Atheist Census

[Trajan]

still no answer to this:
heres a question for any religious types,
can you show me anywhere in chapter and verse in your bible, where the god of the bible did something good for someone ,without hurting someone else,
excluding the myth of creation, good luck you will need it.
i will maybe give you the answer at a later date, go read your bible, i have, hundreds of times, i study ancient history yee see.

[maverick]

1st Kings chapter 3.
As you are an Ancient Historian, perhaps you might answer a question for me, what was the purpose of the Great pyramid of Giza, and how was it built?

[Trajan]

well done maverick, it was solomon,
god gave him wisdom,,and what did solomon do with that wisdom ,, he started worshipping other gods.
some would say the wisdom took
and dont be so lazy i aint your teacher

[M Swanson]

What sort of twisted god creates a parasite which burrows itself into the eye of a 3 year old girl?

I'm not sure why you would ask me this question Rheg. As you appear to have no belief in God, then neither I, nor any other Christian could answer this to your satisfaction. All I can suggest, is that you look elsewhere to find somebody, or something, to blame and answer your query. Sorry, but that's logical and as good as it gets, I'm afraid.

[Oddquine]

I'm not sure why you would ask me this question Rheg. As you appear to have no belief in God, then neither I, nor any other Christian could answer this to your satisfaction. All I can suggest, is that you look elsewhere to find somebody, or something, to blame and answer your query. Sorry, but that's logical and as good as it gets, I'm afraid.

Ah, but can you answer it to your own satisfaction..and if so, how do how do you explain it to yourself...or is most of the Bible just stuff Christians don't think about in case it makes them think.

[cptdodger]

what was the purpose of the Great pyramid of Giza, and how was it built?

Not being an ancient historian myself, I rely on wikipedia ! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Pyramid_of_Giza. If that does'nt answer your questions, the Discovery Channel has a lot of good documentaries about Egypt.

[M Swanson]

Ah, but can you answer it to your own satisfaction..and if so, how do how do you explain it to yourself...or is most of the Bible just stuff Christians don't think about in case it makes them think.

Yes to the first part. I'm only guessing here, but in much the same way you did when you were active in the church possibly! I'm not asking though, because it's none of my business. Lastly, can't answer for Christians in general, of course, but I'm a thinker. It was all part of a natural progression from my beliefs to my faith. I am blessed.

Not being an ancient historian myself, I rely on wikipedia ! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Pyramid_of_Giza. If that does'nt answer your questions, the Discovery Channel has a lot of good documentaries about Egypt.

Good find Cpt and I'll certainly read the article later. Thanks.

[Trajan]

try this site if you want some more info http://ancientegyptonline.co.uk/pyramid-air-shafts.html#clock
or this http://www.cheops-pyramide.ch/pyramid-building.html

[Trajan]

or if you really want to push the boundries ,, try this one,, http://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...mid-of-Giza---

[cptdodger]

In a lot of the documentaries I have watched about how the Pyramids were built, it seemed the builders of them were held in high regard especially the stonemasons, but it was a job for life. I can watch anything about the Pharaoh's, and the Valley Of The Kings and so on, it just intrigues me. I would love to have seen the Tutankhamun exhibition when it was in Britain, but I do battle with myself, on one hand, it bothers me that his grave had been disturbed, on the other, it would be amazing to see the artifacts found within the tomb. For me it was just the same when the Titanic was found, (which is now effectively a grave), again it bothers me that people can dive down to the ship for whatever reason, having said that, the documentary James Cameron did before making his film was very interesting.

[Oddquine]

Yes to the first part. I'm only guessing here, but in much the same way you did when you were active in the church possibly! I'm not asking though, because it's none of my business. Lastly, can't answer for Christians in general, of course, but I'm a thinker. It was all part of a natural progression from my beliefs to my faith. I am blessed.

But the reason I am no longer in the church is because I did think about what was written in the Bible, for a long time, and compared it to what had been/was happening at the time. I decided to leave...because I couldn't justify being a member of an organisation which promoted a Book so blatantly violent and which condoned the actions of others, who used the violence in the Bible as a justification for those actions.

So I repeat, Ah, but can you answer it to your own satisfaction..and if so, how do you explain it to yourself...or is most of the Bible just stuff Christians don't think about in case it makes them think.

And try not to sidestep the how do you explain it to yourself bit, this time.....as I am interested.......because I couldn't explain/interpret/justify any of the violence the bible was putting forward as acceptable behaviour...which is why I left the Church.

[cptdodger]

I put my hands up to it, I have never read the bible, ever. But I did read passages that I think Trajan put on here earlier on in the thread. I must admit, I was quite shocked at some of the things that had been written in it. My concern is if there are people out there that take it literally. If you look at Sharia Law, while I know that is a different religion, these people follow it to the letter, so it can happen. Also, I think it was Maverick, that was asking us to look to the Bible for evidence that there is a God, I had no idea that there were so many different versions of the same book.

[Trajan]

cpt its the same religion, at least the first 5 books of the OT, its really the same book , but jesus is just another prophet in the koran, and a false messiah in the torah,
somewhere in the book of isaiah, another prophet, the god of the bible tells isaiah that the next messiah will be called immanuel not joshua or jesus in greek,
and quote,

Old Testament prophesy: Isaiah 7:14 The "virgin" (almah) shall be with child and his name shall be Immanuel.

In Isaiah’s day, the Hebrew word "almah" meant a young woman / a maiden - not a virgin.

The Hebrew term "Immanuel" means "God With Us".

