Tesco dancing on Asda's grave at the Mart in Thurso?

[davth]

Well Mr Taylor when can we expect to see your hotel and chalets being started. Have to say that the premises at Pennyland are worse looking than the Mart sight.

One would have to wonder what concern it is of yours Scunner, you are appearing very troll like.

[Raymond Taylor]

The building fell down last year and I am on the case. It was 250 years old and unused. It easy to judge not having a clue what is happening behind the scenes. Just for an instance, it took me 5 years to get planning agreed for the house extension.

I do hate when a cheap shot is taken, I sometimes wonder if some that comment on this site live in the real world.

The Mart site has been sitting doing much more damage for over eight years now to the local economy than Pennyland ever has. I won't go on suffice to say to if all my plans had been successful over the years how different the town would be especially to the west.

[Bystander1]

Raymond T,I think you will find that 'e org. is populated by all the kooks under the sun. Either they don't live in Caithness or have blown in over the past few months. Not the place to get any kind of of sensible dialogue, and that includes from me.
And then of course you have the mensa/densa. eedjit, types and the less said about them the better.

[Raymond Taylor]

Raymond T,I think you will find that 'e org. is populated by all the kooks under the sun. Either they don't live in Caithness or have blown in over the past few months. Not the place to get any kind of of sensible dialogue, and that includes from me.
And then of course you have the mensa/densa. eedjit, types and the less said about them the better.

It does seem a bit of a waste of time and energy saying anything on here which is a great shame. It was different some years ago. As you say too many Kooks!

Also, at least I admit I have a private agenda which is very well known and public record. Eventually town planners, public officials and the public are coming round to my way of thinking. I wish people were just honest when commenting.

[Raymond Taylor]

Well Mr Taylor when can we expect to see your hotel and chalets being started. Have to say that the premises at Pennyland are worse looking than the Mart sight.

I am am busy working on proposals as we speak for the hotel and chalet developments. Maybe if your so worried about the state of the Pennyland buildings you will come round and give us a hand when we get listed building consent to do more work on them or even touch them since the roof came off under an emergency provision?

[crayola]

Ha ha that building next to the road at Pennyland had fallen down when I was in Thurso almost a year and a half ago. Have Tesco promised they'll rebuild it for you?

So Raymond (who doesn't like being called a sweetie), have you applied for planning permission for the barbed wire fence and minefield you told us you were planning to put around the dozens of chalets you said you wanted to build in your sheepies' field next to Victoria walk? Do you really think that would attract high class visitors to the town? I have my doubts.

And do you have a problem with the proposed retail development at the mart just because it's NIYBY? Do you only actively support developments on your own personal property and nowhere else in the town? I find it sad that a locally born and bred mannie can express so little support for a development that will benefit everyone in the town.

I am trying to be optimistic. The mart will live again and it will be good for everyone in the town.

We must all believe in it or it won't happen. Be positive Raymond (not sweetie). We all love you. Mwaaaa.

[Bystander1]

As i said earlier all the kooks under the sun.

[Raymond Taylor]

Sorry Crayola, I'm not wasting any more time with you reiterating what has been said before. I just wonder as you mention not actually living here anymore if your still on the same planet?

[crayola]

Raymond (not sweetie) you have not been paying attention. I work part time as doctor of space medicine on Fireball XL5.

We could (perhaps even would) have had an Asda at the business park years ago if you hadn't insisted it should be in your back yard. Will you still not admit that you got that wrong? The fact is that Asda is not in Thurso for that reason and probably that reason alone. Face it!

Similarly plan your hotel near the Weigh Inn and some of your problems will go away.

Meanwhile the new plans for the mart have been at least partly opposed by one of the town's architects. This could go on for a long time. Hopefully not as long as the Tesco procrastinatory expedition.

The architect makes some good points mind. I just hope the process doesn't descend to the depths pioneered by the Asda and Tesco debacles.

[Sgitheanach]

It seems as if a lot of good development plans up here get opposed yet some of the more stupid proposals get passed easily . When it comes to listed buildings rather than let you restore them when they are repairable certain departments would rather let them collapse then demand they get restored at a much higher cost than it could have been originally. When it comes to commercial developments why are people not prepared to sacrifice a bit of their view for the greater good of job creation and the sustainability of the community.

[Raymond Taylor]

Raymond (not sweetie) you have not been paying attention. I work part time as doctor of space medicine on Fireball XL5.

We could (perhaps even would) have had an Asda at the business park years ago if you hadn't insisted it should be in your back yard. Will you still not admit that you got that wrong? The fact is that Asda is not in Thurso for that reason and probably that reason alone. Face it!

