BAN FIREWORKS

[golach]

We in Scotland should ban the use and purchase of fireworks except for organised and public displays.
We have nothing to do with that Catholic Yorkshireman Guy Fawkes, we still if Im right had our own Royalty & government in Scotland at that time, I will stand corrected if I'm wrong, so why as Scots do we celebrate the death of a man that tried to blow up the English Parliament ( and got caught ).
Too many kids have been hurt, animals scared witless at this time of year, OAP put in danger, so why sell fireworks to the public and continue this barbaric celebration.
Golach

[MadPict]

Not just in Scotland - ban them everywhere!

Actually, the firework industry regulatory body has a voluntary code of practice that states fireworks should only be on sale for two weeks before Nov 5th and for one week before New Year. There are shops which stock them 365 days of the year. So much for self regulation!

Having a dog in the family (well, we did have two) I have come to despise the total cretins who let fireworks off for the whole of October and November. This year has actually been noticeably quieter, although with the 5th falling on a Wednesday the displays will straddle the weekends either side.
I do not object to publicised and organised events, as at least we can sedate the dog and maybe even watch our local display. But sadly the morons in our midst will no doubt continue to set off fireworks at all hours of the night, just for "the laugh".
The police need to clamp down on this dangerous and anti-social practice and offenders need a a deterent in the shape of hefty fines (maybe in the region of £1000) to make them think (if their tiny pea brains are capable) twice about lighting the blue touch paper and running away...

MadPict

[linzy222]

I agree i think it should just be organizations etc that should be allowed to buy them!

My kids will be out playing and you will hear fireworks going off and then i start to worry incase 1 of them have been hurt, with the kids out in castletown you never know!

Bangers going off at 2 in the morning etc WHAT IS THE POINT??

Only 2 annoy folk and scare the animals!

I think it was a firework that killed my daughters rabbit, it got a freight and that can kill them and it was only 6mths old so thats the only explanation we can think of!

I agree " BAN THEM ALL EVERYWHERE"!!!!

[jjc]

Am I the only one young enough to remember how much fun fireworks can be when properly used? Does nobody else remember gathering with your whole family (and probably friends and neighbours too), stamping your feet against the cold, listening to the bonfire crackle at the end of the garden, and watching your mum or dad wander off into the darkness before rushing back again with a big grin on their face as a rocket shot up into the air behind them? Surely somebody else must have these happy memories too?

We hear almost every day about the woes of society and the decline of the family unit and yet you are all calling for the abolition of one of the few remaining traditions that still brings families together? Madness.

I see from the Caithness Courier website that gangs of ‘Yobs’ have been terrorising neighbourhoods by throwing fireworks into wheelie-bins, telephone boxes, and post boxes. The police have even arrested some children – thought to be as young as 13 – and charged them with fireworks related offences. Great. But where on earth did 13-year-olds get their hands on fireworks in the first place?

Rather than giving in to a knee-jerk reaction and banning responsible people from having a little fun with their children, why not concentrate on the real problem? There are people out there who (whether driven by greed, apathy, malice, or just plan stupidity) think that there is nothing wrong with giving a 13-year-old kid a couple of rockets and packing them off to play. These are the people that the police need to crack down on, and the laws are already in place to allow them to do so.

Yes, I recognise that fireworks are a nuisance and scare pets, but the responsible people keep their displays for the weekend before or weekend after November 5th. Once again it is the kids who think they are having a little harmless fun who cause the problems during the months around that short time-slot, and once again there is an irresponsible adult who has supplied those kids.

A change in the law to limit personal fireworks displays to specific time-slots in the evenings immediately around November 5th would allow responsible families to continue to enjoy themselves and for pet owners to know when the noises will occur so they can sensibly protect their animals. Perhaps outside of this period only licensed display organisers should be allowed to set off fireworks (for weddings and the like) and only after they have informed local residents of the date and time of the event? In conjunction, the police would need to crack down on both those setting off the fireworks and those supplying them. This, Madpict, could be where your £1000 fine comes into play.

A sensible compromise allowing responsible parents to continue to enjoy this occasion with their children would be a much better idea than running screaming for an all out ban every time a rocket goes up, don’t you think?

