Relationships

[rich]

http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200803/single-marry

[canuck]

rich, it is a slow Friday night here on the dark side of the pond so I gave your article a wee glance through. Are you trying to send a message to the readers in orgland?

[rich]

Hi, Canuck! - As always you understand my devious mind. I've been reading Atlantic Magazine on web and it is a treasure trove of articles about relationships. So then I wondered why does the Org not have something similar?

How is Edinburgh? Ian Rankin was over in Toronto earlier this week. His books are now publised in 30 countries! he says the secret of his writing schedule is that he does it to musi. However he warns that you should never listen to singers while trying to write creatibvely because their words will get in the way of yours.

[canuck]

Are you daring to compare Lori Gottlieb of the Relationship article to the darling of Edinburgh, the great Ian Rankin? Or am I missing the point again?

As to the Rankin theory of writing to music, I think it works only if you have a creative spirit to work from. I don't qualify on that front, so I must write in dead silence. The fireworks banging wildly in my neighbourhood this evening aren't making a positive contribution to the Sunday project.

[Vistravi]

It's quite an interesting read. The writer is assuming that every woman's dream is to get married and have kids. Not so. My sister doesn't want kids and i quite believe that she will never have kids. I want kids but i don't want to get married. i think marriage is only a bit of paper if you're in the realtionship to make that descision anyway. The writer seems very old fashioned in that view that every woman wants to a husband and children

[JMH]

To me it's slightly more traumatic than interesting (though I acknowledge or at least hope she's taking the view to extremes).

[rich]

You know, she does say this article is revisionist. She has changed her mind about a lot of things. Maybe we should drop her an e-mail and ask her to participate in this.
By the way, Canuck, I think you are plenty creative!

[Moira]

Yes, that is a good idea. Drop the author of this article an email and introduce her to Alexander McCall Smith.

[canuck]

It's quite an interesting read. The writer is assuming that every woman's dream is to get married and have kids. Not so. My sister doesn't want kids and i quite believe that she will never have kids. I want kids but i don't want to get married. i think marriage is only a bit of paper if you're in the realtionship to make that descision anyway. The writer seems very old fashioned in that view that every woman wants to a husband and children

Vistravi, I've noticed since moving to Scotland that the North American view of marriage is different to the UK view. A husband is much more fashionable on the far side of the pond. I'm not saying that this is a good or bad thing, just that the author is writing in an environment where marriage is more fashionable.

[canuck]

Yes, that is a good idea. Drop the author of this article an email and introduce her to Alexander McCall Smith.

Does Lori Gottlieb remind you a bit of Isabel Dalhousie of Sunday Philosopher's Club fame?

[rich]

I agree with you, Moira. But both these women have some tough moments. Aren't women in their 40s a lot more interesting than women in their 20s? It's that character thing...

[Moira]

Does Lori Gottlieb remind you a bit of Isabel Dalhousie of Sunday Philosopher's Club fame?

Canuck, you've been reading my mind again.

<snip> Aren't women in their 40s a lot more interesting than women in their 20s? It's that character thing...

Absolutely, Rich. I'm also led to believe that they are even more interesting in their 50's having had a little more time to develop the character thing....

[rich]

The big problem I have yet to see a female writer tackle is (dare I say it?) VENTING.

Because that's what women do. They expound on whatever the grouch of the week is - in our case it is the guy next door who is rebuilding his house for the third time with all the attendant chaos - but whereas the male instinct is to FIX the situation, women aren't really interested in that.

Venting is clearly closely related to NAGGING.

So men end up saying "yes, dear, no, dear, how interesting, dear."

This is not good for relationships.

So NAGGING and VENTING dont feature in women's fiction and men create ideal women characters just in case the old battleaxe starts reading what you wrote.

Dickens is a case in point. Take David Copperfield - his first wife, Dora(?) is a completely unrealistic, sentimentalized, piece of cardboard. She dies halfway through, around page 300 I think - having contributed zero to the novel. (Her little dog has more personality.)

Then she is succeeded by Agnes. Another impossible piece of sentimemtal codswallopian tripe. Except Agnes is always calm and, to this reader at lest, slightly - well not slightly, completely - forbidding. She is one scary lady.

Of course in real life Dickens had bagged off with the actress Elen Tierney. At this stage he was having a way, way, better time than Copperfield - until he had a stroke. Serves him right, eh? I wonder who got the royalties to the novels and actually came out ahead.

Over to you, ladies.....

[Moira]

Rich, as I see it you are throwing down the gauntlet to us ladies on several fronts here. This is the Literature forum so I'll not comment on your obvious personal problems with your partner and your neighbours.

I can't remember the last time I read Dickens - somehow I don't feel the need to go back that far. Did he actually have a stroke? If I had lived in his time I reckon I may have been pretty restricted in what I wanted to say. This would have been mainly due to the dress code of the time which would have restricted my lung capacity considerably.

[rich]

It is very easy to chuck down the gauntlet, isn't it? And that is not insignificant.
Doris Lessing might make an interesting comparison with Dickens. She has created a vivid gallery of futile, pompous males. I should say that its about 20 years since I read Lessing but I thought she was wonderful.
And then from Canada there is Alice Munro and Mavis Gallant.
More relationships. More gender crises.
But it is all fiction so let's not get all hot under the collar...

[Vistravi]

Vistravi, I've noticed since moving to Scotland that the North American view of marriage is different to the UK view. A husband is much more fashionable on the far side of the pond. I'm not saying that this is a good or bad thing, just that the author is writing in an environment where marriage is more fashionable.

Now that you say that, the writers view on what everyone woman wants to be happy is plainly obvious.

Think its mad though.

[canuck]

The big problem I have yet to see a female writer tackle is (dare I say it?) VENTING.

Because that's what women do. They expound on whatever the grouch of the week is - in our case it is the guy next door who is rebuilding his house for the third time with all the attendant chaos - but whereas the male instinct is to FIX the situation, women aren't really interested in that.


Over to you, ladies.....

Modern author of Celtic mysteries, Peter Tremayne has created a very feminine, very FIX IT kind of gal in his heroine, Sister Fedelma. She certainly doesn't nag. I cannot see her VENTING. She just does!

Some of my Sunday projects likely tend to a bit of Venting, but they are certainly not in the nagging category. Granted, I am not a widely read author, but I have been producing my Sunday commentaries for over 30 years. So, I offer to you at least one feminine author who doesn't nag and really tends to the Fix it side of things.