Spiritualists in the Far North - A Debate.

**joxville** · 12-Feb-10, 04:43

As long as you don't talk about football, politics or religion then most forums will tick along just nicely.

Makes for a helluva boring forum though.

**joxville** · 12-Feb-10, 04:44

Anyway Mr M., slightly off topic, why are you up so late?

**Metalattakk** · 12-Feb-10, 04:47

Originally Posted by joxville

Anyway Mr M., slightly off topic, why are you up so late?

Special dispensation.

**joxville** · 12-Feb-10, 05:08

Oh well, I'll be off and try again to get some sleep before the alarm sounds at 7.15am

**gleeber** · 12-Feb-10, 20:40

Your probably right Jox and charlatans not the right word to use to describe your interests.

It wasnt meant in a derogatory manner. I must'nt forget that maybe Jox is right and he can talk to the dead and predict the future but until Ive had a session with him I'll reserve my opinion.
Spiritism seems similar to the prophetic word some brands of Christians claim to recieve from various saintly sources. Its not uncommon to get thoughts in our heads. I suspect we are all born with the ability but only by using the facilities do we learn to interpret its contents.
Reading cards or palms or horoscopes are all part of the same source.
The interesting thing is that the thoughts are there.
I suppose by taking the opposite view that those thoughts all come from inside my head Jox and me would never agree unless he convinced me.
I'm open for convincing.

**katarina** · 15-Feb-10, 15:38

Originally Posted by gleeber

Charlatans calling charlatans charlatans. Only on the org.

I'm not sceptical! I find the notion that someone is born with the abilty to speak with the dead and to make predictions about the future, ridiculous.
I respect your beliefs though.

Are you saying that jox is a charlatan?

And as i am really interested in this phenomenon a question for jox. I believe you, but can you be sure that it is not a form of mind reading, that you yourself are not aware of?

**Red** · 15-Feb-10, 22:04

Apparently everyone is born with a gift, but most people block it out when they are too young to remember - have you ever had an imaginary friend or seen patterns on a wall or ceiling that you think are faces? Who says that they are not?

Have you ever had deja vu, or 'known' something that you really cannot explain how you knew? Have you ever smelled something that wasn't there? Have you ever had shivers down your spine or gone cold then suddenly warm again? These are all signs.

On another note are there any clairvoyants/mediums in the Caithness ares who do private readings that people can recommend?

**Boozeburglar** · 15-Feb-10, 23:03

Originally Posted by Red

Have you ever had deja vu

Sure.

At the same time I get amnesia.

**cuddlepop** · 16-Feb-10, 09:16

Originally Posted by Red

Apparently everyone is born with a gift, but most people block it out when they are too young to remember - have you ever had an imaginary friend or seen patterns on a wall or ceiling that you think are faces? Who says that they are not?

Have you ever had deja vu, or 'known' something that you really cannot explain how you knew? Have you ever smelled something that wasn't there? Have you ever had shivers down your spine or gone cold then suddenly warm again? These are all signs.

On another note are there any clairvoyants/mediums in the Caithness ares who do private readings that people can recommend?

We all have a sixth sense its just some of us have switched it off or dont develop it.

When i was younger my senses were more "tuned" into these things now its all gone quiet unless its immediate family.

**katarina** · 16-Feb-10, 14:03

Originally Posted by cuddlepop

We all have a sixth sense its just some of us have switched it off or dont develop it.

When i was younger my senses were more "tuned" into these things now its all gone quiet unless its immediate family.

But what is that sixth sense? Are we really tuning into the spirit world, on onto some one else's wave lengths? Any spiritualists out there able to clarify that?
Has anyone read Brian Weiss? Very interesting book 'Many lives, Many masters.'

**gleeber** · 16-Feb-10, 14:06

Originally Posted by katarina

Are you saying that jox is a charlatan?

And as i am really interested in this phenomenon a question for jox. I believe you, but can you be sure that it is not a form of mind reading, that you yourself are not aware of?

Originally Posted by katarina

But what is that sixth sense? Are we really tuning into the spirit world, on onto some one else's wave lengths? Any spiritualists out there able to clarify that?
Has anyone read Brian Weiss? Very interesting book 'Many lives, Many masters.'

If you read my second post you would see I withdrew my accusation against Jox that he is a charlatan. A charlatan falsely claims to have a special skill and I think Jox really believes the thoughts and voices he gets in his head are messages from the dead. I think he's deluded though, and you too if you believe him.

