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Thread: Wind/ Solar Power

  1. #1

    Default Wind/ Solar Power

    Just reading about the re- making of the buildings at Wick Harbour for The Wind Power Offices....
    Denmark is among Countries who are phasing out Wind Power as it has become too expensive..apparently other Countries are finding the same thing.
    In Canada, both Wind and Solar Power are on the chopping block as again the prices ar too high. In fact the long term prices are becoming a burden that will become unaffordable.
    It would appear that no real investigation went into these alternative sources of energy, and greedy industrialists pushed ahead with promises of cost savings which looked good in the beginning, but had no basis in fact.
    Another example....Computers were supposed to do away with paper copies....not so....there are more paper copies now than ever before.
    I was looking to find how much the HIE put into the re furbishment of the new Control Offices etc in Wick.... any thoughts people?

  2. #2

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Horseman View Post
    Denmark is among Countries who are phasing out Wind Power as it has become too expensive..
    do you have a source? as a quick search suggests they are still on track to increase it, and from Bloomberg:

    The comments come as the minister prepares to unveil a plan to put an end to Danish subsidies that have supported renewable energy in the country since the 1970s. He says such a framework is no longer necessary because wind power has proven its long-term capacity to compete on equal terms with fossil fuels, without state support. Lilleholt says itís already cheaper to use wind than coal to generate electricity, based on estimated costs of creating a new facility.

  3. #3

    Default

    Just read a new story a few days ago. The article did say that they were phasing out the subsidies as they were too expensive and this would make for increases in the 'finished product'.....i.e....electric power.
    In Canada the Liberal Gov't is in trouble for quickly phasing out coal and guaranteeing too much for 'renewable energy'. They made 10 year guarantees a few years ago. This was after subsidizing the infrastructure......I do see the articles you mention.....I think the direction of this story was that the windmills and solar panels need to be renewed whereas coal didn't. The renewable energy need renewable infrastructure, the cost of which was not taken into consideration....

    Quote......Jacob Peterson head of Equities at Sydbank in Denmark, a few days ago warned that it is too early for the Offshore wind farms to survive without Gov't subsidies, in fact he stated that he didn't even know if it would be profitable.
    And that is why The Province of Ontario, Canada has cancelled some projects....
    There are many opinions here, which have not seen these ideas through to fruition.

    And harnessing all the surplus heat and moving it through the hot water pipes to heat individual homes.......seems we have heard that one before. Perhaps if done on a massive scale and properly thought out as they seem to have done in Denmark would help......The story I read was all rosy and the future was looked at with bright eyes.....There are great ideas many which involve renewable power, but nothing has been proven. The jury is out on these projects.....
    BTW....I am not an engineer but what I think is, sometimes large companies pitch something that will make them huge profits with Gov't handouts/subsidized by the Gov't but when these subsidies have long gone, so are the Corporations.. The Politicians jump on this, through no fault of their own, as they are untrained in business......In Ontario the Gov't is being sued by the Wind Farms that were first approved and now are cancelled.
    Just a thought......,We all have our thoughts.
    Regards.....
    Last edited by The Horseman; 16-Mar-17 at 00:57.

  4. #4

    Default

    FYI....apparently there is an article in the Groat this week. If you look at it on-line, at the very bottom you will see a comment from a GeorgeH stating that in May 2106 the Ministry of Energy stated that the Renewable Energy policy has become too expensive. They cannot afford it!

  5. #5

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by The Horseman View Post
    FYI....apparently there is an article in the Groat this week. If you look at it on-line, at the very bottom you will see a comment from a GeorgeH stating that in May 2106 the Ministry of Energy stated that the Renewable Energy policy has become too expensive. They cannot afford it!
    Thanks for that, I now know that the EU ruled in 2016 that the subsidies/tariffs were a form of unfair competition between the energy companies. So they had to get rid of them, and they offset that by scrapping the 5 planned offshore windfarms.

    Yes I agree, it's a difficult matter whatever way you look at it. From the Chinese involvement of Hinckley or encroaching onshore wind farms, hopefully a solution can be found.

