View Full Version : Court News on 'Police Pages'
I do feel this is an incredibly dangerous 'service' to start on a community website and think more responsiblity and integrity should be shown. The 'Orgs' Police pages are an asset if articles that have previously appeared on the Official Northern Constabulary website are cut and pasted to reach a bigger audience on here, particullary if it is a request for much needed public information regarding a crime or missing person.
And before everyone jumps down my throat and reminds me that the court has public gallerys, and that anyone can go and sit in during trials or cases, or that the reports appear in the papers for anyone who cares to buy a copy to read..... it is on a different level to the faceless anonomys cover that the internet provides. How many people for instance would write a letter to the Groat and put thier name to it for publication on most of the posts they put on an internet forum?
I know times are different, and we are in the age of cyberworld etc etc but I think there are somethings that are better kept off a (small) community website. If there was anything really worth reporting from Wick Court it would make the web because of its importance, not because Noel 'Not News' Donaldson feels the need to come out of retirement.
Being a perfectly law abiding citizen myself, Ive not got an alterior motive on this one, but do feel that lots of people who commit crimes are seriously ashamed, get their cumupance, try and put it behind them and move on, being damned sure never to let it happen again. They dont need permanent reminders from web addicts who have just checked out what their neighbours house sold for, that they deserve the naughty chair. Its also worth remembering that the permanent offenders have no shame and probably will only treat the story of them appearing on the web like a medal of honour.
Like I said, I feel this is a very dangerous development and is akin to idle (armchair) gossip. Maybe Im a bit old fashioned but who really benefits from this type of coverage on a community website?
I do feel this is an incredibly dangerous 'service' to start on a community website and think more responsiblity and integrity should be shown. The 'Orgs' Police pages are an asset if articles that have previously appeared on the Official Northern Constabulary website are cut and pasted to reach a bigger audience on here, particullary if it is a request for much needed public information regarding a crime or missing person.
And before everyone jumps down my throat and reminds me that the court has public gallerys, and that anyone can go and sit in during trials or cases, or that the reports appear in the papers for anyone who cares to buy a copy to read..... it is on a different level to the faceless anonomys cover that the internet provides. How many people for instance would write a letter to the Groat and put thier name to it for publication on most of the posts they put on an internet forum?
I know times are different, and we are in the age of cyberworld etc etc but I think there are somethings that are better kept off a (small) community website. If there was anything really worth reporting from Wick Court it would make the web because of its importance, not because Noel 'Not News' Donaldson feels the need to come out of retirement.
Being a perfectly law abiding citizen myself, Ive not got an alterior motive on this one, but do feel that lots of people who commit crimes are seriously ashamed, get their cumupance, try and put it behind them and move on, being damned sure never to let it happen again. They dont need permanent reminders from web addicts who have just checked out what their neighbours house sold for, that they deserve the naughty chair. Its also worth remembering that the permanent offenders have no shame and probably will only treat the story of them appearing on the web like a medal of honour.
Like I said, I feel this is a very dangerous development and is akin to idle (armchair) gossip. Maybe Im a bit old fashioned but who really benefits from this type of coverage on a community website?
dont agree with you sorry
I have been here a while and never noticed it :eek:
Bobinovich
30-May-10, 17:19
...but who really benefits from this type of coverage on a community website?
Erm, people like myself who do not buy the local papers :cool:
I can not comment as I have never seen it. Just where is this on the org so that I can have a read to find out whats it all about. Might come in handy as I do not buy the local papers either.
I can not comment as I have never seen it. Just where is this on the org so that I can have a read to find out whats it all about. Might come in handy as I do not buy the local papers either.
Its on the front page, where most of us read the news about Caithness, or you can log onto Caithness facebook and read it there, before some chiel posts it on the forum [disgust]
Its on the front page, where most of us read the news about Caithness, or you can log onto Caithness facebook and read it there, before some chiel posts it on the forum [disgust]
Thanks for that :) I now know where it is and have read some of the reports. Not my usual interest so I can not see me reading it very often but I am sure a lot of people will find it interesting. Cant see any harm in it myself.
silverlady
30-May-10, 17:36
I do feel this is an incredibly dangerous 'service' to start on a community website and think more responsiblity and integrity should be shown. The 'Orgs' Police pages are an asset if articles that have previously appeared on the Official Northern Constabulary website are cut and pasted to reach a bigger audience on here, particullary if it is a request for much needed public information regarding a crime or missing person.
