No wood so no CHaP...

[dozy]

What is happening with the Community Heat Project in Wick .Is it true that Homebase got the contract to supply the wood and thats why they are opening in Wick .Where is the Project leader ,i heard she has fallen over and hurt her leg and is off sick .I do hope she is not in hiding after the article in the Scotman on Sunday . Maybe she's off looking for some timber to fell .....

[2little2late]

Is there a link to the news article?

[Julia]

What is happening with the Community Heat Project in Wick .Is it true that Homebase got the contract to supply the wood and thats why they are opening in Wick .Where is the Project leader ,i heard she has fallen over and hurt her leg and is off sick .I do hope she is not in hiding after the article in the Scotman on Sunday . Maybe she's off looking for some timber to fell .....

For more information on the local community heating scheme visit

www.caithnessheatandpower.com

[dozy]

I was only joking about Homebase and the woodfuel .But if the project does not get its finger out , how are they going to get it started never mind keep it running .If the system needs about 120-160 TONNES of fuel a day .Thats 4 or 5 lorry loads , running through streets and roads around Caithness . If you are planning to build such a system you need to know all aspects .What fuel to burn .the tonnage needed per day ,week and year .Where to get the fuel ,the man hours needed to fell, collect and process the fuel along with the distance travelled as a total .All this info is needed to say if the project is a good one for the people and the environment .It is no use to say that the Carbon saved by burning wood is good environmentally, if the process to collect the timber causes more Carbon than it saves .It a simple, Fell one 20 year old tree as fuel today and it takes 20 years before the one you plant now will be ready . Its alot of trees to plant and land to manage .I think that £5 million is alot of money but its not enough tosay that bills will hopefully be about £10.00 P/w. So lets hear from the supporters !!!

[JAWS]

A good Nuclear Power Station would solve the problem or even a decent sized coal, oil or gas powered one.

Instead of using huge Cooling Towers the heat could be used for heating and hot water for the surrounding area.

If wood is deemed the preferred option then coppicing or pollarding would solve the problem of having to wait for trees to fully grow.
As for transport, all that's needed is a decent canal with Dobbin pulling the canal barges. One or two decent sized canal barges a day would carry enough fuel.

On second thoughts, it was canal barges that fuelled the Industrial Revolution, so perhaps Nuclear would be a safer option!
I'd hate to see Caithness full of factory chimneys.

Does anybody know if you can still get water-wheels built anywhere locally?

[dozy]

YES . What size, is it to by metal Is it produce electricity ,if so at what voltage .............

[JAWS]

Water-wheels? It would have to be made of wood and on a huge scale if it was to run a full sized Power Station especially if it needs to replace a system requiring around 150 tons of timber a day to keep it going.

[Gleber2]

Water-wheels? It would have to be made of wood and on a huge scale if it was to run a full sized Power Station especially if it needs to replace a system requiring around 150 tons of timber a day to keep it going.

Of all possible options for renewable biomass, wood must be the craziest and worthy o Week. Hemp, on the other hand, grows in 4 months or so, and is an excellent absorber of greenhouse gasses and is cabon neutral when burned. It would grow very well all arround Caithness.

[JAWS]

Of all possible options for renewable biomass, wood must be the craziest and worthy o Week. Hemp, on the other hand, grows in 4 months or so, and is an excellent absorber of greenhouse gasses and is cabon neutral when burned. It would grow very well all arround Caithness.

Wow! Best suggestion yet man! Turn on! Tune in! Drop out!
Who cares what happens to the world, it will all just float away on the breeze!

[dozy]

The cost of suppling the power station and pipe work is £5 million Capital cost, plus a weekly or monthly charge . It must work out at over £4500.00 per house , thats if the 500 promised sign up .Would it not be better to put up a few solar panels on each house ,this would reduce the fuel bills and save Carbon .It would also mean that there would not be the need to send that monthly Bill for the timber used ..If the panels only help save 70-80% on the fuel bills thats a great help ..or is it to much like common sense .
If there are any free solar panels kicking around drop me a line i'll have them no problem ..Free hot water and Free central heating ,can't be bad . It's the ability to mix the energy saving products that is the best way to go ,not putting all your eggs in one basket is the SMART way .........

