Foxes

**Anfield** · 06-Jun-10, 15:38

Originally Posted by chiel

how do keep yours safe and secure?

In either my pocket or my my wallet

**bekisman** · 06-Jun-10, 15:40

Originally Posted by Shabbychic

Seen this before. It is one of a series of shots taken from a holiday cottage. It was also stated that this lamb fought off the fox and ran away unharmed.

You're right Shabbychic:

"A sequence of shots from the window of our hired cottage in the Lakes. The fox approached the lambs and singled one out, but despite the chase and the standoff, the little white fella somehow managed to see the fox off. "
http://www.flickr.com/photos/zoot42/3513913968/

**Leanne** · 06-Jun-10, 16:42

Originally Posted by Anfield

I don't suppose for one minute that you have considered ensuring that your livestock are safe and secure?

There have been various threads about this issue and it emerged that there are ways of keeping your livestock safe.

I imagine that you are concerned with the economic loss of your animals, so I will pose a question for you

Would you leave a £50/20 note or whatever in an open place without making sure that is secure?

Are you willing to pay the extra that it costs for the produce?

I have 'foxproofed' my chicken run but housing them in a slate built building and surrounding the enclosure with electrified chicken fencing. The fencing alone for a 50m x 20m run cost me £350 to put up (and that is using my OH's labour). Imagine multiplying this up to acres???

**Anfield** · 06-Jun-10, 16:49

Originally Posted by Leanne

Are you willing to pay the extra that it costs for the produce?

I have 'foxproofed' my chicken run but housing them in a slate built building and surrounding the enclosure with electrified chicken fencing. The fencing alone for a 50m x 20m run cost me £350 to put up (and that is using my OH's labour). Imagine multiplying this up to acres???

I don't eat meat so cost is not relevant to me

You have shown above, and in previous posts on different threads, that it is possible to safeguard livestock

If a person can not protect their livestock then maybe they should think again about their capabilities.

**Leanne** · 06-Jun-10, 16:55

Originally Posted by Anfield

You have shown above, and in previous posts on different threads, that it is possible to safeguard livestock

If a person can not protect their livestock then maybe they should think again about their capabilities.

I have shown that as a hobbyist it is possible to protect livestock. Unfortunately this is economically unfeasable. It's not about capabilities, it's about financial viability. Even a meat eater who eats organic and free range would probably baulk at the cost of a lamb joint that is 3 times the price of any other just because it's 'fox friendly'.

**Anfield** · 06-Jun-10, 17:09

Originally Posted by Leanne

Even a meat eater who eats organic and free range would probably baulk at the cost of a lamb joint that is 3 times the price of any other just because it's 'fox friendly'.

Various studies by Defra and others have shown that Fox predation on lambs is less than 2% and it is unclear what percentage of these are on healthy lambs, as opposed to sick and diseased animals.

Defra

http://www.agric.wa.gov.au/objtwr/im...ddf/f06201.pdf

**pegasus** · 06-Jun-10, 17:10

Originally Posted by veekay

Not my land but my live stock.

you avoided the question. what damage are these huge numbers of foxes doing?

**Leanne** · 06-Jun-10, 17:12

Originally Posted by pegasus

you avoided the question. what damage are these huge numbers of foxes doing?

I recon the lack of response means "none of your business". The OP asked if someone could help not justify himself/herself. Do you have a solution that doesn't involved shooting foxes and doesn't involve erecting fencing that isn't subsidised by the government?

**pegasus** · 06-Jun-10, 17:28

Originally Posted by Leanne

I recon the lack of response means "none of your business". The OP asked if someone could help not justify himself/herself. Do you have a solution that doesn't involved shooting foxes and doesn't involve erecting fencing that isn't subsidised by the government?

perhaps this is the wrong section then. this is the general section for youre information. Can the op not speak for themself?

**Leanne** · 06-Jun-10, 17:32

Originally Posted by pegasus

Can the op not speak for themself?

Originally Posted by Leanne

I recon the lack of response means "none of your business".

