Pedophiles

[Nacho]

have just watched the harrowing program on BBC 1 about the pedophiles in Edinburgh.

for those who didn't watch it, it looked at the recent case of a network of pedophiles who shared images and videos of kids they had abused.

they've now been convicted, but it included the details and statements from the parents of the victims, their trusted friends were the ones who carried out the abuse.
i've never been so repulsed and angry, i don't know how the parents had the strength to discuss the case without tears and rage. (hours of counselling, but even so ... )

many oppose the death penalty because of miscarriages of justice, but i would gladly impose and carry out the execution of these *****

'an eye for an eye' is not a philosophy i hold, but in this case i will overlook that.

[teddybear1873]

have just watched the harrowing program on BBC 1 about the pedophiles in Edinburgh.

for those who didn't watch it, it looked at the recent case of a network of pedophiles who shared images and videos of kids they had abused.

they've now been convicted, but it included the details and statements from the parents of the victims, their trusted friends were the ones who carried out the abuse.
i've never been so repulsed and angry, i don't know how the parents had the strength to discuss the case without tears and rage. (hours of counselling, but even so ... )

many oppose the death penalty because of miscarriages of justice, but i would gladly impose and carry out the execution of these *****

'an eye for an eye' is not a philosophy i hold, but in this case i will overlook that.

The death penalty is too lenient for this 'Evil Breed'

Torture for a long length of time would be my way.

[brandy]

i didnt watch it but have been listening to the talk about it on the radio.
theres really no word that can describe the horror of the situation.
personally, i would prob. end up in jail for either attempted murder or outright murder.
on the bright side, when they go to prison... just remember that the majority of prisoners have families.. and children.
they are in prison for a reason, but theres a thing called jail house justice.
my thoughts and prayers go out to all those children and their families.

[riggerboy]

hang em in the market square in public and let all throw hot coals at them
i say we
hang em hang em hang em
hang em hang em hang em
hang em hang em hang em
until they are dead dead dead

[Mik.M.]

hang em in the market square in public and let all throw hot coals at them
i say we
hang em hang em hang em
hang em hang em hang em
hang em hang em hang em
until they are dead dead dead
I`m with Riggerboy on this one,but only after they have had the(insert appropriate word here) kicked out of them first.

[upolian]

I`m with Riggerboy on this one,but only after they have had the(insert appropriate word here) kicked out of them first.

+1
7shades of poo kicked out of them ;)

[Mrs Bucket]

Brand them on the forehead and cheeks and maybe cut their hands off

[Gronnuck]

Brand them on the forehead and cheeks and maybe cut their hands off

I'd cut more than their hands off! . . . and I'd use a blunt spoon.

[opel]

I was once discussing this topic with a friend, and I had said that if anything happened like this to my child then i would go to the ends of the earth to kill the person (can think of betters words for the like but i would be banned forever more) that had done it!
Yes i would end up in jail, yes i would miss years of my childs life but i would just have to do something about it! The utter devastation of something like this being done to your child must be unimagineable!! Complete torture!!
the justice system that deals with these people is a complete and utter failure! i see people that carry out burgalries get more time that paedophiles!!
i see people around wick whom you know are on the sex offenders register and people are talking to them!! HOW CAN THEY talk to them??, Oh my God how can they??

Anyway this then friend i was talking to said he didnt think i would have it in me to murder someone, not even a paedophile,,, God beleive me when i say YES I WOULD!!!!

I think they are worse than any other criminal, from murderers to rapists,, I think they are the most evil ...evil retchid people that walk amongst us!!

Just how can they hurt an innocent child is beyond beleif!!??

They must think they are invincable when they do this to a child, think they are getting away with it!! I would like to see them come face to face with any adult, admit to what they have done and deal then with the punishment then that we would inflict!! but no they would be to spineless to do that wouldnt they!!

i hope they burn in hell when there day comes!

[Rheghead]

Every child at some stage grows up and thinks about having a physical relationship with another but none think they want to grow up to be a child abuser. There is a clear link between abusers and them being victims themselves. Folk say they have the ability to do something about their reasons for abusing kids, maybe but I don't think it is that simple or there wouldn't be any abuse. How easy is it to give up smoking or taking heroine? Is it easy? Not for some it isn't so why do folk think they have an unfettered ability to stop what they're doing?

I'm not defending what they are doing but I just think threads like this are counter productive and just drive abusers underground where they feel as if society is against them and unwilling to help. If they feel they are isolated, who have these abusers got to turn to? The internet? Your kids?:confused[evil]

[riggerboy]

Every child at some stage grows up and thinks about having a physical relationship with another but none think they want to grow up to be a child abuser. There is a clear link between abusers and them being victims themselves. Folk say they have the ability to do something about their reasons for abusing kids, maybe but I don't think it is that simple or there wouldn't be any abuse. How easy is it to give up smoking or taking heroine? Is it easy? Not for some it isn't so why do folk think they have an unfettered ability to stop what they're doing?

I'm not defending what they are doing but I just think threads like this are counter productive and just drive abusers underground where they feel as if society is against them and unwilling to help. If they feel they are isolated, who have these abusers got to turn to? The internet? Your kids?:confused[evil]

you know i kinda agree with all that you have wrote there, so just to let all the pedos in the world know that i

riggerboy will at anytime be there for you to assist and help you with any help you need or feel you need to get you up on to the gallows i will supply all the rope you need bring nothing but your scranny necks, you will have no hard work to do i will do it all for you i will even say a short prayer for you ,something like," you came you abused and you were wiped of the face of our lords planet i hope you burn in hell," kinda thing,

[opel]

Every child at some stage grows up and thinks about having a physical relationship with another but none think they want to grow up to be a child abuser. There is a clear link between abusers and them being victims themselves. Folk say they have the ability to do something about their reasons for abusing kids, maybe but I don't think it is that simple or there wouldn't be any abuse. How easy is it to give up smoking or taking heroine? Is it easy? Not for some it isn't so why do folk think they have an unfettered ability to stop what they're doing?

I'm not defending what they are doing but I just think threads like this are counter productive and just drive abusers underground where they feel as if society is against them and unwilling to help. If they feel they are isolated, who have these abusers got to turn to? The internet? Your kids?:confused[evil]

The difference is the addictions u talk about above, are our own choices and are only hurting ourselves!!

Please do not try to tell me that these people dont know that what they are doing is wrong!

That child does not want to be abused, That evil person knows that the child does not want to be abused therefor it is wrong!!! There is no other way about this!!
Absolutely no other way about this other than they should not be living and breathing on this earth!!

And to say that abused go onto being abusers.. well no sympathy lies with me...

The only help these people need is to be killed in the most horrific way imagineable.... tortured and die a slow slow death!!!
As slow as possible so that they could think long and hard as to what they have done!!
No pain they could ever feel could possibly match the pain of the child they have abused!!

[Rheghead]

Please do not try to tell me that these people dont know that what they are doing is wrong!

They know what they're doing alright, just like a smoker knows he's puffing on a fag and a junkie knows he is shooting up and they both know its bad for them or in complete denial about it.

[opel]

They know what they're doing alright, just like a smoker knows he's puffing on a fag and a junkie knows he is shooting up and they both know its bad for them or in complete denial about it.

But again i will re-iterate... we are inflicting those habits on ourselves!!

Not NEWBORN children up to any given age!!

Please... the difference is beyond compare!!

[opel]

But again i will re-iterate... we are inflicting those habits on ourselves!!

Not NEWBORN children up to any given age!!

Please... the difference is beyond compare!!

Rheghead --
And also.. re driving them underground...
The only underground they deserve is 6 foot underground!!

[Rheghead]

But again i will re-iterate... we are inflicting those habits on ourselves!!

In terms of fighting addictions or even curing mental illness or defining what they are or what effect they have on the brain, is there any difference whether the consequence of that addiction or illness is self harming or harms others? If you take a hard look at what I'm saying then I think you'll agree there isn't.

In fact if you think about it, a person that has a compulsion to harm others requires greater help than the ones that just harm themselves, not less...

[Rheghead]

Rheghead --
And also.. re driving them underground...
The only underground they deserve is 6 foot underground!!

Come now, let's discuss this sensibly. :confused

[northener]

But again i will re-iterate... we are inflicting those habits on ourselves!!

Not NEWBORN children up to any given age!!

Please... the difference is beyond compare!!

I agree with Rheghead on this, the fact that the crime is despicable is not being contested, what is being pointed out is that many of these people are almost pulled along by forces that are outside their control.

If someone finds, say, a four year old boy sexually attractive, then it's very easy to say 'that's wrong' but it's a damn sight harder to actually control that urge. As adults we all tend to find ourselves attracted sexually to certain types of person, fortunately most of us have preferences that fall within social and morally accepted boundaries. But it would be reasonable to say that there are those who are 'wired up' wrong and whose desires are completely unacceptable to our society.

Simply ranting and issuing threats against the perpetrators will change nothing. Robust policing plus an understanding of why people have these urges - and how to combat them - are the way forward. Not mobs baying for blood on street corners.

[Metalattakk]

Whenever I read people on here wishing unspeakable death and hatred upon these people, I am reminded of the following blog post I read some years ago.



Victims
by Reynolds (http://javascript%3Cb%3E%3C/b%3E:openWindow%28%27http://randomreality.blogware.com/blog/cmd=view_user/username=reynolds%27,%20%27info%27,%20450,%20600%2 9;) on Wed 20 Oct 2004 09:34 AM BST

Imagine, if you will, getting sent to a job where a 15 year old boy is threatening suicide. You turn up at the address and discover that it is a care home. Meeting with one of his carers she hands you a list of the boy's medications and it reads like a 'Who's who' of psychiatric drugs. You talk to the boy, and he seems calm, collected and very polite. He explains that he wants to jump out of a window and kill himself, and agrees that he would like to go to hospital. You take him into the paediatric department of a local hospital. As this does not feel like the normal "Teenager wants to kill themselves" you have a chat with the children's nurse and you ask them to let you know what happens to the patient. You leave, and continue with your shift. The next day you ask the children's nurse about the patient and she tells you - "The boy wanted to die because he wants to have sex with, and kill small children - and that he knows that it is wrong".

