Paid Holiday for councillors

[clash67]

Just got home after a particularly hard day, sat down with the paper and I can't believe what I read, with the state that the county is in and councillors forever saying that services need to be cut due to the lack of funds it comes to light that some councillors are taking of to NEW YORK no less for the Tartan week Celebration at the expense of us the taxpayer, at a cost of £35,000. They are basically saying that this will encourage people from the USA to visit Caithness, I am gobsmacked! shouldn't that money be spent more wisely, what will these councillors be doing to promote Caithness when they are over there?Not much I expect judging by the way they represent the County when they are here...money down the drain..and next they will be saying that taxes will have to be raised AGAIN! In my opinion this is a slap in the face for the taxpayer and it should be stopped. Are these councilors not ashamed of themselves! What next? an all expenses paid holiday to Australia perhaps to one of their Scottish festivals. These councillors should be sorting out the mess the County is in before swanning of to America to promote it.

[Royster1911]

Why not use the 35k to send 70k yanks over here (cheap rate budget flight) or just send me and I will spread the word. 5 grand would do nicely. If they need to go, how about bag packing? Mr T jackson was doing it today for somthing to do with Brilon. I hope its not to send the committee over there. My better half gave them 30p which is 30p more than I would have given them.[evil]

[Alice in Blunderland]

I see they are going in April so they will be back in time for their campaigning for the May elections. :D Wonder how many constituents will get a postcard. :eek:

[footie chick]

I see they are going in April so they will be back in time for their campaigning for the May elections. Wonder how many constituents will get a postcard.


Postcards :mad: I'm sick of getting phone calls this week asking who I'll be voting for right at dinner time :mad:

[cuddlepop]

Postcards :mad: I'm sick of getting phone calls this week asking who I'll be voting for right at dinner time :mad:
Just tell them the next time they phone asking you who your voting for tell them "yourself" that 'll get them confused.lol
Footie chick for council!

[footie chick]

Just tell them the next time they phone asking you who your voting for tell them "yourself" that 'll get them confused.lol
Footie chick for council!

Don't think it would be too hard to get them confused[lol]
If I did stand for council the first thing I'd change is being unable to take two kids under 8 to the swimming pool with 1 adult {What are the council paying the pool attendants for? temperature control? they are failling miserably sp} And they have the cheek to go on about childhood obesity!!!!

[Bill Fernie]

Just got home after a particularly hard day, sat down with the paper and I can't believe what I read, with the state that the county is in and councillors forever saying that services need to be cut due to the lack of funds it comes to light that some councillors are taking of to NEW YORK no less for the Tartan week Celebration at the expense of us the taxpayer, at a cost of £35,000. They are basically saying that this will encourage people from the USA to visit Caithness, I am gobsmacked! shouldn't that money be spent more wisely, what will these councillors be doing to promote Caithness when they are over there?Not much I expect judging by the way they represent the County when they are here...money down the drain..and next they will be saying that taxes will have to be raised AGAIN! In my opinion this is a slap in the face for the taxpayer and it should be stopped. Are these councilors not ashamed of themselves! What next? an all expenses paid holiday to Australia perhaps to one of their Scottish festivals. These councillors should be sorting out the mess the County is in before swanning of to America to promote it.

I think clash67 should have made it clear that no Caithness councillors are involved in the story in the John O'Groat Journal today (16 February 2007). The councillors suggested for the trip to New York to represent the Highlands at Tartan Week are the Highland convenor Alison Magee and the chairman of Education, Culture and Sport - Andy Anderson. In addition three staff members of highland 2007 and one local Visit Scotland official and one ECS official.

Speaking as a councillor for a Wick ward I have not personally been on any foreign trips in the three and half years I have been on the council. That does not mean that no one should go to represent Highland if it means promoting the area. Visitors from other countries come to Highland regularly and are paid for by their own governments of local areas. Companies send representatives on trips and missions abroad for all sorts of reasons and they hope to gain some benefit from doing so by way of increased sales or contracts of one sort or another.

