Eductaion in the EU

[weezer 316]

Decided in the light of some unbelievable ignorance about the EU on these pages, from people calling it a German cabal to saying its undemocratic and has no benefits to our inclusion, to trumpet the benefits of the EU. None of this could have happened without EU membership. And its really only the tip of the iceberg.

http://www.euromove.org.uk/index.php?id=15296

[joxville]

Oh, the irony! :-)

[changilass]

lol Jox, I went googling just in case it was a new EU word.

[M Swanson]

LOL Jox. [lol]

Seriously though Weezer, how would it be if not one person in Britain had the right to vote, in anyway at all, for a Prime Minister? Imagine, that prior to attaining this great seat of power, none of us knew him, had heard of him, much less voted for him? Well, enter Mr Van Rumpoy! Not one of 500 Million people had any say in who would hold the most powerful position in Europe. Now, I ask you to be sensible here, Weezee, is that democracy, by anyones' definition? Surely not! Scary stuff though! Who do you think may have chosen Van Rumpoy for President? Over to you. :)

[weezer 316]

Forgive the speeeeling mistake haha!

Tell me, have you ever voted for the prime minister in this country, ever? Ever ever ever? The term parlimentary democracy can be a killer.....

Any ones thoughts on that link above? Or are we still going to exist in perceptual almost religious like denial about the EU?

[M Swanson]

More stuff and nonsense from you Weezer! :) Of course, we vote for the leader of the political party to become our Prime Minister. For example, I briefly thought about casting my vote for the Labour Party, but when Blagger Blair was chosen as the leader, I quickly about turned. Others who didn't, voted for the party and accepted Blair as PM. Democracy! Now, who voted for Van Rumpoy? Had you ever heard of him? Was he voted in, or was he appointed? And by whom? As Farage rightly said to El Presidente - "Who are you? I've never heard of you. Nobody in Europe had heard of you? And who voted for you?" And that from a member of the EU Parliament. Is this democracy? Get away! Now, come on, Weezee. For once, try answering one, or two of the questions put to you. This penchant of yours for fudging isn't really good enough.

Until I have the time to check the details given in the link and the credentials of whoever wrote it, a quick scan leads me to suspect it may be a propaganda jobbie. It certainly smells a bit iffy. Leave that one with me and hopefully I'll get back to you Weezer.

[weezer 316]

Utterly amazing, it smells a bit iffy......just how you decide things clearly. You could try reading it no? Instead of sniffing?

Its no wonder your conclusions are all nonsense you wont even bother reading what the EU does or how it works as you clearly havent a clue, yet you dismiss it anyway. Its like religious folk dismissing evolution, something they have never even read about briefly. Thats whats killing this country, not the EU! You wont or maybe cant read anything that smells a bit iffy.

[M Swanson]

LOL. Still not ONE of my questions answered, Weezer. I wonder why? ;)

As I wrote in my post, I haven't "decided," anything, yet, about this EuroMove outfit, but I'm on the trail. Something definitely fishy about this report. Leave it with me. I'll get back to you.

[weezer 316]

Really. I Remember asking for one example of an EU benefit and you couldnt give one..........or didnt want to.

Now what question(s) was it you wanted answered? You did ask about EU benefits so I supplied several dozen in that link. Was it the democracy question? It answers itself, I can only surmise you mis-understand what democracy is. You, and the rest liek you, havent a clue how the EU works, and even say it forces laws on us! Such basic falsehoods and willingly so it appears need to be confronted as its that which is lowly destroying this country.

For the record Euro move just list whats publicly available. You can cross check the whole lot online, as I am sure you have done already in your extensive understanding of the EU

[Retread]

Decided in the light of some unbelievable ignorance about the EU on these pages, from people calling it a German cabal to saying its undemocratic and has no benefits to our inclusion, to trumpet the benefits of the EU. None of this could have happened without EU membership. And its really only the tip of the iceberg.

http://www.euromove.org.uk/index.php?id=15296

There are many perks to the EU, these guys are very aware of that .. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzEQWigzz30

[badger]

There are many perks to the EU, these guys are very aware of that .. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzEQWigzz30

I'm not even surprised http://www.maxfarquar.com/2013/01/meps-at-work-in-brussels/

[M Swanson]

Thanks Retread and Badger for these clips. There are those who would have us believe that membership for Britain in the EU, is good value for money. This evidence demonstrates clearly, that it's not and this is only one small area of incompetence, dishonesty and absolute waste, of this bureaucratic monster. Is anyone surprised that for the 18th year running, the auditor's have refused to sign-off the accounts? What business would ever be allowed to continue operating in the same circumstances? I think we all know the answer to that one.

