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Thread: New Thurso Hotel and Public Park Plan and the Present Local Plan Review

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
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    2,244

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    Is anyone legally entitled to a view of the sea?

    Without a hotel in it!

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
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    240

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    Quote Originally Posted by Raymond Taylor View Post
    The Sequential test that was carried out for the ASDA/Retail site identified the site to the west of Pennyland House as the 2nd best site for a retail project several years ago. That site and the Mart site were the only ones available. This is still the case. The site I propose is the only site that would be beneficial to the project and the town centre. Any further from the town centre is too far. I know this from experience.Yes the Mart site if you had £3.7m to pay Tesco what they bought it for would secure you a Travelodge or Premier Inn site. Not what you would call a quality site for attracting the type of long term quality tourist, weddings, conferences etc that I have identified. I also own the site I propose to build on which makes the project much more viable and deliverable.
    I wish you the best of luck. It is a great idea for Thurso and desperately needed. Well done to you for wanting to do something so worthwhile and for putting yourself on here to answer the nay sayers (of which there will no doubt be many).

  3. #23

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    I agree with a point made earlier, there has been nothing done in this county for far too many years to encourage the tourist trade. There is nothing for tourists to do, even niche markets such as bird-watchers and ramblers are not catered for although there would be plenty of opportunity for these groups. Caithness does indeed have huge archaeological potential but has not even had a county archaeologist for a number of years due to cutbacks. This county has been left with the 'security' of Dounreay and now the closure is rapidly approaching there is nothing in place to keep or bring people here.

    In honesty I think the hotel and park would be a lovely idea if there was the tourism infrastructure around to support it. Until there is a significant investment to improve this and a significant attitude change in order to accommodate such a change in direction in the community there are enough stop-over places for those who pass through on their way to other places.

    I also don't have an answer to the conundrum. Without investment the tourist gaze will forever be elsewhere, looking at Caithness as nothing more than a stop-over point to other places, the hotel industry won't want to invest hugely in their premises without the tourists to stay for more than a night or two and the local community won't cater to the wants and needs of tourists when they know that these people will only be moving on thus causing tourists to have their gaze on other places as there is nothing to keep them in the local area. It's a vicious circle but I honestly don't think the building of this facility would be enough to change it.

  4. #24

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    Banshee, Could I ask you what you allude to when you mentioned tourism infrastructure?

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    240

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    Quote Originally Posted by Banshee View Post
    I agree with a point made earlier, there has been nothing done in this county for far too many years to encourage the tourist trade. There is nothing for tourists to do, even niche markets such as bird-watchers and ramblers are not catered for although there would be plenty of opportunity for these groups. Caithness does indeed have huge archaeological potential but has not even had a county archaeologist for a number of years due to cutbacks. This county has been left with the 'security' of Dounreay and now the closure is rapidly approaching there is nothing in place to keep or bring people here.

    In honesty I think the hotel and park would be a lovely idea if there was the tourism infrastructure around to support it. Until there is a significant investment to improve this and a significant attitude change in order to accommodate such a change in direction in the community there are enough stop-over places for those who pass through on their way to other places.

    I also don't have an answer to the conundrum. Without investment the tourist gaze will forever be elsewhere, looking at Caithness as nothing more than a stop-over point to other places, the hotel industry won't want to invest hugely in their premises without the tourists to stay for more than a night or two and the local community won't cater to the wants and needs of tourists when they know that these people will only be moving on thus causing tourists to have their gaze on other places as there is nothing to keep them in the local area. It's a vicious circle but I honestly don't think the building of this facility would be enough to change it.
    Having worked in the the hotel trade for many years, with some of those in Caithness and Thurso, I fully agree that more accommodation is needed. The bigger hotels are filled with coach parties visiting the County and Orkney, which leaves a famine of accommodation. In addition a lot of the big hotel with function facilities like the Weigh Inn are extremely busy with large wedding parties which book them out.

    Thurso is desperately in need of a large hotel to fill that gap. I am also sure a lot of year round contracts could be tied up to provide accommodation to businesses. In order to get tourists to visit there must be somewhere for them to stay. Even if they do not stay in the area and are just passing through they are still spending money in the area, through basics at shops, food, fuel, hotel accommodation and business to Scrabster for their trip to Orkney.

    Raymond seems confident that he can secure the business the hotel would need, which I fully agree is there, as well as creating much needed jobs and regeneration in the area.

  6. #26

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    surly any new development is better than none good luck with your new venture

  7. #27

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    Do you have any artists impressions of what the development would look like? If plans are passed do you have any plans for archaeology assessment to be carried out on the site?

