I don't believe what I heard!

[porshiepoo]

All the time that I've been here in caithness I've never come across open prejudice or hostilities between English and Scottish (othere than on this forum but I have to say what I heard today completely stunned me, it wasn't so much what was said but the manner in which it was said, and where.
I was in a shop at the counter and two of the staff there were having a conversation obviously about the football, I didn't need to listen in as it was going on right next to me and not exactly quietly so I got to hear whether I wanted to or not. Anyway these two ladies were harping on about how a commentator on the football had said 'It's now us against the world' and were saying how ridiculous and over played this comment was. They then went on to say how 'They' never shut up about a win that was over forty years ago blah blah blah and how they hope anyone other than England wins. The next few minutes were spent basically in the same manner - berating England.
Now what made it worse for me was that I was stood right next to them and had spoken to the counter staff so they knew I was English yet did it stop them - nope! The worst of it was that this was in the post office in wick high street at the counters where evryone stand.
I was sorely tempted to suggest they leave their ignorant, prejudice remarks for the coffee break gossip but I really didn't think I'd be able to say it in a nice way.

Maybe I'm being a bit sensitive about this as I have heard the England football win comment many times and for someone who doesn't like football it's never bothered me. But the real problem was the way in which it was said and the fact that these two counter staff women didn't care one iota that maybe there were English customers in hearing range, who were feeling more than a tad uncomfortable about their nasty comments re England.
Perhaps these women are in no way prejudice to England but the way their comments were put certainly didn't make it sound that way.

I absolutely love caithness and it's people but that one ignorant conversation has left me a lot more aware of these ancient resentments and a lot less naiive.

[golach]

All the time that I've been here in caithness I've never come across open prejudice or hostilities between English and Scottish (othere than on this forum but I have to say what I heard today completely stunned me, it wasn't so much what was said but the manner in which it was said, and where.
I was in a shop at the counter and two of the staff there were having a conversation obviously about the football, I didn't need to listen in as it was going on right next to me and not exactly quietly so I got to hear whether I wanted to or not. Anyway these two ladies were harping on about how a commentator on the football had said 'It's now us against the world' and were saying how ridiculous and over played this comment was. They then went on to say how 'They' never shut up about a win that was over forty years ago blah blah blah and how they hope anyone other than England wins. The next few minutes were spent basically in the same manner - berating England.
Now what made it worse for me was that I was stood right next to them and had spoken to the counter staff so they knew I was English yet did it stop them - nope! The worst of it was that this was in the post office in wick high street at the counters where evryone stand.
I was sorely tempted to suggest they leave their ignorant, prejudice remarks for the coffee break gossip but I really didn't think I'd be able to say it in a nice way.

Maybe I'm being a bit sensitive about this as I have heard the England football win comment many times and for someone who doesn't like football it's never bothered me. But the real problem was the way in which it was said and the fact that these two counter staff women didn't care one iota that maybe there were English customers in hearing range, who were feeling more than a tad uncomfortable about their nasty comments re England.
Perhaps these women are in no way prejudice to England but the way their comments were put certainly didn't make it sound that way.

I absolutely love caithness and it's people but that one ignorant conversation has left me a lot more aware of these ancient resentments and a lot less naiive.

Porshie, its not the English people that most Scots that I know dislike, its the MEDIA and all the worst that comes out when we have this sort of thing rammed down our throats. i.e. 19 blooming 66!!!!! I love my English relations and my English pals a few I have met in here. BUT when the World Cup comes along, I change my nationality every time England plays, because I shout for the team that is playing England, once the World Cup is over sanity reigns, and I am normal again.
Porshie, please dont take it personal, its in the Sots genes

[jings00]

Porshie, its not the English people that most Scots that I know dislike, its the MEDIA and all the worst that comes out when we have this sort of thing rammed down our throats. i.e. 19 blooming 66!!!!! I love my English relations and my English pals a few I have met in here. BUT when the World Cup comes along, I change my nationality every time England plays, because I shout for the team that is playing England, once the World Cup is over sanity reigns, and I am normal again.
Porshie, please dont take it personal, its in the Sots genes

Pretty much agree with Golach here, it's the media wot does my head in. Though still pretty ignorant and unprofessional of the counter staff to make those comments. No very nice.

[angela5]

That's why the queue is always to the door, they are doing more gossiping than serving.
You should of said something to them porshiepoo, it might learn them to keep their gob's shut in future and concentrate on their queue of customers.

[kenimac1]

Afraid there is a very vocal, very small minority of 'outsider haters' around here, most of whom have never ventured beyond the borders of Scotland.

