BREXIT : Legal Challenges ?

[rob murray]

read this http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politic...he-eu-36671629

JIst is that the referendum result itself is not legally binding in UK law and it alone does not trigger the UK's departure from the EU. Seemingly it is argued that legislation can only be altered by legislation.So, by extension, if a prime minister triggered Article 50 and put the UK on a one-way road out of the EU without Parliament's backing, he or she would be overriding the 1972 European Communities Act, which provides for the UK's membership of the EU and for the EU treaties to have effect in domestic law.The Article 50 process would cut across and emasculate the 1972 act, and so, the argument goes, the prime minister needs the backing of a new act of Parliament to give him of her the constitutional authority to push the Leave button.

[bekisman]

read this http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politic...he-eu-36671629

JIst is that the referendum result itself is not legally binding in UK law and it alone does not trigger the UK's departure from the EU. Seemingly it is argued that legislation can only be altered by legislation.So, by extension, if a prime minister triggered Article 50 and put the UK on a one-way road out of the EU without Parliament's backing, he or she would be overriding the 1972 European Communities Act, which provides for the UK's membership of the EU and for the EU treaties to have effect in domestic law.The Article 50 process would cut across and emasculate the 1972 act, and so, the argument goes, the prime minister needs the backing of a new act of Parliament to give him of her the constitutional authority to push the Leave button.

NO referendum is legally binding so all this lot can be ignored: (don't really think so)

• 8 March 1973: Northern Ireland – Northern Ireland sovereignty referendum on whether Northern Ireland should remain part of the United Kingdom or join the Republic of Ireland (yes to remaining part of the UK)
• 5 June 1975: UK – Membership of the European Community referendum on whether the UK should stay in the European Community (yes)
• 1 March 1979: Scotland – Scottish devolution referendum on whether there should be a Scottish Assembly (40 per cent of the electorate had to vote yes in the referendum, although a small majority voted yes this was short of the 40 per cent threshold required to enact devolution)
• 1 March 1979: Wales – Welsh devolution referendum on whether there should be a Welsh Assembly (no)
• 11 September 1997: Scotland – Scottish devolution referenda on whether there should be a Scottish Parliament and whether the Scottish Parliament should have tax varying powers (both referendums received a yes vote)
• 18 September 1997: Wales – Welsh devolution referendum on whether there should be a National Assembly for Wales (yes)
• 7 May 1998: London – Greater London Authority referendum on whether there should be a Mayor of London and Greater London Authority (yes)
• 22 May 1998: Northern Ireland – Northern Ireland Belfast Agreement referendum on the Good Friday Agreement (yes)
• 3 March 2011: Wales - Welsh devolution referendum on whether the National Assembly for Wales should gain the power to legislate on a wider range of matters (yes)
• 5 May 2011: UK – referendum on whether to change the voting system for electing MPs to the House of Commons from first past the post to the alternative vote (no, first past the post will continue to be used to elect MPs to the House of Commons)
• 18 September 2014: Scotland – referendum on whether Scotland should become an independent country (no, the electorate voted 55 per cent to 45 per cent in favour of Scotland remaining within the UK.

[rob murray]

This was on BBC News, seems that BREXIT is a lot more complicated than a lot of people think it would be if this is correct : An academic from the Institute for Government has predicted that Brexit could cause a "constitutional crisis" within the UK .Akash Paun told Holyrood's Europe committee that the Scotland Act may need to be revisited due to Brexit "cutting across" devolved areas.

Mr Paun, a fellow of the independent research group, was questioned about Scotland's future intergovernmental relationships alongside fellow academic Prof Nicola McEwen, of the Centre for Constitutional Change at Edinburgh University.
The committee has been pressing for details of how Scotland will be involved in the Brexit negotiations, with Theresa May pledging to "consult" devolved administrations but refusing to give a "running commentary" on how this will work.
Scotland's Brexit minister Mike Russell has said he expects a formal process for Scotland's input to be announced soon.

Mr Paun said the Brexit process was "likely to reopen far more elements of our internal territorial constitution than anyone has quite got their heads around yet", and warned that the legislation setting out Holyrood's powers may need to be reassessed.He said: "We may come out of this with a very different set of constitutional arrangements both for governing the distribution of powers between different governments and also in areas where the UK takes back competence from Brussels.
"We may need new arrangements for coordinating policy between the levels of government as well."I think the UK government certainly hasn't quite realised the whole box of issues that this opens up."I think it's pretty much inevitable that the design of the constitutional settlement and the Scotland Act will need to be revisited as part of this process.
"Some people have wondered if you could simply remove the reference to EU law or go for a minimal approach like that, but because of the nature of our membership of the EU winding its way through almost every area of domestic policy, by pulling out it's going to fundamentally change the individual devolution settlements and the relationship between the nations of the UK."
Prof McEwen agreed that Brexit might need primary legislation like the Scotland Act to be "looked at again".

[tonkatojo]

The sooner they debate and pass an amendment the better then, surely the Tory majority and now labour has accepted the will of the referendum and will vote for Brexit will outvote any Tory rebels and the SNP with the Irish block also the Welsh wanting to stay subservient to the EU. Or have I got my figures wrong ?. I missed out the Lib Dems on purpose as they do not count for much but a good whinge these days. And let democracy rule as it should.

[bekisman]

Must admit that even Corbyn admitted "Britain has unfortunately voted to leave the EU and we must respect those wishes" So reality IS soaking in (well with most anyway)

[rob murray]

The sooner they debate and pass an amendment the better then, surely the Tory majority and now labour has accepted the will of the referendum and will vote for Brexit will outvote any Tory rebels and the SNP with the Irish block also the Welsh wanting to stay subservient to the EU. Or have I got my figures wrong ?. I missed out the Lib Dems on purpose as they do not count for much but a good whinge these days. And let democracy rule as it should.

The gist of what the guy from the Institute for Government is saying, if he truthful and I assume he is, is that accepting BREXIT progresses, the legal work involved in dis entangling from EU is complex and will take a lengthy amount of time whilst throwing up legal and constitutional issues . As he put it "Some people have wondered if you could simply remove the reference to EU law or go for a minimal approach like that, ( ie just delete the words EU from all laws..simple eh ! ) but because of the nature of our membership of the EU winding its way through almost every area of domestic policy, by pulling out it's going to fundamentally change the individual devolution settlements and the relationship between the nations of the UK." Mr Paun said the Brexit process was "likely to reopen far more elements of our internal territorial constitution than anyone has quite got their heads around yet"

Anyway the vote was for out and its up to elected politicians and civil servants to disentangle UK from EU, but its not an easy thing to do, so expect a goodly element of time and unseen situations to pop up as no one has undertaken such a complex legal and constitutional exercise of this magnitude before.

[rob murray]

Must admit that even Corbyn admitted "Britain has unfortunately voted to leave the EU and we must respect those wishes" So reality IS soaking in (well with most anyway)

I voted to remain but leave won and thats that, everyone has to accept the outcome... thats democracy, but leaving will be a complex situation on two fronts 1 Negotiating the best deal with EU and global trade deals whilst simultaneously 2 Navigating the legal and constitutional complexities of disentangling from the EU.