Disclosures and Sport.

**Kevin Milkins** · 15-Sep-09, 15:15

There seem to be a great deal of talk about disclosures in the media at the moment and while I would always be very keen to protect a youngster from an undesirable getting the opportunity to groom a child ,I do think the world is going mad.

We do see from time to time a coach or leader that has got into a position of trust so that he/she can exercise a sick lust, but now there is talk that if you do a regular school run with someone else’s child you may need a disclosure. Does anyone else think some of the new proposed legislation is going a bit over the top?

**BRIE** · 15-Sep-09, 15:22

my son at college doing a sports related course & they all have to have a Disclosure for this course, some of the people on the course are only 16 so thats really a child needing the disclosure.

**greenasiamcabbagelooking** · 15-Sep-09, 15:22

i normally hate the beauracratic nanny state we live in Kevin,

but when it comes to the protection of children i think that anyone in a position of trust that works/has contact with children should all be disclosed.

some abusers purposely get jobs/volunteer for these positions with the aim of abusing children, so check em all i say

**brandy** · 15-Sep-09, 16:21

i don't think its a bad idea to have anyone working with children to be dis closured.
it does seem a bit silly to say for example if i was taking my mates kids to school or vice versa on a reg. basis we would need to be checked out.
however, if anyone is going to be working with children they should def. be checked out.
for instance, if you were car pooling and you were taking several children to school reg. you would in essence be a taxi service for the kids, and just to cover all the bases it makes sense to do a disclosure. at the end of the day my children's safety is the most important thing in the world, and GOD only knows how many Ian Huntley's their is in the world.
personally, I think they should take a much harder stance on pedo's and make sure they stay away from children and where they stay and play.
in fact i would like to have an open reg. that tells you where they live so you know if they are in your area.
how are you suppose to protect your child from danger if you don't know its there?

**mrjolly** · 15-Sep-09, 16:21

i say all people who are lesbians and homosexuals should not be allowed to adopt or foster kids. i say it is a form of abuse and this practice should be made illegal as it was before. this is a much a concern as getting people veted in sports etc with working with young people.

**BRIE** · 15-Sep-09, 16:26

Originally Posted by mrjolly

i say all people who are lesbians and homosexuals should not be allowed to adopt or foster kids. i say it is a form of abuse and this practice should be made illegal as it was before. this is a much a concern as getting people veted in sports etc with working with young people.

crikey someone has a touch of homophobia

**rob1** · 15-Sep-09, 16:39

Originally Posted by mrjolly

i say all people who are lesbians and homosexuals should not be allowed to adopt or foster kids. i say it is a form of abuse and this practice should be made illegal as it was before. this is a much a concern as getting people veted in sports etc with working with young people.

Wow, I think you should be band from fostering or adopting children as I think filling childrens heads with this type of nonsence is damaging to their development and negative to our society.

On topic, I do think thing are getting out of hand. It would be so much easier if you just filled in one discloser, but you have to fill in one for every position that you hold. Plus the media and the government paint the picture that there is a peadophile lurking behind every corner just waiting to grab a little child, which is simply not the case.

**Bazeye** · 15-Sep-09, 18:07

Originally Posted by BRIE

crikey someone has a touch of homophobia

I dont think hes scared of them.

**viking** · 15-Sep-09, 19:48

Sadly, disclosure will only pick up those perpetrators who have been discovered. My advice would be to never be alone with a child - always make sure there are 2 adults about and be in a public area at all times.
Monitor what your child is doing on the internet at home and at friends houses - whose parents may not even be in.

**changilass** · 15-Sep-09, 20:16

Don't see what all the fuss is about, its a wee form that requires adresses for last 5 yrs and any previous names you were known under.

I would rather some safeguards than none where my child is concerned.

Folks that have a private arrangement with other parents will not need a disclosure.

**Dadie** · 15-Sep-09, 20:23

But the thing that gets me with the disclosure proccess is that you have to have a separate one for each group/club etc you help out at.
Which can add up to a lot of pesky forms and someone has to pay for the disclosure checks somewhere down the line...wouldnt it be better that one disclosure would cover you for all groups/clubs etc.
Maybe with a national database with a phone no or a address that all clubs can use to check up and a id no.

Just a thought

**changilass** · 15-Sep-09, 20:32

I like the idea of a seperate disclosure for each, that way each group is respnsible for all working for them.

Some one isnt simply saying they already have one.

The other thing about it is that some thing may slip through one disclosure but may get cought on the next one.. This does happen - I know from personal experience.