To say that we should never send anyone might mean we gradually decrease the numbers of people coming to this country due to lack of profile in other countries. Delegations from many Scottish towns and cities regularly go to other places abroad and they in turn come to this country. I totally agree that any particular visit should be weighed agsinst the potential benefit to the arera and in this case we are talking about the Highlands rather than Caithness. This year Highland 2007 is major investment by Highland Council, The Scottish Executive, HIE and many businesses that have put money in to make it a success. A large part of that success will be in encouraging people from other countries with a Highland or Scottish connection to make visit this year or in the future.

Everyone can make there own mind up as to whether a trip is good business or a junket but anyone I have spoken to that has been on a trip on behalf of the council or for a private business tells a similar story - they are hard work. Of course they are enjoyable and interesting at the same time.

Would I go on such a trip if asked? I would consider the benefit to my area and the possibilities for enhancing relationships and perhaps encouraging people in the right places to promote exchanges and increase our tourism potential. In the end it is about employment and if that is improved so mucch the better. Highland has a large tourist industry but Caithness has only small percentage of that. The fact that councillor Andy Anderson has strong Caithness connections might help us in the long run if he and Alison Magee the convenor can push up the numbers thinking about making a trip here. I certainly hope so.

[peter macdonald]

At £35000 ?? It will take a lot of tourists to take back that money Bill . Sorry but seems a total waste of tax payers money. Money that could have been spent helping the flood damage in Golspie / Dingwall etc or has that been forgotten about????

[Rampant Rabbit]

I Wonder How Much Taxes Some People Dont Paid And Then Have Ago At Councillors If You Can Do The Job Why Dont You Put Your Name Forward The Same As They Done You Never Know You Might Get In Yourself Amen

[Torvaig]

I think the council have to be seen to be marketing the Highlands and this seems to be a good way of doing it. After all, the Americans love Scotland and the more we can bring it to their doorstep, the better.

It is easy to say that it is a lot of money for a "jaunt" but if the councillors didn't take part in any marketing I'm sure that would be a fault too. Not an easy decision to make but I'm sure it was made with the best of intentions.

After all, the councillors would be well aware of the accusations which would be thrown at them but still decided on what they thought was best for our tourism trade, which, after all, is very important to our economy.

[clash67]

Thanks for the correction Bill however my point stands and anyway isn't Andy Anderson a councillor? , taxpayers money is being abused, right of the top of my head I could think of numerous ways to spend £35,000 to promote tourism to the Highlands and none of them involve sending" a Highland Council delegation" to America at the taxpayers expense and at a time when the Highland Council is constantly pleading poverty.
Who's hair brained idea was this anyway!
These so called representitives taking off to the states to promote the Highlands is a farce and we all know it, do you honestly think that spending all that money will influence enough Americans to come to the Highlands to be able to recoup this type of expenditure? keeping in mind that there would be a certain amount of American tourists who would be coming here regardless so why not spend the money on improving the Highlands so that those tourists will be influenced to return as well as recommending the Highlands to other would be visitors.
The public is increasingly becoming agrivated at how our taxes is being misused and the services being cut, but one of these days the Highland Council is going to push too far, the public money is not a piggy bank that can be dipped into everytime some OFFICIAL decides to take trips at our expense.
I say this with all due respect to those within the council that work hard at trying to improve things.

