She said that in the 80s with CND she fully supported unilateral disarmament and in fact in those days that was seen as the nly way we were going to get rid of the abomination that is nuclear weapons. She also said that those supporting multinational disarmament were thought of as fools - that it would never happen and that it was simply a way of saying you didnt support nuclear weapons when you did really. We went on to see multi national nuclear reduction in a way that was surprising to those of us who were around and marched with CND at that time. I wonder - and it is just something to think about Richard, whether we have come as far as we are able now with Multi national disarmament and whether its time to revisit unilateral disarmament. Scotland has the opportunity to disarm Scotland and potentially the UK. I dont know. But its worth thinking about.

[Humerous Vegetable]

It depends on where his allegience lies upon a Yes vote.

To his pocket, no doubt. No change there, then. I can't personally imagine a more horrible scenario myself, than having a load of unemployed Labour and LibDem MPs suddenly fighting for seats in an independent Scottish parliament, having spent their entire political careers doing nothing at all for their constituents or their country if it impacted adversely on their bank accounts.
Hopefully they will all be too busy trying to get a seat and all the associated perks, in the House of Lords, which we will not be paying for.

[mi16]

With the recent political cleansing that has been carried out on here, I would expect a new poll to be a resounding yes, somewhere in the 80/20 region.Thankfully the no voters cannot be banned from the ballot box.

[Rheghead]

Thankfully the no voters cannot be banned from the ballet box.

They must be quite expensive seats?

[mi16]

They must be quite expensive seats? Jings, crivvens and help my boab, surely not a typographic errorI better scurry away and correct that misplaced vowel.

[Rheghead]

Jings, crivvens and help my boab, surely not a typographic errorI better scurry away and correct that misplaced vowel.

I wasn't doing the spelling police thing, I'm not bothered how posters spell as long as it is understandable. I just thought it was funny.

[Rheghead]

Top stock market analysts back Alex Salmond about his claims on Scottish oil.

https://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/business/north-of-scotland/334681/stock-market-analysts-back-salmond-on-oil/

[neilsermk1]

top stock market analysts and banks also created the last global financial catastrophe

[Tubthumper]

Anyway - how about a NEW poll to see how people now feel now that we are only days away from the vote? Sorted that for you.

[richardj]

Thanks Tubthumper - I've voted on the new Poll, I seem to be the only NO vote!

[squidge]

There is time yet Richard. I'm sure we'll see a few more :)

[Even Chance]

Cheers Tubs, new poll already beginning to show a trend. Now theres a surprise. Folk are a wee bit more learned now than they were before.

[squidge]

Come along to the Indy cafés tomorrow. 10am PPP wick, 2pm Pentland Hotel Thurso. No guest speakers, just a quick hello then talk to other people and ask questions about the referendum issues that are important to you. Yes, no, undecided are all welcome.