Govan shipbuilders fooled by Tories and the Unionists

[dozy]

Where the govan shipbuilders (BAE) workers that voted No in the scottish referendum to save their jobs lied to by the Unionist ( better together) side. Answers on a postcard to Ruth Davidson,Wullie Rennie and
Cess Dugdale of the " your all mugs" party.

[bekisman]

"The Scottish Conservative leader Ruth Davidson, however, said she had been given assurances by Defence Secretary Michael Fallon that nothing had changed.

She said: "He confirmed there had been no change to the orders that were set out in the Strategic Defence and Security Review last year.
"That means all eight Type 26 anti-submarine frigates that are coming, plus the light frigate order on top of that, and the two offshore patrol vessels. They are coming to the Clyde, as discussed last year, to the same timetable and the same number."
Think what would have happened IF it had been a YES for goodness sake, trying to find £15,000,000 to fill a black hole, would have been really bad

[caltonjock]

Fallon's word is not to be trusted. The contract would have been awarded to Scottish shipbuilders regardless of the outcome of the referendum. With a "Yes" vote the final split taking Scotland out of the Union would have taken a few years to complete. Discussions would be wide ranging in the negotiating period and Westminster would avoid taking any action which might be seen to be aggressive. An important agenda would be centred on Scotland's role in NATO and in this respect Westminster would be guided by instructions from the USA.. Scotland is best strategically placed of all members of NATO and every effort would be made to ensure Scotland remained on-side.

[bekisman]

"The contract would have been awarded to Scottish shipbuilders regardless of the outcome of the referendum" you're dreaming lad

[Manxman]

Great it looks like we will be building these ships and boats but the next question is WHERE DOES THE STEEL COME FROM

[caltonjock]

26 April: Manxman said: Great it looks like we will be building these ships and boats but the next question is WHERE DOES THE STEEL COME FROM

If the EU signs up to the TTIP agreement the steel will come from the USA

[dozy]

26 April: Manxman said: Great it looks like we will be building these ships and boats but the next question is WHERE DOES THE STEEL COME FROM

If the EU signs up to the TTIP agreement the steel will come from the USA

the brittish government go on about the Trident replacement ,but this can't happen as the steels used are secret. The casing and the pressure vessel use different steels which are MOD only . I agree with you if you don't make steel how will you make anything. Obama is hellbent on TTIP which will make Britain. The 51 state of American ,the unionists said that an independent Scotland could not use the pound but TTIP will have us all using dollars . So who's side are these so called unionists on.

[rob murray]

26 April: Manxman said: Great it looks like we will be building these ships and boats but the next question is WHERE DOES THE STEEL COME FROM

If the EU signs up to the TTIP agreement the steel will come from the USA

IM confused your party shout for indy2 if there is a Brexit, so implying we go indy and join EU, but you say thats where the steel will come from, so why stay in / why the pretence of indy2 if Brexit happens ??

[rob murray]

the brittish government go on about the Trident replacement ,but this can't happen as the steels used are secret. The casing and the pressure vessel use different steels which are MOD only . I agree with you if you don't make steel how will you make anything. Obama is hellbent on TTIP which will make Britain. The 51 state of American ,the unionists said that an independent Scotland could not use the pound but TTIP will have us all using dollars . So who's side are these so called unionists on.

TTIP will make the entire EU part of the US not just the UK. Hence Obahmas stark warning over Brexit last week, stay in or go to back of line. TTIP will involve the creation of a super state involving the US and EU and the US will call all shots. The Euro will be maintained but essentail TTIP will erode / ride over lots of EU legislation TTIP is about reducing the regulatory barriers to trade for big business, things like food safety law, environmental legislation, banking regulations and the sovereign powers of individual nations. It is, as John Hilary, Executive Director of campaign group War on Want, said: “An assault on European and US societies by transnational corporations.” : worst scenario under TTIP is Investor-State Dispute Settlements (ISDS), which allow companies to sue governments if those governments’ policies cause a loss of profits. In effect it means unelected transnational corporations can dictate the policies of democratically elected governments ie primarliy corporation tax rates.. And all of this has been discussed in secret by unelected EU offcials and the US. SO why would the SNP, if they get the majority indy vote in a referendum, if UK leaves EU . want to join the EU ?

