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Thread: Are you on the fence over Scottish independence?

  1. #41

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    Corky…You have ‘selective reading syndrome’.
    The Media I have read, listened to, and watched on TV…….all indicate that there is no will at this time for Separation! Now even less that 2014.

  2. #42

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    I can't be bothered re-stating the same arguments over and over again to you Horseman. I don't know where you get your information from but it is not giving you the full story.

    The only thing I will do is re-post the relevant paragraph from the most recent British Social Attitudes survey.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    And before all the uber-Unionists on here pile on and try to dismiss this report please be aware that Prof. Sir John Curtis of Stratchclyde University is one of the editors. His credentials are exemplary. Indeed, he is commonly regarded as the foremost psephologist in the UK.

  3. #43
    Join Date
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    3,124

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    Quote Originally Posted by Corky Smeek View Post
    I can't be bothered re-stating the same arguments over and over again to you Horseman. I don't know where you get your information from but it is not giving you the full story.

    The only thing I will do is re-post the relevant paragraph from the most recent British Social Attitudes survey.

    Click image for larger version. 

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Views:	81 
Size:	77.0 KB 
ID:	35850

    And before all the uber-Unionists on here pile on and try to dismiss this report please be aware that Prof. Sir John Curtis of Stratchclyde University is one of the editors. His credentials are exemplary. Indeed, he is commonly regarded as the foremost psephologist in the UK.
    Sorry Throbs, I have checked and..................nope, not a single hoot is given, let alone 2
    W.A.T.P.

  4. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Horseman View Post
    Corky…You have ‘selective reading syndrome’.
    The Media I have read, listened to, and watched on TV…….all indicate that there is no will at this time for Separation! Now even less that 2014.
    I have to agree with you, Corky only posts the paragraphs that he agrees with and 'conveniently' 'ignores' the paragraphs that don't reflect his/her/their views. Early today Corky posted about a panelbase survey 'forgetting' to mention the section where it showed there is still more 'No' support than 'Yes' .I posted a link to the article which quoted Sir John Curtice as a contributor, then lo and behold, Corky posts another random picture (with no link to source) saying how wonderful Sir JC is. So you are spot on with your statement "Corky…You have ‘selective reading syndrome’

  5. #45

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    There are many Polls out there…So I wud say that the 52% is…Plus or Minus up to 2% to 5%.
    That isn't enough… Poor odds!
    Would you bet on that number! I doubt it.
    And there is No Decision from The Supreme Court!

  6. #46

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    Just thought I'd warn you Fulmar. They are trying to turn it "nasty" again.

  7. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by Corky Smeek View Post
    Just thought I'd warn you Fulmar. They are trying to turn it "nasty" again.

    Just play fair. Stop posting random %'s that you think might make undecided voters think there is more support for independence than there actually is. Your picture tries to imply a far higher % but if you posted a link to the actual article, it's about a particular set of people!

    As for 'Uber' unionists, I prefer 'uber' realist! The SNP have had what, 15 yrs to show us what they can do and even longer to prepare papers to set out a vision of an independent Scotland. What they came up with any higher student could have written. It is woeful. Even you used to promise a vision of Utopia, but I think reality has kicked in and now were going to have to work hard and probably sacrifice certain things for independence. And, no, I'm not prepared to sacrifice anything. I already pay higher taxes than the rest of the citizens of the UK and quite frankly I can't see any improvement, so who in their right mind is going to vote for probably higher taxes and cuts to services just so Nicola Sturgeon can go down in history as the woman who gave Scotland it's Freeeedoommm!!

  8. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by Goodfellers View Post
    Just play fair. Stop posting random %'s that you think might make undecided voters think there is more support for independence than there actually is. Your picture tries to imply a far higher % but if you posted a link to the actual article, it's about a particular set of people!

    As for 'Uber' unionists, I prefer 'uber' realist! The SNP have had what, 15 yrs to show us what they can do and even longer to prepare papers to set out a vision of an independent Scotland. What they came up with any higher student could have written. It is woeful. Even you used to promise a vision of Utopia, but I think reality has kicked in and now were going to have to work hard and probably sacrifice certain things for independence. And, no, I'm not prepared to sacrifice anything. I already pay higher taxes than the rest of the citizens of the UK and quite frankly I can't see any improvement, so who in their right mind is going to vote for probably higher taxes and cuts to services just so Nicola Sturgeon can go down in history as the woman who gave Scotland it's Freeeedoommm!!
    Nah!. I'm not going to rise to the bait. Nae luck lads.

  9. #49

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    Scottish independence: Record level of support in annual survey.

    https://www.heraldscotland.com/polit...annual-survey/

  10. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by Corky Smeek View Post
    Scottish independence: Record level of support in annual survey.

    https://www.heraldscotland.com/polit...annual-survey/
    52%
    Would u put all your money on a Bet with these Odds!?
    Foolishness…..perhaps.