[Mr P Cannop]

fireworks should only be for sale on the 5th november ??

[golach]

Guy Fawkes was born in York in 1570, a Protestant. His mother remarried a Recusant and moved to Knaresborough. He was surrounded by many Catholics during his school days, including the Wright brothers, who were later to be involved in the Gunpowder Plot. Having converted to Catholicism at some point unknown, he first worked in the house of the viscount Montague, enlisted as an adult in the Spanish army, which was occupying the Netherlands (then in Spanish hands), allowing him freedom to practise his religion openly. He adopted the name Guido Fawkes in the Spanish tradition.

Fawkes had been in correspondence with the Spanish Court, (7) but his assessment, along with that of several would-be conspirators, Tom Wintour and his colleague Dutton, notably, was that given the opportunity, Catholics in England would rise up and depose the new King. This was quite false and out of step with the feeling of people at home in England. They were enthusiastically welcoming him in fact. His view indeed was directly contradicted by Don Juan de Tassis, an envoy from the Spanish King, who sounded out feeling in England, and found the spirit for combat entirely lacking.
I see nothing here that connects Scotland with this so called "plot" apart form the Union of the Crowns, we still had our own Parliament until 1707.
Sorry JJC as for your comments about a knee jerk reaction and responsible parents I am in the opposite camp from yourself,are there such beasts as responsible parents these days?
I say coming from the city that lays on some of the more spectacular firework displays twice a year i.e. at the Tattoo & the Big Party, that these type of displays are organised and thousands can watch from many vantage points around the city and in comparitive safety. What I really object too is the yobbish culture and the atitude that me and my ilk are kill joys and are just here to stop the bairnies having a bit of harmless fun. HARMLESS YE CANNA CALL A FIREWORK HARMLESS!!!!!!
Golach

[jjc]

Honestly, Golach, what has Bonfire Night got to do with Guy Fawkes? (Before anybody jumps in with a cry of ‘idiot’ here, let me explain…)

Of course, originally, Bonfire Night was a celebration of the saving of the king and the execution of Fawkes. But that was nearly 400 years ago and I feel pretty safe in saying that there aren’t many people now left who actually light a bonfire, throw on a guy, and set off a firework or two because they are so elated that King James I was saved. In fact, I doubt very much that many people actually know all that much about King James I at all.

No. These days we celebrate Bonfire Night because… well, because we just do.

It’s a night of fun passed down from generation to generation merely through the act of taking part. My parents took the time to make sure that I was excited and enthralled by Bonfire Night every single year and I certainly intend to do the same for my children – and not once will I thank God that King James I didn’t go up in a puff of smoke.

So how about a little less of this nationalistic tripe? The world’s getting smaller and you cannot afford to reject your heritage (and yes, after nearly 400 years, I think that Bonfire Night is as much your heritage as mine) just because it originated south of the border.

---
On the subject of fireworks: Yes, I can call fireworks harmless.

So long as you use them properly, follow the instructions, don’t play around with them, and generally respect them for what they are (a small amount of explosives packed into a cardboard tube) they are completely safe.

What IS harmful is the way that a minority of people choose to abandon all common sense as soon as the nights start to get dark and the rockets appear in the shops. By all means, object to that. But don’t punish the many for the stupidity of the few!

I too enjoy a good, professional firework display. The rockets and Catherine wheels they get are always so much bigger than you can have in your back garden and the show tends to go on for quite some time. But it doesn’t matter how much you enjoy it, how long it goes on for, or how high the rockets climb before they explode, there will always be something missing.

Paying a fiver (or however much) at a gate to be let into a field and watch, alongside 10,000 complete strangers, whilst a faceless employee pushes some buttons to start the electronically controlled display just doesn’t compare to watching your dad proudly display a tin box full of colourful rockets and pretty fountains, ask you to choose which one you want to see next, take your choice to the end of the garden, and carefully release it for nobody else’s pleasure but yours. It will be a sad world that prevents me from doing the same for my children one day.

are there such beasts as responsible parents these days?