Its difficult not to sound disrespectful when we are discussing someones beliefs, particularly someone elses beliefs, but if it comes across like that its only because I need to understand why people would translate the contents of their own heads to suppose they come from a source, not only from outside our own heads but from outside our own world. I think the notion is outrageous so I believe my response to you is as respectful as I can be without compromising my own beliefs.
That being said I will gladly offer myself in public or private to anyone who thinks they have this special skill to give me a message from beyond the grave and I will be more than happy to confirm I am wrong, or deluded, whichever the case may be.

**3of8** · 16-Feb-10, 15:15

Originally Posted by gleeber

If you read my second post you would see I withdrew my accusation against Jox that he is a charlatan. A charlatan falsely claims to have a special skill and I think Jox really believes the thoughts and voices he gets in his head are messages from the dead. I think he's deluded though, and you too if you believe him.

Its difficult not to sound disrespectful when we are discussing someones beliefs, particularly someone elses beliefs, but if it comes across like that its only because I need to understand why people would translate the contents of their own heads to suppose they come from a source, not only from outside our own heads but from outside our own world. I think the notion is outrageous so I believe my response to you is as respectful as I can be without compromising my own beliefs.
That being said I will gladly offer myself in public or private to anyone who thinks they have this special skill to give me a message from beyond the grave and I will be more than happy to confirm I am wrong, or deluded, whichever the case may be.

So how do you know that thoughts that come into your head are not from the dead? If you are, for example, driving your car to work and you suddenly think about a fondly remembered dead relative or friend, how can you prove that the spirit of that person hasn't made contact with you causing the thought?

Yesterday, I thought about my aunt and some of the funny things she did for absolutely no reason and she's been dead for 20 years. Why would that happen?

Have you not considered that maybe people like Jox are channels to the spirit world because people like you and I are too dense to appreciate that we're being spoken to?

**onecalledk** · 16-Feb-10, 16:04

Originally Posted by 3of8

So how do you know that thoughts that come into your head are not from the dead? If you are, for example, driving your car to work and you suddenly think about a fondly remembered dead relative or friend, how can you prove that the spirit of that person hasn't made contact with you causing the thought?

Yesterday, I thought about my aunt and some of the funny things she did for absolutely no reason and she's been dead for 20 years. Why would that happen?

Have you not considered that maybe people like Jox are channels to the spirit world because people like you and I are too dense to appreciate that we're being spoken to?

Would agree totally with this post. How many times has it been documented that family members for example "know" when someone is in trouble or not well or in need of help. Mothers have a very strong bond with their children and can often just "know" when something has happened to one of their offspring.

How many times have you answered the phone to find the person you were just thinking about at the other end? Our "gut feeling" is our connection to those around us, it is our "sixth sense".

Why does the idea of being able to link to others on the planet whether actually physically here in body or not seem to provoke such a reaction of disbelief in people? If it cannot be proven to be real it cannot be proven to be unreal!

I dont quite understand why people get so riled about their having to be a definate answer to life and death, why is it so important to some that life is just life and there is nothing else ? why does it provoke such strong emotions ? Why is it not possible for everyone to have their own belief and that belief not tested or ridiculed?

We are all correct at any given time.

K

**joxville** · 16-Feb-10, 16:47

Originally Posted by gleeber

If you read my second post you would see I withdrew my accusation against Jox that he is a charlatan. A charlatan falsely claims to have a special skill and I think Jox really believes the thoughts and voices he gets in his head are messages from the dead. I think he's deluded though, and you too if you believe him.

Its difficult not to sound disrespectful when we are discussing someones beliefs, particularly someone elses beliefs, but if it comes across like that its only because I need to understand why people would translate the contents of their own heads to suppose they come from a source, not only from outside our own heads but from outside our own world. I think the notion is outrageous so I believe my response to you is as respectful as I can be without compromising my own beliefs.
That being said I will gladly offer myself in public or private to anyone who thinks they have this special skill to give me a message from beyond the grave and I will be more than happy to confirm I am wrong, or deluded, whichever the case may be.

Thanks for clarifying your position.