And before everyone jumps down my throat and reminds me that the court has public gallerys, and that anyone can go and sit in during trials or cases, or that the reports appear in the papers for anyone who cares to buy a copy to read..... it is on a different level to the faceless anonomys cover that the internet provides. How many people for instance would write a letter to the Groat and put thier name to it for publication on most of the posts they put on an internet forum?
I know times are different, and we are in the age of cyberworld etc etc but I think there are somethings that are better kept off a (small) community website. If there was anything really worth reporting from Wick Court it would make the web because of its importance, not because Noel 'Not News' Donaldson feels the need to come out of retirement.
Being a perfectly law abiding citizen myself, Ive not got an alterior motive on this one, but do feel that lots of people who commit crimes are seriously ashamed, get their cumupance, try and put it behind them and move on, being damned sure never to let it happen again. They dont need permanent reminders from web addicts who have just checked out what their neighbours house sold for, that they deserve the naughty chair. Its also worth remembering that the permanent offenders have no shame and probably will only treat the story of them appearing on the web like a medal of honour.
Like I said, I feel this is a very dangerous development and is akin to idle (armchair) gossip. Maybe Im a bit old fashioned but who really benefits from this type of coverage on a community website?
I agree with you, totally.
I do feel this is an incredibly dangerous 'service' to start on a community website and think more responsiblity and integrity should be shown. The 'Orgs' Police pages are an asset if articles that have previously appeared on the Official Northern Constabulary website are cut and pasted to reach a bigger audience on here, particullary if it is a request for much needed public information regarding a crime or missing person.
And before everyone jumps down my throat and reminds me that the court has public gallerys, and that anyone can go and sit in during trials or cases, or that the reports appear in the papers for anyone who cares to buy a copy to read..... it is on a different level to the faceless anonomys cover that the internet provides. How many people for instance would write a letter to the Groat and put thier name to it for publication on most of the posts they put on an internet forum?
I know times are different, and we are in the age of cyberworld etc etc but I think there are somethings that are better kept off a (small) community website. If there was anything really worth reporting from Wick Court it would make the web because of its importance, not because Noel 'Not News' Donaldson feels the need to come out of retirement.
Being a perfectly law abiding citizen myself, Ive not got an alterior motive on this one, but do feel that lots of people who commit crimes are seriously ashamed, get their cumupance, try and put it behind them and move on, being damned sure never to let it happen again. They dont need permanent reminders from web addicts who have just checked out what their neighbours house sold for, that they deserve the naughty chair. Its also worth remembering that the permanent offenders have no shame and probably will only treat the story of them appearing on the web like a medal of honour.
Like I said, I feel this is a very dangerous development and is akin to idle (armchair) gossip. Maybe Im a bit old fashioned but who really benefits from this type of coverage on a community website?
Caithness.org a small community website i would disagree with that it attracts a lot bigger and wider audenece than you think.
Do i think this website should name and shame people in the caithness area thats has committed crime i think they should not do that some people might want a fresh start and leave there past in the past and websites makes it to easy for people to go googling there workmate or friends and it doesnt help if people are putting more info on there websites.
I think caithness.org should stick to writing about all the positive things about the community and leave all the naming and shaming to the local papers.
All it takes is for some local nutpot that is always getting into trouble with law to see his or her name on the caithness org website shaming them and taking a dislike to seeing that on here it will be a case of bill i want a word with u ? i really dont think its a good idea having the court news page more trouble than its worth
I do feel this is an incredibly dangerous 'service' to start on a community website and think more responsiblity and integrity should be shown. The 'Orgs' Police pages are an asset if articles that have previously appeared on the Official Northern Constabulary website are cut and pasted to reach a bigger audience on here, particullary if it is a request for much needed public information regarding a crime or missing person.