[caltonjock]

This is interesting

https://www.facebook.com/peoplepower...480788/?type=3

[rob murray]

This is interesting

https://www.facebook.com/peoplepower...480788/?type=3

Yes very very interesting, take a look at http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/...u-9779688.html with this TTIP caper, BREXIT looks like best option, why would an independant Scotland want to join the EU and suffer US / EU intrusion, surely nats can stop the demands for indy2 if UK votes to leave EU ? Scotland would be swallowed up chewed up an spat out !! INdy2 should be held on basis of NOT joining EU, ie create a Norwagein type model, any one out there got any thoughts on this

[caltonjock]

I agree with yourself that BREXIT presents the best option for the future of an independent Scotland.

[bekisman]

"As is the norm the Labour Party is on the hunt, making mischief, blaming the Tory government for all the ills that society is suffering" Hmm who wrote that I wonder? (Starts with c and ends in k)

[Rheghead]

"As is the norm the Labour Party is on the hunt, making mischief, blaming the Tory government for all the ills that society is suffering" Hmm who wrote that I wonder? (Starts with c and ends in k)

Ahem... just to remind you of an Inconvenient Truth. doesn't the Tory government continue to blame the last Labour government for the banking crisis and the rising debt? Gordon Brown gathered cross-party agreement to deal with his strategy to tackle it notwithstanding.

[Oddquine]

I agree with yourself that BREXIT presents the best option for the future of an independent Scotland.

As someone who voted to come out in 1975, I'm inclined to agree with you.....but it should be our decision, not that of the English electorate...once we have seen how the EU will work for us, when we can do our own negotiations to suit our own priorities. We can't judge on how well or badly it works for us currently under Westminster control.

Anyway, I'm pretty sure that there will be some party standing in an independent Scotland with a referendum (a Scexit, maybe?) in its manifesto, if not immediately, then after a time, just as I would expect some party to be having republicanism os an option. Independence would only be the start of the journey, not the end-point.

[rob murray]

As someone who voted to come out in 1975, I'm inclined to agree with you.....but it should be our decision, not that of the English electorate...once we have seen how the EU will work for us, when we can do our own negotiations to suit our own priorities. We can't judge on how well or badly it works for us currently under Westminster control.

Anyway, I'm pretty sure that there will be some party standing in an independent Scotland with a referendum (a Scexit, maybe?) in its manifesto, if not immediately, then after a time, just as I would expect some party to be having republicanism os an option. Independence would only be the start of the journey, not the end-point.

an indy republic is RISE's central demand

[Oddquine]

an indy republic is RISE's central demand

RISE does a lot of demanding, I've noticed on FB, for a party which is going to be lucky to have more MSPs than Scotland has pandas after Thursday. I have a feeling the Greens want a republic as well, though.

If we can find someone with gravitas and charisma, who is not a current or past member of any parliament, has never been involved in bank-rolling or lobbying politicians for influence, has never appeared on a reality TV show, hasn't been to a private school, or Oxbridge, isn't a "celebrity", isn't a millionaire......and has to be begged to stand as opposed to clamouring to be a candidate.......I am not overly bothered. Don't see why we can't just choose one of the Royals as president....there are loads of them to choose from..and at least they know what is expected from them.

[bekisman]

Often wondered why the shipyards on the Clyde are not fining work from outside the UK? I know it's not nice to point out, but surely this (possible) delay in Navy orders, gives a bloody good insight into what it would be like IF Scotland had left UK?

[caltonjock]

The Clyde is staved of commercial shipbuilding because the MOD insist on vetting all shipbuilding contracts before they are signed off. If the MOD decides national security is at risk the veto the deal. This is the primary cause of the demise of passenger, containers on the Clyde.