Cameron's bribe/threat for Wee Eck.

[Oddquine]

I guessed thats what his point was but as a newly independent Scotland would not be a member of the EU it would require passports unless we are all supposed to never travel outside these borders. Mind does make me wonder how many would trade their British passports for a new shiney Scottish ones.

Always with the caveat that I personally, would as soon not be in the EU........what do you mean by a newly independent Scotland? Do you mean a Scotland the day after the Referendum..or a Scotland on Independence Day in 2016? I should think that what applies to Scotland after the Referendum re the EU, if the result is yes, would also apply to rUK........as neither will be the UK which negotiated the original accession treaty......and both would have to negotiate new terms.

After all....rUK would be in no position to give the EU control over Scottish waters and allow EU members' fishing fleets free reign in them, as Heath did as a sweetener to get in...would they?

Passports, until 2016, is a strawman argument in this thread, as we will be in negotiations in the run up to Independence until then...with every entity with which we need to negotiate, including the EU. Doubtless between 2014 and 2016, Scottish Passports will be produced....just as the rUK will have to produce updated ones to remove the Great Britain from "The United Kingdom" for their use from Independence Day....but I'd guess that dual nationality will be allowed....at least until old passports, UK or otherwise, are due for renewal...and then what would happen would more depend on the rules in the issuing country, and have not a lot to do with Scotland.

To me, the more interesting scenario would be, if Scotland votes for Independence and joins the EU, the situation regarding passports if the rUK votes to leave the EU in 2017. Unlike current Westminster scaremongering, I can't see Scotland insisting there will be closed, guarded borders with passports..can you?

[Gronnuck]

Also if the UK cant commission warships anywhere except the uk, how can they commission fighter jets from America?http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-18919388

The Royal Navy has never commissioned a shipyard outside the UK to build a fighting ship because there are facets of the structure, fitting and contents that are highly classified. Obviously the Government and the Navy need to be able to collaborate during such work very closely. Come independence and separation the UKr government might well withdraw its support for Govan. Even if only in a fit of pique.
Where Britain has collaborated with NATO partners to build aircraft this has only been to build parts of the aircraft. The USA will not include much of their Avionics for instance and partners fit their own. When you say ‘collaboration’ it’s never 100% because governments have some things they will not share. There is a history of squabbles over engines, weapon systems as well as avionics.
I hope the Govan shipyards will get to build the Type 26 Frigate, even if it is only the hull and part of the superstructure; something is better than nothing and we need to preserve the skillbase.

[theone]

Also if the UK cant commission warships anywhere except the uk, how can they commission fighter jets from America?http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-18919388

The difference is that the "bought" the aircraft from America. An American company designed and built them, and Britain was allowed to buy them. That said, there will be a lot of elements that the British wouldn't have been allowed to buy, radars, weapon systems etc.

With warships, they are a unique, British design. If Britain decides to sell them to another country, fair enough, but until that time there will be a number of design aspects that the are confidential and hence can't be see by foreign eyes.

Try and find a photo of a propeller from a vanguard class submarine. Or a reactor. You won't. It's confidential, for approved UK eyes only.

The reason RFA and support ships are currently built abroad is that they are not confidential, and to supplement this the labour costs are so much lower than the UK. Govan etc don't get these contracts because they are far too expensive. Take away the "secrecy" aspect that Govan etc offer and they suddenly become a very unattractive option.