Similarly plan your hotel near the Weigh Inn and some of your problems will go away.

Meanwhile the new plans for the mart have been at least partly opposed by one of the town's architects. This could go on for a long time. Hopefully not as long as the Tesco procrastinatory expedition.

The architect makes some good points mind. I just hope the process doesn't descend to the depths pioneered by the Asda and Tesco debacles.

More misinformation that I have to respond to again. Quite glad really as it gives me a chance to say how wrong you are.

"I" was approached by Asda, they wanted to build on the Pennyland and nowhere else. It was not me that stopped them. Miller developments from Inverness who had purchased the Mart site objected and eventually succeeded in denying the town this development after the public enquiry.

Tesco then bought the Mart site from Miller for a whopping £3.8m and in doing so protected their Thurso and Wick operations denying our community, 70 jobs, competition - cheaper prices for food and fuel etc.

Tesco did the math and no Asda for 10 years. I would ask you to do the math, but I'd be wasting more time.

Results just in from 2002 Miller Developments £3.8m - Benefit to the people of Thurso and surrounding communities £0

Little wonder they flew their team and barrister up on private jet to Wick and take us on at the public enquiry in the Pentland Hotel. Good business really.

And now just to be clear on the hotel site. I argued that the site on the front is the only site that would justify the investment for a top quality hotel way back in 1990. It was to cost £4m and employ 65. I won permission from the local councillors to build there in 2002 in the town hall in Thurso. This decision was overturned when it was taken to Inverness and voted on. 65 jobs for the past 14 years, all those visitors we have lost out on, how much healthier the town centre would be. The hotel alone would have ploughed £1m into the local economy per year.

In my last comment to you I touch on NIMBYISM and self interest as Sgitheanach does above. The damage these people including the councillors in Inverness have done to the town is incalculable and can never be undone.

So Crayola please stop talking complete and utter rubbish and wasting my time. I have bankers and town planners to prepare for today. I am not beaten yet.

[crayola]

Now that's odd. The response to the planning application from the Thurso architect is no longer on the council web site.

http://wam.highland.gov.uk/wam/appli...=NZGNHSIHGP500

I hope a revised version will appear soon since it drew attention to a number of interesting and important issues.

In particular it expanded on points raised in the document dated 08 FEB 2016 from the Highland Council's planning officer.

I shall not name the company or the individual architect at this point as that would be unprofessional.

I shall correct Raymond (not sweetie) Taylor's severe misapprehensions at a later time.

[crayola]

Raymond (not sweetie) will you please play attention to what I'm telling you and stop answering back in class!

I don't care who approached whom first in the Asda debacle. The important point is that you have been saying for years that the best place for Asda was in your back yard. This is manifestly wrong because Asda's application was rejected and as far as I can see there is no chance whatsoever of Asda building there now.

Do you have problems distinguishing between what actually happened and what you would like to have happened? The former is the real world and the latter is your imaginary world. Stop denying it!

There remains the likelihood that Asda could have been built years ago if you and they had applied for planning permission further out of town near the business park. Do you remember how many local residents objected to your plans? It was a lot! It would have been a lot less if the plan was to build Asda further west and it would have almost certainly gone through on the first council vote which would have made its eventual existence much more likely.

In summary, the claim that your back yard was the only viable location for a large supermarket is manifest nonsense because the plan failed.

Furthermore I propose that ten years later you have still not learned from your initial mistakes. As far as I can ascertain you have been claiming for 15 years that it's not viable to build a posh hotel any further west than the location you prefer. Why for heaven's sake would this be? Forss House Hotel is the poshest place in the west of the county and it's way way way west of Pennyland! And Ackergill Tower is nowhere near the town of Wick! The Weigh Inn is not a posh joint but it has been successfully in place for many long years and long before you made the trip west to Pennyland. What is so different about your hotel's guests that they need to be so close to you?

Stop blaming everyone else for your mistakes, join the real world and collaborate with those you decry so that Thurso's future may be secured. Goddess knows this will be sorely needed once Dounreay eventually winds down.

[Raymond Taylor]

I repeat what I have said for years, Asda not I wanted to build at Pennyland and only in that location. Remembering that it was the Council Planners that directed them here in 2006.

And yes, the site I identified for the hotel many years ago and which is now supported by Highland Council planners is the best place to secure the future of such an important project while supporting the town centre businesses. I have said it a hundred times, it's the only place to build this. Lenders also have some say where they will support, but of course I live in the real world.

So where did I make a mistake? Is it my mistake that if the hotel had been built it would have been now open 20 years employing 65 people and Asda 10 years ago employing 75? With these developments the town centre would be in a much better state? These my deluded friend are the simple facts of the matter.