I hate paedophiles as much as any other member of society - but in front of me that day, I saw a victim.
I firmly believe that almost all of these people know that what they are doing is wrong. I also firmly believe that many of them actually wish that they didn't do what they do. Almost all of them are victims themselves.

I would hope that most right-minded people would want to help this particular young man, rather than burn him and skin him alive.

It's a dilemma right enough, though.

Ref: http://randomreality.blogware.com/blog/_archives/2004/10/20/163041.html

[opel]

I beleive for me the right thing to do would be to end my part in this discussion. I feel so strongly about it that if i continue i will blow a gasket!
Not because of your opinions, i just do not like hearing another side to the story. There is no other side for me, there is NO excuse for what they have done!

I understand the above comments and accept that these are your opinions!!

However the people that carry out this most godawfull crime deserve no less than the most horrible punishment that could be inflicted! that is how i feel and i will never sway from that!

I would never ever ever feel sympathy for them, try to understand them,, Or feel as they were the victim... Never!

Can you think for a moment how you would feel if say your 9 month old baby was raped by a paedophile? Would you try to understand why they did it,, or see them as a victim? I simply could not!

But i accept your opinions as yours,, and mines as mines!

[Margaret M.]

The chances of the perpetrators having once been innocent children that were molested are very high. It is interesting that some are able to break the cycle while others keep it going. I am in training to work with children who live in high risk surroundings. Talk about being jolted out of my comfort zone. What some children are subjected to is beyond belief. What we read in the newspapers is filtered versions of the brutality that takes place within some homes. It is very difficult to feel compassion for the adults in these situations but in so many of the cases they were victims of the same horrendous treatment as children. It's all they know and so the cycle continues.

[northener]

...., i just do not like hearing another side to the story. There is no other side for me, there is NO excuse for what they have done!

I understand the above comments and accept that these are your opinions!!

......

Nobody is excusing what they have done, Opel.

[butterfly]

The chances of the perpetrators having once been innocent children that were molested are very high.It is very difficult to feel compassion for the adults in these situations but in so many of the cases they were victims of the same horrendous treatment as children. It's all they know and so the cycle continues.


I have to agree with Rheghead,Metalattak and Margaret M,and by saying this it doesnt mean i have sympathy for the abuser's,just that we need to look at the wider picture,there is always a background.

[changilass]

The rational side of my brain (and yes, I do have one), accepts that there is something wrong in the wiring of some folks brains. These peole need help and we need to try to understand the reasons in order to stop it from happening.

However, the mother in me says that if anyone abused my child I would not be responsible for my actions.

[oldmarine]

Pedophiles: Whether they are born with this desire or come by it due to something happening to them as children, has been argued by many so-called experts. What I do recognise by all of this, it is a sickness that is perpetrated on too many innoscent children. If it had happened to one of my young children, I am afraid of the consequences that would have affected me.

[Olin]

I think to "kill" them is a ridiculous thing to say or do.

I look at it, and I know this will sound odd and weird, but "preferences"

Like some people are attracted to people with blonde hair or who are tall or of the same sex. These paedos unfortunately are born with a preference of small and young children which is unfortunate and wrong in my opinion.

You don't choose what it is that drives you and to kill someone for that is worse than the paedos themselves.


I don't know what must be done but I do know what is the wrong thing to do with regards to people who commit these crimes.

Its a very very touchy subject and I doubt caithness.org will find the correct answers to be honest....

[brandy]

at the end of the day rape is rape no matter what age a person is. it just takes a special twistedness to rape a child. a paedophile is nothing but a rapist. some one who emotionally and physically rapes our children.. how many times have we heard the phrase.. this is our little secret.. this is just between us.. dont tell anyone!
yes, some sick people are attracted to children, it dosent mean they have to act on it.
we put down rabid animals.. why not rabid people?
a monster is still a monster no matter how you look at it
just want to add, even if it means locking them away for the rest of their lives where they can never hurt another child again.
it can never give back what has been taken away but it can stop it happening again.

[butterfly]

The rational side of my brain (and yes, I do have one), accepts that there is something wrong in the wiring of some folks brains. These peole need help and we need to try to understand the reasons in order to stop it from happening.

However, the mother in me says that if anyone abused my child I would not be responsible for my actions.



Agree Changi,there is no telling how i would react if it happened to any of mine.

Just dont see what good a baying mob can solve.

[Olin]

A monster is a monster?

We put down animals with rabies yes. Do we murder people with aids now too?

All I'm saying is these "monsters" should be treated rather than thrown away with.

I just think killing is wrong when it comes to people.

[riggerboy]

A monster is a monster?

We put down animals with rabies yes. Do we murder people with aids now too?

All I'm saying is these "monsters" should be treated rather than thrown away with.

I just think killing is wrong when it comes to people.

yes i think we should treat these monsters aswell, let me think how should we treat them,
o i know the same as you would treat the person that rapes your son or daughter, with a small bit of lead placed into the ear at very high speed

[Olin]

Well opinion is opinion. I just think killing someone is wrong because you'll never get them back. No matter how good or bad they are.

[Mrs Bucket]

Every child at some stage grows up and thinks about having a physical relationship with another but none think they want to grow up to be a child abuser. There is a clear link between abusers and them being victims themselves. Folk say they have the ability to do something about their reasons for abusing kids, maybe but I don't think it is that simple or there wouldn't be any abuse. How easy is it to give up smoking or taking heroine? Is it easy? Not for some it isn't so why do folk think they have an unfettered ability to stop what they're doing?I'm not defending what they are doing but I just think threads like this are counter productive and just drive abusers underground where they feel as if society is against them and unwilling to help. If they feel they are isolated, who have these abusers got to turn to? The internet? Your kids?:confused[evil]
You dont want that scum to think that society is against them get real babies are involved

[Mrs Bucket]

you know i kinda agree with all that you have wrote there, so just to let all the pedos in the world know that i

riggerboy will at anytime be there for you to assist and help you with any help you need or feel you need to get you up on to the gallows i will supply all the rope you need bring nothing but your scranny necks, you will have no hard work to do i will do it all for you i will even say a short prayer for you ,something like," you came you abused and you were wiped of the face of our lords planet i hope you burn in hell," kinda thing,
Well said.....

[Mrs Bucket]

I agree with Rheghead on this, the fact that the crime is despicable is not being contested, what is being pointed out is that many of these people are almost pulled along by forces that are outside their control.

If someone finds, say, a four year old boy sexually attractive, then it's very easy to say 'that's wrong' but it's a damn sight harder to actually control that urge. As adults we all tend to find ourselves attracted sexually to certain types of person, fortunately most of us have preferences that fall within social and morally accepted boundaries. But it would be reasonable to say that there are those who are 'wired up' wrong and whose desires are completely unacceptable to our society.

Simply ranting and issuing threats against the perpetrators will change nothing. Robust policing plus an understanding of why people have these urges - and how to combat them - are the way forward. Not mobs baying for blood on street corners.
Shoot the***people

[M R]

Jail is not the answer fro these kinda people. What, sitting back in a cell, fed, watered, probably playing top titles on an xbox 360 and watching movies on sky+ HD. And who pays for this !!!!

Oh no, i will leave it there before an infraction comes my way.[evil]

[Boozeburglar]

Whenever I read people on here wishing unspeakable death and hatred upon these people, I am reminded of the following blog post I read some years ago.

I firmly believe that almost all of these people know that what they are doing is wrong. I also firmly believe that many of them actually wish that they didn't do what they do. Almost all of them are victims themselves.

I would hope that most right-minded people would want to help this particular young man, rather than burn him and skin him alive.

It's a dilemma right enough, though.

Ref: http://randomreality.blogware.com/blog/_archives/2004/10/20/163041.html

With respect, this is a cop out.

EVERY criminal behaviour has some mitigating antecedent.

On that basis, are we to allow all criminals clemency?

I say crush the ______ like a beetle.

[opel]

A monster is a monster?

We put down animals with rabies yes. Do we murder people with aids now too?

All I'm saying is these "monsters" should be treated rather than thrown away with.

I just think killing is wrong when it comes to people.

Forgive me, I did say i was going to stay out of this wee discussion..

However... I have to ask you people that are suggesting that these people could be helped,, treated ..you say yes?.........

So............

Given a padeophile was treated, councilled, the lot..everything that could be done say over the course of 4-5 years..
Docs were happy, the person was not then deemed to be a further risk to children.. yes..
My question to you defenders is...
Would You Leave YOUR CHILD With This Man/Woman...?? Given that they are now supposedly cured??
I would imagine the answer would be NO...
No-one wants these people in our society, And i know all of you would not leave YOUR child with a convicted paedo..
Come on now!!!

And as for jail,,, wheres the justice there! Those in jail have better lives than young people lying on the streets who have run away from a paedo, and am sure there is many!

[northener]

You dont want that scum to think that society is against them get real babies are involved


Shoot the***people

So you are saying that there should be no attempts made to understand why the crimes are being committed?

Yes or no?

[riggerboy]

So you are saying that there should be no attempts made to understand why the crimes are being committed?

Yes or no?


yes we should try to understand why but we should still deal out the death penalty within 24 hrs
and let it be known that we as a nation will not stand for it, whether it is right or wrong in the eys of the lord, i would rather stand and be judged for taking the life of a peado knowing i saved children from their grasp than to let the beasts hurt our children

hang em hang em hang em

[northener]

yes we should try to understand why but we should still deal out the death penalty within 24 hrs
and let it be known that we as a nation will not stand for it, whether it is right or wrong in the eys of the lord, i would rather stand and be judged for taking the life of a peado knowing i saved children from their grasp than to let the beasts hurt our children

hang em hang em hang em

Soooo....if your 17 year old son had attended a party and had sex with a 14 year old girl. you'd presumably be happy to send him to the long drop?