And before everyone jumps down my throat and reminds me that the court has public gallerys, and that anyone can go and sit in during trials or cases, or that the reports appear in the papers for anyone who cares to buy a copy to read..... it is on a different level to the faceless anonomys cover that the internet provides. How many people for instance would write a letter to the Groat and put thier name to it for publication on most of the posts they put on an internet forum?
I know times are different, and we are in the age of cyberworld etc etc but I think there are somethings that are better kept off a (small) community website. If there was anything really worth reporting from Wick Court it would make the web because of its importance, not because Noel 'Not News' Donaldson feels the need to come out of retirement.
Being a perfectly law abiding citizen myself, Ive not got an alterior motive on this one, but do feel that lots of people who commit crimes are seriously ashamed, get their cumupance, try and put it behind them and move on, being damned sure never to let it happen again. They dont need permanent reminders from web addicts who have just checked out what their neighbours house sold for, that they deserve the naughty chair. Its also worth remembering that the permanent offenders have no shame and probably will only treat the story of them appearing on the web like a medal of honour.
Like I said, I feel this is a very dangerous development and is akin to idle (armchair) gossip. Maybe Im a bit old fashioned but who really benefits from this type of coverage on a community website?
Considering you dont agree with it you've just brought it to more peoples attention.
Many thanks Droopy for drawing my attention to the 'Police pages'. Thankfully I don't have a young impressionable teenage daughter, nor do I have a pregnant wife, but it's useful to be aware of potential assailants in our community so that we can avoid them.
As for the miscreants, their names are now known. They should have thought of the consequences of their actions prior to initiating the incident that brought them to court.
I couldn’t give a fig if their transgression comes back time and time again to haunt them. What they did to their victim will live with them for a long time too, and they are more deserving of any sympathy as far as I’m concerned.
Like I said, I feel this is a very dangerous development and is akin to idle (armchair) gossip.
Gossip!?!The definition of gossip is: idle talk or rumor, about the personal or private affairs of others.
Correct me if I am wrong, the affairs are not private or personal once a court judgement has been made. Nor are they rumor, unless you believe the courts have no certainty as to their facts?
I couldn’t give a fig if their transgression comes back time and time again to haunt them. What they did to their victim will live with them for a long time too, and they are more deserving of any sympathy as far as I’m concerned.
Very well put!
Bill Fernie
30-May-10, 20:15
Just to say I am trialling the court news items with Noel Donaldson for three months to see how it goes.
I have yet to decide how long items in that section remain on the web site. In the past we haver not removed itemes from the site unless there was a good reason. It maybe that there is nothing to be gained from keeping court stories on the web site long term but then there might be.
I will consider comments here and on any items as we go along over the next three months to make more definite decisions.
Essentially it is just another service of news on the web site which has been evolving ever since it started.
Newspapers publish court cases and the information is often available on court web sites in relation to what trials are coming up and if you dig deep enough the results can be found.
What we will need to consider is how much is in the public interest and this is debatable and will come down to making a judgement on the merits of each case. Reports along the lines of those published in newspapers and other web sites but available to those that do not buy papers or live far away.
As I say it will be reviewed at the end of August by which time we should know if it is useful and of interest. I wil read any further comments posted on here before making a decision.
Thanks for the comments so far.
Its all been printed in the court pages of the groat/courier anyway!
So its all in the public domain and people, if interested will read it and those that couldnt care less will not look ...
Might be handy if someone you know is in court and you never got the local rag.
Newspapers publish court cases and the information is often available on court web sites in relation to what trials are coming up and if you dig deep enough the results can be found.
That's fair enough Bill but internet forums are a different kind of beast to newspapers and other forms of communication.
I was saddened by the recent attack on the lady who stole the gala funds and further saddened by some of the orgers who were at the forefront of the attack.
