Wick Roundabout

[IgnorantWeeker]

Rheg and Z, As a Caithneasian driver having just returned from another drive through Edinburgh this weekend, I take it you are going to tell me that all the manouvers i saw without indicators was being done by fellow Caithness drivers and not the Oh so correct southeners! Likewise it was someone returning home to this side of the Ord that was tootling along taking in the sights at 30mph between Perth and Inv,resulting in the 50 car tailback

[George Brims]

Comments from someone who learned to drive in Caithness (on a Massey Ferguson tractor!), moved to the south, and then fled the country and lives iin the USA now.

True enough as IgnorantWeeekr says, there are bad drivers everywhere. It's just the style of bad that changes. Worst thing in Caithness is people that still think the only thing liable to hit them is a horse and cart, so they will (for example) do a U-turn *out of a parking space* with traffic approaching in both directions, and always enter main roads without stopping even though other people are approaching them at 60+mph. Interestingly, ' went all the way around the worls and they drive just the same in Hawaii!
Last time I was over, I folowed a mannie in an old car across the Black Isle coming north. He was tootling along about 5 mph below the speed limit, but every time we passed a "speed cameras operating" sign, he would brake hard to another 10mph slower, then gradually pick up speed again until the next sign. As for roundabouts, I know at least one driver that never coped with them right until he had whatever refresher test you get when you hit 70, and was afterwards impeccable.

Doon Sooth they are just too damn aggressive. The honking when you don't take off like a Formula 1 car a split second before the green light is especially annoying. And never get in the wrong lane, as no-one will ever give you a chance to change. Worst of all from my point of view was the way they treat cyclists - basically driving as if the cyclist doesn't exist.

Now US drivers have their faults too - tailgating on the freeway is the most dangerous. Another one that drives me mad is swinging out to the left before making a right turn, and generally making turns far too wide - like brand new learners feart to be too aggressive with the wheel.

DrSzin may be interested to know that the US 4 way stop is being replaced now, at least for a few trials, with roundabouts! I would love to see what would happen if British drivers were given the 4 way stop in exchange. My bet would be a deadlock with cars nose to nose in the middle and the drivers out on top of the road fighting.

The things that scare me, and I've only seen them in pictures, are those huge roundabouts with smaller satellite roundabouts (that rotate in the opposite direction!?) surrounding them. If I come over to the UK and am faced with one of those right after I drive out of the airport I am going to get in big trouble!

[Rheghead]

Rheg and Z, As a Caithneasian driver having just returned from another drive through Edinburgh this weekend, I take it you are going to tell me that all the manouvers i saw without indicators was being done by fellow Caithness drivers

Not at all, but it could be a possibility. As I said, my comment WAS a sweeping statement but I maintain that driving standards are poor up here. As a Caithnessian driver yourself, you are probably unaware that it is not imperative to signal at every approach to a roundabout. However, practice makes perfect and since the lack of roundabouts in Caithness, I am not surprised at the lack of courtesy on the roads up here.

and not the Oh so correct southeners!

A jackass biggotted comment.

Likewise it was someone returning home to this side of the Ord that was tootling along taking in the sights at 30mph between Perth and Inv,resulting in the 50 car tailback

Say no more. Your signature says it all

[Rheghead]

DrSzin may be interested to know that the US 4 way stop is being replaced now, at least for a few trials, with roundabouts!

I think it was an american that invented the roundabout.

[IgnorantWeeker]

Having witnessed an area in Miami, trialing roundabouts as Gearge mentioned i have to say that it makes the happenings at the foot of the cliff and the service bridge look like heaven. But the best thing about the stop system is that it is enforcable by fines which makes the Yanks respect them! though like many junctions here they are just OTT having to do a propper stop and takes some control from the driver.

But the worst has to be in NZ, having to give way to someone turning right across you if there is nothing behind you!

[DrSzin]

Having witnessed an area in Miami, trialing roundabouts as Gearge mentioned i have to say that it makes the happenings at the foot of the cliff and the service bridge look like heaven. But the best thing about the stop system is that it is enforcable by fines which makes the Yanks respect them! though like many junctions here they are just OTT having to do a propper stop and takes some control from the driver.

I know about the introduction of roundabouts in the US: I got the shock of my life when I came across one in Miami a couple of weeks ago. Somewhat surprisingly, it was working well: everyone was obeying the rules and traffic was flowing smoothly.

Four-way stops only work efficiently when the (average) volume of traffic is not too high, so perhaps the junction at the end of Bridge Street would be ideal. The US ones are indeed enforced by fines, and you have to work hard to avoid getting a ticket if you are caught crawling over the white line without stopping. I was once pulled up by the local cops for not coming to a complete stop, but I managed to convince them that I was an ignorant (but extremely polite and repentant) foreigner. I had only just passed my test, and my temporary CA driver's license was partially-hidden inside my UK licence; I think the cop only looked at the latter, and he let me off with a stern warning. Phew!

Edinburgh may have lots of roundabouts, but the natives don't always signal properly. When turning right at a roundabout, many don't signal right until they are more than half-way round -- when they should be signalling left!