[catran]

Soooo....if your 17 year old son had attended a party and had sex with a 14 year old girl. you'd presumably be happy to send him to the long drop?

Well I would say that is a different kettle of fish altogether. The biggest problem is once they come out of the nick they get rehoused and a grant to establish themselves in another area. I would not like to think one of them was living in our midst, would you? The police cannot keep tags on them all the while and a lot slip through the network by moving about the country. Scarey to say the least.

[northener]

Well I would say that is a different kettle of fish altogether.

Which is the answer I would expect from any rational thinking human being. However, the law states that having sex with a minor is illegal - that makes the perpetrator a paedophile. Period. So we hang the 17 year old according to those who are expressing 'outrage' at 'paedos' and who are suggesting that they should 'all' be eradicated.

I used that as an example that the 'torture them and hang them' approach is all fine and dandy...until it involves someone on the edges or someone who is close to you.
Knee-jerk mentality will get us nowhere. We need to understand our enemy to hopefully carry out preventative measures - as opposed to simply waiting until after the event and then simply exterminating the individual.



The biggest problem is once they come out of the nick they get rehoused and a grant to establish themselves in another area. I would not like to think one of them was living in our midst, would you? The police cannot keep tags on them all the while and a lot slip through the network by moving about the country. Scarey to say the least.

Fair comment. Personally I do not think that the system is robust enough when dealing with offenders or past offenders. The overall sentencing policy is set too low IMO. Those who are released back into the community are not supervised closely enough and need to have their freedom of movement severely restricted.
Recidivists should not be granted any freedom whatsoever -under any circumstances.

[John Baikie]

I'd hang them - but not by the neck. I don't believe killing them is the answer. Dangly bits removed.

[Vistravi]

Soooo....if your 17 year old son had attended a party and had sex with a 14 year old girl. you'd presumably be happy to send him to the long drop?

That really depends on whether he knows what her age was. if he thought she was old enough then it is not his fault and she was very foolish to have lied about her age. But if he knows her real age and still does the deed then that is wrong.

However that is another argument.

The real monsters are not teen lads who have sex with underage girls it is the men and women in their 20s + that abuse children.

[Vistravi]

I can't watch things like that. Can't read accounts of it even with knowing the child involved had a happy ending and beat their abuser. It just makes me so mad that people do this to children. Children are innocents and they never ask to be abused. [evil]

Yes people who abuse children have a screw loose that is obvious. They are obviously missing a wire somewhere. But that does not mean they deserve to be monocuddled and live a life in jail of luxury.

They deserve capital punishment and so much more. i cannot say any more as it would only incure in a fraction [evil]

[brandy]

and here we come into the letter of the law and the spirit of the law.
lets face it.. we all know on here we are talking about sickos who molest and rape young children from new borns up.
its not teen consensual sex.
yes, the sex offender act covers a HUGE range.. and a lot of it is ridiculous when it comes to 16 year olds getting off with 15 year olds.. but can we be grown up enough to admit we are talking about the monsters that prey on children... and that is exactly what they do.

[Vistravi]

I'd hang them - but not by the neck. I don't believe killing them is the answer. Dangly bits removed.

I completley agree with you!

[Rheghead]

However... I have to ask you people that are suggesting that these people could be helped,, treated ..you say yes?.........

So............

Given a padeophile was treated, councilled, the lot..everything that could be done say over the course of 4-5 years..
Docs were happy, the person was not then deemed to be a further risk to children.. yes..
My question to you defenders is...
Would You Leave YOUR CHILD With This Man/Woman...?? Given that they are now supposedly cured??
I would imagine the answer would be NO...
No-one wants these people in our society, And i know all of you would not leave YOUR child with a convicted paedo..
Come on now!!!!

A very easy answer to that scenario and it depends.

If those peadophiles were subjected to treatment that I had faith in and I knew them well then yes I would be quite happy to leave my daughter into their care.

Apart from that then no responsible parent leaves their kids in the hands of a stranger any way. So the answer would be a no.

[squidge]

The answer is to make the system work -to know where and what these people are doing. To make them subject to any sort of order that makes it more difficult for them to continue in the same vein; to make sure that help is available to anyone struggling with feelings that they are attracted to children without having to hide it. There is a lot of talk about what we would do if our chidlren were abused - i cant even bear to think about it but where is the help for people who are frightened and worried that they are feeling attrracted to children?
Those of you who are advocating hanging all peadophiles make clear what you would do if your child was abused but what would you do if your grown up child came to you and, sobbing confessed that they were attracted to children? How would you feel and what would you do?

[Rheghead]

Would anyone be actually prepared to carry out a killing of a paedophile themselves?

Before you answer that, consider some things beforehand. Most people answer questions in a message forum truthfully based upon their attitude rather than their behavior. So again, would you be prepared to kill yourself?

Then there is the possibility that in the attempt that you fail and it is you that ends in prison and the paedo with a vengence is left on the outside with your kids, who is gonna protect them now? So, again will you be prepared to kill a paedo?

If the answer is yes then you are just as much a monster as the paedo, if you realise that verbose calls for death to the paedos is just not contributing to a solution and is a side show to the real discussion then you have to go along and actually agree that treatment is the way forward and attitudes of the wider public need to change as well.

[Boozeburglar]

You are talking rubbish.

Plenty people have killed paedophiles who have abused their children or themselves, and none of them are monsters.

The courts have judged similarly, handing out minimal punishment.

You seem to have a lot of sympathy for these people.

I wonder why.

[Nacho]

A very easy answer to that scenario and it depends.

If those peadophiles were subjected to treatment that I had faith in and I knew them well then yes I would be quite happy to leave my daughter into their care.

Apart from that then no responsible parent leaves their kids in the hands of a stranger any way. So the answer would be a no.



a lot of victims of sexual abuse are abused by people they know, friends of the family, even family members.

pedohiles are extremely manipulative and devious people, they have to be to get what they want.

for this reason, i wouldn't trust any form of treatment. who is to say they're treated ? of course the offender will say they are, so they can get back out into our community.

to say you would trust your daughter in the care of a 'reformed' sex offender astonishes me Rheg does your daughter's mother share the same view ?!

how many pedophiles come forward and hand themselves in before they carry out abuse ? i doubt there's many.

i applaud the understanding attitude of some of the posters on this thread who wouldn't advocate murder/torture, maybe i'm some sort of over protective parent who would gladly (and very sucessfully) 'strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger' ....

but please don't say that would make me as bad as them.

[Vistravi]

Wanting to preseve life, protect our young and doing anything to protect our young makes us human and as nature intended.

I don't think they should be killed but made to suffer. To make them suffer for what they put a child through when they abuse them is only right. Maybe i'm just extremely over protective with children and very maternal but i would always put myself in the way of harm to protect a child.

[highland red]

This is a very modern subject: (but not a new one) and I think one of the first media recorded instances were in Cleveland in the modern era.

Just cast your minds back to the Sarah Payne era. At that time her Mother was trying to get the law changed to enable communities to have prior and current knowledge of sex offenders and paedophiles named and shamed nationally in the public domain. (in theory a good idea).

I will always remember an early morning live feed to national TV that showed support for this on an estate in Portsmouth where the "supporters" were banner carrying and slogan chanting in support of having known offenders being "outed".

Some of the supporters appeared to be only one step up the food chain from a slug, but were canvassing for this knowledge to be in the interests of the general public.

Well to tell you the truth I thought great: But why stop at sex crimes? why shouldn't the public have the same access to those who were living in the community that may have been convicted of murder, rape, burglary, mugging/robbery, arson, assault, manslaughter and on and so forth? would we as a community benefit with this information?

I know the subject of sexual crimes is a very difficult one to stomach, but I have to say that a large majority of serving prisoners seek to minimise their crimes by citing sex offenders as the very bottom layer.

I understand when people feel outraged at sex crimes ( as I do also) but I can assure you that there are MORE "beasts / nonces" on ordinary location in the prison population than there are in "protective custody".

[Boozeburglar]

Metalattakk>

"With respect, you're talking out of your hoop."

I don't know why you would choose to bad rep me for expressing my opinion without even giving any justification.

Idiot.

I notice whenever this subject surfaces you are quick to defend the poor paedophiles.

I wonder why?

[Metalattakk]

You seem to have a lot of sympathy for these people.

I wonder why.



I notice whenever this subject surfaces you are quick to defend the poor paedophiles.

I wonder why?

I dunno, maybe in your warped mind you think anyone who doesn't subscribe to your "hang them, burn them, skin them alive" brigade must be paedophiles too.

Your blatant, outrageous insinuations are both ridiculous and bordering on the slanderous.

[Nacho]

Metalattakk>

I notice whenever this subject surfaces you are quick to defend the poor paedophiles.

I wonder why?

this comment is beneath you Booze, an emotional topic, but let's keep a clear head here

metalattakk has joined the discussion with his viewpoint, kill em all would sound a bit boring after a while so let's consider his view and challenge our own...

isn't that the point of a forum ..... ?

[Boozeburglar]

I genuinely wonder why these people are so sympathetic to paedophiles.

[greenasiamcabbagelooking]

because their empathy region of the brain reaches more to the offender than the victim ...

weird , but there ya go

[Metalattakk]

I genuinely wonder why these people are so sympathetic to paedophiles.


because their empathy region of the brain reaches more to the offender than the victim ...

weird , but there ya go

Nah, it's probably more that some people want to find out why these things happen and try to fix it and try to eradicate it, rather than resort to base, animalistic, knee-jerk mob-mentality responses from the Neanderthal gut reactions of the baying torch-wielding blood-thirsty cretins among us.

Weird, but there ya go, eh?

[greenasiamcabbagelooking]

Nah, it's probably more that some people want to find out why these things happen and try to fix it and try to eradicate it, rather than resort to base, animalistic, knee-jerk mob-mentality responses from the Neanderthal gut reactions of the baying torch-wielding blood-thirsty cretins among us.

