Well I'm going to say it.

[away]

[quote="squidge"]

Its the same racist twaddle thats been spouted for years and its boring dull unimaginative and wrong and more this particular point it neither helps understand the issues or contribute to resolving them.

How about if i add GO infront of your name and you follow that instruction

I knew your were going to try and pull the racism card, and eagerly awaited your reply. For your information I have many friends and work collegues from varying nations, from kenyan, morrocan, pakistani, carribean, south african to indian, of the top of my head I can think of at least 5 muslim friends and associates I have, ranging from meeting socially to even trips away to football. Your being both boring dull and unimaginative with your labelling of racist (change the record its boring now), you sound like a child that isnt getting its own way, and cause it doesnt suit, then Im doing wrong. Funnily enough all five of the muslim friends I have made reference to are employed and have choose to respect their religions, and yet not let it hold them back in the ways of living a normal,product, and rewarding life. Although off the original topic of the guy who got shot, you will note that my original post was relating to the topic in discussion, yet having read your previous twaddle in other postings and then for you to make reference to "balance", just made me laugh.

Add what you like infront, I'll still be here

[golach]

Im refering to since the country has opened it doors, and doesnt even know what its letting in. These are the people who wrongly feel that we should change our ways of life to accomodate them, rubbish they should remember what country they choose to come to. The same as if I got caught drinking in their parts of the world or stealing, Id either be flogged or have my hands cut off. They don't help themselves, and people like you that actually make it into governemt positions are making them expect even more. what about us some of us have been paying taxes into this country all our working days, rasheed maroof muhamed steps of the plane at heathrow with his 7 kids and three wives, and gets his social security forms filled out for him (cause he cant speak english), handed cash to see him through till his giro arrives, and a taxi to his new council house (cause he cant use public transport), the same council house that if I went on a housing list for Id have to wait 10yrs, then sits back every week waiting for his giro and all other benefits, casue do gooders make him aware of what he's entitled do, and makes absolutely no effort to learn the language, nor none of his family. Balance as I say dont make me laugh, the looneys have got in power cause of listening to people like you, the same looneys that put our own troops over to get involved in americas war

If this statement is not racist it certanly sounds it to me, and as far as I'm concerned its agruments like this that breed resentment and bigotry

[away]

If this statement is not racist it certanly sounds it to me, and as far as I'm concerned its agruments like this that breed resentment and bigotry

No Golach, not bigotry but yes possibley rescentment. And strangely not much of it rescentment towards the parties concerned, probably more aimed at the government that has let this situation arise. It can't be bigotry when you have asians and all walks of life down here signing up for the BNP (Im more Torie myself btw) because they are sick of what they are seeing happening to their own country, you'll note I made reference to "their own country", but but but how can you say that I hear you say, your a mean and nasty racist?, As explained in my previous post I am neither racist nor bigot. From my time in wick I don't remember being able to sit on the bus and listen to the colour mix of dialects, myself being the only one on that bus to speak english, hence why I couldnt possibley survive in my area being a bigot

[brandy]

hmm having read the many differening views well most of them anyway .. *G* would just like to put in at the end of the day.. a man who had no connection with the terrorists was brutally murdered.. the police have accepted all blame.. i do not profess to know all the details.. but from what i understand the men were not in uniform?
me personally IF some one came at me carrying a gun and shouting i would run as well.. as its harder to hit a moving target than a stationary one..
if as has been told he was held down and shot.. then point to be he was executed..
but as it stands he was shot in the head multiple times.. and brutaly killed while having no involvment at all.. and as has been pointed out why did they let him on the bus?
and why did they shoot him in the head?
police are trained to shoot in the arms and legs to disable a suspect..
so that makes no sence..
my thoughts go out to the family of the young man as i am sure they are in extreme pain because no matter what the cause they have lost their son just as all the others lost family in the earlier bombings..

[Rheghead]

Where do you get your facts, from the Media? As far as I am concerned lets wait until the public enquiry comes out then point the accusing finger, in my opinion Fred, you are very quick to condem but you are very slow at offering tangible solutions. I personally dont have a solution, but I think our Police Force do a grand job in very difficult days.
And I think they were not hard enough on the G8 nusiances that we in the big city had to put up with. It must be a great life up in the surroundings o Latheron

Here here golach,

It is also true to say that the police have allways had a 'shoot to kill' policy in place, not just since 7/7. It is wrong to shoot to wound or to warn. It is also true that it makes little difference to the man or his family if he was shot once in the head or 5 times in the head. But it probably (I am not a doctor)makes a difference in his ability to detonate a bomb.