Are you now going to allow the org to be used as an extension of the justice system and let people post willy nilly about anything that may catch their attention on the court page? Has the org now stooped so low as to allow itself to be used as a town square stocks session whenever someone gets a bee in their bonnet and decide the judge wasnt harsh enough? I can see the birth of a new mob mentality and the thought sickens me.
If that's the case may I respectfully ask that if you are going to allow comments on court cases, that anyone who may contribute to a thread coming directly from a court report, must sign in using their real name and address.
ywindythesecond
30-May-10, 23:41
If that's the case may I respectfully ask that if you are going to allow comments on court cases, that anyone who may contribute to a thread coming directly from a court report, must sign in using their real name and address.
That is a really good point Gleeber.
I am sure that Mr. Donaldson knows where to draw the line on these things...seems he has been around a 'few years'! And Bill Fernie is not exactly new at this!
There are pros and Cons to this, but with the advent of the Internet and newspapers going On Line, this is a Natural Extension.
With us the general 'rule of thumb' is that if a person's name is used where it is only an allegation, then the conclusion must be reported upon...i.e. Guilty or Not Guilty.
If a person is convicted then the name can be used/that serves itself
Then there is what we define as an Amber Alert...If a child is abducted and info has to get out to the Public Immediately, the Radio Stations, TV., interupt their broadcast and give this info right away/ Why not the Internet!
Then you come to the most difficult area which is perhaps a Child Predator, serial abuser, armed robber or murderer. These situations elicit two sides. One side wants make it available to the Public, the other, why print someone's name if they have not been convicted in the Court!
This to me is a balancing act....and I think, if the decision to identify is done for the right reasons, then it satisfies all. Of course the Accused person, thru their Laywer may ask for a Publication Ban. Sometimes granted, sometimes not.
And 'Gleeber'..... perhaps commenting on Court Cases should be a least limited, if not prohibited.
And an automatic time line for deletion...30/60 90 etc etc days.
I dealt with these issues for 20 years whilst working....so far the UK Newspapers seem to deal with it well, and as I said, the Internet will be the 'Newspapers' of the Future...e.g. Huffington Post in the US. We also have our local City and Community Web Sites, reporting the same news as the Papers.
Just some thoughts....You can never satisity all Camps but if done for the right reasons it seems to work..
Also of course a person may write a 'Letter to the Editor, and these are printed in the normal course of business, but with the blessing of the paper.
Caithness.org is serving it's public/ readers/ the community, and it would I think be remiss not to report upon all Public information.
Bill Fernie
31-May-10, 09:26
Re comment -
"And an automatic time line for deletion...30/60 90 etc etc days."
Yes I am considering a removal timescale for the court items.
Also where a case is ongoing how to deal with final court judgments and the timescale as we need to finalise the times satisfactorily.
All of this type of situation is dealt with by newspapers and their web sites.
As for discussions on court cases or comments I think this already happens from time to time even if the story was not published on this web site. We will as always need to look at each post on its merits and hopefully moderation will deal with any problems.
The thing about justice is that it only has a chance of working if it is public. Justice behind closed doors creates resentment, mistrust and injustice for victims.
With regard to vehemently condeming the actions of a criminal, it i something that has to be done. Shame and respect are very important factors to keeping behaviour within limits that support living socially (as the gregarious animals that we are). I think that alot of the problems we percieve in socety today is due to a complete loss of shame and respect. If we do not condemn criminal behaviour and express that condemnation, then shame and respect for others will become even more erroded.
I suppose I was always going to be on a hiding to nothing with this one seens as I was expressing my views about web and internet forum content..............on an internet forum! The combined total of posts is 15,000+ of the users who dont entirely agree with me.. Where do yous find the time?...;)
Just to clear up on a few points.
Obviously, I dont condone anyone who has carried out a criminal offence, particullary against another person and or property. And also that its been a centuaries old tradition that law breakers are 'shamed' by some means of public knowledge.
However, look at it from a different prospective, the victim. A victim of crime has a harrowing enough expierience to go to court, give evidence and have a part of his/her life they wish never happened for all to read in the local paper. But todays newspaper is tomorrows chip wrappings..... the web is forever.