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
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    2,245

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    I think this would be a great development for the town, and would support it in principle.

    Although I realise this is only for a change to the local plan, I'd like to think any detailed planning permission ensured the hotel itself was closer to the road than the cliffs. I personally wouldn't want the hotel building to back right onto the Victoria walk as is shown in the article.

    I would also like to see more detailed plans for the "public park". Although I realise this is a "sweetener" for the hotel development, I wonder what form it would take? Being realistic, the landscaping would have to be carefully done, any trees aren't going to last very long there! The grassy playing field to the other side of the caravan park is already very under used. Would the people of the town really benefit from a large open field area? Or would a more specific/structured area be better - racketball/basketball court or such?
    Patriotism is when love of your own people comes first; Nationalism, when hate for people other than your own comes first.

    - Charles de Gaulle

  9. #29

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    I went to the Visit Scotland site for Thurso to have a look at what they say there is for tourists to do.

    The most northerly town in mainland Scotland, Thurso is a great base for exploring the surrounding countryside.

    There’s plenty to see and do in and around the delightful town of Thurso. The town is a hive of lovely traditional shops, cafes, bars and restaurants. Other great ‘must-sees’ are the circular wellhouse of Meadow Well, a fine public library and the impressive Janet Street overlooking the River Thurso close to Thurso Bridge. Check out the Swanson Gallery which hosts year round exhibitions of fine artwork, or discover the magical world of Glass Creations by artist Ian Pearson. Caithness Horizons is also well worth a visit with fascinating museum exhibits and a changing annual gallery programme.

    Thurso is also a major surfing area and a premier heavy cold surf destination which hosts surfing championships, including two World Championships for Kayak surfing. The plentiful reefs, points, river mouths and beaches, on top of the consistent year-round surfing opportunities, make the location a paradise for watersports lovers.

    West of Thurso is the Dounreay nuclear power station and its story is explained in an exhibition within the Caithness Horizons visitor centre. The dramatic north coast stretches away to the west, while inland is the vast area of blanket bog known as the ‘Flow Country’. http://www.visitscotland.com/info/towns-villages/thurso-p243991

    That's the information given. To mention the Meadow Well is a farce, it's a stone building with dim lighting and a hard to read sign in the middle of it. The surfers aren't even catered to very well since the permission to have a building erected with showers etc down at Thurso East has been turned down. This would have been a great selling point for the internationally renowned surfing Thurso has. No-one can deny that we do have excellent beaches but there is only a limited period in which all but the hardy local would venture down there for leisure time!

    Caithness Horizons has had some excellent programmes on, the Ancient Ancestors festival was brilliant but there needs to be more of these things and run by other people to encourage diversity and depth of things to do for all ages. There is nothing for children to do in the area so families are not catered to very well. We have an excellent music scene, including the folk music on every Wednesday night at the Commercial Bar, but there is very little to showcase it especially with the B-fest having been cancelled. Also where's the mention of Northern Nashville which has attracted people from across the world?

    There are limited leisure facilities, the small local pools with attached gym along with two local riding schools - neither of which having an indoor school for poor weather riding. Someone has been trying to bring about a soft-play area for children but is struggling.

    With more things for tourists, especially families to do in the local area the tourism infrastructure would be robust enough to have a good selection of hotels that will cater to more than just the travel-through traffic. I honestly really hope you get to build it and it works for you Raymond but I think more needs to be done in the wider community to help support you. I am hoping to come along to your open day tomorrow and would love to talk to you more about it then if I could, the forum is great but it doesn't beat a good conversation!

  10. #30

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    In reply to the last two comments and the points raised. At this stage in the planning process an Archaeology report does not need to be done, it will have to be carried out if we come to a detailed application.

    I am only looking for the site to be included in the local plan for tourism and leisure purposes at present. The detail stage will also include the final siting of the building structures, the physical size of these and many other details. Also community benefit and park, what would be included there etc etc. It is a hugely detailed process and public opinion and wishes on all aspects are taken into consideration by not only me but the Highland Council planning officials and councillors.

    As for artist impressions, the drawings I have had done were expensive enough at this stage. No one before has mentioned the building should be further back on the site, so not sure how to answer that one except in the negative. What I can say on the siting, taking comments on board here and on Facebook these past days, swapping the lodges and the hotel round putting the hotel slightly further west will be considered. My only fear on this point is the need to be as close to the town as possible.

