Sturgeon backtracks over room in her home for refugees

[squidge]

There was a great wee programme on Radio 4 last week that I was listening to as I was travelling. It compared the situation now to the situation in the 70s with the Vietnamese Boat people speaking to those involved then and now. I'll try and find the link it was really interesting and thought provoking.

[rob murray]

There was a great wee programme on Radio 4 last week that I was listening to as I was travelling. It compared the situation now to the situation in the 70s with the Vietnamese Boat people speaking to those involved then and now. I'll try and find the link it was really interesting and thought provoking.

Thanks apppreciate it.......without prejudging, things were a lot different in the 70's....on many levels....and of course we had the Ugandan Asian crisis in early 70's as well.

[BetterTogether]

Seems like we are now beginning to see a bury your head in the sand and ignore the problems approach being taken. From one source it comes as no surprise because it doesn't fit with their political agenda, the other maybe it doesn't count, they don't care or its just a bit awkward to deal with. I shall provide a link for viewing.


http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/65...-rape-germanyA


There major differences between Vietnamese Boat people and Middle Eastern Refugees is the cultural differences, you may not like it or want to label differently but there is a vast world of difference between the cultures, religions and ethics of Vietnam and those of the Middle East.

[squidge]

This is it Rob. It looks at what we did and draws comparisons but it does recognise differences.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b06bng2x

The Long View

Vietnamese refugees in 1979

Johnathon Freedland compares Britain's response to refugees from Vietnam in the 1970s with our reaction to refugees from Syria today.Thousands of Vietnamese refugees came to the UK from 1979, were placed in camps and then dispersed around the country.

Jonathan and his guests ask how well Britain met the needs of those Vietnamese refugees, how they and their children adapted to life in the UK and what their experience tells us about today's refugee crisis.Producer Julia Johnson.

[BetterTogether]

More silence on the major differences .........

[rob murray]

You're changing the debate Rob as is Squidge you're now discussing how we can take more by sorting out infrastructure but you've yet to address the serious issues which are occurring within the refugee camps currently.

Misogyny , rape, sexual abuse of women and children, forced prostitution, Violence.

Unless you address those very serious issues are you tacitly saying it's all ok as long as we've sorted out the infrastructure before hand.

I fully accept Squidge will play her usual ignore tactic because it's easier to pretend not to see posts that way you can't be pulled into dealing with the uncomfortable issues surrounding the issue but you sir have no excuse.

Are these men the sort you want in this country, men who consider women second class citizens, men who do not respect western liberal values, men who consider a woman not dressed in a Niqab and wearing a short skirt as sexually available for his own pleasure.
Instead of blathering about housing and infrastructure deal with the harsh realities.

Germany is now struggling with these issues but you two seem to prefer to not see the issue and just keep waving them in.

IM not waving anyone in, nor changing any debate, I was merely pointing out from the off that detailed planned was required, not emotive hot air, and the impact upon available services on the premise that however its done, "properly screened asylum seekers" come. I made the point several times that any intakes have to be dispersed to prevent ghettos and non intergration as CPT DODGER has illustrated. Of courses IM not as you say ignoring very serious issues which you state : rape, sexual abuse of women and children, forced prostitution, Violence....who the hell would want those types. ARe you saying that 100% of "asylum" seekers behave like this.....????

[cptdodger]

ARe you saying that 100% of "asylum" seekers behave like this.....????

Trust me Rob, it doesn't have to be 100% of them behaving like that to alter your way of life. I am sure where I lived they were not all like that, but enough were.

[BetterTogether]

You need to do some research in the refugee camps Rob and Middle Eastern attitudes toward women. Then come back to the debate a bit more informed. Getting dragged into a debate on allowing large groups of men into country without knowing much about their culture, religion, views on life is a dangerous place to be.

Squidge bless her has never been to the region hasn't a clue about the culture or attitudes prevelant in the area and closest she gets is reading an article somewhere. First hand knowledge for her is zero.

