What is the point of Labour anymore?

[Shabbychic]

I just don't get them. I mean JC wanders about the UK promising he is going to do loads of supery, dupery things. He even claims he will bring down this Tory government, and it all sounds great. He gets his supporters all fired up and ready to go, then they head into Parliament, and instead of voting against Bills he promised to oppose, he suddenly changes his mind and tells his team to ABSTAIN.


Take the Immigration Bill the other night, with all the nasty wee clauses in it. First the members were told to abstain, and although many objected to this, some just packed up and headed home. Then suddenly, because of all the objections, they were told, with an hour or so to go, if anybody was still hanging about, they should vote against it, with the result it passed by, I think, 63. They could easily have taken that one.


I really don't think JC wants to be PM. I believe he just wants to sit back in the opposition benches and blame everything on the Tories....after all, he didn't vote for it, (CETA anyone?) when in fact, by abstaining, he most certainly did.


I read somewhere the other day that Dr Martin Luther King once said: "If you see a good fight, get in it." but JC's motto seems to be: "If you see a good fight, volunteer to haud the jaikets."


Anybody have any idea what is really going on in the modern Labour Party?

[B0wer]

Personally I think Scottish Labour should splinter from UK Labour which is looking more and more like Mr Corbyns Socialist fantisy party. I don't think he actually wants to be prime minister. He is quite happy raking in money as an opposition that can promise everything and anything, even contradictory things because it will never have to actually find the money it says is out there. Give him 3 months in Office and either the UK will be totally bankrupt and not running because he has nationalised everything with the last of the money and can't afford to run it. Or we will see the biggest series of u turns in political history as he discovers the magic money tree doesn't exist.

[aqua]

Scottish Labour is at this moment even more incompetent than UK Labour. The Scottish Labour leader is even more useless than Corbyn. I think he’s called Richard. What’s his surname? I don’t know.

[Fulmar]

How do you know? Do you haunt the chamber in Holyrood and listen to every debate?

[aqua]

Yeah.

Richard who?

[Fulmar]

Richard Leonard.

[orkneycadian]

Anybody have any idea what is really going on in the modern Labour Party?

Anti semetism?

[Shabbychic]

Anti semetism?

I'm far from being a Labour supporter these days, but all this Antisemitism nonsense is just a dirty smear campaign championed by the Tories........who have a great reputation for racism themselves, and always have had.

This election is turning into a really nasty business from all angles this time, one of the worst I've ever seen.

[j4bberw0ck]

Shabbychic, you don't sound like a person who watched Andrew Neil comprehensively gut Jeremy Corbyn in his interview last evening, on the subject of anti-Semitism in the Labour Party - and that's both the Parliamentary party and the organisation. All socialist administrations need a scapegoat to distract the hoi polloi's gaze from their governmental failings and the Jews are usually convenient. Look also at the people Corbyn associates with.

And please don't start about right-wing BBC bias. It'd be a first, were it to happen.

[Shabbychic]

Shabbychic, you don't sound like a person who watched Andrew Neil comprehensively gut Jeremy Corbyn in his interview last evening, on the subject of anti-Semitism in the Labour Party - and that's both the Parliamentary party and the organisation. All socialist administrations need a scapegoat to distract the hoi polloi's gaze from their governmental failings and the Jews are usually convenient. Look also at the people Corbyn associates with.

And please don't start about right-wing BBC bias. It'd be a first, were it to happen.

Actually I did watch it comprehensively, and obviously saw it differently from you. If you call shouting over someone constantly because he wants his point to be the only point, as Andrew Neil is famous for, as a gutting, then that's your prerogative. I call it bullying. What was he to apologise for anyway? He has apologised and sorted things out in the past apparently. To do so again on Neil's command is not what an interview should be about. I didn't watch the interview to see that, but to hear what his plans were if in government, especially regarding us. (he changes that about quite a bit, as he does with a lot of things.)

As for the Antisemitism in the Labour Party, I have no intentions of arguing their corner. What I will say is, much of it is regarding the present government policies in Israel, and how they deal with Palestine and other issues, which is not quite the same as hating Jews. Antisemitism is used far too loosely these days.

I'm sorry you don't see the BBC the way I do, but that's up to you.

[Corky Smeek]

In some respects there is a big difference between the BBC in London and BBC Scotland. The connections between the Labour party and BBC Scotland are far too numerous and too close for any of their output to be considered balanced and impartial. Consider the following:-

1. During Indyref 1 the Head of BBC Scotland News and Current Affairs was John Boothman long term partner of Susan Deacon, Labour MSP (at the time).
2. Also in 2014 BBC Scotland decided to give Kezia Dugdale, (Labour MSP at the time) her own politics-based radio 'phone-in show. The idea was dropped when, after some test shows (not broadcast), it was realised that her talents were not ideally suited to the format, i.e. she was hopeless at it.
3. The BBC appoint Sarah Smith, daughter of former Labour Party leader, John Smith as their Scotland Editor.
4. Catriona Renton, BBC Scotland News Reporter is a former Labour Party Councillor.
5. Kirsty Wark has, twice holidayed with Jack McConnell, former Labour Party First Minister, at her holiday home in Majorca.
6. Then there was the Christmas List. The Labour Party provided the BBC with a set of SNP-bad stories to cover the politically quiet period over the festive season. BBC Scotland dutifully ran these as though they were news stories and not party political press releases. News of this leaked and it became embarrassing for the BBC as it was possible to predict their "exclusives" before they were broadcast.