And yes, I realise not everyone buys a paper but even the papers websites dont print all the court items unless it has a significant enough importance to be worthy. i.e in the greater public interest..... not for armchair 'googling' experts who can trawl items up for eternity. Not everyone has a bebo/facebook lifestyle where they must let the world know when their next holiday is, or show pics of their new house, car, dog, hat, hairbrush etc.
With all respect to the said Journalist, its hardly 'The Cook Report' catagory. If for instance he'd used his 'skills' to uncover why theres a near organised crime element in Wick that seems to be untouchable by authorities from the Council to the DHSS right up to the Police, now that would be a story worth printing. That would be a public service. However sitting in Court writing who said/did what to who is pretty basic stuff.
The long term consequences of this type of web voyuerism far outweighs any short term gains. The 'Org' is not the Court System, neither is it the Police Force....they have their own websites......
Crackeday
31-May-10, 11:23
I suppose I was always going to be on a hiding to nothing with this one seens as I was expressing my views about web and internet forum content..............on an internet forum! The combined total of posts is 15,000+ of the users who dont entirely agree with me.. Where do yous find the time?...;)
Just to clear up on a few points.
Obviously, I dont condone anyone who has carried out a criminal offence, particullary against another person and or property. And also that its been a centuaries old tradition that law breakers are 'shamed' by some means of public knowledge.
However, look at it from a different prospective, the victim. A victim of crime has a harrowing enough expierience to go to court, give evidence and have a part of his/her life they wish never happened for all to read in the local paper. But todays newspaper is tomorrows chip wrappings..... the web is forever.
And yes, I realise not everyone buys a paper but even the papers websites dont print all the court items unless it has a significant enough importance to be worthy. i.e in the greater public interest..... not for armchair 'googling' experts who can trawl items up for eternity. Not everyone has a bebo/facebook lifestyle where they must let the world know when their next holiday is, or show pics of their new house, car, dog, hat, hairbrush etc.
With all respect to the said Journalist, its hardly 'The Cook Report' catagory. If for instance he'd used his 'skills' to uncover why theres a near organised crime element in Wick that seems to be untouchable by authorities from the Council to the DHSS right up to the Police, now that would be a story worth printing. That would be a public service. However sitting in Court writing who said/did what to who is pretty basic stuff.
The long term consequences of this type of web voyuerism far outweighs any short term gains. The 'Org' is not the Court System, neither is it the Police Force....they have their own websites......
I really dont see where your coming from. The court pages DONT have to be looked at, its your personal choice. If you dont want ot know about it, DONT read it!!! Simples.
You cant open a paper without seeing Court and crime reports whether its a tabloid or a broadsheet, so your argument Im afraid holds no water.
No-one said the org is the court system, it is merely reporting what is happening in Caithness, its a personal choice whether you want to read certain items.
If you read the rules of the forum you will see that it is against the rules to "fish" for information etc, so all you will read on the court pages is what has been reported as FACT in the actual court, not idle gossip etc.
cullbucket
31-May-10, 18:44
Well I am glad to see the sheriff court online.
I don't post often and I live overseas and the sherrif court pages has given me some of the best local entertainment over the years, hence my signature. People do the daftest things in caithness, especially after a fill of drink. I remember going to Ferriers with my mate one friday to see if his drunk and incapable made it to the groat before we went off to the pub. Often, the court reports often have some great quotes that remind me of home. Of course there are some things that are much darker and not in the least entertaining.... I'm not lumping everything together - maybe I am irresponsible and small minded, but if I did something that warranted a visit to the court, I would expect it to be in the groat or online in these days and that would be a part of the punishment.... oh the shame...
Welcomefamily
31-May-10, 23:37
It has been shown to be effective down south, people do have a choice of committing a crime.
http://www.theratbook.com
It has been shown to be effective down south, people do have a choice of committing a crime.
http://www.theratbook.com
Wowee!!....
Welcomefamily
01-Jun-10, 07:28
The pain and hurt many of these kids have doesnt stop at the end of the sentence.
Shouldn't justice be seen to be done?
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