What a terribly sad thing to say, Golach. Of course there are responsible parents, a great many of them. It’s just that you don’t get your name in the papers by doing the right thing. Don't give up hope

[Liz]

Yes JJC I do remember enjoying watching fireworks when I was wee but, as I said in another thread, they went 'phut' and 'whoosh' not BANG! FLASH! like the ones nowadays. They are more like exocet missiles than fireworks and very, very dangerous!

Of course it is sad that the few who use fireworks irresponsibly spoil it for the rest but, sadly, that is the case with so many things in life.

Also, why are fireworks being set off all through October and November? At least if they were set off on Guy Fawkes Night (though why we celebrate this I'm not sure?!) pet owners could make sure their animals were indoors. I notice in the Groat today that another poor dog has gone missing after being frightened by fireworks!
It's not just domestic animals that are affected but wildlife and stray/feral cats and kittens.
There are also the morons who think it is fun to put fireworks in letter boxes and wheelie bins etc.

It really is time for a complete ban on fireworks except for controlled displays where everyone can enjoy fireworks in safety.

I did hear that there was a petition and I wondered where this is so I could sign it?

[golach]

What IS harmful is the way that a minority of people choose to abandon all common sense as soon as the nights start to get dark and the rockets appear in the shops. By all means, object to that

JJC, this is exactly what we are objecting too, this unwarranted and indiscriminate igniting of fireworks from the end of September onwards, if it was just on, as you call it "Bonfire Night" then our pets could be kept in on that specific night and maybe all would be well.
But this is not so, how is it you never hear of any loutish behaviour at Up Hellea in Shetland? are the Shetlanders any more responsible as parents?
I am and have been a responsible parent and Grandparent and when I lived on the country then yes the bottom of the garden firework show was in order as there were not so many pets around, But never in town as I did not know who's pet was out for a walk, and I have more respect for my neighbours and their pets
Golach

[jjc]

What IS harmful is the way that a minority of people choose to abandon all common sense as soon as the nights start to get dark and the rockets appear in the shops. By all means, object to that.

JJC, this is exactly what we are objecting too,

I believe you subjectively quote me, Golach. The rest of that statement was:

But don’t punish the many for the stupidity of the few!

Since I can remember (around two-and-a-half decades) we have had repeating aerial bombs, rockets, whistling fountains, noisy Catherine Wheels, and a host of other spectacular arrangements. We even had bangers, but they were banned when I was young, and even when they were available my dad used to scoff at them and regale my siblings and me with tales of bangers (long since made illegal) that could blow holes in the side of an upturned metal bucket. I'm sorry, Liz, but at no point in the past quarter-century do I recall seeing a firework display that only went 'phut' and 'whoosh'.

Strangely enough though, I do recall that for just about every one of those years I can remember certain voices complaining that the fireworks were starting earlier and earlier, and that they were getting noisier and noisier. I guess that as society rushes to protect the next generation more and more from the things that made my childhood fun (are kids even allowed to play out on the streets any more?) those voices have just increased in pitch and volume until somebody just might hear them.

Ah well, ce la vie. I suppose they'll always have their Playstations…


------

If you remember
Never to forgot
The Youth
The wild hope
The dream . . .
You will forget
To remember
The wrinkles
The weariness
The short days.

(Peggy Stebbins Nelson)

[Liz]

I'm sorry, Liz, but at no point in the past quarter-century do I recall seeing a firework display that only went 'phut' and 'whoosh'.

Obviously had a deprived childhood!

I DO feel sorry for children of today as I think their freedom is being taken away more and more and that is SO sad.

However, that is not what this 'debate' is about! It is the fact that people are being injured, property damaged and animals terrified due to what some people class as fun!

There have to be regulations put in place that will make sure people can enjoy firework displays and those who misuse fireworks can't get access to them.

[casper]

There have been so many fireworks going off in my area recently. I am so fed up with them!

I have 2 cats - both indoor cats. The older one hasn't been too bothered - the youngster has been terrified.

I wish we could put a total ban on fireworks. I am sick of them. It upsets me so much, when I read about poor animals being scared and injured, even killed. Is it all worth it - NO!

