'Hoodies' Demo in Inverness - stop scapegoating the kids

[squidge]

I dont understand Setanta

are you saying it isnt just a sweat shirt? that it has character changing properties? that it is something other than an item of clothing - with a hood

Like a coat?

[Setanta]

Setanta remains true to form.


So there are youth clubs etc 'everywhere' are there?
Here in Dornoch, no small village, there is no such club (as far as I'm aware), unless you want to be battered brain-dead by Wee Free evangelists.

One reason for the decline of community-run clubs is of course the same paranoia fostered by the Sun, Mail etc - and that's the paranoia about 'paedophiles' infiltrating our kids clubs.

Plenty of parents are unwilling to volunteer,

That leaves much responsibility on local councils to provide trained youth leaders etc - no doubt Setanta will be amongst the first to complain about a waste of council-tax-payers money.

No I wouldn’t wish the wee frees on any one, that is unless I didn’t like someone then I would send them round to their door
In Dornoch there is a very good Martial Arts club, which kids could go to for an evening.
I totally agree with your Sun statement they whole thing has got way out of hand and paranoia does rule.

Parents want other people to look after their kids. I teach kids and youths and we tried to get a roster going whereby a parent could be present roughly once in every 15 weeks, could we get them to do it ....naw. We soon realized that we were their cheap babysitters.

You’re wrong about your last statement I actual agree that we need more professionals but the old adage springs to mind that “you can take a horse to water but you can’t make him drink”. Where the facilities are on their doorsteps they still don’t go. Before someone jumps down my throat these facilities are crammed full of young people who like mix, play, exercise and have a good time. So heres my question “why are these kids different from the ones on the street corners”?

[scotsboy]

an orange sash is just a strip of material

It is much more than that Actually it is mainly collarettes that are worn these days, rather then the Sash.

[Setanta]

I dont understand Setanta

are you saying it isnt just a sweat shirt? that it has character changing properties? that it is something other than an item of clothing - with a hood

Like a coat?

No offence squidge but I find answering this laborious. I assume that you are taking the Michael. You still singled out the hood and ignored all the other obvious examples. Clothes do change personality take a snivelling little kid and give him the colours of the local gang, while he is wearing them with his mates he thinks he is a hero. Meet him on another day without the kit and his friends and you will see the sniveller again. Ever notice the change in an individual when they are put into a uniform?
A hooded top worn either as a sports item so as not to get cold and cause injuries or as something just to keep an individual warm is fine. But we are not talking about individuals in this scenario, we are talking (at least I am) about groups

[Setanta]

an orange sash is just a strip of material

It is much more than that Actually it is mainly collarettes that are worn these days, rather then the Sash.

I know and the message is still the same

[Setanta]

an orange sash is just a strip of material

It is much more than that Actually it is mainly collarettes that are worn these days, rather then the Sash.

Just conjured up a pic of you "collarettes plus the hood over the top" aaahhh (thought you would prefer this colour)

[golach]

Of course there's always the Army Cadets, where they try to get you to join up with an official gang of international thugs and killers - but that's OK its for Queen & Country (er, and Mr Bush).

How dare you call our Servicemen "International Thugs" all my relations,myself and my two sons served in HM Forces, and we were not "Thugs" or criminals.
It galls me to see the like of you penning this spiteful bile, to try to gain some credance by jumping on this particular bandwagon.
Take a look at your former SSP leader and take him as a shining example to the youth of today. I don't think so!!! a former jailbird.
The British Armed Forces have kept this country and you and your ilk safe and sound for many many years.

[squidge]

No offence squidge but I find answering this laborious.
A hooded top worn either as a sports item so as not to get cold and cause injuries or as something just to keep an individual warm is fine. But we are not talking about individuals in this scenario, we are talking (at least I am) about groups

No offence taken Setanta After all you brought us to the crux of the matter.
halleluyah - cos it seemed to be that no one was gonna get there!!!!

