View Full Version : Bailing out Ireland
A few observations; well, questions really.
What would happen in the same circumstances to an independent Scotland, with similar populations and demographics?
The UK (as a whole) can borrow on the international markets at a rate that we can lend to Ireland at a profit and still be cheaper than Ireland can borrow for themselves.
Should we help, independently, (we have to as part of the IMF) or as George tells us, can we afford not to?
I don't think the question will ever arise - Scotland will never be independent, it cannot afford to be.
Walter Ego
23-Nov-10, 09:23
A few observations; well, questions really.
What would happen in the same circumstances to an independent Scotland, with similar populations and demographics?
We'd be screwed. As the SNP well know - that's why they've stopped yelping on about full independence, they have seen what happened to some of their 'role models'.
The UK (as a whole) can borrow on the international markets at a rate that we can lend to Ireland at a profit and still be cheaper than Ireland can borrow for themselves.
Should we help, independently, (we have to as part of the IMF) or as George tells us, can we afford not to?
No. Stuff them. We've enough on bailing out our own bad management without putting capital at risk with an inept country.
The current grubbiement view is that we need to help Ireland so that the Irish can continue to buy goods and services from the UK. It is said that Ireland is one of our biggest export markets.
So I guess in the present economic climate the best way to bring a country to its knees is for the populace to stop buying. I wonder what would happen if everyone in Ireland didn't spend any money, other than for food and necessities, until after Christmas :confused.
No. Stuff them. We've enough on bailing out our own bad management without putting capital at risk with an inept country.[/quote]
Would you say the same if the boot was on the other foot?
orkneycadian
23-Nov-10, 13:35
If, due to excessive hardship, Andrea Corr ever finds herself without a bed or a roof over her head, then I am willing to help out!
I don't think the government is offering the loan out of the goodness of its heart. Britain has a lot to lose if Irelands economy goes down the pan.
I have found it interesting how the economies of Ireland and Iceland, once the "role models" for an independent Scotland have suffered so badly. Banking provides wealth in good times, but when things go sour the fact that they don't actually produce anything causes problems.
In times like these unity helps. Being a little fish in a big pond is a dangerous way to be.
tonkatojo
23-Nov-10, 13:40
No. Stuff them. We've enough on bailing out our own bad management without putting capital at risk with an inept country.
Would you say the same if the boot was on the other foot?[/QUOTE]
The boot was on the other foot and they decided to stay "neutral". :(
orkneycadian
23-Nov-10, 13:45
Britain has a lot to lose if Irelands economy goes down the pan.
Britain has a lot to lose if (when) Britains economy goes down the pan....
But still we insist in sending foreign aid to every country under the sun, irrespective of how neighbourly we are, or how likely the other country is going to repay the gesture by sending us suicide bombers.
Given that we have no money of our own these days, borrowing money to then lend to someone else is madness.
Apparently the best two economies in Europe are Norway and Switzerland.
Wonder why that is?
tonkatojo
23-Nov-10, 13:49
Apparently the best two economies in Europe are Norway and Switzerland.
Wonder why that is?
I find that an enigma too.
Britain has a lot to lose if (when) Britains economy goes down the pan....
But still we insist in sending foreign aid to every country under the sun, irrespective of how neighbourly we are, or how likely the other country is going to repay the gesture by sending us suicide bombers.
Given that we have no money of our own these days, borrowing money to then lend to someone else is madness.
I do agree with you regarding foreign aid.
As for borrowing to lend, as long as the interest rates are right, it will actually make us money.
orkneycadian
23-Nov-10, 15:19
As for borrowing to lend, as long as the interest rates are right, it will actually make us money.
Are you an investment banker? ;)
Are you an investment banker? ;)
No, but I have been called something that rhymes with that.
Walter Ego
23-Nov-10, 16:55
No. Stuff them. We've enough on bailing out our own bad management without putting capital at risk with an inept country.
Would you say the same if the boot was on the other foot?[/quote]
But the boot isn't on the other foot. If I get my house repossessed, would my neighbours offer to pay my arrears to pull me out of the problem? I think not.
And Tonkatojo has a VERY valid point.....Eire was happy to ride on the skirts of the UK during WW2 without actually doing anything positive as a nation. So no sympathy there from me.
Would you say the same if the boot was on the other foot?
