'Bonanza for drug firms'

[Phill]

It's a good job were not paranoid!

So the powers that be ordered a wagon load of vaccines in preparation, fortunately it didn't end up like Survivors and they've got half a wagon load left.
Be grateful they got it wrong the right way.

Ok so a drugs company earned some pennies, big wow.

As for creating the disease in a lab so they can miraculously appear with the vaccine......hmm, been reading too many Hollywood scripts maybe.

I know a guy, a Doctor in fact, maybe Professor, smartypants either way and I call him Dr Dave 'cos it annoys him. Anyway I digress, he does research into these types of virus'sses and other microbio diseasy type things. I really don't understand it all but the point is, nature mutates these things at a pretty fantastic rate.

This is part of the reason we have MRSA and other Superbugs, they mutate and change their own defence systems against ours (Dr Dave's) drugs and stuff that are created to fight them.

As I understand it, it's an ongoing battle and we're playing catchup.

[sevenfortyseven]

It's a good job were not paranoid!

So the powers that be ordered a wagon load of vaccines in preparation, fortunately it didn't end up like Survivors and they've got half a wagon load left.
Be grateful they got it wrong the right way.

Ok so a drugs company earned some pennies, big wow.

As for creating the disease in a lab so they can miraculously appear with the vaccine......hmm, been reading too many Hollywood scripts maybe.

I know a guy, a Doctor in fact, maybe Professor, smartypants either way and I call him Dr Dave 'cos it annoys him. Anyway I digress, he does research into these types of virus'sses and other microbio diseasy type things. I really don't understand it all but the point is, nature mutates these things at a pretty fantastic rate.

This is part of the reason we have MRSA and other Superbugs, they mutate and change their own defence systems against ours (Dr Dave's) drugs and stuff that are created to fight them.

As I understand it, it's an ongoing battle and we're playing catchup.

here here.

[Stavro]

If you go back years ago to Thalidomide that was billed as a safe anti sickness drug and look what happened there......

Just because a drug company tells you there drug is a miracle does NOT make it a miracle. There bottom line is PROFIT . How can you trust a company whos sole objective is PROFIT. Health then does not come into it.

K

Valid points, K.

And Phill's, too, about mutation in viruses.

Originally it was thought that two doses given 21 days apart would be required for full efficacy. ...

As of 3 December 2009, 11.2 million doses of Pandemrix have been delivered to health services in the UK, where the vaccine forms the bulk of the governments mass vaccination programme. This is nowhere near the 132 Million doeses that is claimed withing this thread.

The orders placed by government to the pharma companies were based on the original thought of multiple doses that you allude to, and the fact that the original plan was to vaccinate the entire population. Once the orders were placed, you can bet that there would be no opt-out clause.

The amount left over just indicates the very low take-up rate.

Do you think that the science reporter at the Mail made the figures up?

[tonkatojo]

Valid points, K.

And Phill's, too, about mutation in viruses.




The orders placed by government to the pharma companies were based on the original thought of multiple doses that you allude to, and the fact that the original plan was to vaccinate the entire population. Once the orders were placed, you can bet that there would be no opt-out clause.

The amount left over just indicates the very low take-up rate.

Do you think that the science reporter at the Mail made the figures up?

Come on Stavro, news paper reporters telling the truth are like rocky horse dung.

[Stavro]

Come on Stavro, news paper reporters telling the truth are like rocky horse dung.

Okay, okay, okay.

[Bazeye]

I thought this thread was going to be about organised drug cartels.

[Kodiak]

Valid points, K.



Do you think that the science reporter at the Mail made the figures up?

Er... Let me think about this..........Difficult one this........Now let me see, would a reporter exagerate figures to sell newspapers..........I would say a BIG YES..

[Neil Howie]

Originally Posted by Stavro
My view is that this "swine flu" was engineered in a lab by the same people who offered the gubberment/grubbyment the vaccine to cure it.

Thought Stavro was off his rocker, until I read this, or listen as a podcast, from those good people at naked Scientist:

Chris - What are the present theories about how they arise?

Adrian - Well, the simplest theory that has been put out is that perhaps it’s an entirely natural occurrence. We believe that most ‘flus are getting around in birds so presumably it’s got around in birds. However, this new flu shows no relationship with birds. All of its most immediate ancestors are viruses of pigs. Therefore, you’ve got to believe where it’s got around in pigs. But the real problem with that is that it clearly has three separate parents. And one of those parents was in North America some years ago. One was in South East Asia. And one was in Europe. So you got to think of getting three pigs from different parts of the world together to make the new virus.