Weird, but there ya go, eh?


the naturalistic urge to protect our young may be seen as primal and animalistic, but it's natural, it's human.

i'm not aware of any other species that sexually abuse their own.

i may be wrong, but comparing the 'knee-jerk' 'mob-mentality' reactions of concerned parents with some primal neanderthal sub intelligentia is a bit insulting.

i'm all for exploring what went wrong with the pedophile's hardware that made them miscalculate right from wrong,
in the meantime however ............ let's make all potential pedophiles know that there isn't a cooshy jail cell in a nonce wing waiting for them....

why should the offender be offered more treatment than the victim ?

[Metalattakk]

why should the offender be offered more treatment than the victim ?

Show me where anyone (including me) said they should?

[greenasiamcabbagelooking]

Show me where anyone (including me) said they should?


i wish i could include a quote about the victims ...

all your responses have been about the offenders ...

do you know any victims of sexual abuse ?

do they hold the same values as you ?

i do, and i can assure they don't give a toss about treatment or 'understanding'
they're main concern is that it doesn't happen again and the complete lack of faith they have in the current sex offender monitoring systems.

many victims of sexual abuse end up either a complete mess or committing suicide while their perpetrator walks free, off to abuse again and again and again.

killing pedophiles isn't the answer , of course it isn't, but it would make the victims feel better .... and would save a few bob in jails costs as well :)

[Metalattakk]

do you know any victims of sexual abuse ?
Yep, one or two.


do they hold the same values as you ?
Nope, not that I know of. I'm fairly sure I'm not speaking on their behalf.


many victims of sexual abuse end up either a complete mess or committing suicide while their perpetrator walks free, off to abuse again and again and again.

Worse than that, many of the victims go on to abuse kids in their own adult lives. How do we stop that, then? Kill all the kids who have been abused? That'd nip that problem in the bud, eh? :roll:


killing pedophiles isn't the answer , of course it isn't, but it would make the victims feel better .... and would save a few bob in jails costs as well :)

I'm not entirely convinced it would make the victims feel any better at all, in the long run.

And as for costs, the endless 'death row' appeals processes and their relevant costs would likely end up costing us mere taxpayers more in the long run anyway.

Killing people is never the answer.

[riggerboy]

Soooo....if your 17 year old son had attended a party and had sex with a 14 year old girl. you'd presumably be happy to send him to the long drop?


yes without question, the law is the law

the riggerboy will willing hang em and sleep at night my name is rigger pierpoint

[Mrs Bucket]

I can't watch things like that. Can't read accounts of it even with knowing the child involved had a happy ending and beat their abuser. It just makes me so mad that people do this to children. Children are innocents and they never ask to be abused. [evil]

Yes people who abuse children have a screw loose that is obvious. They are obviously missing a wire somewhere. But that does not mean they deserve to be monocuddled and live a life in jail of luxury.

They deserve capital punishment and so much more. i cannot say any more as it would only incure in a fraction [evil]

I agree with you and also about the difference teenagers and adults who know excatly what they are doing

[Mrs Bucket]

Wonder what the BNP stance is on this issue

[riggerboy]

Wonder what the BNP stance is on this issue

oh now thats a can o worms we dont want to open

[EDDIE]

Every child at some stage grows up and thinks about having a physical relationship with another but none think they want to grow up to be a child abuser. There is a clear link between abusers and them being victims themselves. Folk say they have the ability to do something about their reasons for abusing kids, maybe but I don't think it is that simple or there wouldn't be any abuse. How easy is it to give up smoking or taking heroine? Is it easy? Not for some it isn't so why do folk think they have an unfettered ability to stop what they're doing?

I'm not defending what they are doing but I just think threads like this are counter productive and just drive abusers underground where they feel as if society is against them and unwilling to help. If they feel they are isolated, who have these abusers got to turn to? The internet? Your kids?:confused[evil]

opel Rheghead is correct in what he is saying and i dont think a pedofile has much of a choice in mending there ways because its in there brain its how they are there urges and thoughts will never go away thats why they should be locked up for life because there will always be a possibilty of them reoffending again.

[Vistravi]

Abuse comes in all forms and often there are two to three types of abuse going on at the same time. For example a child is being abused by someone sexually it will aslo be pysically as they are being hurt and emotionally as they are being made to feel like they have done something wrong to deserve it and often that is why children do not say anything as their abuser has made them feel like it is their fault. I have not yet had a child tell me they are getting abused. The children i have worked with have been fortunate enough that they have been left alone to be children. I have had concerns that turned out to be completly innocent. My step sisters have suffered from emotional abuse at the hands of their step mother. I have known a couple of children who have suffered from emotional abuse and it hurts to see it and because their parents have no idea they are doing it to their children i could only try to make them see what they are doing to their children only to be told that because i don't have children i don't know anything. I'm glad to say that not one of the parents in the nursery i work in would listen to me if i said something to them about what i can see happening that they were not aware of doing.

Rheghead and Metalattakk have you ever known someone who has been or is being abused? If you have how can you have empathy for the people who hurt those children when you have seen what the abuse has done to the person? If you haven't then i can understand why you want to understand why people do what they do when they abuse children. If you can't see the pain that it puts the victim through then its no wonder.

[northener]

There's a lot of people posting on here who are accusing some of having 'sympathy' or 'empathy' with sex offenders because their viewpoint is one of trying to understand what the underlying causes of these crimes are.

What a blinkered and bizarre idea.

Understanding is the key resolving to most situations in life - and this one is no different. Unfortunately some people on here cannot see that one can understand (as in having knowledge of) the motives behind someones behaviour without agreeing that their behaviour is somehow acceptable.

Have you ever listened to any interview tapes between the Police and an arrested sex offender? If so, you'll have noticed that the officers speak to the offender in a manner most likely to result in them getting the information they want.
Contrary to what I'm sure some people on here would like to see, most of the time is spent in rational and level headed questioning and discussion. Not banging the table, shouting and threatening like some episode of 'The Sweeney' (top prog!:Razz). Which I'm sure some posters on here would be doing if given the opportunity......

[northener]

yes without question, the law is the law

the riggerboy will willing hang em and sleep at night my name is rigger pierpoint

:lol: Good on you Riggsy - stick to yer principles, mate.:Razz

[maverick]

paedophiles are the lowest form of life on the face of the planet, end of story.

The problem is that we cannot simply identify who a paedophile is by looking at them.

The law says that it is illegal to have sexual intercourse with someone under the age of consent which is 16 in Scotland and I believe that it is the same in england and wales, those who transgress the law are then placed on the sex offenders register. Any one who has sex with someone who is under the age of 16 is considered to be a sex offender.

A paedophile is a person who forces his or her sexual desires on to someone who is not old enough to consent to sexual intercourse.

A person who forces their sexual desires on someone over the age of 16 is classed as a rapist, which is the second lowest form of life on the planet.

I can accept that teenagers from the age of 14-17 will experiment with sex in a consentual type of manner where things can go to far, but I also accept that the law is in place to protect those who are not ready for that level of commital.

paedophiles are the enemy of our children, and for every paedophile caught probably another 100 or so escape the net.

the only sure 100% way of preventing paedophiles from re-offending is to execute them.

to know your enemy you must first become their friend, once you have befriended them and their defences are down then and only then should you select the most fitting solution for their demise...........

[riggerboy]

paedophiles are the lowest form of life on the face of the planet, end of story.

The problem is that we cannot simply identify who a paedophile is by looking at them.

The law says that it is illegal to have sexual intercourse with someone under the age of consent which is 16 in Scotland and I believe that it is the same in england and wales, those who transgress the law are then placed on the sex offenders register. Any one who has sex with someone who is under the age of 16 is considered to be a sex offender.

A paedophile is a person who forces his or her sexual desires on to someone who is not old enough to consent to sexual intercourse.

A person who forces their sexual desires on someone over the age of 16 is classed as a rapist, which is the second lowest form of life on the planet.

I can accept that teenagers from the age of 14-17 will experiment with sex in a consentual type of manner where things can go to far, but I also accept that the law is in place to protect those who are not ready for that level of commital.

paedophiles are the enemy of our children, and for every paedophile caught probably another 100 or so escape the net.

the only sure 100% way of preventing paedophiles from re-offending is to execute them.

to know your enemy you must first become their friend, once you have befriended them and their defences are down then and only then should you select the most fitting solution for their demise...........


here here the riggerboy has a job for you, i will gladly stand at your side and execute them even if i only get 1 in a 100 i will eventually get to them all,

i will stand by my principles and


hang em hang em hang em all
until they are eradicated from this plant sent to damnation for all eternity, to have their soles tortured and scared.

[northener]

....

hang em hang em hang em all
until they are eradicated from this plant sent to damnation for all eternity, to have their soles tortured and scared.


But you can only hang those that have been convicted of committing a crime...what about trying to resolve the problems before the courts get involved? Thats why paedophiles and those involved in the child sex industry need to be questioned, analysed and understood. 'Know your enemy' is a good phrase that springs to mind.

Prevention is always better than cure. I haven't seen anyone who is pro-execution even attempt to address this issue........maybe because they haven't really got any answers apart from a ridiculously simplistic and unworkable approach?

[Rheghead]

I genuinely wonder why these people are so sympathetic to paedophiles.

Because despite them committing heinious crimes which I am not defending, I still see them as human beings and am prepared to give them a second chance to reform themselves and retake their place in society instead of writing them off as a lost cause so they will keep re-offending. Is that so hard to understand?

What do want for these people, reform or let them keep reoffending? The choice is seemples.

[cesare]

one word................Death

[Rheghead]

Rheghead and Metalattakk have you ever known someone who has been or is being abused? If you have how can you have empathy for the people who hurt those children when you have seen what the abuse has done to the person? If you haven't then i can understand why you want to understand why people do what they do when they abuse children. If you can't see the pain that it puts the victim through then its no wonder.

As a former police officer I have had to deal with those abused and the abusers. I come from experience with my viewpoint, pity some folk are just armchair executioners...