[Squares]

"Outsider haters"

They were speaking about the English football team.

Reality/hyposensitvity check required

[Whitewater]

It is the media that causes all the problems. I always support any British team that that is playing, whether it is football, rugby or cricket, but I do get rather tired of hearing the 1966 saga dragged up everytime England are playing in either the European or World championships. I have worked with English people all my life, both here and abroad, have many English friends and have played football and rugby abroad where we had British teams that consisted of Irish & Welch as well as English, we always had a great time together, many laughs, drinks and good nights, where fun was on the agenda, not prejudiced towards each other in any way.
You were unfortunate porshiepoo to have met two bigoted idiotic women who have probably not been out of Wick or Caithness, never mind Scotland. We are not all like that, the gripe is at the media.

[paris]

Hi there Porshie. Do you remember the school incident ??? The comment which i got ?? (We tend to stick together ) I will never forget that, nor will my kids, and that was from someone who was dep head of wick school !!!

[peter macdonald]

Totally agree with Whitewater Golach et all...When it comes to England playing football some of the media in England lose all sense and shame ...and it is that fact not the English people .not their players ,not their coach who hack the rest of the Uk off Ever read the Sun etc whenever England play Argentina or more especially Germany ??? A few years ago the prominent German politician Helmut Schmitt wrote to the PM and put a letter in the Times complaining bitterly and quite rightly about the covertly racist headlines before a game between England and Germany I was cringing when I read them
So Im sorry if any Englsh folks are offended by such remarks as was heard in the Post Office but I cannot say it will get any better until the world cup is over and the media frenzy has died down

[peter macdonald]

Paris i dont know what comments you received in Wick or want to as it aint my business but i suspect it was akin to some of the jibes about being Scottish i got from a tiny minority of illeducated Englishmen when i worked in Essex They made up abt 0.001% of the folks I dealt with In fact the worst comment i came across was from the Evening Standard who described an out break of food posioning in the central belt as "jocks with the runs"
So things are said like this all over the UK not just up here and I dont think they represent the true feelings of the locals where ever they are in the UK
PS my workmate who was from Ireland had to put up with a lot more "jokes" than i had to

[Corsastu]

i agree with it being the media am sick of hearing bout rooney not being able to play and its the end o the world and if its no at its theo wallcot getting in the squad wished they wud shut up about it

[tip top]

porshiepoo - 'fraid you will hear a lot more comments akin to the ones heard in Wick over the next few months (and years). The constant references to 1966, calling the English Team us (when reporting across the UK) and downright rudeness and ignorance shown in comments directed towards both the opposition and the teams own management (e.g. Graham Taylors picture as a swede) do not go unnoticed in the territories. So perhaps the comments you heard were only as offensive as the tripe we hear constantly?

[gleeber]

Its got nothing to do with football or the English media. If Scotland had won the world cup do you really think we would have let the world forget it?. Unlikely! It's pure and unadulterated prejudice and its nothing short of racism.
Read the posts and you will see that they are not even aware of their prejudice. They probably see it as a bit of lightsome banter but as porshiepoos post confirms its far from that.
I was the same until a few years ago until I was challenged about the source of that banter. I didnt have any excuse when the attitude was stripped to the bare bones. It did me the world of good because it also helped me see the source of other prejudices I had formed as a child, growing up in an intolerant society. Homosexuality, religious discrimination, skin colour, all of them were laid bare.
I honstly believe that whats going on in this thread is very important for each individual to consider the real source of their resentment. On top of that, get over it, and you can all have have a fantastic team to support in the coming world cup. I for one will be shouting for England.

[Corsastu]

well for one aye wont be cheering on england if they won it it would be in the papers for monthson end and we wud hear of nothing else

[JimH]

I'm not English - I'm from Liverpool - of Irish and Welsh decendents _ and I live in Caithness. I love to watch all the sports wether it be Scotland winning the Calcutta Cup or England winning the ashes, or Carlisle getting promoted or Gretna getting to Europe****.
There will always be winners and losers - and we will always have something or other rammed down our throat by the media - and, of course, everything in the media is gospel.
Whatever you heard - and it sounded unpleasant - it is not representative of the people of Caithness. I should have come here years ago.
We all like winners - but have to look after the losers as well, but you will always have the bigot with the larger than life "Cakehole" to spoil it for others.