Chris - So what you’re saying is when you, sort of, molecularly interrogate the genetic history of what we’re seeing as the H1N1 swine flu pandemic, you can see that it must have three independent bits of parentage. And the big question is, “Well, how on Earth did all those parents come together to infect the first person who got this?”

Adrian - That’s right. So if they were brought together by pigs, for example, say through live pig trade between continents, it means that quarantine, which has worked for dozens of years in the past, has somehow broken down on at least two occasions. If you got to get three things together in one part of the world, one might be there originally. The other two have to come through quarantine to leave the country and come through quarantine to get into a country. So that’s one possibility. The other possibility which we have put into this paper that we have published is that we’ve been thinking, could have they got together by some sort of laboratory error? We know that virologists pass viruses from one another around the world for use in their laboratories, for identification, for making vaccines and so on. What sort of conditions might three viruses have got together in one place in order to be able to shuffle their genes and produce the new pandemic flu?

read it all at was swine flu man made



--- Insert smug quote here ---

[Stavro]

The drug companies and the government are testing things well in advance of ever telling the people anything. You get told what they want you to know about. The food industry is linked in with the drug companies. Our food is full of harmful chemicals that are no good for general health, it suits the companies to produce food that contains little nutrients because then we can be fooled into buying vitamins over the counter which the drug companies make. Its a win/win for them.

Vitamins, micronutrients and other natural health approaches are the arch-enemies of the pharmaceutical industry, because they are not patentable. Even more importantly, they effectively help prevent and control diseases, because they correct the malfunction of millions of cells in our body as the primary cause of disease. It is becoming increasingly more difficult to obtain natural vitamins that have not been synthetically produced.
All this knowledge has been banned from being applied to medicine in favour of the multi-billion dollar investment business with patented drugs.The pharmaceutical industry is not a 'health industry'. It's an investment business. The business with disease makes more profit than any other industry on earth.

[toodiemac]

“Swine flu may have started in laboratory, expert says
20 May 2009
The man who helped develop the Tamiflu flu anti-viral drug believes the swine flu epidemic has been caused by human error. Adrian Gibbs says the H1N1 virus may have been man-made and was passed to humans after a handling mistake at a laboratory.
Gibbs, who has studied germ evolution for 40 years, is to publish a paper about his theory, which he developed after studying the swine flu virus’s genetic blueprint. “One of the simplest explanations is that it’s a laboratory escape,” he told reporters from Bloomberg.
Viruses are developed on eggs, and Gibbs believes the new H1N1 strain may have accidentally evolved before being passed to humans. He has discovered that the strain mutates three times faster than the most closely-related viruses found in pigs, which suggests it had evolved outside of swine.
It would not be the first time a virus has ‘escaped’ from a laboratory. Earlier this year the avian flu virus made its way into a consignment of seasonal flu vaccines, which were destined for around 18 countries in Europe.
Some scientists also suspect that the Russian flu outbreak of 1977 was started when a virus was accidentally released from a laboratory.
(Source: Bloomberg.com. May 13, 2009).”

[toodiemac]

For those who believe that it just couldn’t happen, remember that avian flu was very nearly released into the population by a large pharmaceutical company last year (or it may have been the year before). The company said that it had been a mistake.

It was a large batch of seasonal flu vaccines which were infected, and that was some mistake to make! However, it gets worse - that very same batch of seasonal flu vaccine had not been attenuated either (which seasonal flu vaccine always is) which is another massive mistake to make! The combination of the un-attenuated seasonal flu vaccine mixed with the avian flu vaccine – well it just doesn’t bear thinking about, a real serious pandemic situation. Anyway, not only were those two huge mistakes made, and the vaccine batch very obviously wasn’t tested, but all this was only discovered by somebody (I seem to remember it was a lab technician or something) who decided to test the batch after receiving it for distribution. That somebody did not have to test it, and was not under instructions to test it, they did it of their own back (thankfully).

Now, it’s hard to use the word ‘impossible’ in science, but the chances of the above happening purely by chance are, well, as impossible as you could get really given all the safety procedures in place. It’s all fact, so definitely not some made-up conspiracy theory by the way, before anybody decides to go down that route.