[Rheghead]

I repeat what I have said for years, Asda not I wanted to build at Pennyland and only in that location. Remembering that it was the Council Planners that directed them here in 2006.

And yes, the site I identified for the hotel many years ago and which is now supported by Highland Council planners is the best place to secure the future of such an important project while supporting the town centre businesses. I have said it a hundred times, it's the only place to build this. Lenders also have some say where they will support, but of course I live in the real world.

So where did I make a mistake? Is it my mistake that if the hotel had been built it would have been now open 20 years employing 65 people and Asda 10 years ago employing 75? With these developments the town centre would be in a much better state? These my deluded friend are the simple facts of the matter.

Have you ever considered to yourself that you have failed because you have upset the apple cart syndrome?

[Raymond Taylor]

Yeah! It's been tough.

Even with a petition of over 3000 supporting the Asda at Pennyland in 2006,with the support of Highland Council planners and Community Council we still came unstuck.

My first ever hotel application on the "front" was approved in 1992 by local councillors. At that time it also had the support of Thurso Traders, Community Council and many businesses. It was reversed in Inverness a few months later. Local Labour councillor Jim Fry raised a "notice of amendment" which called the project down to Inverness to be reviewed.

I attended the meeting and was astonished and dismayed how this hugely important project for the town was dealt with.

Christina Cumming the Labour Party group leader stood up in the chamber and announced "the labour councillors en masse would be supporting Mr Fry's amendment to reject the hotel project".

Basically the Labour whip was being used.

The Chairman of the planning committee Francis Keith from Durness was astonished as much as me and said in chamber "This was the first time politics had ever influenced a planning matter" lucky for me and the town eh?

The planning approval was lost and a precedent was set. Over the next few years I appealed and applied again a few times but once it was rejected originally as I said the precedent of rejection was set.

So Mr Reghhead not just me but the town lost out by pure politics, I wasn't even a Tory but my Dad loved Maggie, maybe that was it. Upsetting the apple cart is really an underestimation of what went on back then.

[crayola]

Some progress at last! You agreed with Rheg that you failed.

Yes Raymond (not sweetie) you have made all those mistakes. You evidently don't distinguish reality from what you think reality should be. You failed with your first hotel bids and you failed with Asda. Face it, learn from your mistakes and don't keep making the same mistakes over and over again.

The facts are that you failed to build a hotel and you failed to build a supermarket but all you do is blame everyone but yourself. Those jobs didn't and don't exist because you failed. Change your ways and your attitude of blame and you might start to succeed.

Badmouthing the wonderful Mr Jim Fry won't help you.

Anyways....

Let's get back to discussing the important topic of the proposal for the mart. I only responded to your initial trolling of this thread because I felt sorry for you.

[Raymond Taylor]

Is informing folk what actually happened badmouthing? I knew Jim and he was certainly a good man. Did he allow the use the Labour whip to overturn a local approval.. Yes! Was it the first time a political whip was used in the experience of the planning chairmans long tenure as a councillor...Yes!

So not only am I still sweetie, which I told you annoys me I'm now also an Internet troll. Pot and Black come to mind- almost 3000 posts v 34 posts as I said your somewhat deluded!

I better rest my case as I have now covered exhaustively my thoughts. If you don't quite get it fair enough, I'm sure plenty do. I'm not wasting another word on you as I'm getting dizzy repeating myself.

I will lastly and gladly inform the forum that a detailed first phase plan for the development of the West of Thurso plan will be out mid summer. I will hold a pre planning meeting with the Highland Council planners at the earliest opportunity. This plan will include the development of a 55 room spa and leisure hotel, associated chalets, housing, business units, petrol station and the complete renovation of the outbuildings. Added to this the development of the 170 acre Community Woodland is progressing and the 20 acre public park is still part of our plans.

JTP the renowned town planners received thier brief from me earlier this week and have started work.

[crayola]

But have you learned anything from your past failures or will you repeat all your mistakes yet again? Your admission of failure to Rheg is a good start.

I look forward to seeing your plans and if sensible I'm sure you will credit me with helping you see the light after so many years of sitting in the dark shouting at the world.

Would you be interested in investing in the Caithness and Sutherland School of Witchcraft? We took the secret society route when we started up but we shall go public once we are better established in the area. A site close to your hotel would guarantee you a steady flow of well heeled guests.

Back on topic, does anyone know why the submission from the Thurso architect in connection with the new mart proposal has been taken down from the planning web site?

[davth]

Crayola, why do you see the need to troll another member continuously using terms he has already informed you he finds annoying and continuously insulting him by calling him a failure?
Is it any concern of yours if he wishes to continue with his plans to develop Thurso?