[PhilR]

I wasn't going to respond to this post but my blood is boiling at reading such uninformed, ignorant drivel from the likes of Fred.

The recent attacks are a direct result of our involvement in Iraq? Just a suggestion Fred, but if you ever get the chance to walk down Basra main street and ask an average Iraqi citizen what they think of the coalition forces being there, they will shake your hand, call you their saviour from 30 years of mass murder, rape and torture, and ask you to take tea with them. Oh...but then the media says the total opposite so you'll obviously believe them! Someone else said that if it wasn't Iraq it would be some other cause the Imams are preaching against in the UK mosques. Absolutely true.

How dare you take a scattering of journalistic 'facts' about the London shooting and then broadcast your own twisted conclusions. What makes you a one-man Investigations Commission, armed with nothing more than a few official facts and a large pile of sensationalist gossip? Coupled with your armchair knowledge of world events, I'm relieved to see that you are in a minority on this subject.

p.s. Katarina - If you think that eliminating a suspected terrorist with multiple shots is so horrible, watching dozens of limbs flying in all directions isn't too nice either!

p.p.s. Some great points from MadPict and Squidge.

Off to count to 10 now!!!

[away]

[quote="brandy"]
police are trained to shoot in the arms and legs to disable a suspect..
so that makes no sence..

Your are correct in one thing Brandy, you may not have all the facts.
If you have ever undergone any form of arms training you will realise that you are trained to go for the mass of the body, torso area. This isnt TJ hooker, can you imagine how difficult it would be to pull of a shot specifying limps in a crowded area, the reason for going for the mass is simple, one as stated by yourself it is most certainly harder to hit a moving target (certainly with a short nosed pistol, as any minimal movement is exagerated in your aim), hence the validity of your arms and legs story goes out the window, two, the amount of major organs contained within the torso guarentees almost inevitably he will drop to the ground.

[squidge]

Funnily enough all five of the muslim friends I have made reference to are employed and have choose to respect their religions, and yet not let it hold them back in the ways of living a normal,product, and rewarding life.

So why use such a racist extreme example as you did here

rasheed maroof muhamed steps of the plane at heathrow with his 7 kids and three wives, and gets his social security forms filled out for him (cause he cant speak english), handed cash to see him through till his giro arrives, and a taxi to his new council house (cause he cant use public transport), the same council house that if I went on a housing list for Id have to wait 10yrs, then sits back every week waiting for his giro and all other benefits, casue do gooders make him aware of what he's entitled do, and makes absolutely no effort to learn the language, nor none of his family.

I maintain that these remarks are ignorant, racist and wrong. Whether you feel that you are a racist or not is immaterial - those remarks are as distasteful now as they have ever been and they have been being made for twenty years.

[away]

not squidge not wrong, if you read the comparison between the two quotes you made reference to, you will see that I am trying to state the difference of those that are entering the country now, and those who have resided in the UK for if not all the majority of their life, these are facts Ive stated sorry

[Donnie]

[Shooting him multiple times is standard procedure in this kind of situation. Once a threat has been identified, it has to be neutralised. They shoot them from the spinal cord to the brain to make sure nervous system shuts down stopping the fingers from reacting in a way that may trigger the bomb.

What i still can't understand is, if he was suspected of carrying a bomb, why did they let him get on a bus before he even got to the tube station?

I guess they had hoped he was going to lead them to the missing bombers or maybe other people involved. I imagine when they saw him heading towards the tube they didn't want to take the risk any further.

[jay]

just a thought....... a deaf coloured man running to catch his train wouldn't stand a chance!

[squidge]

I am trying to state the difference of those that are entering the country now, and those who have resided in the UK for if not all the majority of their life,

OK Away i accept that it was for illustrative purposes only , however the example you use cant happen

[scorrie]

I guess they had hoped he was going to lead them to the missing bombers or maybe other people involved. I imagine when they saw him heading towards the tube they didn't want to take the risk any further.