[clash67]

I Wonder How Much Taxes Some People Dont Paid And Then Have Ago At Councillors If You Can Do The Job Why Dont You Put Your Name Forward The Same As They Done You Never Know You Might Get In Yourself Amen

I wonder how many people are struggling to pay taxes because they are living on the poverty line as it is, they see their hard earned money being used to fund holidays for members of the highland council or to fund big expensive meetings where redicoulis decisions are made despite the publics outrage ie Asdas application for a Thurso store, as far taxes go I pay my share along with everyone else though God knows why sometimes.
and I am tiring of the argument " if you can do the job why don't you put your name forward" well heres why we can't all drop our occupations to go run for council , the community needs all trades and everyone does their bit from coal merchants to plummers, we are doing OUR job to pay the taxes that allow us to have councillors, if an electrician rewired a house and made a horendous job of it he couldn't exactly tell his customer "well if you think you could do better". Point being if you can't do the job right then what are we paying all our hard earned money for, just remember WE pay their wages ( and everthing else) and so provide jobs for them, we don't need excuses like "well you do it then" we need to see that we are getting what most of these councillors promised us when they were after our votes.

[clash67]

anyway Rampent Rabbit you should practice what you preach, I noticed you said in one of your previous posts something like "what have your councillors done for you lately because from what I see they haven't done much", so I expect we will see you running for council then "if you think you can do better".

[cliffhbuber]

The oak stands tall, but the limbs are a bit bare of leaves.

It might be promotionally useful to advertise at the headwaters of the great Canadian fur trade company begun by energetic and enterprising Highlanders out of Scotland and Montreal.
The NorthWest Fur Company ran its operations c 1790 to 1816 when the Hudson Bay Co. took over Ft. William and the fur trade at the western end of Lake Superior in Canada.
The "Bay" had a number of Orkneymen working out of the Hudson Bay lowlands and into what became Manitoba.
Sadly, the promotion of the Highlands for scenic tourism and back-to-roots trips has been negligible in the area of Northwestern Ontario that was opened up by Scots, French Canadians, and Metis
Phone books in the region of over 250 000 are full of Scot names, especially Highland names.
All forms of media, including the internet, can be used to promote Caithness and the Highlands.

[Rampant Rabbit]

Sorry Clash 67 Not Got The Brains Like You Good Self To Do The Job.but You Could Handle The Job. You Might Even Get Some Help With Your Band To Go To Europe With

[clash67]

Sorry Clash 67 Not Got The Brains Like You Good Self To Do The Job.but You Could Handle The Job. You Might Even Get Some Help With Your Band To Go To Europe With

No thanks, I'm no smarter than the next guy but I ain't dumb either, I can see when money is being wasted, I have already played in the States and probably done more for tourism then than I expect the council possie will do when they go. as a result of my visit to the States I persuaded a group of no less than sixteen people to come to Thurso for a holiday, I wasn't thinking of the local economy admittedly I just wanted them to come over to have a nice holiday and see the sites, the fact they spent a fortune while they were here was a bonus and was good for local shops.
If they did give my band the money I would certainly show them how to promote the Highlands to America, and perhaps if they funded a band with touring experience and good communication skills that would produce more results, after the performance in the states lots of People came to talk to me asking about where I was from and what it was like in Scotland, music can be a great way of opening people up and sparking interest, so the council could do a lot worse than to fund the band to do the job. I even done a presentation at a "show and tell" session in a Colorado School where I talked about Caithness history, its wildlife and the landscape etc. which went down a treat and the pupils asked lots of questions afterwards, I enjoyed it.
Of course if I was to apply for funding from the department of Education, Culture and sport to fund a tour to the USA to promote the Highlands I wouldn't stand a snowballs chance in hell!

[Errogie]

They've been making this trip for some years now and I know a number of musicians who have been lucky enough to take part playing in a variety of venues including Grand Central Station.

I don't know whether anyone has done the research to find out exactly how many visitors have been directly brought over as a result of each visit but some of the participants are asking why they don't turn their attention to other locations other than New York. It can't be good marketing to hit the same location year after year.

If the figures do show that it is worth doing then what about trying Chicago, San Francisco or even Toronto where there is a huge Scottish connected community. Perhaps it's just too easy to roll out the same formula year after year? Do the people who are putting this together really know what they are doing because otherwise it does begin to look like just another junket? Let's have the cost benefit analysis before any more bad publicity sticks to this trip.