[riggerboy]

As a former police officer I have had to deal with those abused and the abusers. I come from experience with my viewpoint, pity some folk are just armchair executioners...

i resemble that remark but given the chance i would gladly execute the lot of them, if i could do it with a button from my armchair then i would not have to have a t-break you bring the typhoo and i`ll do the rest,

[riggerboy]

But you can only hang those that have been convicted of committing a crime...what about trying to resolve the problems before the courts get involved? Thats why paedophiles and those involved in the child sex industry need to be questioned, analysed and understood. 'Know your enemy' is a good phrase that springs to mind.

Prevention is always better than cure. I haven't seen anyone who is pro-execution even attempt to address this issue........maybe because they haven't really got any answers apart from a ridiculously simplistic and unworkable approach?


yes prevention is better than cure without a doubt, let the courts have them for five minutes and then unleash the power of the people on them

then onto the gallows,


you may analyse them as they walk on a beautiful morning with the sun blazing down on the cold hard nails of the gallows and the short sharp snap of the rope, analyse them as they walk with terror on their faces, a terror only a abuser would have, the same terror that was on the face of the abused as they carried out the deeds that have led them to riggerboys gallows,

[oldmarine]

Would anyone be actually prepared to carry out a killing of a paedophile themselves?

Before you answer that, consider some things beforehand. Most people answer questions in a message forum truthfully based upon their attitude rather than their behavior. So again, would you be prepared to kill yourself?

Then there is the possibility that in the attempt that you fail and it is you that ends in prison and the paedo with a vengence is left on the outside with your kids, who is gonna protect them now? So, again will you be prepared to kill a paedo?

If the answer is yes then you are just as much a monster as the paedo, if you realise that verbose calls for death to the paedos is just not contributing to a solution and is a side show to the real discussion then you have to go along and actually agree that treatment is the way forward and attitudes of the wider public need to change as well.

I don't delight in killing anyone. Even during WW2 when I was in a war with a formidable enemy, I did not thrill about killing. However, my training as a US Marine prepared me to do something that I had been raised as a Christian to believe that killing was wrong. I probably could not be able to kill a pedaphile even if one of my youngsters were affected by one. However, I would do everything in my power to make certain that person was put away where they could not do do again.

[northener]

you may analyse them as they walk on a beautiful morning with the sun blazing down on the cold hard nails of the gallows and the short sharp snap of the rope, analyse them as they walk with terror on their faces, a terror only a abuser would have, the same terror that was on the face of the abused as they carried out the deeds that have led them to riggerboys gallows,

Well, if the Gubbment ever re-introduces the position of "Witchfinder Generall" - I reckon you'll be well in, old chap.:Razz

[riggerboy]

Well, if the Gubbment ever re-introduces the position of "Witchfinder Generall" - I reckon you'll be well in, old chap.:Razz


many thanks "i think"

[zarapopet]

they should all be castrated and then stabbed bit by bit so you can see them feel pain . to show how much pain we hads to injur through years and years of abuse i was one of these victims and getting the justice you deserve wont happen i tried to get justice for 4 years for the 20 years of abuse i incured but due to nobody else comming forward the sick bas....... got of . we will never get the justice we deserve with the law the way it is who suffers again us time and time again.
when a case doesnt go to court it is believed they are not guilty and people call you a lier and cross the street.
please please dont judge us if a case doesnt go to court sexual abuse which happed a very long time ago is hard to prove but we know what has happened and these sick individuals should pay for ruining our lives as i know i am still suffering a great deal..
as said befor it could be anyone father brother policeman judge ministers anyone .
please help stop this by reporting it as soon as possible as the evidence will be there the sooner the better,

[evil][evil][evil]

[zarapopet]

you are completely wrong these sick bas..... know exactly what they are doing they are very clever sick individuals.
i am a victim of 20 years of mental physical and sexual abuse .
we get no justice for the pain and trauma caused to us which is a life sentance .i fought for 4yrs to get my abusers sent down but failed due to nobody stasnding by me and 1 to 1 dont count . the sick bas.... got of with it . i want to hurt him as much as hes hurt me but guess what ill be sent down now wheres my justice i can never get it.
they shoiuld all be put on stroma with an electric fence so cant get of at least some of us would be safe. i gather these people who think they are ill have had a great life .
my life was hell and still is because of my family i have been disowned by them as they have stuck by the beast who abused me for all these years. him being a officer in the army meen anyone can be an abuser be it police drs ministers teachers ect....
you have to act quick if the abuse is going on for to get the evidence you need . getting some one whom sees whats going on to stand by you 100& or theres no point they will get away with it as they are time and time again. lets try to let our kids have a safe and happy childhood.

from a very hurt and very angry zarapopet , [evil] [evil] [evil]

[Rheghead]

they should all be castrated and then stabbed bit by bit so you can see them feel pain . to show how much pain we hads to injur through years and years of abuse i was one of these victims and getting the justice you deserve wont happen i tried to get justice for 4 years for the 20 years of abuse i incured but due to nobody else comming forward the sick bas....... got of . we will never get the justice we deserve with the law the way it is who suffers again us time and time again.
when a case doesnt go to court it is believed they are not guilty and people call you a lier and cross the street.
please please dont judge us if a case doesnt go to court sexual abuse which happed a very long time ago is hard to prove but we know what has happened and these sick individuals should pay for ruining our lives as i know i am still suffering a great deal..
as said befor it could be anyone father brother policeman judge ministers anyone .
please help stop this by reporting it as soon as possible as the evidence will be there the sooner the better,

[evil][evil][evil]

A perfect example why victims and their families should take no part in sentencing. Justice is for all not just who victims think deserve it. You have a right to express anger and nobody will deny you that but anger has no place in the judicial process. We have inherited a judicial process from centuries of trial and error, it isn't perfect but it is time tested and is the best anybody has come up with so far. As you say evidence is everything, I would be happy for a 1000 murderers and child abusers to go free on a lack of evidence than one innocent person to be found guilty on the same deal.

[John Baikie]

I'm kinda in the riggerboy camp on this one, and none of the pc nonsense i've read on here has convinced me otherwise. they don't deserve any sympathy or understanding. Putting someone in jail for robbing grannies may make them stop, but a man who gets sexually aroused looking at young children cannot change, and there is only one (or two) options to fix it.

[Rheghead]

I'm kinda in the riggerboy camp on this one, and none of the pc nonsense i've read on here has convinced me otherwise. they don't deserve any sympathy or understanding. Putting someone in jail for robbing grannies may make them stop, but a man who gets sexually aroused looking at young children cannot change, and there is only one (or two) options to fix it.

Yes but how could you be 100% sure that you had your man? Could you let it lie on your concience if wrong? A paediatrician got mobbed just because of the name of his job, that is how this reaction to such crimes makes some folk react.

[John Baikie]

Yes but how could you be 100% sure that you had your man? Could you let it lie on your concience if wrong? A paediatrician got mobbed just because of the name of his job, that is how this reaction to such crimes makes some folk react.

Oh I'd like to be certain it was the right bollox that were being chopped off. That goes without saying. But once I was sure....snip...snip....no further questions your honour.

[Rheghead]

Oh I'd like to be certain it was the right bollox that were being chopped off. That goes without saying. But once I was sure....snip...snip....no further questions your honour.

And what if 20 years later the girl came clean and said she made a false accusation out of spite because she didn't like the new man in her mother's life because she still wanted mummy and daddy to get back together?:confused

[northener]

I'm kinda in the riggerboy camp on this one, and none of the pc nonsense i've read on here has convinced me otherwise. they don't deserve any sympathy or understanding. Putting someone in jail for robbing grannies may make them stop, but a man who gets sexually aroused looking at young children cannot change, and there is only one (or two) options to fix it.


PC nonsense? So furthering our understanding of why people commit crimes to try and enable us to combat it more effectively is being 'PC' is it?

[Boozeburglar]

Just to clarify, I am not suggesting for a moment that having sympathy or trying to understand what makes these people tick is an evil in itself. However, I would like to know the underlying reason some cannot act more 'naturally' in response to this issue. Often those who have been abuse victims engage in lifelong denial, and can exhibit sympathy for those that abuse them; often this perverse reaction can prevent them from acting in their best interests, or those of others. It is perhaps useful for anyone feeling so benign to examine their rationale.

[northener]

....... However, I would like to know the underlying reason some cannot act more 'naturally' in response to this issue. .......

Some people fight with their heart BB. I prefer to fight with my head.......

[Metalattakk]

However, I would like to know the underlying reason some cannot act more 'naturally' in response to this issue.

It's not a question of 'cannot', more a case of having the intelligence and awareness to choose to override the base instinct to cut bits off them.

Murderous revolt won't stop these people doing what they do. Understanding why they do it and working out how to treat it, might.

[John Baikie]

PC nonsense? So furthering our understanding of why people commit crimes to try and enable us to combat it more effectively is being 'PC' is it?

Understanding why a monster gets sexual kicks out of babies and small children is not going to stop it. I can see the point of your argument in many examples of criminal activity, but this is a whole different thing. They cannot be changed. Their sexual preference is always going to be the same.

[zarapopet]

HI I KNOW FULL WELL WHOM MY ABUSERS WERE AND THEY ALL DESERVE TO BE BEHIND BARS NOT FREE TO CONTINUE TO ABUSE AS THEY NEVER CHANGE, WE HAVE TO CHANGE THE WAY THE JUSTICE SYSTEM WORKS IN THESE DIFFICULT TO PROVE CASES IE ONE AGAINST ONE SHOULD BE ALLOUD , AS WE NEVER GET OUR CHANCE IN COURT TO CONVICT THE PEOPLE WHOM BETRADE OUR TRUST AND TOOK AWAY OUR INNOCENCE. PUTTING THEM ON A REGISTER IS AT LEAST SOME KIND OF JUSTICE FOR US [evil]

[Rheghead]

They cannot be changed. Their sexual preference is always going to be the same.