[squidge]

The refugee council and the UN state quite clearly that the way to avoid the sexual abuse of women refugees is to ensure that genuine refugees are assimilated into communities as soon as possible and not left to languish in transit or refugee camps for years on end.

It appears that the all refugees are closet terrorists wasn't scary enough so we have moved on to all refugees are potential rapists to see if that does the trick.

The way to ensure that refugee camps are not turned into hotbeds of criminal behaviour is to develop a system of safe routes, allocations, screening to ensure that people are moved through and onto safety as soon as possible.

[rob murray]

You need to do some research in the refugee camps Rob and Middle Eastern attitudes toward women. Then come back to the debate a bit more informed. Getting dragged into a debate on allowing large groups of men into country without knowing much about their culture, religion, views on life is a dangerous place to be.

AGreed......but in my defense I admit that I aint that clued up on the middle east and geo politics and present developments in Syria, I do rely on folk like your self for information but can you not see my basic point, lets say we allowed only women and young children into UK...whats the plan....where the details.....or lets say we were dealing with another Ugandan Asian cirsis wheres the planning....loads of emotive hot air as far as I can see.

[rob murray]

Trust me Rob, it doesn't have to be 100% of them behaving like that to alter your way of life. I am sure where I lived they were not all like that, but enough were.

OK, I dont know enough of this situation so will bow out now, I accpet what your saying, but have never expereinced it first hand, never having lived anywhere but the North

[cptdodger]

The refugee council and the UN state quite clearly that the way to avoid the sexual abuse of women refugees is to ensure that genuine refugees are assimilated into communities as soon as possible and not left to languish in transit or refugee camps for years on end.

But it didn't make any difference, as far as I know we had genuine refugees, but they themselves did not assimilate into communities. That was their choice. You can take them out of their Country, but you cannot take their Country and their believes out of them, they were as much enemies in Britain as they were in Yugoslavia. They are not suddenly going to conform to the British way of life because we feel they have been given a second chance so they should.

[BetterTogether]

The refugee council and the UN state quite clearly that the way to avoid the sexual abuse of women refugees is to ensure that genuine refugees are assimilated into communities as soon as possible and not left to languish in transit or refugee camps for years on end.

Why is it they need to be integrated into European countries or is segragation within the camps not acceptable as a first case scenario, single men one area, women and children another, couples another. The reality is they need to be able to return to their own countries safely not reintegrated into other countries.

It appears that the all refugees are closet terrorists wasn't scary enough so we have moved on to all refugees are potential rapists to see if that does the trick.

Not all refugees are terrorists that's plain simple trying to denigrate the argument that within the large mass of people will be terrorists using it as a means to enter Europe. There is a significant problem within the camps of ramp and sexual abuse to deny that is to deny that real problems exsist. It's never all people but the fact it's a significant problem and you choose to try ignore it and fast track those people to this country.

The way to ensure that refugee camps are not turned into hotbeds of criminal behaviour is to develop a system of safe routes, allocations, screening to ensure that people are moved through and onto safety as soon as possible.

The way to ensure this country doesn't become a hotbed for for refugee criminal behaviour is to ensure that all refugees are brought into the country via official camps and vetted before entry, not just allow anyone able to walk to the borders entry.

[BetterTogether]

So with all the fine words so far I'm wondering why the SNP haven't fully entered into the gateway scheme.http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/608...ehoming-scheme

[cptdodger]

And on that same link - http://www.express.co.uk/comment/exp...596.1443465420

This is what I was talking about, and before anybody says it's this newspaper or that newspaper, my daughter was affected by this twenty seven years ago, and it's only going to get worse, not better.