Check out a few of these facts about the true cost of our membership in the EU. For what return?
The net cost of the EU budget to Britain in 2011 was £10.8 billion* and rising. But the actual cost - direct and indirect - is much more than that.Last time it was calculated, in 2008, the European Union was costing us £65 billion gross every year. That's about £1,000 each every year for every man, woman and child in the UK. It increases every year, so it will be a lot more now.
* Source: Office for National Statistics "Pink Book"

[Retread]

I am all for the Common Market, and I find it REALLY hard to believe that if Britian left the EU tomorrow trade with Europe would evaporate. Would we take a hit ??, yup. Would we get over it ??, yup. But I believe we would be better off if our laws and Government weren't overuled by Brussels, a wasteful arrogant monolith that seems to assume we all want to be part of the EUSSR. They haven't balanced their own books in sixteen years. Nuff said.

[M Swanson]

Can't argue with any of that Retread. A-g-a-i-n. :D

[M Swanson]

Really. I Remember asking for one example of an EU benefit and you couldnt give one..........or didnt want to.

Now what question(s) was it you wanted answered? You did ask about EU benefits so I supplied several dozen in that link. Was it the democracy question? It answers itself, I can only surmise you mis-understand what democracy is. You, and the rest liek you, havent a clue how the EU works, and even say it forces laws on us! Such basic falsehoods and willingly so it appears need to be confronted as its that which is lowly destroying this country.

So, I couldn't give one Weeze! As I said, "rugger all." :D

Of course it was the question of "democracy," with regard to Van Rumpoy in particular. I'm not surprised you couldn't answer the questions though ........ 500 Million of us can't. So let's try an easier one for you. How about the election of Barosso, the European Commission President? By anyone's definition was he democratically elected? It's an easy enough question and I hope you do a lot better with this one than you've managed with all the others. :cool:

[Rheghead]

Can't argue with any of that Retread. A-g-a-i-n. :D

I thought you expressed remorse for voting for EEC membership?

[M Swanson]

Yes, that's right, Rheg. You have to remember that we were all sold a pup in the 70's. The issue was on whether we wanted free trade between us and Europe. It's the only reason so many of us voted for it, but it didn't take long before the folly of our gullibility began to strike home. Heath even admitted that we had been hoodwinked. Major plans were already set-up and voting 'Yes' opened the door to what has now become the likelihood of a Federal State. I doubt many of us oldies, who voted in the seventies are pleased to have signed away so much. We were shafted big-time.

I still believe in trading with the EU, but without the constraints and obligations of membership. I believe that is still very possible and thus agreed with Retread.

[Rheghead]

Nah, no regrets, I believe Heath was pro-europe until his dying day.

[M Swanson]

Ay? It was Heath who sold us down the river, by using deception. He gloated about it. I'm surprised anyone could applaud such treason ....... no matter what their views are on membership to the EU.

[Rheghead]

Margeret Thatcher on the other hand, she did sell us into the EEC via the referendum, she changed her mind, or at least she seemed to. She then went onto being the PM with the largest overall majorities ever, much more than Cameron will ever achieve and she never gave us a referendum to get out. How spineless was that?

[M Swanson]

LOL. "Spineless?" Yeah! Right! I suppose that explains, why Margaret Hilda took on and crushed the unions, who were crippling Britain? How did the rest of the world describe us ...... "The sick man of Europe," and they were right. We were constantly being held to ransom, with outlandish demands from the Commie inspired Trade Unions and teetering on the edge of self-destruction in the 70's. It took great courage and love of country to turn that around and most of the people loved her for her strength and determination.

I suppose it was also "spineless," of her to fight for, and win, a £700 Million rebate for Britain? She fought like a tiger for it. And remind me Rheg, who handed back a good part of this rebate? Not blagger Blair, was it? Doh!