[porshiepoo]

Its got nothing to do with football or the English media. If Scotland had won the world cup do you really think we would have let the world forget it?. Unlikely! It's pure and unadulterated prejudice and its nothing short of racism.
Read the posts and you will see that they are not even aware of their prejudice. They probably see it as a bit of lightsome banter but as porshiepoos post confirms its far from that.
I was the same until a few years ago until I was challenged about the source of that banter. I didnt have any excuse when the attitude was stripped to the bare bones. It did me the world of good because it also helped me see the source of other prejudices I had formed as a child, growing up in an intolerant society. Homosexuality, religious discrimination, skin colour, all of them were laid bare.
I honstly believe that whats going on in this thread is very important for each individual to consider the real source of their resentment. On top of that, get over it, and you can all have have a fantastic team to support in the coming world cup. I for one will be shouting for England.

My sentiments exactly!
If Scotland won a world cup I'm sure they'd be so proud of it however many years later that they'd want to let everyone know, and rightly so. England has a right to be proud of that achievement and IMO it appears that those who would rather it was never mentioned again are simply jealous of Englands football achievement and that in turns fuels the prejudice against them.
Don't get me wrong, I could care less about any football win but I know for sure that if Scotland won or Wales or Ireland (Hmmmm not sure if these have a team as I know zilch about football), I for one would be happy for them and certainly wouldn't expect them to sweep it under the carpet.


I think a real problem is that the football teams are split in this way. Why can't we just have team 'UK'? it would do away with a lot of the prejudices anyway. Incidentally how many of the players in these teams are actually born and bred players of that country? The prejudice seems especially irrational to me!

My main problem with what happened today is not what was said, I know that sort of thing goes on everyday, and if I'd overheard it in the street by passersby I probably wouldn't have been so bothered.
It was the fact that these two women were being so obviously prejudice whilst working in a public enviroment and seemed to have no concern about who was there or who they were offending. I actually felt quite sorry for the lady that served me cos she was English too! What a lovely enviroment to have to work in!

[golach]

Its got nothing to do with football or the English media. If Scotland had won the world cup do you really think we would have let the world forget it?. Unlikely! It's pure and unadulterated prejudice and its nothing short of racism.
Read the posts and you will see that they are not even aware of their prejudice. They probably see it as a bit of lightsome banter but as porshiepoos post confirms its far from that.
I was the same until a few years ago until I was challenged about the source of that banter. I didnt have any excuse when the attitude was stripped to the bare bones. It did me the world of good because it also helped me see the source of other prejudices I had formed as a child, growing up in an intolerant society. Homosexuality, religious discrimination, skin colour, all of them were laid bare.
I honstly believe that whats going on in this thread is very important for each individual to consider the real source of their resentment. On top of that, get over it, and you can all have have a fantastic team to support in the coming world cup. I for one will be shouting for England.

Aye you'll be supporting England you say, does that not make You predjudiced? For heavens sake man, get a grip, its only football we are talking about here. A sport, not Global Warming, Famine in Ethiopia, or a threat of being overrun by radical homosexual Islamic fundmentalists, who may be colour blind. ITS Football a game, get a life Gleeber come off your Holy Willie soap box, and join the rest of humanity.

[obiron]

Aye you'll be supporting England you say, does that not make You predjudiced? For heavens sake man, get a grip, its only football we are talking about here. A sport, not Global Warming, Famine in Ethiopia, or a threat of being overrun by radical homosexual Islamic fundmentalists, who may be colour blind. ITS Football a game, get a life Gleeber come off your Holy Willie soap box, and join the rest of humanity.

well said golach. i like a lot of england players but the english media does my head in. during the last world cup was there not panic about david beckham this year its wayne rooney.

[Jeid]

To be honest, the English media have been bringing this up for 40 years now. I'm tired of it now. I've only been alive 23 years!

I actually hope they don't win it. Not because I don't like the English. I just can't be bothered with the media hype that will follow it. If the press could keep quiet, then I wouldn't mind it so much.

[landmarker]

I'm not surprised ther eis some resentment. I'd happily take it on board and try to tackle it with humour.

The Scots have every right to be fed up of England's '66 and all that. It wasn't too much of a big deal down here back then. I was a paper boy and actually left the telly as extra time started to go and do my paper round - and I was a football fanatic! Only the passage of time and the growth of football as a media love interest in the meantime has highlighted that 'ancient' victory. We were the home side after all. most host nations do very well in the competition. England were not an attractive side to watch back then, they seldom have been since either.

When I finally move up there (somewhere) I'll expect about 50% resentment & will live with it. If it's just the football team they're slagging off I'll rest easy.

I think I'd have mentioned Scottish goalkeepers or some similarly daft talking point. They'd have sneered behind me back of course but am I bothered?