Scexit UK

[Rheghead]

"SUPPORT FOR INDEPENDENCE SINKS" Oh dear, oh dear (Hot off the press, Today November 30th)
http://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/su...inks-0j2bc7jxc

How much faith do you put in opinion polls?

[squidge]

Lol Rheghead, perhaps when it sinks to less that it was in 2011 we should be concerned - in the meantime Christmas is coming and then it's a new year and who knows what that will bring

[bekisman]

Come on you two Sassenachs whats the results of there 'ere 'National Survey'???

[squidge]

Well the news is that there have been over 2 million responses. Gonna take a wee bit of time to sort the results yet.

[bekisman]

Oh my [G]od been watching BBC Parliament on 504 'Brexit Negotiation Objectives' very interesting and complex questions by the Select Committee (very aptly controlled by Hilary) all pertinent questions pertaining to the negotiations by mostly erudite members - that is until the SNP Peter Grant asked - paraphrase - "You [John Longworth] were in the leave campaign.. it is said by a UKIP person 'Hofer did not win as not enough Austrians have been killed by migrants' AND seeing that UKIP was financed by Mr Banks and You (John Longworth) were in the Leave campaign, do you agree"? Eh!! Duh! if this is the standard of ability - notwithstanding outwith the compass of the Committee - I lower my head in abject incredulation

[Oddquine]

Well.....there we have it....a Brexit plan even woollier than the White Paper at the time of the indyref......and not even produced before the vote on it, either. Wishful thinking isn't just the prerogative of ScotNats, it appears, it is also in the armoury of the BritNats, along with lies and misrepresentation. So it is a waiting and seeing game....waiting for leaks from the negotiations and seeing how they will be spun by Westminster and the media.

It doesn't, however, look as if there is much chance of what rules/regulations/laws get "repatriated to Westminster" being devolved further down the line...given the paper makes only the commitment that no decisions "currently taken" by the devolved administrations will be removed from them....and no commitments as to what, if any, "repatriated powers" will be devolved. I wonder why the paper said "decisions currently taken" as opposed to "powers already passed" [in the Scotland Act 2016]..and it leads one, if cynical, to consider that perhaps some promised powers...like the APD and VAT assignment, which have not yet taken effect may not take effect.

When it comes to what the UK expects from the EU. it appears to be making the same assumption we did in 2014...that the EU will play ball...but regarding the repatriation of powers...the EU doesn't have to play ball....given we are "taking our sovereignty back". Logically, if Westminster knows nothing else right now, it knows what sovereignty we have handed to the EU, so it knows exactly what sovereignty is going to be repatriated....doesn't it? Or are bits of UK sovereignty still available as bargaining chips in the Brexit negotiations, like our fishing waters, so that is why they can't tell us yet even what they are considering devolving, in whole or part, away from the high heid yins in Westminster?

[bekisman]

RELAX! stop worrying, it will all turn out fine, watch this space... all these snowflakes waffling and whinging, just 'cos those nasty judges (including the Scots one) said the devolved governments had no involvement.. and what's this about the Welsh 'government' voting against - thought Wales voted leave? oh dear oh dear

[Rheghead]

Talks have been going on with EU to allow an independent Scotland to have transitional EU membership if Scotland decides to leave the UK, all the benefits and access to the Single market. This would prevent a hard Scexit from the EU which Theresa May and her cohorts at Westminster seem to be falling into the abyss. Jacqueline Minor confirmed that only an independent Scotland can apply for full membership but due to the extraordinary circumstances to Scotland's case of being dragged out of the EU against popular support then the fact that we are already in compliance with EU law and standards will be taken into consideration during the application process.

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/1...old/?ref=fbshr

[Oddquine]

Talks have been going on with EU to allow an independent Scotland to have transitional EU membership if Scotland decides to leave the UK, all the benefits and access to the Single market. This would prevent a hard Scexit from the EU which Theresa May and her cohorts at Westminster seem to be falling into the abyss. Jacqueline Minor confirmed that only an independent Scotland can apply for full membership but due to the extraordinary circumstances to Scotland's case of being dragged out of the EU against popular support then the fact that we are already in compliance with EU law and standards will be taken into consideration during the application process.

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/1...old/?ref=fbshr

I'm not overly inclined to take what individuals say as fact....although it would be good if it turns out to be correct. There is certainly much more chance of the EU having some sympathy for the Scottish pro-EU majority than of the Westminster negotiating team having any, though.

I was just thinking that if all of us in the peripheral nations of the "Union" held our breath waiting for Westminster do do something to benefit the whole UK...there would be no problems with Wales, Scotland and NI...because we'd all have died of asphyxiation a long, long time ago.

[Fulmar]

The Herald talks about
'Dr Kirsty Hughes told MSPs discussions have been taking place about putting Scotland in a "transitional holding pen" after Brexit to avoid "an absurd out and then in process".