Now, each one of these, taken on their own means nothing. Add them together and a rather worrying pattern emerges.

[aqua]

Shabbychic, you don't sound like a person who watched Andrew Neil comprehensively gut Jeremy Corbyn in his interview last evening, on the subject of anti-Semitism in the Labour Party - and that's both the Parliamentary party and the organisation. All socialist administrations need a scapegoat to distract the hoi polloi's gaze from their governmental failings and the Jews are usually convenient. Look also at the people Corbyn associates with.

And please don't start about right-wing BBC bias. It'd be a first, were it to happen.

I watched Neil and Corbyn.

I can’t stand Corbyn either, but Neil’s constant interruptions and childish questioning were so annoying, and Corbyn’s responses were better than I expected, so I ended up more supportive of Corbyn than ever before!

[orkneycadian]

Can this really get any worse for the SNP?

https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/...anti-semitism/

New SNP resignation over alleged anti-Semitism

Not an election candidate, but much worse, part of the Conduct Committee

Starting to make Jeremy Corbyn look quite angelic.

[orkneycadian]

I don't think Laura Keunssberg of the BBC is overly renowned for being a Conservative "smear campaigner";

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50567564

In fact, the BBC are more renowned for being Left supporting.

[Shabbychic]

I don't think Laura Keunssberg of the BBC is overly renowned for being a Conservative "smear campaigner";

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50567564

In fact, the BBC are more renowned for being Left supporting.

It's amazing how we can see things so differently.


I have always viewed Laura Kuenssberg as heavily leaning towards the Tories, and quite friendly with Boris. He even went as far as to quote the "die in a ditch" statement she made in recent times. That article link of hers, is not quite how I saw the interview, and I'm no Corbyn fan. (I sincerely hope he gets in, in England though.)


As for the BBC, once again in my view, they are very right wing nowadays, and BBC news very often seems to be a Party Political broadcast for the Right. Many of the top team at BBC are Tories, and then there are the BBC staff who leave to work for the Tory Party. I'm afraid Aunntie Beeb just ain't what it used to be. Every time, which is not often may I add, that I watch BBC news, I always think to myself "I wonder what the truth really is?"


Have you watched Question Time over the past couple of years? The amount of times Nigel Farage has been on, for example, is way over the top, especially considering his Party's standing in Westminster. Then there are the regular audience "plants", especially in Scottish editions, but now being seen more and more often in England too. They are always from the Right.


Then there is the cutting of the laughter at Boris the other night at the leaders debate, and the changing footage of Boris laying the Remembrance wreath. I could go on....


But really, my statement about Antisemitism smears goes way beyond the BBC. The right wing media in this country is getting beyond a joke and most of the smearing comes from there. They want Brexit, and their backers and chiefs want Brexit, and they will do anything to make sure it happens.

[orkneycadian]

I have always viewed Laura Kuenssberg as heavily leaning towards the Tories, and quite friendly with Boris.

[orkneycadian]

I'm far from being a Labour supporter these days, but all this Antisemitism nonsense is just a dirty smear campaign championed by the Tories........who have a great reputation for racism themselves, and always have had.

Conservative smear campaign?;

Uh-huh;

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50585278

[orkneycadian]

So, 0.16% of standing Labour candidates have had their parties support removed due to allegations of anti semetism.

Absolutely shocking.

But, what's that I hear you say?

1.7% of standing SNP candidates have had their parties support removed due to allegations of anti semetism?

Surely not?

That means that the rate of SNP candidates accused of anti semetism is nearly 11 times higher than the allegedly anti Semitic Labour party!

Wow.

[Alrock]

Yes, there are Anti-Semitic members of the Labour Party, it is a natural home for them due to the support there is in the Labour Party for the Palestinians treatment by the state of Israel (an issue important to them)...

This does not make the Party itself Anti-Semitic.

Just like Islamaphobic people are more likely to be drawn towards the Tory Party but that does not make them an Islamaphobic party.

Yes, both sides could probably do more to root out the more extremist elements of their party, but like I said, this does not make them Anti-Semitic or Islamaphobic.

If you want me to be convinced that Labour is an Anti-Semitic Party then can you please point out to me an actual policy proposal that is Anti-Semitic?

[orkneycadian]

Yes, there are Anti-Semitic members of the Labour Party, it is a natural home for them due to the support there is in the Labour Party for the Palestinians treatment by the state of Israel (an issue important to them)...

This does not make the Party itself Anti-Semitic.

I think the Labour party can now rest easy, given that the proportion of SNP election candidates who have had their parties support withdrawn due to allegations of anti Semitism is nearly 11 times higher.

Labour would need to withdraw support from another 10 election candidates to match the SNP. Not impossible, but rather unlikely.