So, why is the Messiah's name Jesus Christ instead of "Immanuel"? Who today calls Jesus Christ "Immanuel"? Did not Isaiah state: "His name shall be Immanuel." Does the Bible contradict itself?
they do say the greatest story ever told,, and they aint kidding

[Trajan]

and cpt you dont need to be into ancient history , just pick up any bible and read some of the chapters in the OT, it makes hitler and stalin look like amateurs ,
hitler was a roman catholic and stalin,
When Stalin was sixteen, he received a scholarship to attend the Georgian Orthodox Tiflis Theological Seminary in Tbilisi, another christian,
where do you think these nutters got all their ideas from, if the god of the bible can kill millions of peeps on a whim , why not them,they were both brought up to believe in the bible,
funnily enough these nutjobs were looked upon as saviours of there nations

[squidge]

The bible is a book written in times when the behaviour contained within it was commonplace. I dont hold with it being the 'word of God' although I can accept that the men who wrote it believed that they were carrying out the will of God. For Christians though, I think that everything changes with the coming of Christ. All the sacrifices, all the punishments were nul and void because whereas before Jesus sin was cleansed with blood, after Jesus all sin was cleansed by HIS blood. Thats why people say that if you truly repent and take Jesus into your heart then you will be absolved of all your sins. The teachings of Jesus trump all the 'throw stones at them if they look at your cow' stuff and didnt he say that you should love your neighbour, do unto others as you would have done to you? That isnt THAT bad a philosophy even if you are NOT A Christian actually.

[M Swanson]

And try not to sidestep the how do you explain it to yourself bit, this time.....as I am interested.......because I couldn't explain/interpret/justify any of the violence the bible was putting forward as acceptable behaviour...which is why I left the Church.

Let's cut to the chase here OQ. My opinion is, that you never quite managed to attain faith and have little, to no idea, of what it means. I'm not responsible for that, nor with the best will in the world could I, or anyone else ever bestow that gift on you. So, that makes me wonder where the seat of your torment is, that you would need to try and destroy my, or anyone elses faith. Because yes, that is what you do, in a desperate attempt to find some peace for yourself. For me, you don't seem to fit in any category. Not a dyed-in-the-wool atheist; nor a committed agnostic and not a Christian in terms of faith, but still holding some of its beliefs. It must be a scarey, lonely place. Let me just say, I am a Christian. I believe in God and our Lord Jesus. I fire from love, not hate. I do not begrudge anyone their beliefs - it's none of my business. Through my faith, I can sleep peacefully at night and I am not answerable to you, or anyone else. As I said previously, I am truly blessed. Amen.

That's the last I have to say to you OQ. I hope you find peace.

[cptdodger]

[QUOTE=Trajan;1001531]cpt its the same religion, at least the first 5 books of the OT, its really the same book


So, if it's the same book and the same religion, why is there so many different interpretations of it ? As in, Catholic, Muslim, Judaism, the list is endless. The thing I find hard to understand is, if God created heaven, earth and so on, why is there not just one religion?

[Alrock]

[QUOTE=cptdodger;1001879]

cpt its the same religion, at least the first 5 books of the OT, its really the same book


So, if it's the same book and the same religion, why is there so many different interpretations of it ? As in, Catholic, Muslim, Judaism, the list is endless. The thing I find hard to understand is, if God created heaven, earth and so on, why is there not just one religion?

I guess, as you hinted at, it's all down to interpretation.... & I guess that all the religious posters on here think their interpretation is the correct one....

Does any one here care to explain why they think their interpretation is the correct one & why they think the other interpretations are wrong?

[Oddquine]

Let's cut to the chase here OQ. My opinion is, that you never quite managed to attain faith and have little, to no idea, of what it means. I'm not responsible for that, nor with the best will in the world could I, or anyone else ever bestow that gift on you. So, that makes me wonder where the seat of your torment is, that you would need to try and destroy my, or anyone elses faith. Because yes, that is what you do, in a desperate attempt to find some peace for yourself. For me, you don't seem to fit in any category. Not a dyed-in-the-wool atheist; nor a committed agnostic and not a Christian in terms of faith, but still holding some of its beliefs. It must be a scarey, lonely place. Let me just say, I am a Christian. I believe in God and our Lord Jesus. I fire from love, not hate. I do not begrudge anyone their beliefs - it's none of my business. Through my faith, I can sleep peacefully at night and I am not answerable to you, or anyone else. As I said previously, I am truly blessed. Amen.

That's the last I have to say to you OQ. I hope you find peace.

So no explanation as to why you believe that the bible is not violent and a bad example to the gullible.....and an acceptance that you can happily go the "god gave us free will" route when considering the influence of the bible and religion on the world so you don't have to do thinking? Why am i not surprised?

I managed to attain faith as long as I didn't think, M Swanson..and eleven years attending Sunday School regularly (and Sunday School was my choice only) does tend to reduce thinking to an irrelevance against the absolute certainty being pushed, and thought I had found that certainty.

I think I may have been actually looking for something in which to believe, given that I also used to attend Salvation Army services and the Gospel tent which turned up periodically in my home area.. I spent a lot of my Sunday time over the years listening to preachers. But once I actually engaged my brain, the faith gradually disappeared.

It may have been unhelpful in the early preparation for unquestioning faith stakes that I wasn't brought up in a household which indoctrinated me ahead of time., but in one which would, in a census have put their religion down as Church of Scotland..but otherwise did not even get us baptised, far less expect us to do anything but treat others as we would prefer to be treated ourselves. My embracing religion was solely my choice, even from the age of five when I joined Sunday School..as was leaving the church completely 19 years later.

I have peace..M Swanson... why would you think I don't? But I wonder sometimes if you do.....because it always seems to me that those least comfortable with their religious beliefs are those who proclaim them to anyone who will listen, as if they are trying to convince themselves more than those listening to them.

[Flynn]

M Swanson is an atheist. They just don't realise it.