It doesn't matter whether you believe whole-heartedly in spiritualism or not, you should still question it, I do. It took me a long time to accept the way I am, and I still question everyday why can I do something that others can't? I'm not deluded in any way, though I did think along similar lines when I was young. I've learned to switch it on and off at will, though sometimes if a spirit is desperate enough to get a message to someone, it will pester me until I acknowledge it. I can see where Metallattakk and Gleeber are coming from, where is the rock solid evidence? The truthful answer is there isn't any, it's up to the medium to believe what they are receiving is sound enough evidence, and for the person receiving the reading to take from it what they want. Should you have blind faith in it? Absolutely not, no more than you should put blind faith in any religion or belief. I know it's difficult for Metallattakk, Gleeber and others to put into words what they think without it seeming disrespectful, I'm sure for the most part they aren't trying to be, it's just that they need something more concrete than 'because I believe in it, you should too'. I know so many mediums that accept what they receive as absolute proof, that they don't feel the need to question, which actually makes them quite dangerous, because they will try so hard to convince the recipient that they are right in what they are saying. To me, that is so very wrong, the recipients emotional state is being taken advantage of, and who knows what could result from that. Spiritualism isn't dangerous, mediumship is. Be careful who you see and what you believe, always question the medium, don't make it easy for them, the brain is a powerful tool, it's weakness is it's open to suggestion.

**sandyr1** · 18-Feb-10, 03:44

Originally Posted by joxville

I was raised to have a strong sense of right and wrong, to believe in justice, to be honest and fair. I am an open person. I give what I receive in good faith and for free. I am not, never have been, and never will be dishonest in my dealings with anyone, especially at a time when some people are feeling emotionally raw.

Love and light to you and yours.

*********** Whilst reading the local 'crack' I came upon this statement by Joxville...I am having difficulty understanding how he can quote so beautifully, and in the next breath let his 'dark humour' pour from his mouth/hands about people dying/ Seems to be a wee bitty of a contradiction here......
************Would the Real Man please stand up...you have to be one or the other, not both!

**golach** · 18-Feb-10, 10:31

Originally Posted by sandyr1

Whilst reading the local 'crack' I came upon this statement by Joxville...I am having difficulty understanding how he can quote so beautifully, and in the next breath let his 'dark humour' pour from his mouth/hands about people dying/ Seems to be a wee bitty of a contradiction here......
Would the Real Man please stand up...you have to be one or the other, not both!

Ach come on Sandyr1, if you were sitting in Caithness and reading this and not in Canada as you are, would you be so indignant at Jox? I think not.
Another Orger made uncalled for reference to the death of Princess Diana on the same day, and that did not make you indignant.
To quote your good self "you have to be one or the other".

**Boozeburglar** · 18-Feb-10, 11:14

I was not wondering around making jokes about Di when it happened. In fact I was passing the piles of flowers and crowds of rubber neckers on my way to deal with flesh and bone everyday people, including more than one war veteran, supporting them and their families and carers in order to let them die in peace and dignity.

When have I claimed to be sensitive or open to the spirit of people who have passed on? I have not claimed to talk to dead people.

Someone mentioned Diana had a black Ford car, I mentioned she did not have much luck with black cars.

If, after 13 years that is too much, or uncalled for, then perhaps you need to get a grip.

**Boozeburglar** · 18-Feb-10, 11:20

Originally Posted by joxville

I know, personally, about 70 mediums, but am acquainted with maybe close on 200. . . . I've never met a medium who has a book or business to promote.

Not a single one had a book they were selling at the end of the meeting? Not a single one runs any business with their 'gift' and offers information about it at the end of their meetings?

I am beginning to wonder who these 200 are. Are they dead people?

**sandyr1** · 18-Feb-10, 13:24

Well Mr G...you may have a point....BUT.... I am sure that we would all like a modicum of decency and sensivity (even you and I who likely have seem more than most). And I didn't see the other post...
I don't know/ just distasteful, plus the fact that the author of the post likely is do far out of that poor young man's league...... don't think that is/ should be what the Org stands for....
And I am sure you are aware that there is some nastiness creeping into posts on here, and perhaps these things should be 'nipped in the bud'.
I am sure there are many like me who like to hear whats happening in Caithness etc., without the dirt.....well too much dirt and disrespect...anyway I just found post of his love etc....kinda doesn't connect......................

**katarina** · 18-Feb-10, 15:09

Originally Posted by sandyr1

*********** Whilst reading the local 'crack' I came upon this statement by Joxville...I am having difficulty understanding how he can quote so beautifully, and in the next breath let his 'dark humour' pour from his mouth/hands about people dying/ Seems to be a wee bitty of a contradiction here......
************Would the Real Man please stand up...you have to be one or the other, not both!

Which post contradicted this? I'm having difficulty understanding.