What is being talked about is the intimidation of people by youngsters wearing hoods - If we are not talking about individuals - if one youngster in a hoodie isnt scary at all and two youngsters in a hoodie is not really scary either - strikes me the issue isnt hoodies at all but groups of badly behaved ill mannered and criminal kids. That has NOTHING to do with the clothes they are wearing it has to do with their behaviour.

The Eastgate Centre should emply its security staff not to stand at the doors telling kids to take down their hoods cos they assume they are all troublemakers but to break up groups of badly behaved and ill mannered young people who are - in actual fact - behaving in an inappropriate and unpleasant manner.

This hype over hoodies is absolute rubbish and has simply provided the media with a ready scapegoat and contributed to the feeling of insecurity some people have in our society today. It masks the REAL problem and it avoids the need to find a solution. It PRETENDS to do something about the problem of violence and crime in our society and actually does NOTHING at all! It is in fact a complete smoke screen, an illusion and the worst sort of nonsense

[Whitewater]

I've been having a read through this thread and have come to the conclussion that there are a lot sick people on this forum, all trying to outdo each other.

There is nothing wrong with hooded tops, whether they be attached to sweat shirts or coats, I have several and so has my partner and family. They are very practical items of clothing, and it is only good manners to take the tops down when you go indoors to do some shopping or whatever takes your fancy`

However, because of the type of garment it is, it can be very useful when somebody is up to no good and doesn't want to recognised, but that is the way of the world, it always has been and always will be as long as there are humans around. Unfortunately it is always the way that a few will spoil it for everybody else.

[squidge]

STOP PRESS

latest on the MFR news is that this is not gonna happen - the eastage Centre are not going to Ban hoodies they only ask that people do not cover their faces. Eastgate centre is apparently a little unhappy that they have been the subject of this unwarranted bit of publicity

Common sense prevails

[Rheghead]

Plus there is no practical application for a hoodie, they aren't waterproof, there is no reason for them.

Since when has one had to have a practical application for each piece of clothing?

What were stripey socks all about then? With toes in?

How practical are high heels?

mini skirts? pencil skirts? Flared trousers - all that material flapping about and getting wet?
Whats the practical application of a tie?

Hoodies are fashionable and thats the only point. They are warm and fashonable and they are simply sweatshirts

Well since the basic function of life is just to propagate the next generation, high heel shoes, mini skirts and other skimpy stuff have a very basic practical function in giving what would be normally a 'plain Jane' changing her into quite an attractive young woman...given a pint or two.

Hoodies? Nah, just useless garb, like your toed socks.

[George Brims]

Can we also ban cloth caps from old men driving cars. One of them in front of you driving down the street is more of a danger to society than any pimpley youth in a hoodie.

No no neeps old chap we mustn't ban them. They are a valuable warning signal for the rest of us. Both my own dad, when he was teaching me to drive, and my father-in-law some years later, gave me the same piece of advice - "Watch out for anybody that wears their bunnet when they're driving". Now I've travelled the world a bit, I find it applies to baseball caps, cowboys hats, and ladies' Sunday hats as well.

And you *really* have to keep clear of people who wear theiir hoodie up while they're driving, especiallly when they change lanes.

[frank ward]

Northern Constabulary, The management of Eastgate, and all the shops, have withdrawn the proposed ban on hooded tops and baseball caps.

This follows protests from the Scottish Socialist Youth organisation, who visited the parties concerned and explained that such action was unnecessary and inappropriate, and would be resisted.

The Demo has been cancelled. The first attempt within Scotland to impose such measurers has failed.

Congratulations to the Highlands SSY.

[Setanta]

The Demo has been cancelled. The first attempt within Scotland to impose such measurers has failed.

Congratulations to the Highlands SSY.

Glad to see you’re so happy that the gang type hoodie has won a victory for intimidation. It’s pretty creepy that you can’t decipher the difference between thugs and an individual. Hope the intimidated feel as gleeful as you do. I am sure my granny will be over the Moon when 3 or 4 of them come along and offer to carry her purse for her .

[squidge]

It’s pretty creepy that you can’t decipher the difference between thugs and an individual. .