I think you might be a long time waiting

**pegasus** · 06-Jun-10, 17:47

Originally Posted by Leanne

I think you might be a long time waiting

so youre saying i wont get any sense out of either of you. i see

**unicorn** · 06-Jun-10, 17:49

Why on earth should any landowner and stock owner have to come on here and justify why they wish to rid their land of vermin.
Get a grip of yourselves people, it's all fine to sit in your town house and got to your cosy town job each day, it's a totally different story when you work 24 hours a day to lamb and look after your animals in all weather conditions and have foxes on the prowl that are liable to destroy your hard efforts.
I do not believe in killing animals for no reason but I do believe that when they pose a risk they should be dealt with in an efficient and quick way,
I abhor fox hunting but I can totally understand why someone would want to protect their land by humanely killing and we have absolutely no right whatsoever to try to butt in and interfere in their choice.

**pegasus** · 06-Jun-10, 18:01

Originally Posted by unicorn

Why on earth should any landowner and stock owner have to come on here and justify why they wish to rid their land of vermin.
Get a grip of yourselves people, it's all fine to sit in your town house and got to your cosy town job each day, it's a totally different story when you work 24 hours a day to lamb and look after your animals in all weather conditions and have foxes on the prowl that are liable to destroy your hard efforts.
I do not believe in killing animals for no reason but I do believe that when they pose a risk they should be dealt with in an efficient and quick way,
I abhor fox hunting but I can totally understand why someone would want to protect their land by humanely killing and we have absolutely no right whatsoever to try to butt in and interfere in their choice.

the op said that they were inundated with them and i and others wanted to know what damage they werre doing. looks like they cannot answer anyway.

btw, most people who work with lambs look after tghe animals not because they are sacrificing anything but because they want more money for themselves from the slaughterhouse to buy a 4x4. townies understand this well i assure you.

Peg

**unicorn** · 06-Jun-10, 18:05

So you are an expert are you, I actually know many people who have had rabbit hutches broken into and rabbits killed in hutches in their gardens, so how on earth is someone in the country supposed to keep the things away in fields if they want to have a go at their livestock. Go out and give it a try.
And the OP is trying to keep their stock safe by removing the danger they are facing. So your argument there is totally silly.
You see there is also a townie statement, Farmers genuinely need their 4x4 townies dont.

**Leanne** · 06-Jun-10, 18:14

Originally Posted by pegasus

btw, most people who work with lambs look after tghe animals not because they are sacrificing anything but because they want more money for themselves from the slaughterhouse to buy a 4x4.
Peg

Isn't this what everyone else would call a job? Why should farmers be any different - they have as much right to put food on the table, pay the bills and buy nice things as anyone else.

Unicorn is right - your post shouts 'townie'.

I've just been driving my 4x4 - out spraying my fields to kill the docks

**rich** · 06-Jun-10, 18:17

Here in Ontario foxes are a major source of rabies.
We have a humane way of dealing with the likelihood of rabies in wild life.
We feed the critters vaccine
Could a similar program utilising contraceptives be offered in Caithness?

http://www.mnr.gov.on.ca/en/Business...02_166320.html

**Kirdon** · 06-Jun-10, 18:42

Originally Posted by Leanne

Isn't this what everyone else would call a job? Why should farmers be any different - they have as much right to put food on the table, pay the bills and buy nice things as anyone else.

Unicorn is right - your post shouts 'townie'.

I've just been driving my 4x4 - out spraying my fields to kill the docks

Well said, I work to pay for my "nice things" to.

Originally Posted by rich

Here in Ontario foxes are a major source of rabies.
We have a humane way of dealing with the likelihood of rabies in wild life.
We feed the critters vaccine
Could a similar program utilising contraceptives be offered in Caithness?

http://www.mnr.gov.on.ca/en/Business...02_166320.html

The best contraceptive for Foxes that are bothering livestock is an accurately placed peice of lead.

**fred** · 06-Jun-10, 18:47

Originally Posted by rich

Here in Ontario foxes are a major source of rabies.
We have a humane way of dealing with the likelihood of rabies in wild life.
We feed the critters vaccine
Could a similar program utilising contraceptives be offered in Caithness?

http://www.mnr.gov.on.ca/en/Business...02_166320.html

Teaching the little critters how to put them on could be tricky.