Should men be able to choose?

[golach]

A 25-year-old Michigan computer programmer named Matthew Dubay sued in federal court to avoid paying child support for his 7-month-old daughter. The girl's mother, he alleges, had claimed to be both infertile and on birth control, and he had made it clear all along that he didn't want children. The resulting pregnancy, as he saw it, was simply not his fault, and the child not in any way his responsibility. I don't think he should have to pay unless he wants to but what's your opinion?

You ladies have all gotten away from the origional question set by pooltneytooner. The man in this case should get the benifit of the doubt, how could she be infertile and on the pill, and he made it clear he did not want children, another case of ...it has to be the mans fault, because its us that gives birth.

[connieb19]

you can all say what you want at the end of the day he should got off at georgemas

I don't think he should have gone on the train at all.. if he's not prepared to pay the fare..

[connieb19]

You ladies have all gotten away from the origional question set by pooltneytooner. The man in this case should get the benifit of the doubt, how could she be infertile and on the pill, and he made it clear he did not want children, another case of ...it has to be the mans fault, because its us that gives birth.

It dosn't really matter whos "fault" it is. There is now a child involved. If he shouldn't pay to bring it up, then who should?

[golach]

It dosn't really matter whos "fault" it is. There is now a child involved. If he shouldn't pay to bring it up, then who should?

Good question connie...Her!!!!!

[Billy Boy]

speaking as man i would'nt trust any woman i had only just met and was going to have a one night stand with (besides Mrs Billy Boy would batter me )

[_Ju_]

You ladies have all gotten away from the origional question set by pooltneytooner. The man in this case should get the benifit of the doubt, how could she be infertile and on the pill, and he made it clear he did not want children, another case of ...it has to be the mans fault, because its us that gives birth.

Once upon a time and reality...... which one is reality and which fiction?

A fella sees a lovely lass down at the waterfront. The lass does not find the lad distasteful either. They get to know eachother a little bit better over a drink and dance, and...as things tend to do, one thing led to another ......

• Fiction (usually): they decide to take things slowly and arrange to have a coffee at weatherspoons the next day
• reality (usually): animal instict is rearling it's ugly head, and heck....you only live once.

Supposing we go with reality, either one invites the other in for coffee. Over coffee things evolve a little:

• fiction : both are cautious, and have taken care of contraception and discuss the use of condoms to avoid STD's like the sensible adults that they are, even though both are two sheets to the wind
• Reality: The fella supposes or asks if the lassie is on contraceptives. The lassie thinks "it's only once....nothing is going to happen this once..its not even the right time of the month". The fella gets told that everything is taken care of or that it's the wrong time of the month.
• Reality 2: contraception?whats that....don't bother us, we're busy!

A few weeks later the lassie finds out that maybe that only once actually could happen:

• reality: two people were necessary to create that baby. Both made assumptions and took risks. Both have to live with the consequences.
• Fiction: The lad calls foul, after all, he never intended to be a father with a stranger. He never intended to be a father full stop.

Fertility is not an exclusively female characteristic. No one is partitioning blame. Both are to blame (if you want to use this word). Nor is the financial contribution of this reluctant father expected to be the only financial contribution to the up-bringing of this child. The mother also contributes financially. Both pay. Both should pay to raise this child that resulted from poor judgement on both parts.

I say again: everyone has an equal choice in becoming a parent. If you are a man you make your choice being responsible for your contraception. If you are a woman you make a choice being responsible for your contraception. If you are responsible for your contraception you will know that it is not 100% infalible. You will also think, as a responsible person, that if you have a fumble with a stranger, that you don't know they are telling the truth. If you are in a stable relationship and know that you definately don't want to be a parent and are not sure of your partner, you will have to take care of yourself. Knowing all this you will measure the risk versus the thrill and live with the consequences if you choose the thrill.

It's not a case of it's the man's fault because we give birth. It's a case of two people making individual desicions that have a single outcome. If you cannot live with that outcome you (male and/or female) make sure not to take the wrong decision. The one person that should not be the one to pay is the child,which unfortunately happens all to often.