**Kevin Milkins** · 15-Sep-09, 20:40

My wife and I had at one time a large input into rugby both as players and coaching and my three sons all played rugby from a very young age (about six).
After about fifteen years involvement in all capacities in the club the new law was imminent that all clubs that coach children had an obligation to appoint a child protection officer and send them for training on the appropriate courses for training to RFU standards.

As chairman of the club at that time I was keen to stay one step ahead and dually got one of our young player’s mothers involved and she was trained and ready for action long before it became law.

Mrs M was doing a coaching session one cold November morning with the under eight team when a young lad on the wing (that just did not want to be there) had his socks pulled up to his armpits and sleeves pulled down to his ankles to stay warm got knocked on the face with the ball.

After a sharp intake of breath he let out a squawk I WANT MY MAM and with the snot and tears running down his face Mrs M cleaned him up and gave him a cuddle as he was sobbing uncontrollably, his mother was enjoying her Sunday morning lie in.

Our freshly appointed and highly trained child protection officer was very quick to point out that when the new law comes in, giving a child a cuddle would be seen as inappropriate contact.

My three lads were by this time playing senior rugby and we both gave up coaching not long after. I think there are a lot of good folk out there in all sporting circles that, as a result of these new laws would feel uneasy about working with children and giving something back to sport and rightly or wrongly, it makes me feel sad.

When this discussion on radio 2 about people doing the school runs may come under the same umbrella, it makes me think about what message is all this sending to kids.

**Dadie** · 15-Sep-09, 20:47

If involved with church activities for example...
1 church
mother and toddlers
sunday school
school kid club
and a teenage youth club

You are involved with all groups.

4 disclosures

**sms** · 15-Sep-09, 20:55

Im all for disclosures- but i think it was a pain when i needed 2 for the same school i worked in. I was the cleaner and the lollypop lady at the same school. Got one done for each then when leaving both posts i had to fill in another 2 disclosures to be the relief posts.

**BINBOB** · 15-Sep-09, 21:40

Originally Posted by BRIE

crikey someone has a touch of homophobia

More than a touch..............live and let live.

**starry** · 15-Sep-09, 22:22

Originally Posted by mrjolly

i say all people who are lesbians and homosexuals should not be allowed to adopt or foster kids. i say it is a form of abuse and this practice should be made illegal as it was before. this is a much a concern as getting people veted in sports etc with working with young people.

Surely this has to be a wind up ?

Anyway disclosures, I think instead of the multiple form filling that is done just now, people working with children could be issued with a disclosure card rather than certificate. You keep the same number, you show the card to your employer to prove it is you and they check the disclosure number with the relevant department.
Same idea as a driving license. Less paperwork, less cost.

I have 9 disclosures, all done over the last 6 years

I also think they create a false sense of security, I could have a long history of child cruelty or abuse, my 9 disclosures may just mean I haven't been caught.

**tonkatojo** · 15-Sep-09, 22:39

Originally Posted by Kevin Milkins

My wife and I had at one time a large input into rugby both as players and coaching and my three sons all played rugby from a very young age (about six).
After about fifteen years involvement in all capacities in the club the new law was imminent that all clubs that coach children had an obligation to appoint a child protection officer and send them for training on the appropriate courses for training to RFU standards.

As chairman of the club at that time I was keen to stay one step ahead and dually got one of our young player’s mothers involved and she was trained and ready for action long before it became law.

Mrs M was doing a coaching session one cold November morning with the under eight team when a young lad on the wing (that just did not want to be there) had his socks pulled up to his armpits and sleeves pulled down to his ankles to stay warm got knocked on the face with the ball.

After a sharp intake of breath he let out a squawk I WANT MY MAM and with the snot and tears running down his face Mrs M cleaned him up and gave him a cuddle as he was sobbing uncontrollably, his mother was enjoying her Sunday morning lie in.

Our freshly appointed and highly trained child protection officer was very quick to point out that when the new law comes in, giving a child a cuddle would be seen as inappropriate contact.

My three lads were by this time playing senior rugby and we both gave up coaching not long after. I think there are a lot of good folk out there in all sporting circles that, as a result of these new laws would feel uneasy about working with children and giving something back to sport and rightly or wrongly, it makes me feel sad.

When this discussion on radio 2 about people doing the school runs may come under the same umbrella, it makes me think about what message is all this sending to kids.

I think you are correct Kevin, but the powers that be call the shots we will just have to go with the flow, if anyone says otherwise they are prime suspects in their eyes.