[Oddquine]

The councillors suggested for the trip to New York to represent the Highlands at Tartan Week are the Highland convenor Alison Magee and the chairman of Education, Culture and Sport - Andy Anderson. In addition three staff members of highland 2007 and one local Visit Scotland official and one ECS official.

What is ECS, btw? :confused

Which of these delegates are paid for from council funds? If more than the two council officials...why?

And if not more than the two council officials..............why so much?

I've never been against Council officials attending trips to promote the area...............but I have never really understood why it is thought that a flotilla of people will do more good than a couple of people who have all the facts at their fingertips.

[clash67]

What is ECS, btw? :confused

Which of these delegates are paid for from council funds? If more than the two council officials...why?

And if not more than the two council officials..............why so much?

I've never been against Council officials attending trips to promote the area...............but I have never really understood why it is thought that a flotilla of people will do more good than a couple of people who have all the facts at their fingertips.

All very good questions.

[peter macdonald]

In view of the reopening of the Highlands ferry links to the Faroes I would have thought a trip to Wicks twin town Klakksvik in the Faroes would have been more appropriate Funny that the councilors seem to prefer New York to the Faroes in spring!!!

[Bill Fernie]

I have already requested that the council mark the occassion of the first arrival of the Norona ferry to Scrabster with a piper or two and perhaps other welcoming tokens. no one has yet suggested there should be any exhange visits.

The twinning arrangement Wick has with Klaksvik has not been high on the agenda in recent yearsd due to the difficulty in getting there. The new ferry might indeed open up possibilities for Wick people and perhaps a councillor from time to time visiting and their officials and representatives coming here.

A coupole of years ago we did have visit from a number of school children to Wick from Klaksvik so the connection has not disappeared altogether. The Smyrril Line is hoping to promote package tours to the Highlands via their ferry into Scrabster. Undoubtedly this is something we will want to encourage. In reverse there may be people here who would like to visit the Faroes and now that ferry will be plying back and forth some might make the trip. The ferry will also be going to other countries so othe replaces might also benefit. We are much closer to Norway than London so the possibilties for holidays, visits and perhaps other business might become more apparent if ties are made.

If I hear of any trip suggestions perhaps I should run a poll on here to see if folk think it is worthwhile. It might be worth reflecting that people in other countries may not have the same vehemence by some against their politicians and officials visitng other countries as there appears to be in this country.

I think part of the problem is that the title of this thread "Paid Holiday For Councillors" Visits to other places can be for whole range of reasons and partly to allow representatives to see good ideas in action that might be of benefit to an area back home. I myself have visited Stromness with CASE and whilst there saw the research place looking at Wave Power and the work going on there. I also took the oportunity separately myself to look at the marina deevelopment in the harbour. At my own expense I visited Kirkwall last summer to see the marina there and get some idea of how one might benefit Wick Harbour. I have over the last couple of years been trying to educate myself on the benefits of this for Wick especially as the Wick Harbour Authority are aiming to have pontoons in the habour around May this year and hoping to get bigger one in for 2008. Not the foreaign trip but visits to anywhere are usually arranged in my experince to allow people to gain understanding of a particular issue or business that might have some benefit for the area.

Visits are not always as exciting as it might appear although they are always interesting. I have for example visited a new home for care of the elderly in West Lothian with social workers and councillors from Highland. The reason was that West lothian council are pioneering many new develoments in technology fro looking after older people in hcarehomes and in their own houses. Already we can see an affect on our thinking in highland following that visit. It will take time for this to be ralised on the ground with physical changes - that takes time but the fac that we saw it all working and in action and spoke to residents about how they were able to improve their lives is something I hope will come out of that particular visit. I joined that visit in my capacity as Caithness area chairman of Housing and Social Work.