But the boot isn't on the other foot. If I get my house repossessed, would my neighbours offer to pay my arrears to pull me out of the problem? I think not.
And Tonkatojo has a VERY valid point.....Eire was happy to ride on the skirts of the UK during WW2 without actually doing anything positive as a nation. So no sympathy there from me.[/quote]
Way to hold a grudge for 65 years :cool:
Whoe! what happened to the quote dubry?
Methinks this is only the beginning. Am hearing that many Countries are living beyod their means.....Standby.....
Would you say the same if the boot was on the other foot?
The boot was on the other foot and they decided to stay "neutral". :([/quote]
Their ( Irelands) government may have stayed neutral during ww2 but it did not deter their people joining the british army to fight in the war. They joined in their thousands and fought and died alongside our brave lads,indeed many Irish Nationals still serve in the British Army.
The boot was on the other foot and they decided to stay "neutral". :(
Their ( Irelands) government may have stayed neutral during ww2 but it did not deter their people joining the british army to fight in the war. They joined in their thousands and fought and died alongside our brave lads,indeed many Irish Nationals still serve in the British Army.[/QUOTE]
Yes you're right, and my thanks go to them.
But any aid or loan goes to their government, not to these individuals.
IMF and the EU Reps on BBC World News tonite, talking....This is only the beginning.......
It's another bail out for the banks not the Irish...
rob murray
24-Nov-10, 17:22
It's another bail out for the banks not the Irish...
yes. the RBS ( one of our nationalised banks ) has a large multi billion exposure with the irish banks /finance houses
E Mannie frae e Financial Times, in his pretend American Accent said....ye ain't seen no-thin' yet!..
Their ( Irelands) government may have stayed neutral during ww2 but it did not deter their people joining the british army to fight in the war. They joined in their thousands and fought and died alongside our brave lads,indeed many Irish Nationals still serve in the British Army.
Yes you're right, and my thanks go to them.
But any aid or loan goes to their government, not to these individuals.[/quote]
Yep, 70,000 Southern Irishmen fought for Britain in WW2.. A lot of people may not know this:
The Cranborne report
Viscount Cranborne, the British Secretary of State for Dominion Affairs, wrote a letter to the British War Cabinet regarding Irish-British collaboration during 1939-1945:
“
They agreed to our use of Lough Foyle for naval and air purposes. The ownership of the Lough is disputed, but the Southern Irish authorities are tacitly not pressing their claim in present conditions and are also ignoring any flying by our aircraft over the Donegal shore of the Lough, which is necessary in certain wind conditions to enable flying boats to take off the Lough.
They have agreed to use by our aircraft based on Lough Erne of a corridor over Southern Irish territory and territorial waters for the purpose of flying out to the Atlantic.
They have arranged for the immediate transmission to the United Kingdom Representative’s Office in Dublin of reports of submarine activity received from their coast watching service.
They arranged for the broadening of reports by their Air observation Corps of aircraft sighted over or approaching Southern Irish territory. (This does not include our aircraft using the corridor referred to in (b) above.)
They arranged for the extinction of trade and business lighting in coastal towns where such lighting was alleged to afford a useful landmark for German aircraft.
They have continued to supply us with meteorological reports.
They have agreed to the use by our ships and aircraft of two wireless direction-finding stations at Malin Head.
They have supplied particulars of German crashed aircraft and personnel crashed or washed ashore or arrested on land.
They arranged for staff talks on the question of co-operation against a possible German invasion of Southern Ireland, and close contact has since been maintained between the respective military authorities.
They continue to intern all German fighting personnel reaching Southern Ireland. On the other hand, though after protracted negotiations, Allied service personnel are now allowed to depart freely and full assistance is given in recovering damaged aircraft.
Recently, in connection with the establishment of prisoner of war camps in Northern Ireland, they have agreed to return or at least intern any German prisoners who may escape from Northern Ireland across the border to Southern Ireland.
They have throughout offered no objection to the departure from Southern Ireland of persons wishing to serve in the United Kingdom Forces nor to the journey on leave of such persons to and from Southern Ireland (in plain clothes).
They have continued to exchange information with our security authorities regarding all aliens (including Germans) in Southern Ireland.
They have (within the last few days) agreed to our establishing a Radar station in Southern Ireland for use against the latest form of submarine activity.
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