[Fulmar]

It is worth bearing in mind that the Syrian people whom David Cameron wish to see given priority for admittance to the UK are women (including those who have suffered sexual violence) and vulnerable (often un-accompanied) children and young families in general.
I abhor the criminal and sexual violence that is reportedly taking place in some of the camps but I do not see that as a reason not to help people who are refugees and I think that for once, the UK government is correct to concentrate on the people it has identified as priority for coming here.
Interestingly, only a day or two ago on Radio 4's Today programme, there was a feature about a family that were among the first to be admitted (in the last 12 months), a disabled father ( a teacher, I think) and his wife and two kids. They are settled and living in Bradford and happy to be away from war and violence and their destroyed house and that their two kids are enjoying attending primary school and no longer in fear of bombs raining down upon them, night and day. Both parents were looking forward to one day being able to return to Syria and hoping that there would be external help to rid the country not only of the government but also those whom they described as 'foreigners' - I guess they meant IS.

[gingernut]

Seems like we are now beginning to see a bury your head in the sand and ignore the problems approach being taken. From one source it comes as no surprise because it doesn't fit with their political agenda, the other maybe it doesn't count, they don't care or its just a bit awkward to deal with. I shall provide a link for viewing.


http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/65...-rape-germanyA


There major differences between Vietnamese Boat people and Middle Eastern Refugees is the cultural differences, you may not like it or want to label differently but there is a vast world of difference between the cultures, religions and ethics of Vietnam and those of the Middle East.

Here's another source of information about the problem of rape in Sweden largely linked to the increased immigration
http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/5195/sweden-rape
The Swedish authorities have been keeping such information under wraps and it's only recently that the extent of the problem is emerging.

[cptdodger]

It is worth bearing in mind that the Syrian people whom David Cameron wish to see given priority for admittance to the UK are women (including those who have suffered sexual violence) and vulnerable (often un-accompanied) children and young families in general.
I abhor the criminal and sexual violence that is reportedly taking place in some of the camps but I do not see that as a reason not to help people who are refugees and I think that for once, the UK government is correct to concentrate on the people it has identified as priority for coming here.
Interestingly, only a day or two ago on Radio 4's Today programme, there was a feature about a family that were among the first to be admitted (in the last 12 months), a disabled father ( a teacher, I think) and his wife and two kids. They are settled and living in Bradford and happy to be away from war and violence and their destroyed house and that their two kids are enjoying attending primary school and no longer in fear of bombs raining down upon them, night and day. Both parents were looking forward to one day being able to return to Syria and hoping that there would be external help to rid the country not only of the government but also those whom they described as 'foreigners' - I guess they meant IS.

On BBC1 Scotland now (9pm) The Food Bank : Scotland's Hidden Hunger.

When are you going to start prioritizing and caring about people in our Country?

[BetterTogether]

It is worth bearing in mind that the Syrian people whom David Cameron wish to see given priority for admittance to the UK are women (including those who have suffered sexual violence) and vulnerable (often un-accompanied) children and young families in general.I abhor the criminal and sexual violence that is reportedly taking place in some of the camps but I do not see that as a reason not to help people who are refugees and I think that for once, the UK government is correct to concentrate on the people it has identified as priority for coming here.Interestingly, only a day or two ago on Radio 4's Today programme, there was a feature about a family that were among the first to be admitted (in the last 12 months), a disabled father ( a teacher, I think) and his wife and two kids. They are settled and living in Bradford and happy to be away from war and violence and their destroyed house and that their two kids are enjoying attending primary school and no longer in fear of bombs raining down upon them, night and day. Both parents were looking forward to one day being able to return to Syria and hoping that there would be external help to rid the country not only of the government but also those whom they described as 'foreigners' - I guess they meant IS.

Doesn't really surprise me they are happy in Bradford have you actually been there ? I'd say it's almost like a home from home for them. Minus the bombs and shootings at the moment !

[Fulmar]

Yes, I have been there- I worked in Leeds for 3 years and that (as you probably know), is not a million miles away. We also have family living in and around Rotherham- and they always have done and quite happy there.
In answer to CPT, I try to do this each and every day- mainly by giving to the food bank and through my church in its outreach work. What do you do to help?