Then how come they do make that change? In the wasters thread that I started recently, folk were saying we can only give them the support unconditionally to help make them do it, it is them that have to make that decision and all of them know that what they're doing is wrong. As I said before, no one wakes up and decides to be a child sex abuser. Making a change is a whole lot harder than staying as you are and it is much harder if you know that nobody in society is baying for your blood, so what is the incentive? The fact that most do change is a testament that it is treatable with corrective help and support.

[Phill]

These people need to be removed from society, that is simple, basic and fundamental standard in my opinion.
However I do not have enough faith in the Police, SCJS, CPS, the Courts System et al to allow anyone to be sent off to the gallows, skinning, burning at the stake etc. etc.

I do believe these people are sick and they are not simply criminals. I do not think they carry out these crimes & harmful acts through a clear decisive choice, they do not sit mentally in the mainstream of society nor do they sit on the edges. They are twisted, sick, depraved and disillusioned individuals.
But neither are they among a group of bored individuals that of an evening after having a drink and a smoke decide to go and nick a motor and go for a joyride. Neither of these crimes is right or justified but there is a difference centred around choice.
I believe these people have compulsions and urges that most of us cannot accept nor understand, this is not a defence nor sympathy but an objective viewpoint.

I grew up living a few doors away from a paedophile and can stand testament to some of their guile and cunning, and from and outside stance can see the deep, deep, utterly destructive harm that they inflict even to those who are not their direct victims.

But to concentrate on dragging out the paedophiles and sending them to the gallows or putting them to the wall is not going to stop future offenders. Trying to get into the mindset and gather an understanding as to what is going on in their minds might just help in creating a method of detection and prevention before the harm is done.
I remember a case a few years ago after a paedophile had served his time he pleaded not to be released from prison because he said he couldn't help himself or stop himself from re-offending.

Upon detection and sentencing, remove them from society and look seriously at any attempt at re-introducing them to society, can they be rehabilitated I don't know. But trying to hide them in society isn't doing either party any favours. Serious and in-depth psychological work is part of the way forward.

It is a very complex issue and the more insight that can be sought the better to help children in the future.



I write all this one caveat though, if my children are ever harmed, I will find you!

[Boozeburglar]

Most addicts change when they need to, to gain liberty. The do not become non-addicts in this way, they are performing.

They learn to moderate their behaviours when necessary.

My ex, and best friend, is one of the leading experts in this area; and I know far more than I can go into here.

I have resolved all my liberal feelings, (if you read up you will see I am a liberal thinker).

There is a time for anger. A time for revenge.

There is no more appropriate target than these people.

[squidge]

I dont think anyone has sympathy for paedophiles.Those of us that advocate another viewpoint apart from the hang them flog them an cut off their bits simply believe that mob rule is never the answer to anything.

I am aware of the effects that abuse can have on those who suffer. whilst i am thankful that this knowledge does not come to me first hand I have been moved to tears of outrage, sadness and horror by what people in utter despair have chosen to share with me. However if i found out any of my children were hurt or abused by someone I too would want to kill or physically maim the person responsible but that is a gut feeling, a primeval urge to kill the agressor in order to protect my young. I know that in a civilised society this is not the right thing to do. Zarapopet talks about the shortcomings of the justice system and her pain at not getting justice is clear and raw. It is understandable that she feels angry, bitter and humiliated by the process. This is the area that needs the attention. Making the justice system fit for purpose so that it can deal quickly effectively and thoroughly with paedophiles, It must keep track of them and it must treat them in such a way that it ensures that re offending is minimised.

Unfortunately we absolutely have to learn to "understand" what makes a paedophile a paedophile. Why do these people abuse children. We need to decide how to deal with those who are in danger of carrying out this behaviour. I dont pretend to know and understand the reasons why people are this way but as a society we cant hide our heads under the sheets in fear and then scream for blood when what we were hiding from confronts us.

Its interesting that no one answered my question about what they would do if their child came to them sobbing and confessed they had sexual feelings about children and they were afraid. Maybe we can all feel horror at the thought that our child might be prey to a paedophile but maybe none of us can imagine that our child could actually BE that abuser. Despite this every single sick twisted cruel evil perpetrator was someones child -so what would YOU do?

[zarapopet]

if the child is young enough you would hope that they could get the help ie therapys befor it is to late .
catch them the younger the better.
i hear there is a place in inverness that is supposed to help peds reform. not sure this will work as the longer they abuse the harder it is to change there way of thinking.
i know a lot of people are so afraid of speaking out or cpming forward as they will never get the justice we so rightly deserve . if the case is droped due to lack of evidence these sick people arnt even put on a regiser so it wouldnt show up in a disclosure so they are free to get jobs in schools hospitals ect so what now . [evil]

[sevenfortyseven]

Thing that worries me about this case was that the men in this 'ring' were in some cases normal, upstanding members of the community (one of them was chairman of LGBT Scotland). Some of them were young men who if you saw them in the street you wouldnt think they were as sick as they were.

Im not gonna pretend to know anything about what to do to criminals but bringing back the death penalty isnt a bad start. Failing that lock them up for life in a state hospital like they do in california. Yeah the taxpayer foots the bill but atleast then we know where they are and what theyre doing. Cant put a price on that.

[brandy]

its a sad day that we live in when the guilty are innocent, and the innocent are guilty.
if someone hurt one of my children i would move heaven and earth to make sure that that person paid for the rest of their lives.
i would not rest, until i knew that the monster was locked away where they could not hurt another person.
everyday, the battered, raped, mutilated bodies of children are found all over the world.
but its ok.. because the thing that did it is sick and not in their right mind. they cant help their selves. obviously we know they are sick and not in their right minds.
dosent mean they should not be punished.
if you were a kleptomaniac and walked into a shop and stole things... would someone be telling the police.. its ok.. they have a prob. they cant help their selves? sorry no it dosent work that way.
personally, i believe in capital punishment.
when there is no shadow of doubt, then yes if that person deserves the death sentence then give it to them.
why should we as tax payers keep them in a better way that we ourselves live, when they have murdered, tortured and destroyed lives.
in all honesty i think that they should toughen up the prison systems.
make it to where its not a nice place to work.
bring back the chain gangs.. make the do hard labour.
its a punishment not a reward.
you want to talk reform?
then do something to make criminals reform...
giving them a slap on the hand.. you bad boy!
putting them to therapy.. oh no my mother didnt love me..
or my personal favourite.. (and i am religious)
PRAISE JESUS I HAVE FOUND THE LORD.. im a brand new man!
so many times i have seen all these things and it is just a front to get out again and go back to what they were doing before.
Victims are called victims for a reason..
maybe its time we stopped worrying about what is PC, and do what is right.

[zarapopet]

i agree 100 % we need toi change the law so we the victims can get the justice we so rightly deserve we were robed of our chilhood and innocence . fighting for 4 years now as i look at it was a waste of time i punished myself even more while he got of with it.
when i herd the case fell through i wanted my own justice so bad that i have now got a conviction and had to do 2 years prob how irronic is that i got longer than they prob would have .
i still am very angry these individuals will get away with it time and time again as they have more rights than there victims.agh...........[evil][evil][evil]

[sweetpea]

I'm kinda in the riggerboy camp on this one, and none of the pc nonsense i've read on here has convinced me otherwise. they don't deserve any sympathy or understanding. Putting someone in jail for robbing grannies may make them stop, but a man who gets sexually aroused looking at young children cannot change, and there is only one (or two) options to fix it.


I'm with you on this, but when you say pc non sense I refer to too many laws made in Europe referring to ''human rights'. The only method I favour is castration and solitary, chemical castration has too many unknown side effects which may make them apppear 'normal'.

[Whitewater]

I can see both points of view in this thread, I don't pretend to know which one is correct.

I was at a meeting last night and afterwards a few of us fell into discussion regarding this topic, we came to the conclussion that their brains (the paedophiles) did not work in the same way as ours, there was an inbuilt fault, and no amount of therapy would be able to correct it as the thought process was flawed.

If, as a child had I been abused or more recently if any of my children had been abused, I know, because of the type of person I am, I would not rest until I had retribution of some sort.

I agree with Phil, these people have to be removed from society. Reforming some people does work, but with others, who have a flawed mind it is a waste of time, it is very easy for them to say ''yes sir, I'm a reformed person now, I've seen the error of my ways, I'll never do it again sir'' How often have we seen people released early, and are back inside in a matter of weeks, having committed the same crime or crimes all over again.

I also agree that we have to find out how their mind works so that we can prevent it ever happening again.

Sadly all the thought appears to be on finding out what goes on in the paedophiles mind, nobody has thought to look into the victims mind to try to fix the damage done there. It is obvious by the comments made here that that damage appears to last for ever.

[zarapopet]

i personaly dont think they can be reformed . these sick individuals are very clever they know what to say to kids to stop them telling.i was petrified of my father ect and only divolged what happened a few years ago.
as to say about the sufffering still it hurrendious ie i have mental health issues the flash backs are so realistic .
some times i realy cant cope with these feelings i want to give up . then theres no more pain as its so deep it hurts real bad. :~(:~(
im now at a looose end in how to get the justice and closure one deserves any clues

[Vistravi]

i personaly dont think they can be reformed . these sick individuals are very clever they know what to say to kids to stop them telling.i was petrified of my father ect and only divolged what happened a few years ago.
as to say about the sufffering still it hurrendious ie i have mental health issues the flash backs are so realistic .
some times i realy cant cope with these feelings i want to give up . then theres no more pain as its so deep it hurts real bad. :~(:~(
im now at a looose end in how to get the justice and closure one deserves any clues


Reading your posts zarapopet is hard honey. You're pain is so raw. I hope you do get justice and i do not blame you for trying to give your abuser justice yourself. Never give up on getting justice. You will get it one day. It's as soon as you give up that you'll never get it.

Your abuser will get what is coming to him and you will feel better in yourself one day and prove to him that you are strong enough to overcome it and live your life happily.

I have been told by many people that i am a good listener so if you feel like talking just drop me a message.