An unwritten Edinburgh rule is: if there are two lanes on any road, you must drive in the right one; this is particularly the case if you are driving slowly, if there are no parked cars, and if there is a long line of traffic behind you. Whatever you do, don't drive in the left lane or folk will think you're a Weegie.

It's different in Glasgow: if there are two lanes, with lots of parked cars, then you drive in the left lane as much as you can, but you must obviously switch lanes in order to avoid each and every parked car -- you mustn't stay in the right lane or folk will think you're an Edin.

There are good and bad drivers everywhere. The funny thing is -- it's always someone else that's the bad one.

[MadPict]

Get your head around this one!!!

Rheghead - I do believe the very first roundabout was constructed in the UK. There was an item on the local news recently about it. It is nothing special - just a plain roundabout with some grass and bushes on it - but definately quoted as being the very first roundabout.

[Rheghead]

I know that they were first introduced here in GB, but they are an American idea though not introducd there until recently.

[MadPict]

Some roundabout facts.....

The first roundabouts were developed in 1923 to assist traffic movements at junctions.

Mini-roundabouts were introduced to the UK in 1976.

The first roundabout in the UK appeared in the Garden City of Letchworth.....
"intersection for gyratory movement'"

Traffic circles were considered a disastrous failure in the US, but roundabouts continued to be popular in Europe, especially Britain.

Sounds like it is a toss up between New York businessman William Phelps Eno and Eugene Henard, the Architect for the City of Paris, as to who first developed the roundabout.

It's amazing what gets thrown up on the Interwebnetland -
http://www.alaskaroundabouts.com/history.html#history

Think I'll get my anorak......

[IgnorantWeeker]

Rheg, The Screen name and Signature were solely put on as a reply to your ignorant pompous and self opinionated statement about driving, though I would usually ignore the comments of the white settlers who’s views are normally somewhat blinkered to say the least! (and you had the cheek to call me a bigot)

All of the above surely proven by your statement of assumed superior knowledge in stating that i was not aware that it was not always required to indicate on approach to a roundabout, i was obviously refering to occasions where it was required. Try listening not preaching!

As a Caithnessian driver yourself, you are probably unaware that it is not imperative to signal at every approach to a roundabout.

Obviously southern drivers DO find it a dream to drive up here as the courtesy and civility shown to them would be more than they could expect in the city. Likewise drivers from the north DO return to the citys where they ADAPT thier driving to suit the conditions, unless of course you would like to argue that such aggressive driving should be employed up here to in the name of progress.
I will be the first to admit that there are poor drivers up here and at times I slip into that category but before making sweeping statements about here, please have the decency to think without the rose tinted glasses and accept there are bad drivers wherever there are cars not simply by location.
Think I better go lie down in a darkened room for a while before talking some sense to the Doc about witnessing the standards of driving at mini roundabouts on NE 10th AV amongst other areas in Miami over the last 30 months.

[Rheghead]

Rheg, The Screen name and Signature were solely put on as a reply to your ignorant pompous and self opinionated statement about driving,

Again you are wrong. There is nothing opinionated about stating things from direct observation, but I did say it was a sweeping statement so you should start listening and not preaching.

though I would usually ignore the comments of the white settlers

Why would you normally ignore the views of people who have chosen to live in the far north, are they unworthy to live here?

who’s views are normally somewhat blinkered to say the least! (and you had the cheek to call me a bigot)

I can usually understand reverse psychology, but this takes the biscuit

All of the above surely proven by your statement of assumed superior knowledge in stating that i was not aware that it was not always required to indicate on approach to a roundabout,.

Well thank you for the compliment, you sure know it when you see it, I have been trained to higher than normal driving standards through service with the police force and a Gold star rider motorcycle course.

Obviously southern drivers DO find it a dream to drive up here as the courtesy and civility shown to them would be more than they could expect in the city.

Quite, but herein lies the problem. As has been said before, drivers up here have never really been tested in the big world outside. I have lost count of the times that i have someone say they will not drive outside the county. This leads to a state of carelessness through complacency.

Likewise drivers from the north DO return to the citys where they ADAPT thier driving to suit the conditions,

A dangerous situation if you ask me, my opinion is that they should attend a refresher course, outside the county. Then they might feel more liberated to go further afield and they may just on the off chance lose their insular ways. It will be good for them.

unless of course you would like to argue that such aggressive driving should be employed up here to in the name of progress.

Equally dangerous is overly defensive driving.

I will be the first to admit that there are poor drivers up here and at times I slip into that category

Thank you for your honesty, I am guilty as well

but before making sweeping statements about here,

I fully admitted to making a sweeping statement in my original post, I don't need you to accuse me of making them. My position is there is a higher incidence of bad drivers up here purely because of complacency not that they can't be better drivers.

please have the decency to think without the rose tinted glasses and accept there are bad drivers wherever there are cars not simply by location.

There are bad drivers everywhere, but location does make a difference to a driver's standards purely on the terrain, it has to make a difference.