[jjc]

There have to be regulations put in place that will make sure people can enjoy firework displays and those who misuse fireworks can't get access to them.

But that's just the point, Liz. There ARE regulations in place for JUST that purpose!!!

A new fireworks bill went through parliament this year that will allow a noise limit to be imposed on fireworks. It will force retailers wishing to sell fireworks to be licensed (and for that license to be revoked, as well as a fine of up to £5000, and a prison term of up to 6 months, if they sell to minors). It will, and I think this will interest you most, prohibit the use of fireworks during anti-social hours. The government have reached an agreement with the firework industry that fireworks will only be sold for the three weeks prior to November 5th and a few days afterwards (with a similar agreement for New Year). The storage of fireworks for personal use for more than 14 days is an offence that carries a £5000 fine.

The Fireworks Act 2003 has not yet come into effect, but by November 5th next year these new regulations will be enforced and hopefully things will improve. Why not give these measures a chance and see if they can't make things better? Who knows, you may not have to take fireworks away from future generations after all!?!?!?

[Loafer]

jjc

If you honestly think that a petty backbenchers bill will make a difference, then you are sadly mistaken. Who is going to police it? The police? Never! Who is going to catch any culprits? The police? This society is going downhill, and I do not know who can stop it. When I was a bairn, not long ago, I am only 32, if I had said to my elders what bairns say to elders today, I would have got a slap across the side of my loogs (from my dad), but that is not permitted these days. I think it is time the belt was brought back into schools, and, more importantly, the birch was brought back for the young delinquints that are roaming our streets and making life a misery for everyone. Why are kids so loud and noisy these days? Where has the innocence of hide-and-seek gone?

The Loafer

[jjc]

If you honestly think that a petty backbenchers bill will make a difference, then you are sadly mistaken. Who is going to police it? The police?...

...Why are kids so loud and noisy these days? Where has the innocence of hide-and-seek gone?

Well, yes I do think that the Fireworks Act 2003 will make a difference. And yes, I do expect the police to police it (it's kind of in the name, don't you think?) Why? Because it is not a 'petty backbenchers bill'. It has gone through the relevant parliamentary processes, has been given Royal Assent, and it is now law.

As for why kids are noisy these days and the reasons for the disappearance of innocent hide-and-seek – I believe you will find they are one and the same… I guess that as we wrap them up in cotton wool to protect them from the dangers of the world (Heaven forbid they might get lost whilst playing hide-and-seek – can't have that – sit them down at the computer game where you know they are safe) they have learned that we are more interested in the perception of their welfare than in their actual welfare. If they are noisy and undisciplined then we'll talk to them gently so as not to disturb their fragile minds. Never mind that they will grow up unable to deal with authority and get on in the real world, at least they have been allowed to express themselves!!!

I agree, a good slap across the backside never did me any harm. But whilst we are waiting for parenting to come full circle and for such draconian measures to once again be acceptable for parents, why don't we ban fireworks? That'll keep them all safe…

[MadPict]

See, it's almost midnight and there are still fireworks going off. This pee's me off even more - there is NO consideration for the neighbours/community at all.
Fireworks should only be allowed between 7pm and 9pm - what reason is there for launching air mortar bombs at midnight?
OK, the Millennium was an exception, and I have admit it was spectacular and sounded like the artillery barrages in the First World War. But why do we have to have fireworks every New Years Eve?

From the replies to this thread it seems more and more folk oppose fireworks - but liek many things this government promises it will end up a fudge. The firework industry will not doubt whine and moan about lost jobs and suchlike. And all the while develop even more noisy products.

Hmmm, I wonder what time I'll get to sleep tonight...

MadPict

[squidge]

Oh goodness me

I am having a bonfire party next saturday. Yes we are having fireworks too.

There will be maybe 15 or 20 people. Is it a guy fawkes celebration? i dunno i just think it will be fun. I have asked my neighbours to come and the dog is going away for the night. I am making chilli and soup and hot dogs and the fireworks will be over by about 7.30. The children will be supervised and the fire will be big and hot. Once all the wee ones have gone home to bed a few of us grown ups will down a few drams listen to some music and then crash out on the amazing number of beds i seem to have in this house.