  11. #31

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    See you tomorrow Banshee and many others I hope. 3pm-8pm at Caithness Horizons

  12. #32

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    Thank you so much for all the information tonight. You certainly set my mind at ease. I'll be keeping my fingers crossed now!

  13. #33

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    Thanks Banshee it was got to chat to folk yesterday. Just a quick follow up from the open day and the feeling I am getting. Seems to me on social media and yesterday there is around 85% support for my tourism and leisure projects on the site I would like to develop. TS18 as described in the Highland Council Main Issues Report (MIR). The main concern raised yesterday was surprisingly the delivery time.

    Folk were amazed when I told them the best I could do even with a fair wind was open the doors in around 5 years. The process is now this... If supportive we need the Highland Council planners to add TS18 to the MIR for tourism and leisure purposes. Then "IF" they decide to add it the final plan this will be published in 18 months. The final MIR then needs to go to the Scottish Office Reporter who will take a year to decide "IF" he/she agrees with the planning officials. Same type of thing happened with the Mart v Pennyland ASDA decision. The reporter can torpedo the whole thing.

    The project which can only be planned in detail once I know I have a green light will take 8 months to design and up to 18 months to complete.The process is that laborious and complex.

    Bought the Royal in 1979, identified the need for a new hotel around 1984, bought Pennyland Farm for the hotel site in 1987, won approval locally for project in 1992, decision turned over in Inverness a few months later.It is now 2015. Sort of depressing really when I know what it would have meant to the town over the past 20 years. Glad I'm still sane, just!
    Last edited by Raymond Taylor; 14-Jan-15 at 11:35.

  14. #34
    Join Date
    May 2013
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    A place near by
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    I have to say that I was pretty impressed with the presentation I was a bit skeptical before seeing and hearing about the plans. It was nice to see someone actually wanting something of high quality in Thurso. I suspect the biggest hurdle will be Inverness!

  15. #35

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    Best of luck, this could be very good for the town. I feel a little embarrassed when I have to accommodate guests in Thurso's increasingly shabby existing hotel stock.

  16. #36

    Default Just what Thurso needs

    Best of luck Raymond this is what Thurso needs only hope all our councillors support you and we dont end up with the Asda situation where the majority of the town wanted it but it was thrown out by a single vote.

  17. #37

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    Not sure what Mr Taylor thinks his hotel is going to offer to stop people wanting to go to Orkney.Is he going to be doing something more for the tourist than just accommodation for his own profit?As if he puts them in accommodation with that beautiful view I am sure they will ask wat the island is and will want to visit it.Would it not have been better to have bought the Pentland with no view of where you don't want people to go.I am sure Mr Taylor also is aware on the Asda etc housing requirements there are other sites available around town not just his or Tescos

  18. #38
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    240

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    Quote Originally Posted by mini one View Post
    Not sure what Mr Taylor thinks his hotel is going to offer to stop people wanting to go to Orkney.Is he going to be doing something more for the tourist than just accommodation for his own profit?As if he puts them in accommodation with that beautiful view I am sure they will ask wat the island is and will want to visit it.Would it not have been better to have bought the Pentland with no view of where you don't want people to go.I am sure Mr Taylor also is aware on the Asda etc housing requirements there are other sites available around town not just his or Tescos
    I for one would welcome any money to the town, even if it is as a stop off to Orkney. When people stay in a nice hotel, with a beautiful view it showcases a lot more of the county than staying in one of the current hotels which is badly in need of refurb and upgrade. Seems like some sour grapes there Mini One!

    Who in their right mind would want to have a hotel that doesn't make money? Would be a little pointless. Do you think the current hotel owners (many of which are multi site companies and not private) in the town don't spend money to upgrade their hotels for the public good? No, it's to suit their bank balance.

    This is something Thurso should be extremely proud of, and any extra overnight visitors to the town will undoubtedly benefit the many.

  19. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by mini one View Post
    Not sure what Mr Taylor thinks his hotel is going to offer to stop people wanting to go to Orkney.Is he going to be doing something more for the tourist than just accommodation for his own profit?As if he puts them in accommodation with that beautiful view I am sure they will ask wat the island is and will want to visit it.Would it not have been better to have bought the Pentland with no view of where you don't want people to go.I am sure Mr Taylor also is aware on the Asda etc housing requirements there are other sites available around town not just his or Tescos
    Had you lost your password for the past few years? I only ask as your previous post was "18-Sep-11"

    It seems strange to come out of retirement just to take a dump on someone's attempt to bring a bit of life to the county...





  20. #40
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
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    very close almost touching
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    Good luck to him and anything that improves a town is welcome with me

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