[DrSzin]

Think I better go lie down in a darkened room for a while before talking some sense to the Doc about witnessing the standards of driving at mini roundabouts on NE 10th AV amongst other areas in Miami over the last 30 months.

I can assure you that the system was working as intended, and that the traffic was flowing smoothly! I assume this isn't normally the case? I can't remember where the roundabout was, and I don't remember how big it was either (probably because I was concentrating too hard), but I don't think it was a mini-roundabout.

I don't much like driving in Miami: drivers tailgate and lane-dodge with impunity and without signalling, and they drive too fast in heavy traffic. Furthermore, they often lane-dodge with no gain at all. I don't know how often I caught up with a car that had switched lanes many times in order to overtake, only to be re-overtaken a few minutes later.

One of my worst drives ever was down I95 between West Palm Beach and Miami Beach in a heavy thunderstorm. It was really busy, there was spray everywhere, and half the mad fools were tailgating, lane-switching and driving as fast as ever; it was a nightmare.

I hope it wasn't you I was stuck behind in west Edinburgh at the weekend! He or she was driving erratically in-between two lanes (Scalextric style) at 25mph, and failing miserably to overtake a bus. It was a red Rover (a 200?) and it had "SK" plates with "J & G Sutherland" emblazoned on them. Musta been a reverse-white-settler who hasn't quite settled-in yet.

[IgnorantWeeker]

Rheg, You manage to prove my point with your failure to listen to what I said once again and your out of context dissection of the text (is that part of your police training too). It is only yourself who seems to see the Wisdom you speak off I was only pointing out your self-assumption.

Ok so you have talked to some people (all of Reay?) who don’t see the attraction or necessity to visit any city, are they wrong? (There are some people in Cities who don’t want to venture outside the pollution, grime and noise)! Insular works both ways!! But perhaps that is too difficult a concept for you to grasp.
Do you deny that there are many more from here who are able to drive in busier traffic systems. Stop focusing on the negative and enjoy the fact that you can leave a safe distance between you and the car in front without someone jumping in to it here!

Whoopee, Police driving with all it’s flaws based on outdated techniques and machinery isn’t the greatest add on how to be an effective driver. Going by it you would issue far more tickets in a City environment, then again if your brainwashed by the officialdom that requires you to believe that simply by doing the course you are better and fail to recognise it is not 100%.

[IgnorantWeeker]

Doc, I panicked when you said a red car and saw my aggressive driving at the weekend but apart from having a Pug not a Rover, I never saw 25 too often due to the guy threatening to jump of the north bridge and screwing up the traffic. He had probably read one of Rheg's self-opinionated rants and couldn't take any more!

I95 to West Palm can be fun as you point out in wet conditions (or even a dry day) and the turnpike just as bad. There just seems to be so much fuel engrained in the road surface and the tyre rubber is a harder compound to allow for the summer temperatures and increased wear rates doesn't help!

The section I know best is 10th Av as I said before, between Biscayne Bvd and 79th St where mini roundabouts installed almost 3 years ago. It wasn't a 4 way stop but 10th had right off way and the side roads were give ways so it was to improve the situation for them but 10 is still treated as the right of way by most! (A bit like a lot of drivers coming down the cliff or coming off bridge st, before anyone says it)

[MadPict]

I did post about this roundabout some time ago in a similar thread about the traffic lights just up the road.
I still find that some drivers just ignore the fact it is a roundabout and treat the direction they are travelling in as the one with right of way!

They need to move the traffic lights up from their current location and stick them in the place of the roundabout - and maybe even move the roundabout up to the junction with Thurso Road and Dempster Street - but then who bothers to drive throuigh Wick now that the A9 has been 'diverted'......

[Fran]

Thank you for all your responses.
Captain chaos...I was not sitting waiting for traffic coming down station road on my right. I was illustrating my position on the roundabout, at a busy time, coming from Bridge street heading for the hospital. It was a busy time and i was giving way to 2 vans coming round on my right, on the roundabout from station road when the car behind tooted in annoyance. Less haste more speed is my motto and i am a careful and very experienced driver.
according to the british Highway code of roundabouts rule 161, when approaching a roundabout you should give priority to traffic approaching from your right.(this applies to everything).
Check whether road markings allow you to enter the roundabout without giving way. If so, proceed, but still look to the right before joining.
Watch out for vehicles driving on the roundabout, be aware that they may not be signalling correctly or at all.

Test yourself on www.@dsa.gov.uk

for a laugh look at the Highway code 2004 (revised edition) which is how a lot of motorists drive!!
Katarina...if 4 cars arrive at the roundabout they all give way to the right which would be to one car.
Dali...where is the 2nd roundabout in wick/
Blondie...thank you for your support!!!
Drivers should be patient and not toot their horns in annoyance. what has happened to curteous drivers.

[gravedigga]

where is the 2nd roundabout in wick

Other end of River Street at the end of the service bridge

[katarina]

:
Katarina...if 4 cars arrive at the roundabout they all give way to the right which would be to one car.
:

Eh, no. I would be giving way to the car on my right which would be giving way to the car on his right which would be giving way to the car on his right, which would be giving way to me. And I would be giving way to the car on my right.........