Says You!!!

All teenagers wearing hoodies are not thugs its just a sweatshirt and banning them doesnt tackle the problem of thuggish behaviour

[Setanta]

It’s pretty creepy that you can’t decipher the difference between thugs and an individual. .

Says You!!!

All teenagers wearing hoodies are not thugs its just a sweatshirt and banning them doesnt tackle the problem of thuggish behaviour

The thugs cant behave that way if they are not allowed in and if you dont want to be painted with the same brush stand out from the crowd.

[luskentyre]

I don't think anyone has suggested that, just because you wear a hooded top, you are a hooligan. That's generalisation in the extreme.

I think it's a sensible precaution to deter people from wearing these items (and items LIKE this) in shopping centres etc. It's a deterrant - it would stop people who are hooligans from thinking they could get away with crime because they stand less chance of getting recognised.

I also suspect such a ban wouldn't just apply to young people, which kind of deflates the Scottish Socialists arguements.

[Rheghead]

I think it is rather poignant that the photo of the junior minister ( in the Scotsman this week) that was campaigning against hoodlums and yob behavior had a young lad making disrespectful signs behind her back. And guess what? He was wearing a hoodie...

Though your right, it is only an innocent piece of attire, but so are black shirts, brown shirts, bovva boots, green parkers, stud belts and hells angel colours.

[squidge]

Ach you know me!!!!

I have to see the individual - i cant lump people together as groups. I have met some interesting people in my life by being able to do this but i can understand that some of you are too scared or narrow minded to see past the clothes someone wears.

I look at a "black shirt" or a "brown shirt" Rheghead and hope its on a handsome man! I see "bovver boots" - heck i dont even notice peoples footwear to be frank. I wouldnt know what a bovver boot is - unless its a Doc Marten's type thing. Well my cousin used to wear nothing else i quite liked the red ones that fastened up to her knees. Passing a group of kids in hoodies hanging about where the trolleys are ourside tesco last night I said "Excuse me can i get a trolley guys" They parted and one said "that'll be three pounds please" I laughed and said "Aye nice try" and they all laughed and passed me the small trolley i wanted. It was cold and rainy last night - they had hoods up - they werent intimidating just cold and damp i would imagine.

Im gonna say this again despite the fact that it seems so obvious i cant imagine other people having difficulty with the concept.

Banning hoodies in shopping centres or in the streeet or anywhere else for that matter doesnt solve the youth thug problem that everyone thinks it represents. It simply provides a "stereotype" that can persuade people that this sort of behaviour is being confronted when actually it does nothting to stop it or change behaviour. It is a complete smoke screen a complete nonsense. Surely you can see that

[katarina]

Banning hoodies in shopping centres or in the streeet or anywhere else for that matter doesnt solve the youth thug problem that everyone thinks it represents. It simply provides a "stereotype" that can persuade people that this sort of behaviour is being confronted when actually it does nothting to stop it or change behaviour. It is a complete smoke screen a complete nonsense. Surely you can see that

I simply can't understand how some people just can't get the point. Are you saying that being able to identify a person is unimportant when a crime is committed? I haven't seen as much rubbish as this thread has generated since a long time. OF COURSE there's nothing wrong with wearing hoodies, my children do so do I, neither is there anything wrong with wearing a ski-mask at the appropriate time and place.
It is ludicrous that you are even implying that the reason behind the banning of hoods is to solve the thug problem or change behaviour. If it were only that easy! The reason is, to me obvious, so that any one - young or old, committing a crime, can be identified on security camera. Anyone with nothing to hide would have no hesitation in removing hoods when in a shopping mall. You insult the inteligence of the general public by implying that we can be persuaded that this small step is confronting the problem.
It is only one very small step forward, but I would say, a neccessary one. So you met a nice bunch of kids wearing hoods! I'm not surprised - I'm sure most of them are. however, had you not been so lucky, been knocked down and had your handbag snatched, and no onlooker could give a description or even an approx. age because of the 'fashion statement' I wonder if your opinion would have changed.