Just about sums it up really. As far as I'm concerned, a 'holding pen' is generally used for sheep.

[Rheghead]

The Herald talks about
'Dr Kirsty Hughes told MSPs discussions have been taking place about putting Scotland in a "transitional holding pen" after Brexit to avoid "an absurd out and then in process".

Just about sums it up really. As far as I'm concerned, a 'holding pen' is generally used for sheep.

"£350 million per week for the NHS" pmsl

[Oddquine]

"£350 million per week for the NHS" pmsl

There's a meme going around on FB atm...saying "Why not just leave things as they are and just tell the Brexiteers we have left Europe? After all, they believed every lie that was told to them before the vote!"

Sound like a plan?

[Rheghead]

Scottish fishery won't get what they want out of Brexit, it looks like they've been shafted but it also looks like they will lose their customer base as they will have sell their produce through WTO rules which could mean import taxes on Scottish exports.

https://www.theguardian.com/environm...u-memo-reveals

[Oddquine]

Scottish fishery won't get what they want out of Brexit, it looks like they've been shafted but it also looks like they will lose their customer base as they will have sell their produce through WTO rules which could mean import taxes on Scottish exports.

https://www.theguardian.com/environm...u-memo-reveals

Don't see how they can say there is an imbalance when the UK, one country out of 27, gets 20% upwards of the quotas. At least there are still fish to be fished for...if not for the EU and quotas, there wouldn't be enough fish for the current number of Scottish fishermen to make a living from, given their over-fishing before we joined the EU.

[squidge]

Not getting the "world class" shipbuildingginvestment promised either it seems

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/1..._s_last_yards/

[Oddquine]

Not getting the "world class" shipbuildingginvestment promised either it seems

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/1..._s_last_yards/

Anybody surprised?

[Rheghead]

I see Scottish Labour are trying to push a vision of a federal UK to kill off Scottish independence. I would go along with that vision but how realistic is it? To make it a real option then they have to convince us that a federal UK has the support of the majority of the UK otherwise it is just a pipedream and thus it is a diversion.

[Oddquine]

I see Scottish Labour are trying to push a vision of a federal UK to kill off Scottish independence. I would go along with that vision but how realistic is it? To make it a real option then they have to convince us that a federal UK has the support of the majority of the UK otherwise it is just a pipedream and thus it is a diversion.

It's a Scottish Labour policy, so of course it's not realistic. The Labour Party in Scotland doesn't DO realistic, though to be fair nor does their head office.

They expect us to believe they are for federalism...when that the VOW promised as near Home Rule as dammit...and the Labour Party was a big player in rejecting every proposal of any use during the Smith Commission to leave us with the current pointless poisoned chalice. I'll bet they don't even know what federalism means.

Federalism won't get rid of Trident, though, or stop us being sucked into America's wars..because I'd also be prepared to bet that under no circumstances would Westminster permit a Federal Parliament of the nations which would allow the three wee nations to outvote the big one......and in a federal Parliament of the regions....there's England's built in majority back again.

[Rheghead]

It's a Scottish Labour policy, so of course it's not realistic. The Labour Party in Scotland doesn't DO realistic, though to be fair nor does their head office.

They expect us to believe they are for federalism...when that the VOW promised as near Home Rule as dammit...and the Labour Party was a big player in rejecting every proposal of any use during the Smith Commission to leave us with the current pointless poisoned chalice. I'll bet they don't even know what federalism means.

Federalism won't get rid of Trident, though, or stop us being sucked into America's wars..because I'd also be prepared to bet that under no circumstances would Westminster permit a Federal Parliament of the nations which would allow the three wee nations to outvote the big one......and in a federal Parliament of the regions....there's England's built in majority back again.

Totally agree.

However, the Westminster government could kill off the prospect of Scottish independence right now if they gave any realistic indication that within ten years that we would have a federalised UK, true and proper proportional representation in all elections, agreement from all devolved parliaments to all overseas conflicts, abolishment of the House of Lords and written constitutional protection for NHS treatment. We need a UK that we all can be proud to be a part of if we are look at a modern future of the UK.

[Oddquine]

Totally agree.

However, the Westminster government could kill off the prospect of Scottish independence right now if they gave any realistic indication that within ten years that we would have a federalised UK, true and proper proportional representation in all elections, agreement from all devolved parliaments to all overseas conflicts, abolishment of the House of Lords and written constitutional protection for NHS treatment. We need a UK that we all can be proud to be a part of if we are look at a modern future of the UK.

Aye, right! I won't be holding my breath...because Westminster promises only last until the paper they are written on can be scrunched up and thrown in the bucket. Did we not see that with the first indyref? We voted NO and everything they said would happen if we voted YES happened anyway....and we got EVEL into the bargain. That's how Westminster keeps promises.