  6. #6

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    Yes, it is a difficult 'new road' to travel. In Canada we have a total of approx 20 Nuke Reactors, some of which are shutting down due to licensing regs. We also have several small ones at Universities and those that deal in isotopes.
    Our Politicians ate tinkering with Solar and Wind, but not doing a good job of it.......mind you much of this 'new power' is trial and error. The thinking is that when the Gov't subsidies are gone, so will some of the conglomerates that are presently building and operating these Farms. So we shall see.....it is akin to the push for Battery Powered vehicles. The price of Petrol is half that of the UK, and we really don't have many diesel cars, in fact VW and Audi are not importing any more diesel vehicles into Canada, perhaps even America. Truck/lorries will retain Diesel engines.
    It is a changing World with as I said. Trial and Error.
    The only place that is certainly for EV's is California. They have undertaken very strict measures, even banning two stroke engines, years ago....mind you they have a population of 40 million, so they can do their own thing!
    But now the Donald has arrived and he is changing things. He appointed the Anti green guy to the EP....Environmental Protection so who knows what will occur....And the Donald's Mother was from Lewis.....

  7. #7
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    The Danes are not phasing out wind power. They may be phasing out the incentives as they are probably not needed any more as wind is now cheaper than most types of fossil fuel generation if not cheaper than all types.
    God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
    Courage to change the things I can,
    And wisdom to know the difference.

  8. #8

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    Denmark is in the process of phasing out Five Offshore wind plants as this renewable is becoming too expensive.
    Google will confirm. In addition other Countries are doing the same, in fact Ontario, Canada has cancelled said wind power plants. Without subsidies it is not feasible/profitable/sustainable.
    I don't wish to argue. Just reading the latest news....ty...

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Horseman View Post
    Denmark is in the process of phasing out Five Offshore wind plants as this renewable is becoming too expensive.
    Google will confirm. In addition other Countries are doing the same, in fact Ontario, Canada has cancelled said wind power plants. Without subsidies it is not feasible/profitable/sustainable.
    I don't wish to argue. Just reading the latest news....ty...
    I think you will find that those plants are not being scrapped, they are being repowered under a new name with bigger turbines.

    Following several repowering programmes the much larger turbines of today are more systematically included in the general planning framework. Thus a more organised approach for integrating wind power into the physical planning has been developed. The repowering programmes have also resulted in a significant reduction in numbers of turbines whilst the installed capacity has been increasing.
    https://ens.dk/sites/ens.dk/files/Gl...wind_power.pdf
    Last edited by Rheghead; 18-Mar-17 at 17:16.
    God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
    Courage to change the things I can,
    And wisdom to know the difference.

  10. #10

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    The Yes I have scanned the report and no where does it identify Cost. This was a report on the Implementation of greenhouse gas reduction and Low emission strategies. Methinks several years ago..
    Recently the Danish Energy Minister Lillholt stated....Costs for Renewable energy is turning out to 'dramatically' increasing in costs since 2012 and it cannot go on. Plans are to 'scrap' five new offshore wind farms.
    We have seen the same thing. Huge wind farms cancelled. And if the subsidies that are presently being paid, cease to exist the systems will probably collapse.
    In addition, one of the probs that exist is Wind is not consistent, so there have to be back up systems....same with Solar....and no way of harnessing the energy for later use. Maybe Musk will build a big enuff Battery. There are projects that are underway to harness electrical power......caves/water etc., but none yet of value.
    Of course Politics play a part. Our Gov't had to increase rates by 25% over the past 2 years or so...that was trouble for them..so they are reducing the Electical rates and taaking the 25% on somewhere else. The games that are played!
    Last edited by The Horseman; 18-Mar-17 at 18:52.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Horseman View Post
    The Yes I have scanned the report and no where does it identify Cost. This was a report on the Implementation of greenhouse gas reduction and Low emission strategies. Methinks several years ago..
    Recently the Danish Energy Minister Lillholt stated....Costs for Renewable energy is turning out to 'dramatically' increasing in costs since 2012 and it cannot go on. Plans are to 'scrap' five new offshore wind farms.
    We have seen the same thing. Huge wind farms cancelled. And if the subsidies that are presently being paid, cease to exist the systems will probably collapse.
    In addition, one of the probs that exist is Wind is not consistent, so there have to be back up systems....same with Solar....and no way of harnessing the energy for later use. Maybe Musk will build a big enuff Battery. There are projects that are underway to harness electrical power......caves/water etc., but none yet of value.
    Of course Politics play a part. Our Gov't had to increase rates by 25% over the past 2 years or so...that was trouble for them..so they are reducing the Electical rates and taaking the 25% on somewhere else. The games that are played!
    Costs are coming down for wind. Rather than phasing out wind power, the policy of Denmark is definitely one of expanding wind power to provide 50.1% of current consumption. That is definitely at odds with your version.