[JAWS]

I suppose it's one way of getting a meal ticket for 18 years!

[_Ju_]

I suppose it's one way of getting a meal ticket for 18 years!

Hmmm...mealticket for child or mother??? You have to be precise oh wise JAWS, this is caitness.org after all!

[JAWS]

I wouldn't know having been a single parent myself, although I must admit that my two weren't babies at the time.

I'm mindful of another thread where there was some grave doubt expressed that any mother would walk away from her children. Yes some do, and some do it even when the children are babies.

Such matters are not as one sided as people would like to believe, although it is much more comforting to believe it is.

[changilass]

I wouldn't know having been a single parent myself, although I must admit that my two weren't babies at the time.

I'm mindful of another thread where there was some grave doubt expressed that any mother would walk away from her children. Yes some do, and some do it even when the children are babies.

Such matters are not as one sided as people would like to believe, although it is much more comforting to believe it is.

Being involved in fostering, you would be surprised at just what some parents can do, there are times when a child is better off without its parents

[JAWS]

Being involved in fostering, you would be surprised at just what some parents can do, there are times when a child is better off without its parents

Changilass, you have my total respect. Thee are times when you must have to put the pieces of some poor child back together when somebody else has made a very good attempt at totally destroying them.

I know that some parents should be drowned at birth, the birth of their child that is, because they are unfit to be let loose with a pet cockroach never mind a child.

[Sandra_B]

I suppose it's one way of getting a meal ticket for 18 years!

A meal ticket? How much is child support?

Just went back and read the article, he's being asked to pay $500 a month, that works out to be about 70 pounds a week. After she buys clothes, nappies, food, childcare and all the other things a baby needs I doubt she'll be living the life of luxury.

[golach]

Being involved in fostering, you would be surprised at just what some parents can do, there are times when a child is better off without its parents

I have always said you have a beeg heart Changilass

[_Ju_]

The fact the guy had no paternal instinct and the woman knew this and the fact that the women was 'infertile' and using contraception then I think he kinda figured he was safe.

Safe? Has he never heard of AIDS, ghonorrea and other STD's?

[_Ju_]

A meal ticket? How much is child support?

Just went back and read the article, he's being asked to pay $500 a month, that works out to be about 70 pounds a week. After she buys clothes, nappies, food, childcare and all the other things a baby needs I doubt she'll be living the life of luxury.

Exactly, 100% agree with you SandraB.

And that money is not equivalent to investment of the custodial parent ( be they father or mother).

Do not think for one minute that the 70 quid a week is easy money for the time, the work, the constraints on your life and just being alone puts on you. Most custodial parents do not begrudge their children all this. But the non custodial parent (who is often adored as the parent who comes round to take them out for fun and games every so often and will more often than not have nothing to do with the nitty gritty of daily living and discipline) gets to do only the fun bits (if he/she wants) and considers their responsibilities to end when signing the doted line at the ottom of the check ( if they actually do this and don't just do their best not to)

[krieve]

He should have to pay ,nobody forced him not to where a condom! If he was certain he never wanted to bring a child into the world regardless of the women saying she was infertile he should have still use protection. It is as much his responsibility as the womans.

[squidge]

the only person responsible for his mistake is himself. We are responsible for our own actions - if she had said - walk off that cliff and youll fly then could he sue cos he fell and broke his neck???

sex makes babies and it does it very effectively - the only 100% sure way not to make a baby is not to have sex. contraception is never 100% safe nor is infertility. if you are prepared to have sex then you have to live with your responsibility for your mistake

[golach]

Excuse me ladies, it takes two to tango...she was up for it as much as he was, she told the lies...thus she is 80% responsible IMHO

[squidge]

and she is going to provide a happy healthy and secure home for the child she says in the article and he isnt going to have anything to do with it except pay for it - he is getting off lightly if you ask me which is the harder of the two do you think

[Sandra_B]

How do you know she told lies??