[Gleber2]

[quote=JAWS]Wow! Best suggestion yet man! Turn on! Tune in! Drop out!
Who cares what happens
You would have to roll a joint the size of a telegraph pole to get a hit from hemp but I'm sure some would try.

[dozy]

Might just be the answer ....WHO KNOWS ...WHO CARES ...

[lhm]

Dozy your sugestion of solar panels would be great as at least they work and could be linked in with existing central heating systems with very little disruption and would not need the streets to be all dug up (what a mess) and even after this is all done nobody is sure this is going to work and the true cost of the heating.

[JAWS]

The cost of suppling the power station and pipe work is £5 million Capital cost, plus a weekly or monthly charge . It must work out at over £4500.00 per house , thats if the 500 promised sign up .Would it not be better to put up a few solar panels on each house ,this would reduce the fuel bills and save Carbon .It would also mean that there would not be the need to send that monthly Bill for the timber used ..If the panels only help save 70-80% on the fuel bills thats a great help ..or is it to much like common sense .
If there are any free solar panels kicking around drop me a line i'll have them no problem ..Free hot water and Free central heating ,can't be bad . It's the ability to mix the energy saving products that is the best way to go ,not putting all your eggs in one basket is the SMART way .........

Behave dozy, I'm horrified to admit that I have to agree with you. (Oh how it hurts not being able to be awkward and take the mickey!)

All the suggestions are for huge attention grabbing schemes costing mega-bucks and needing massive infrastructures.
I agree with you. There are lots of methods which would supply most of the needs for individual premises which would also mean that there would be no need for massive increased in power output of the national grid.

Solar panels are one source of power. Small Wind turbines, no bigger than a Sky Dish are another. More effective insulation and draught-proofing to reduce energy use. I'm sure that many people know of other simple, small scale systems.

As most on here will know, I'm certainly no "tree-hugging save the planet at all costs" enthusiast, but a little thought and the exercise of some common sense would do a lot to reduce a lot current problems.

The only drawback to such ideas that I can see is that they leave no massive, highly visible monuments for the 'powers that be' to point to in order to feed their own egos.

If you help people provide for their own needs then they will take the credit for it.
If you force them to rely on you to provide for them then with luck they will show their gratitude by giving you all the credit.

[dozy]

Do'es anyone know if the householders are having to pay for the connection to the system .I got a PM saying that the fee was going to be £500.00 each .

IS THIS A CON OR WHAT ???????????

[Errogie]

I share some of the same suspicions that the cost and carbon generated from harvesting, transporting and drying the stuff before you burn it is a huge unknown and then the carcinogens, tars and other byproducts from badly burned wood can be pretty nasty.

Woodburners are sometimes known as the "trendy pollutants". I cut and burn from 15 to 20 tons of wood a year and believe you me there are two heats in wood!. The big challenge is in stacking and drying it under cover.

But I look forward to passing through Wick and getting that exhilerating aroma of well combusted spruce or lodgepole like you still sometimes catch that great peat smell in the north or far west.

[dozy]

As you are no doubt aware the secret to burning timber cleanly is to reduce the moisture content ,the dryer the better . When i proposed the Idea to Ms Marshall she was told this . When you need to dry timber on a large scale and smarter view must be taken . You have to use the flue gas from the boiler to dry the timber by passing it through a machine like a big tumble dryer. This will reduce the moisture content to below 10% ,the decrease in moisture raises the calorific value per kilo to the point that coal fired boilers can be used .This allows the extra heat to be turned into high pressure steam which is needed to produce Electicity . If they had decided to go straight to Electricity instead of hot water ,there would be No need to dig up the road .Its the people that should have been given the choice to go for hot water or electricity .Electricity is much more flexible and the power lines are already there . This system would have halved electric bills if it were to be used locally and not sent down the Grid .Solar Panels mixed with Biomass is the way to go and it gives jobs to locals and an income to farmers .

[Errogie]

Dozy,presumably you mean that it make more sense to use steam to power a device that converts it into electricity rather like the way that Dounereay operated with its heat source and that this should be the product on offer.

So does taking water up to that operating temperature pose a problem for a wood fuel sysytem?

Seems to me that the existing cable power transmission system is probably going to be a lot less problematic than sending hot water through the streets of Wick in pipes which will no doubt also drop in tempreature en route to peoples houses.

Yet another reason to dig up the roads again!