I have visited Edinburgh in may cpacity as chairman of the BPEO Particles Group where I am expected to represent the public and ensure that the process of ionvolvement of the public is fair and open. I have hadmeetings with others inlcuding the Scottish Executive and many in the nuclear industry. I have made the case on how the whoel issue is affecting Caithness and hope that my representation on bhelaf of people in the county have had a beneficial affect on how our area is treated in that resepct. Should this be regarded as a Junket - I had my hotel, travel and dinner paid for like anyone else travelling on business.

I do think everyone has to be clear that trips of any sort are scutinised by eveyone and as can be seen from the reporting in the newspapers all councillors do not agree with all trips being made. At the end of the day if feeling is strong enough they are put to a vote and the majority decide. This current trip to New York was debated at Resources comitte last week. I was not at that meeing as I prioritised another meeting in Caithness as having much more importance for us all in the county. That was a meeting to discuss moving forward the Socio-economic report from the group chaired by John Thurso MP and the meeting was held in the Pentland Hotel in Thurso. the meeting was attended by Arthur McCourt, John Thurso MP, Jamie Stone MSP, the NDA, several UKAEA people, Chamber of Commerce area convenor David Flear, several councillors including myself as well as arange of others. ( We got soup and a sandwich)

Important information was given to us and commitements made by several at the meeting for the future of the area with decommissioning of Dounreay in the background. Several people came from quite long way to thurso for this meeting. Can that be regarded as a Holiday for the officials concerend. I think not. All trips need to have some reasons for them and some may have immediately obvious benefits whilst others may have longer term affects. It is not always possible to say which will have the biggest affect when they are being made.

No trips expecially long ones with larger costs are undertaken lightly. To call a trip a holiday is I think being unfair and gives no recognition of the benefits that might flow from the visit over the longer term.

[peter macdonald]

Bill no one here is critical of your trips and if you had anything to do with getting the Faroe Norway Scrabster link restored then my sincere thanks This hopefully will give a boost to the local economy although i hope they will publise the fact that this also is a direct route to Norway and is Scotlands ONLY direct ferry into Scandinavia.However this trip to New York is costing a lot of taxpayers money at a time when air fares across the Altantic are rising ,the pound is exchanging at almost 2 dollars therefore keeping a lot of US visitors holidaying at home ,so why the visit???? Better they spent the money on making sure this years service by the Smyrril line is made a permanet fixture

[Bill Fernie]

Here is the link to the paper on the New York trip that was discussed by the Resources Committee of Highland council in Inverness last week -
See
http://www.highland.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres/D35B1802-9363-4D21-838B-DC0EC8B3C4D2/0/res3007.pdf

This paper gives more detials and what is involved including the fact that of the £35,000 - £10,000 is for the travel and accomodation etc and £25,000 is involved with the expenses of marketing and transport and what is required at the exhibition. The paper also outlines what happens and how many visitors attend the event which is very large in Grand Central Station.

Some folk may still disagree with this type of expenditure but at least you can get clearer idea from this paper what is involved rather than just looking at som many folk going to New York as if on holiday and the attempt to improve the chances of the Highland area in respect to visitors making part of their stay in Scotland a few days in Highland.

Closer to home the Thurso councillors are involved in trying to lay on a trip to Brilon - the twin town of Thurso after having been invited by that town. A committee has been formed and they are arranging fund raising events to help defray the expense of the trip. Twinning arrangements are supposed to help both towns involved and usually this involves visits by people from either town and often school trips from each town. The Thurso pipe band was there a few years ago and I expect will go back at the right time.

Hope the link to the council paper is useful to those interested. It is open to anyone to lobby councillors and the council with their views on any matter and the agendas for all meetings are published in advance on the web site. I am not aware of anyone writing to suggest their disgreement with plans to promote the Highlands in New York in 2007 or later.

I understand some councillors did not agree with spending of the money on the trip but the majority did although only two councillors are actually going on the trip along with staff. The number of staff would appear to be linked to scale of the vent and all that needs to be done to meet the public in New York and offer a decent standard of service. I am sure most people would not thank Highland council if the media reported a mediocre Highland stand at NY.