The next day we are all having the hugest most cholesterol filled breakfast i have made in a long time.

Should i not be allowed to do this? Am i an irresponsible adult because i enjoy the wonder on the kiddies faces as the fireworks go whoosh fizz and BANG. I resent people saying i should be banned from buying the things i want to buy and using them properly and responsibly. Get the law to be the law. Stop children buying fireworks and misbehaving with them by stopping shops selling them to children for weeks and weeks, but dont tell me i cant buy them for a evening of fun. That is just ridiculously heavy handed.

[dpw39]

When I was a lad, we used to take great delight in pinching my Dads old boiler suit and stuffing it with straw/paper whatever, and sticking it in an old pram and wheeling it around the town and collecting pennies which was to be spent on fireworks. The more realistic the guy, the more pennies received. In all my years in Caithness, I've never seen this, why not?

I agree, their should be more control over the sale of fireworks especially to children, and parental control must be in force at all times... Consideration of other members in the community whether they be OAP's, the vulnerable or family pets etc should always be taken into consideration. Alright, special occasions such as New Year and the Millenium is acceptable, as is Bonfire Night. But it must be in a controlled atmosphere either by professionals or consenting responsible adults.

I feel sorry for kids these days, as they never have what we had, such as BAD HOUSING , RICKETS , DISCIPLINE etc, oh and respect for the older generation as well as our parents . Eventually we will come full circle, where we will vear away from this attitude of "SOD YOU JACK, I'M ALRIGHT" culture, and be more understanding and caring about our fellow men/women as well as our neighbours regarding fireworks and the like...

Do they have Bonfire toffee, baked tatties or Black peas up here? and when was the last time you saw the kids going round to all the houses collecting wood for the street bonfire on the run-up to Bonfire night?

The acrid smell on bonfire nights still bring back happy memories of childhood of being allowed to light the blue touch paper (under parental control) was a memory that still remains with me to this day. Also stood in front of a huge (from a childs point of view) bonfire, roasting one side of your body at a time was something else, and the smell of smoke left on your clothes the day after was, ermmm pungent to say the least. But you could always sneak a crafty fag, when there where no adults in the vicinty, and your Mother would be unable to detect the smell of tobacco on your clothes.

The bonfire toffe was the best, and should be re-introduced as it stuck your teeth together for a good half hour and kept you quiet for a bit, oh happy days...

A total ban, I disagree, but irresponsible behaviour should be punnished as the lifeboat service have been called out on occasions mistaking a firework for a distress flare I think we should bring back Mssr Faukes and help him to complete his mission, there's more whiz-bangs down in that parliament place than is sold in the shops up here.

Ciao,


Dave the Rave
"back at last"

[squidge]

When I was a lad, we used to take great delight in pinching my Dads old boiler suit and stuffing it with straw/paper whatever....

Do they have Bonfire toffee, baked tatties or Black peas up here?


The bonfire toffe was the best, and should be re-introduced as it stuck your teeth together for a good half hour and kept you quiet for a bit, oh happy days...


Dave the Rave
"back at last"

Yes Dave we are doing the Guy thing.... and if you want black peas i am importing them specially to introduce all my Caithness friends to this northern delicacy!!!

And i am even making bonfire toffee although i cant find those round foil trays to put it in with a lolly pop stick to hold onto so it looks like it will be the trusty hammer

Wanna come????

[dpw39]

Its only a Northern delicacy if we are insitu, so is it a Southern delicacy as we are domiciled in Caithness? and yes please I would love an invite. You can take the lad out of Lancashire, but you can't take the Lancahire out the lad...

Tin foil in ramikins or use egg cups and pop your stick in that, it'll do, also the black peas are used all year round for pigeon food, and we only used to get them on Bonfire nights with lashings of Malt vinegar (not that pilly wally (!) stuff that they use up here) and Black pepper, Mmmmm, me mouths watering already...

Is it Saturday the 8th ?

and what do I need to bring ?

I won't be able to sleep with anticipation

Ciao,


Dave the Rave