It was Margaret Hilda, who almost single-handedly fought against a single currency abroad. And my word, how history has proven her to be right. It was almost as if she had a crystal ball. How different it would have been if Ireland, Portgugal and Greece had believed her. Do you remember the cries from Blair, Mandelson and .......... Heseltine, when warning of the "lost jobs and investment which would be incalculable," if we didn't sign-up for a single currency? Nothing's changed there, then. Even today, it's the favoured weapon of the EU, fanatical, flunkies! :D And where are any of those champions of the EU, who were so wrong in wanting sterling to be abolished? Have any of them apologised for their monumental error? Nah! Not even one of Weeze's heroes - Charles Kennedy, grandee of EuroMove! :roll: Small wonder so many of us mourn the loss of such a courageous visionary to lead us. God bless you, Margaret Hilda. :cool:

[weezer 316]

lol! More ignorance!

bureaucratic monster eh.......covers some 500million people with less employes than the BBC. Im going to guess, again, you had no idea that was the case.

Now are you EVER going to try and name 1 benefit of EU membership. I really do beg of you to please try and even guess or something!

Its tragic such people can vote on this issue. Not even a basic understanding of the EU, its workings, it size, its role, is laws, how these are decided (I strongly suggest you read about this as it will astonish you) and how they are enforced, and how this helps us..........

[Alrock]

lol! More ignorance!

bureaucratic monster eh.......

...................Its tragic such people can vote on this issue. Not even a basic understanding of the EU, its workings, it size, its role, is laws, how these are decided (I strongly suggest you read about this as it will astonish you) and how they are enforced, and how this helps us..........

Hopefully there will be some intelligent debate around this referendum on membership that will educate people on exactly what the EU does.... However, I fear that it will just descend into the same sort of ugly slagging match that the Scottish Independence debate has turned into.

[Rheghead]

Very selective memories

[ducati]

Without EU quoters there would be no fish left. Without EU subsidies there would be no farmers left.

Theres 2 benefits if you like. Seems quite important really.

[M Swanson]

lol! More ignorance!

bureaucratic monster eh.......covers some 500million people with less employes than the BBC. Im going to guess, again, you had no idea that was the case.

Now are you EVER going to try and name 1 benefit of EU membership. I really do beg of you to please try and even guess or something!

Its tragic such people can vote on this issue. Not even a basic understanding of the EU, its workings, it size, its role, is laws, how these are decided (I strongly suggest you read about this as it will astonish you) and how they are enforced, and how this helps us..........

LOL. And still not one of my questions answered, Weeze. ;) You have asked me two and I have answered both, whilst the ELEVEN, I've asked you, remain unanswered, but if you can't, you can't. Anyway, let's round the figure up to a lucky 13!

Do non-Eu countries have free trade agreements with the EU and yet are not members of it? If so, I wonder if they're contributing like we are, £53 Million a day for the privilege? How about Japan?

If we have so much power and influence as members of the EU, then why are we having to claw back powers? There ya go, Weezer - it's not actually 13 questions now, it's 15 and rising. ;)

BTW Can you link us to the claim that the BBC employ more staff than the EU, please? If not, it's yet more nonsense from you then. :roll: 16.

[M Swanson]

Without EU quoters there would be no fish left. Without EU subsidies there would be no farmers left.

Theres 2 benefits if you like. Seems quite important really.

Now why didn't I think of that, Ducati? :lol:

[M Swanson]

Very selective memories

Ah! So you agree with the facts I gave, concerning Margaret Hilda? Not so much selective, as true then, Rheg. :cool:

[macadamia]

"The European Commission is divided into departments known as Directorates General (DGs), roughly equivalent to ministries. Each covers a specific policy area or service such as

trade or environment, and is headed by a Director-General who reports to a Commissioner. Around 38 000 people are employed by the European Commission.

In the European Parliament, around 6 000 people work in the general secretariat and in the political groups. They are joined by Members of Parliament and their staff. In the Council

of the European Union, around 3 500 people work in the general secretariat." - European Commission's own figures.

.
BBC Staff Numbers (from the BBC 2011-2012 Annual Report) - ""As shown in the table, the average year-on-year equivalent full-time headcount has reduced by 384 since last year, from 17,242 to 16,858, reflecting the initial impact of Delivering Quality First initiatives. The largest divisional reductions have been in Finance (12.3%) and Vision (12.2%). Many of the reductions have occurred in administration and support teams, allowing us to focus licence fee spend on content and output and to reduce overheads. Figures for the regional distribution of staff reflect the relocation of staff from London to Salford Quays."

If you're going to chuck facts at us, it helps if they are true.

[M Swanson]

Bravo Macadamia, even if you did beat me to the knock-out punch. :cool:

[macadamia]

All part of the service, me old china! 'E don't half talk some tosh!