    Just beware that the UK right wing media are constantly twisting the truth on renewable energy so I do not doubt what you have read. I've read it too.
    God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
    Courage to change the things I can,
    And wisdom to know the difference.

  12. #12

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    Yes I think there are two versions...
    Vestas is saying that it is amazing, and 50% by 2020, and the Gov'ts Energy Minister saying that they cannot afford the costs and are going to scrap future expansion.
    Now, who will win.....Big business with their Lobbyists, or The Gov't who wants to keep costs Down so that they will get re elected.
    The future shall tell.....s

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Horseman View Post
    Yes I think there are two versions...
    Vestas is saying that it is amazing, and 50% by 2020, and the Gov'ts Energy Minister saying that they cannot afford the costs and are going to scrap future expansion.
    Now, who will win.....Big business with their Lobbyists, or The Gov't who wants to keep costs Down so that they will get re elected.
    The future shall tell.....s
    I'd love to see a credible source that suggests what you are saying is correct. That link that I provided to show that Denmark was expanding its wind power was from the Danish department for energy in their government.
    God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
    Courage to change the things I can,
    And wisdom to know the difference.

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rheghead View Post
    I'd love to see a credible source that suggests what you are saying is correct. That link that I provided to show that Denmark was expanding its wind power was from the Danish department for energy in their government.
    Would I lie to you after seeing the video of Crayola...
    Google ...The Daily Caller......Windswept Denmark says Wind Energy has become too expensive....that is the Abreviated version from Reuters.
    And Canada is saying the same thing......
    Am on an iPad and cannot pull it over here...s

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Horseman View Post
    Would I lie to you after seeing the video of Crayola...
    Google ...The Daily Caller......Windswept Denmark says Wind Energy has become too expensive....that is the Abreviated version from Reuters.
    And Canada is saying the same thing......
    Am on an iPad and cannot pull it over here...s
    Please be careful of where you get your information from.

    The Daily Caller publishes information that cannot be validated and that is anti scientific fact. The information provided should be regarded as speculative opinion or propaganda and cannot be substantiated by fact or evidence. It is among the most untrustworthy sources in the media.
    http://www.fakenewschecker.com/fake-...e/daily-caller
    God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
    Courage to change the things I can,
    And wisdom to know the difference.

  16. #16

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    Actually they were quoting Reuters...
    Swedish Company Vattenfall won two tenders for windfarms in Denmark but the projects are in doubt. The costs of the Electricity from these two projects are twice the present price of Electricity which is .22 Danish Crowns and the rest would have to be subsidized by the Gov't, which is really the people paying double the price
    Vattefall's Manager said......Denmark doesn't know what it wants at the moment.
    I think I mentioned in a previous post that the Corporations push ahead to get as much money from the Countries, and this is what occurred...Copied from Reuters...
    Same scenario as here.
    Over and out! Regards..s

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Horseman View Post
    Actually they were quoting Reuters...
    Swedish Company Vattenfall won two tenders for windfarms in Denmark but the projects are in doubt. The costs of the Electricity from these two projects are twice the present price of Electricity which is .22 Danish Crowns and the rest would have to be subsidized by the Gov't, which is really the people paying double the price
    Vattefall's Manager said......Denmark doesn't know what it wants at the moment.
    I think I mentioned in a previous post that the Corporations push ahead to get as much money from the Countries, and this is what occurred...Copied from Reuters...
    Same scenario as here.
    Over and out! Regards..s
    They claim they are quoting Reuters. They can quote small snippets of Reuters word for word but leave out the most of what Reuters said that would have put the main message in context.
    God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
    Courage to change the things I can,
    And wisdom to know the difference.

  18. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rheghead View Post
    They claim they are quoting Reuters. They can quote small snippets of Reuters word for word but leave out the most of what Reuters said that would have put the main message in context.
    No....no.....I went to Reuters website. Quoted them......

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Horseman View Post
    No....no.....I went to Reuters website. Quoted them......
    Who are we supposed to believe then if what Reuters is saying is completely wide of the mark as well then?
    God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
    Courage to change the things I can,
    And wisdom to know the difference.

  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rheghead View Post
    Who are we supposed to believe then if what Reuters is saying is completely wide of the mark as well then?
    I defer to u......Times takes turns says Robbie Burns!

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