  11. #51

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Horseman View Post
    52%
    Would u put all your money on a Bet with these Odds!?
    Foolishness…..perhaps.
    Corky's actually had to trawl backwards to get that figure from September, earlier today Corky posted about the latest Panelbase survey (cleverly edited to show only what he/she/they wanted) where support for indy was only 47%.

    What Corky needs to remember is that polls are basically a waste of time as its likely The Supreme Court will rule in Westminster's favour and a referendum can only be had when the UK government allow it. Rightly so, the UK government have a job to protect the majority of the population who want to remain in the union. IF, and only if, the SNP can regularly get 60%+ of all votes, then the UK government should be minded to look at indtref2.

  12. #52

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    Nope, still not rising to it.

  13. #53

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    A couple of quotes before bedtime:-


    “It would be wrong to suggest that Scotland could not be another such successful, independent country.”.


    David Cameron (former UK PM)


    "If a democracy cannot change its mind, it ceases to be a democracy.".


    David Davis (former Brexit Secretary)

  14. #54

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    Of course I agree with the above….very common comments! But you have a bunch of Politicians who are ‘Long in the tooth’ and they are getting nowhere…Just a waste of money…People will not forget the Shenanigans with Salmond. A lot of DIRT there!

    And Einstein supposedly said……Doing the same thing, and getting the same result is Insanity!******************

    This got messed up a bit………..





    David Cameron (former UK PM)


    "If a democracy cannot change its mind, it ceases to be a democracy.".


    David Davis (former Brexit Secretary)[/QUOTE]
    Last edited by The Horseman; 24-Oct-22 at 03:16.

  15. #55

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    Quote Originally Posted by Corky Smeek View Post
    A couple of quotes before bedtime:-


    “It would be wrong to suggest that Scotland could not be another such successful, independent country.”.


    David Cameron (former UK PM)


    "If a democracy cannot change its mind, it ceases to be a democracy.".


    David Davis (former Brexit Secretary)

    We haven't changed our minds though, have we? All the opinion polls you refer to back up that fact. We are a democracy; it seems to be you that has trouble accepting that fact.

  16. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Horseman View Post
    And Einstein supposedly said……Doing the same thing, and getting the same result is Insanity!******************

    This got messed up a bit………..
    Absolutely, couldn't agree more. You have hit the nail slap-bang, square on the head. I couldn't have put it better my self.

    Let's stop doing the same thing. Let's stop trusting Westminster to act in Scotland's best interests and get out of this Union. To remain in the Union would indeed be insanity.

  17. #57

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    Quote Originally Posted by Goodfellers View Post
    We haven't changed our minds though, have we? All the opinion polls you refer to back up that fact. We are a democracy; it seems to be you that has trouble accepting that fact.
    But your side are too frightened to put it to the test. If you are so confident ask the people. That is democracy. We are entitled to change our minds.

  18. #58

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    Quote Originally Posted by Corky Smeek View Post
    But your side are too frightened to put it to the test. If you are so confident ask the people. That is democracy. We are entitled to change our minds.
    I'm not sure if you're aware, but referendums are expensive and take up government time, time and money that could be better spent.

    Keep getting over 60% in the polls then maybe consider asking Westminster. You can't keep requesting referendums because of a handful of uber nationalists refusing to accept the will of the majority.

  19. #59

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    Three more interesting quotes about democracy:-


    “There is no other treaty in the world that I’m aware of where a sovereign nation undertakes to join up, and can only leave when the other side says so.”

    David Davis talking about UK leaving the EU (but seemingly unaware of the Treaty of Union 1707).


    " A democracy fails to be a democracy if the public are not allowed to change their mind".

    Ian Murray (Labour MP)


    "The future of Scotland is obviously a matter for Scotland"

    Keir Starmer (Leader of the Opposition)

  20. #60

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    Quote Originally Posted by Goodfellers View Post
    I'm not sure if you're aware, but referendums are expensive and take up government time, time and money that could be better spent.

    Keep getting over 60% in the polls then maybe consider asking Westminster. You can't keep requesting referendums because of a handful of uber nationalists refusing to accept the will of the majority.
    Glad you brought that up. So here is a quote from Ruth Davidson, Baroness:-

    “If the Greens and the SNP, and the SSP or any of the other parties who have declared an interest in independence, get over the line and can make a coalition, make a majority, get the votes in the Parliament, then they’ll vote through a referendum.

    That’s what democracy is all about.”


    Also it seems to have escaped your notice that by all current parliamentary conventions in the UK there is a mandate for IndyRef2.

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