[toodiemac]

Another thing I found really interesting is that pharmaceutical companies produce what they call mock-up vaccines, i.e. they get a vaccine made, tested and therefore ready to use should the need arise quickly i.e. in a pandemic situation (Tested in so much as it can be, remember it's not the final vaccine which will be used). All the ingredients and additives are used and then added to that is a flu strain. Now the European guidelines (don’t know off hand the exact details but I could probably link to them if anybody wanted) state that the flu strain chosen for the mock-up should be one which pretty much the whole population would have no resistance to whatsoever, to enable adequate testing. That vaccine is then registered (some European thing).

In November 2008 when the mock up flu vaccine was registered the strain of flu which was chosen to go in it was swine flu. It was then tested (though I don’t know where about in the world the testing took place) and lo and behold – we have a swine flu outbreak the following April.

Now, I know that an attenuated flu vaccine can’t actually give you the flu, but as I pointed out in my previous post it’s perfectly possible for the vaccine company to ‘make a mistake’ and release the vaccine without it being attenuated – not just possible, it has happened.

Make of that what you will – maybe I am a bit of a conspiracy theorist actually but it’s all fact, no fiction. I think it all deserves a great deal of thought really.

[Stavro]

Pharmaceutical companies are based upon profits, not ethics. Why should we believe their "mistake" claims? Oil companies are geared on profit, too; is it a "mistake" when they do not pass on reductions in crude prices?

[roadbowler]

great post toodiemac! And must say i agree with stavro about the pharmaceutical industry and their arch enemy. Natural holistic medicine works and not a lot of profit to be made. Pharmaceuticals create more illness than cure as far as i can make out or else it wouldna be the 3rd largest industry in the world. Btw. Pandemrix was not the only vaccine used in the uk. Not saying it'll make up the numbers but, worth mentioning. Tuesday. WHO hearing. Subject: faked pandemics. Interesting. For the person who said these swine flu vaccines were tested all the same as any others. Show me where. They haven't. There is not one clinical trial saying the vaccine will lower the mortality rate of swine flu. Not one. Btw. The seasonal flu jab only lowers the death rate of seasonal flu overall by 1%. I'll say it again. 1% because it don't work.

[roadbowler]

btw. What i forgot to say was, the stupidest thing about this whole charade is the government were placing orders and buying this vaccine before ANY type of testing was done to see if it even bloody worked. Do you buy a car before seeing it works? No. The government spent hundreds of millions of your money on a vaccine that they didn't even know worked for a fabricated pandemic that never happened. You couldna make it up, could ye? Lol

[Stavro]

btw. What i forgot to say was, the stupidest thing about this whole charade is the government were placing orders and buying this vaccine before ANY type of testing was done to see if it even bloody worked. Do you buy a car before seeing it works? No. The government spent hundreds of millions of your money on a vaccine that they didn't even know worked for a fabricated pandemic that never happened. You couldna make it up, could ye? Lol

Staggering, isn't it?

[Kodiak]

“Swine flu may have started in laboratory, expert says
20 May 2009
”

Swine Flu Linked to 1918 Influenza Pandemic

In 1918 a human influenza virus known as the Spanish flu spread through the central United States while a swine respiratory disease occurred concurrently. A Kansas State University researcher has found that the virus causing the pandemic was able to infect and replicate in pigs, but did not kill them, unlike in other mammalian hosts like monkeys, mice and ferrets where the infection has been lethal.


So it looks like Swine Flu has been around longer than you think, to read more click on the Link Below :-


http://blogs.discovery.com/news_anim...-pandemic.html

Also as reported here at Wikkipedia

1918 pandemic in humans

The 1918 flu pandemic in humans was associated with H1N1 and influenza appearing in pigs; this may reflect a zoonosis either from swine to humans, or from humans to swine. Although it is not certain in which direction the virus was transferred, some evidence suggests that, in this case, pigs caught the disease from humans. For instance, swine influenza was only noted as a new disease of pigs in 1918, after the first large outbreaks of influenza amongst people. It is estimated that anywhere from 50 to 100 million people were killed worldwide.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swine_influenza

[purplelady]

Not everyone was offered it which i thin k we should have been I have the seasonal one my son had his and he was fine i think had i been offfered i would have had it waht makes me mad if they have so much left over then why not offer it to everyone then sell off the rest