[zarapopet]

Thanks vistriva its great to know theres decent folk out there :d

[riggerboy]

i completely agree with zarapoppet,

they cannot be fixed, and unless your that way you will never understand what causes it,
we "normal folk" find it disgusting however "they" say it is normal to them, we cannot let this continue if a dog bites we shoot it, if any animal goes wrong we kill it, if the peados are guilty then we hould have a public hanging and send out the message that we will not tolerate this sort of thing,

yes we may hang a person that has a mental fuse not earthing correctly but there is no medical cure,

i remember watching a documentry about a bloke that was sent to prison for being a peado, he asked to have his dangly bits removed so that he would be no threat to kids again,
he knew himself that after all the rehab and discussions he was still a risk to kids yet the home office still said he was a new man and was no risk, who do you believe ???????

[Whitewater]

Zarapopet, I have no way of contemplating how you must feel. I know that getting retribution would go a long way towards making you a happier person, but that alone will not cure the problem. I think you have to get help, but I'm not sure how you should go about that. But a problem shared will help to reduce the pain. Vistravi has offered you help, accept the offer.

[Boozeburglar]

I would strongly advise you approach only qualified counsellors. Well meaning individuals are not always a safe pair of hands with this issue.

[NLP]

Zarapopet, I have no way of contemplating how you must feel. I know that getting retribution would go a long way towards making you a happier person, but that alone will not cure the problem. I think you have to get help, but I'm not sure how you should go about that. But a problem shared will help to reduce the pain. Vistravi has offered you help, accept the offer.

Her Doctor can refer her to a counsellor shouldn't take to long to get an appointment, don't know where Zarapopet stays but in Wick they were in the old medical centre.

[zarapopet]

i would kill my abusers as i had my chilhood and innocence robed by these guys and yes they were all family members and the justice system gave them more rights than myself i dont know why they wont let us fight one againsl one we know full well what we were put through daily . we the victims suffer again .i spent 30 hours tellin g my story on a tape and video it is degrading having to dscribe exactly what they made me do and i feel it was for nothing as didnt get the justice i deserve .they wernt even put on the sex offenders reg as case didnt get 2 court. we talk about disclosures to keep the kids safe well it wouldnt go on a disclosure so whats the point of it they be able to offend again and again. also a leopard never changes its spots i should know. he was a piller of the comunity and people thought he was great my arse i know different......[evil]

[Aaldtimer]

...has this :- http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/paedophile-rapist-to-be-beheaded-and-crucified-in-saudi-arabia-1814475.html :eek:

[Rheghead]

...has this :- http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/paedophile-rapist-to-be-beheaded-and-crucified-in-saudi-arabia-1814475.html :eek:

Perhaps all those baying for blood should move out to Saudi?

[mrjolly]

Perhaps all those baying for blood should move out to Saudi?i say lets do what the saudi"s do with them.

[northener]

"While Saudi Arabia carries out numerous beheadings -- 102 last year, according to Amnesty International - crucifixions are relatively rare. The last one appears to have been in May, when the headless body of a sex murderer was displayed in the capital."

Whilst the guy could be described as getting what he deserved....did the previous beheadings and crucifixion deter him? No, not one little bit.

And that's why I keep banging on about trying to get inside their heads - not just bumping them off.

All some on here are doing are advocating a course of events after the crime has been committed, with absolutely no thought or ideas coming forth about how to prevent these despicable crimes in the first place. Too late pal, another kids been abused and all you can do is shake your fist at the sky....

If execution is such a fantastic deterrent (as I'm sure some on here believe) - why do countries with 'robust' execution policies still have to keep executing people for committing the crime in the first place?

Answers on a Death Warrant please.....

[zarapopet]

how do we get these sick individuals into therapy when 95% get of with it do you think they are going to own up to what they are doing .no so how do we protect our kids . yes we need to get everyone whom was abused befor to go around the schools but this is still a tabo subject and people rather say nothing as its a lot easier than all the stress of going to police make statements and get all the emotions one hid all these years reserfice for what we get nothing out of it as ive said befor they get of with it and people blame you for lying cross the road and disown u i lost everything when i came forward because the law doesnt do one against one .wheres the justice in that tell me im the one who lost all he still hAS THE FAMILY ECT ive nothing but a mental health problem now on how to cope with the unjust in these situations.
where are the support groups for us .yet you want support for the abusers come on they will never change and thats been proven time and time again.

[northener]

.....
.
where are the support groups for us .yet you want support for the abusers come on they will never change and thats been proven time and time again.



You say I am "want(ing) support for the abusers", Oh no I'm not. I'm trying to get across the fact that all a lot people are talking about on here is what will take place after the crime has been committed.

Much better to try and prevent the problems in the first place, surely?

[John Baikie]

cutting bollox off can only help prevent it. talking to the creeps certainly won't

[golach]

cutting bollox off can only help prevent it. talking to the creeps certainly won't
You would find that a touch difficult when the pedophile is a female

[northener]

cutting bollox off can only help prevent it. talking to the creeps certainly won't

Cutting them off means the offence has already been committed, a child has been harmed, you've just failed in your duty of protection to that child.


Other types of crime are analysed and profiled, to do that you have to communicate with past offenders, why should this crime be treated any different to, say, a murder or an abduction?

[John Baikie]

You would find that a touch difficult when the pedophile is a female

then we just go for hanging, i'm cool with either to be honest

[John Baikie]

Cutting them off means the offence has already been committed, a child has been harmed, you've just failed in your duty of protection to that child.


Other types of crime are analysed and profiled, to do that you have to communicate with past offenders, why should this crime be treated any different to, say, a murder or an abduction?

and talking to these people will do...what exactly?
what a load of guff you're talking. you can't change these people. They get sexually aroused by small children FFS. It's not asking a guy why he feels a need to steal.

[John Baikie]

This has turned into a typical org debate where the usual suspects can't accept that not everyone has the same PC attitude towards things. I have no intention of spending any more time talking about sitting down and treating these monsters like victims......

(adopts Duncan Ballantyne voice)


And for that reason, I'm out.

[northener]

This has turned into a typical org debate where the usual suspects can't accept that not everyone has the same PC attitude towards things. I have no intention of spending any more time talking about sitting down and treating these monsters like victims......

(adopts Duncan Ballantyne voice)


And for that reason, I'm out.

Nope, you're out because you can't come up with a coherent rational answer to preventing the problem of child abuse.

Goodbye.

[Boozeburglar]

There is a zero rate of recidivism when capital punishment has been applied, Northerner. There would certainly be children saved from abuse in that scenario, regardless of the effect on possible first time offenders.

[John Baikie]

Nope, you're out because you can't come up with a coherent rational answer to preventing the problem of child abuse.

Goodbye.

Actually I did but it wasn't PC enough for you. Goodbye and good luck defending paedophiles.

[tigger2u]

Some of these comments really make me think that people must know what "these People" look like. Do they have "child abuser" printed on their heads no they dont. Some of you really need to take a step back and think about it. the ones that commit these crimes are highly likely to be a family member. Maybe your brother/sister/Aunt or uncle. Im sure it would give you a different view of things if it was you accused too.

I know of 1 guy who was walked in on by a parent while he looked down a childs nappy and she reported him. what would you do if you walked in or if you were that guy.

I also noticed that most people here keep assuming the abusers are guys, I would have thought the recent case in English nursery would have opened your eyes that is isnt always guys that can do this.

[Metalattakk]

Actually I did but it wasn't PC enough for you. Goodbye and good luck defending paedophiles.

Show me where anyone, and I mean anyone, has defended paedophiles in this thread.

Your comments are idiotic.

[maverick]

reading some of these posts, it has become evident to me that an education is definately wasted on a fool. Ok child abuse happens because a child or children get abused, we all got that. sadly this has to happen in order for the afore mentioned abuse to become a crime, now it doesn't matter if you are not directly involved in the abuse, that is to say the physical act, and are involved in the subscription of child porn etc, you are still a paedophile. Now in my opinion if you are an abused child and are being molested on a regular basis just for the sick gratification of other sick individuals, once these people are arrested and gone through due process of law and are found guilty, should be sentenced to death, then a least the child who was abused could be told that the bad man won't be coming back to do it again, perhaps this would give some closure to the abused. the other good thing about the death penalty is that it is 100% guaranteed that there will be no chance of reoffending. Adults who murder and rape other adults is bad enough, but adults who murder and beast young defenceless children should have no right to live among us either in gaol or on the street. If someone was to beast one of my children I can assure you now that the same individual would never spend one day in prison, and I have no problem being judge, jury and executioner. God may have mercy on his soul, I WONT!

[nightowl]

You say I am "want(ing) support for the abusers", Oh no I'm not. I'm trying to get across the fact that all a lot people are talking about on here is what will take place after the crime has been committed.

Much better to try and prevent the problems in the first place, surely?

How? As has been explained on here the abusers have no remorse, conscience or feelings of guilt, indeed denying any wrongdoing at all, so why on earth would they come forward before the abuse to ask for treatment or counselling. How can they be identified before starting to abuse? It seems all the law can do - and only if proper legislation is in place - is to deal with these sick individuals as soon as they expose themselves for what they are, and remove them from society before they can harm any more innocents. There still linger bad memories of Cleveland and Orkney, but lessons must have been learned and Child Protection methods must have improved since then, giving a much more sensitive approach to recognizing damaged children and giving them a voice. So without being on a permanent witchhunt we should all do our bit to ensure our children grow up in innocence and safety.

[Rheghead]

Actually I did but it wasn't PC enough for you. Goodbye and good luck defending paedophiles.

You may hate paedos and I can understand that but at least they have the decency to drive well within the speed limit whilst passing schools, you can't say that for everyone.

[_Ju_]

There is a zero rate of recidivism when capital punishment has been applied, Northerner. There would certainly be children saved from abuse in that scenario, regardless of the effect on possible first time offenders.

So then we apply capital punishment to pedophiles. How long before they think it is better to kill the child they are abusing, usually the only witness, in the hope they can "get away with it"? Capital punishment has done nothing to reduce violent crime in the USA, and infact, is suspected of hightening the desperation of the criminals.