So, if he had blown himself up on the bus and taken several passengers with him then that would have been acceptable would it? After all, he MIGHT have led them to missing bombers.

One thing is certain, if this man had been involved then there would not have been much chance of getting any information out of him once seven bullets had perforated his brain.

[fred]

I wasn't going to respond to this post but my blood is boiling at reading such uninformed, ignorant drivel from the likes of Fred.

The recent attacks are a direct result of our involvement in Iraq? Just a suggestion Fred, but if you ever get the chance to walk down Basra main street and ask an average Iraqi citizen what they think of the coalition forces being there, they will shake your hand, call you their saviour from 30 years of mass murder, rape and torture, and ask you to take tea with them. Oh...but then the media says the total opposite so you'll obviously believe them! Someone else said that if it wasn't Iraq it would be some other cause the Imams are preaching against in the UK mosques. Absolutely true.

So those naughty people at the BBC are just making up all those stories about the insurgent attacks on the occupying forces and Iraqi collaborators?

I don't think so.

Here are the facts about what we have done for Iraq:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/mid...st/4694123.stm

What do you think the future holds for Iraq now? The coalition forces won't stay to protect them for ever and when they leave it will be civil war and more carnage. What Iraqi people are left alive, one out of every thousand is dead already, will be worse off than when they started but you can bet we'll have their oil.

[gleeber]

I just heard on the radio that the football game between Millwall FC and the Iranian national team scheduled for Saturday in London had been cancelled.
It seems to me like there are some heavy things going on in the background for a decision like this to be made. Millwall FC said they were acting on information recieved that people may be in danger if the game went ahead
Millwall are known to carry some of the most right wing football supporters (thugs) in the country. My guess is these idiots were planning some dust-up against an obvious "Islamic menace". It would have been awful.
I have to admit I had planned taking my daughter to London soon, but no more. It must be very difficult trying to live a normal life in some parts of London these days.
I suppose my attitude is the one our Leaders are telling us not to adopt and who am I to disagree with them? Mind you they have a fair bit more security around them than my daughter And I would have in London.
What a blinking mess.

[golach]

I wasn't going to respond to this post but my blood is boiling at reading such uninformed, ignorant drivel from the likes of Fred.

The recent attacks are a direct result of our involvement in Iraq? Just a suggestion Fred, but if you ever get the chance to walk down Basra main street and ask an average Iraqi citizen what they think of the coalition forces being there, they will shake your hand, call you their saviour from 30 years of mass murder, rape and torture, and ask you to take tea with them. Oh...but then the media says the total opposite so you'll obviously believe them! Someone else said that if it wasn't Iraq it would be some other cause the Imams are preaching against in the UK mosques. Absolutely true.

So those naughty people at the BBC are just making up all those stories about the insurgent attacks on the occupying forces and Iraqi collaborators?

I don't think so.

.

Oh Fred to think I gave you some common sense, even though I don't agree with you but you have now shown me that you must be the most naive person in the world if you believe all that you see on the media, everything you see, is edited and manipulated to give the producer of the article the most extreme coverage.
Take a pinch o salt Fred

[away]

OK Away i accept that it was for illustrative purposes only , however the example you use cant happen

The only people stopping it from happening are those who dwell on hard times of previous, namely yourself and the likes. Like stated earlier the times they are a changing

[squidge]

The only people stopping it from happening are those who dwell on hard times of previous, namely yourself and the likes. Like stated earlier the times they are a changing

Honestly!!!! You wont let it go will you - i feel like you are misunderstanding what i am saying deliberately but maybe i m not doing a good enough job of being clear.Under social security legislation as at TODAY the situation you described cannot happen. The LEGISLATION prevents people such as you described getting benefits the way you described. There were times when it could have happened in the early eighties but this is no longer the case.The law has been changed and today that could not happen. Im not going to say any more about this cos im sure everyone is rolling their eyes.

[Rheghead]

2222

[fred]

Oh Fred to think I gave you some common sense, even though I don't agree with you but you have now shown me that you must be the most naive person in the world if you believe all that you see on the media, everything you see, is edited and manipulated to give the producer of the article the most extreme coverage.
Take a pinch o salt Fred

Oh I do, when the papers were full of stories about Iraq having weapons of mass destruction I didn't believe one word of it.

And when our government declared war on terror I never thought for one minute that terror wouldn't fight back.

.