[northener]

It amazes me how many people on here don't have the gumption to see beyond acts of revenge or simply calling for execution as a punishment with no thought to prevention in the first place.

At no point have I advocated leniency towards convicted paedophiles. What I have continually stressed is the need to find ways of preventing these crimes taking place in the first place. All this has met with is comments like "what's the point?" or "it won't make any difference".

Recidivism is a big problem, I know. Personally I'd see the handing out of sentances toughened up enormously - but that will not stop anyone from committing an offence in the first place.

It's funny how no-one in the 'hang them' crowd has come up with a credible answer to my comments regarding the previous crucifixion of sex offenders in Saudi and how this has failed to stop a mass rapist. Co0me on then? Why is it still a problem in countries with the death penalty?

Or am I to assume you really don't give a rat's arse about how many kids get abused - as long as you have someone to hang as a method of massaging your own Egos and convincing yourselves you're 'doing something about the problem'?

(Pats on the back all round, self-satisfied grins and a bit of gory entertainment....job done).

Not.

[northener]

Actually I did but it wasn't PC enough for you. Goodbye and good luck defending paedophiles.

You've already flounced my friend. At least have the decency to stay flounced.[lol]

[northener]

How? As has been explained on here the abusers have no remorse, conscience or feelings of guilt, indeed denying any wrongdoing at all, so why on earth would they come forward before the abuse to ask for treatment or counselling. How can they be identified before starting to abuse? It seems all the law can do - and only if proper legislation is in place - is to deal with these sick individuals as soon as they expose themselves for what they are, and remove them from society before they can harm any more innocents. There still linger bad memories of Cleveland and Orkney, but lessons must have been learned and Child Protection methods must have improved since then, giving a much more sensitive approach to recognizing damaged children and giving them a voice. So without being on a permanent witchhunt we should all do our bit to ensure our children grow up in innocence and safety.

Thanks for a coherent and intelligent response Nightowl...one of only a few.

I agree that in many cases (as in any area of criminal activity) it is only possible to combat this problem when the problem first rears it's ugly head. As Boozeburglar points out, execution would prevent recividism - but so would life imprisonment - but does nothing to prevent first time offences.

The big difference with child sex crimes is that we are not dealing with run of the mill criminals whose criminal activities mainly fall into two categories - accumulation of wealth or violence for the sake of violence.
We are dealing with a category of offender who 'does not play by the rules' and will go to extraordinay lengths to avoid detection - as already stated by many on this thread. And thats why we need as much intelligence from these people as we can possibly get.

Once you've executed them - that intelligence is gone forever.
However, if someone is incarcerated for life (or a very lengthy prison sentance) that source of information and intelligence is still there to be mined for years to come. Unless (as i suspect some on here believe) that once they are arrested all offenders just say "It's a fair cop, Guv. I'll tell all I know"...my arse they will.

Execute them and win a battle. Lock them up and you may just win the war.

[Rheghead]

I'm sorry northerner but I'd like to see summat more radical. I'd like to see existing and more drop-in centres with specially trained staff who can welcome in those people (without judgement) who have the urge to harm children for counselling without fear of being accused of condoning the crimes which they are there to prevent. I'd like to see a full bottom up and top down shake up of the social dept in such a way that social workers feel that they are valued by society and their paymasters. I want social workers to look forward to go to work instead of being felt taken for granted, a volunteer is better than ten pressed men. I'd like to see a change in public attitudes towards compulsive behavior disorders in general, it isn't all their own fault. I'd like to see a shake up on the funding for all this, we need to get into a mindset that says a penny spent is ten pence saved. How much is spent on paedos after conviction in terms of policing, prison and compo to victims when a little pro-active social working with real powers and funding could slash the tax burden. We need to get into the politics of management of good sense rather than management by crisis and exception. Ach, my 2p. Take it or leave it I'm past caring for now. :~(

[Boozeburglar]

So then we apply capital punishment to pedophiles. How long before they think it is better to kill the child they are abusing, usually the only witness, in the hope they can "get away with it"? Capital punishment has done nothing to reduce violent crime in the USA, and infact, is suspected of hightening the desperation of the criminals.

If you want a debate on the merits of capital punishment, please start a new thread. I am answering a post by Northener; not advocating the death penalty.

I am specifically addressing the issue of repeat offending; making the point that the deterrent quality of capital punishment is irrelevant when it removes opportunity for repeat offending completely, (we already established there is little way of identifying first time offenders before they offend, so the way we deal with those who have offended is a very relevant question), and thus would save many who would otherwise become victims to repeat offenders. (Child abuse not being a capital crime could be argued to have little impact in deterring perpetrators from murdering their victims, but is certainly one reason why they are released at some point to abuse more..)

Again, I am not advocating cp, just pointing out one effect that is undeniable.

[zarapopet]

you talk about stopping these sickos from ac ting on there urges befor they offend . what a lot of crap when my abuse started i was told if i told anyone what was happening i wouild be put in a home away from the rest of my family , that i would be put in jail so what do you think a 7year old would do keep it to them selves also in our heads was would anyone believe me. my brothers started at the age of 15 weather he had seen what my father was doing .
my innocence was robed from me and the fact of i couldnt trust anyone not even my mother ect where was she in all this she was supposed to protect me. when i eventual told the police what was going on and happened for 20yrs whos side did she take certainly not mine .
4 years fighting for justice was shear hell to be told lack of evidence the case was dropped do you not think i know what they put me through but that aint enough.and you want me to give these sick perverted people a chance no way im still suffering after the trauma caused to me yet these sick individuals are getting on with a normal life holidays ect come on we need to put an end to these crimes by letting us get the justice we need in the courts .they need to change the law to get us our justice.
i am still traumatised by what i was put through bet he aint bothered at all.

[evil][evil][evil]

[highland red]

cutting bollox off can only help prevent it. talking to the creeps certainly won't

I'm glad someone brought up "bollox": there is certainly enough being spouted on this particular subject from one side and the hang em high to let's pretend it doesn't happen in my area/community to last us for a long while.

It's a subject always sure of a "good" response from both ends of the spectrum. I wouldn't say that anyone is right or wrong to have their particular points of view but I dare say that when this subject eventually blows itself out on this forum, nothing anyone has said from one side to the other will have changed anything one jot.

And as the person equating himself/herself with a certain Mr Pierpoint, well, as someone that me and my family knew socially (and professionally for me): he was always the consumate gentleman and professional and given the context of your flippant reference: I doubt you would be fit to lace his boots.;)

[Vistravi]

You may hate paedos and I can understand that but at least they have the decency to drive well within the speed limit whilst passing schools, you can't say that for everyone.

Unfortunatly this argument doesn't fall in the same league as a pedophille will do much more damage to someone than being hit by a car doing over 20 mph past a school. The car may kill the child but the metal damage done to the abused child lasts a lifetime and many abused children feel that they can't tell anyone and that sometimes leads to them killing themselves just to escape the abuse and its effects.

These two situations are two different traumatic situations and can never be compared.

[Vistravi]

how do we get these sick individuals into therapy when 95% get of with it do you think they are going to own up to what they are doing .no so how do we protect our kids . yes we need to get everyone whom was abused befor to go around the schools but this is still a tabo subject and people rather say nothing as its a lot easier than all the stress of going to police make statements and get all the emotions one hid all these years reserfice for what we get nothing out of it as ive said befor they get of with it and people blame you for lying cross the road and disown u i lost everything when i came forward because the law doesnt do one against one .wheres the justice in that tell me im the one who lost all he still hAS THE FAMILY ECT ive nothing but a mental health problem now on how to cope with the unjust in these situations.
where are the support groups for us .yet you want support for the abusers come on they will never change and thats been proven time and time again.

He will do it again and with the evidence from you and the child he does it to he will pay and the family that thought he was right and you were wrong will come running back to you for forgiveness. The question would be, would you forgive them when that happens? I know that in your place i would not.

You are absoultly right. They can not be reformed. They are sick in the mind not insane and that can't be writen of as insanity in court.

You were brave and strong to come forward and tell the police about what your abusers did to you and for that alone you should feel proud. There are people who are abused as children and never tell or try to fight and get justice.

You should've been loved and cherished for what you were, a blessing and a treasure. But i care deeply for other people particulary children. And if anything that today at work showed, i would never let any harm come to a child and make sure they had everything they needed from me. Your father is a monster for what he stole from you and he will be punished.

[oldmarine]

you talk about stopping these sickos from ac ting on there urges befor they offend . what a lot of crap when my abuse started i was told if i told anyone what was happening i wouild be put in a home away from the rest of my family , that i would be put in jail so what do you think a 7year old would do keep it to them selves also in our heads was would anyone believe me. my brothers started at the age of 15 weather he had seen what my father was doing .
my innocence was robed from me and the fact of i couldnt trust anyone not even my mother ect where was she in all this she was supposed to protect me. when i eventual told the police what was going on and happened for 20yrs whos side did she take certainly not mine .
4 years fighting for justice was shear hell to be told lack of evidence the case was dropped do you not think i know what they put me through but that aint enough.and you want me to give these sick perverted people a chance no way im still suffering after the trauma caused to me yet these sick individuals are getting on with a normal life holidays ect come on we need to put an end to these crimes by letting us get the justice we need in the courts .they need to change the law to get us our justice.
i am still traumatised by what i was put through bet he aint bothered at all.

[evil][evil][evil]

Zarapopet: Your abuse must have been a hellish nightmare for you. It must have been awefull for family members not to believe you. For your own mental health, you will have to give up your anger and try to seek a way to forgive those you feel wronged you. Perhaps it is not too late to seek professional help.

[NLP]

Zarapopet: Your abuse must have been a hellish nightmare for you. It must have been awefull for family members not to believe you. For your own mental health, you will have to give up your anger and try to seek a way to forgive those you feel wronged you. Perhaps it is not too late to seek professional help.


oldmarine your words are so true, people in this situation do need to forgive in some way or they go crazy with the memories, to move on one has to forgive you won't ever forget but life can be bearable.

[Boozeburglar]

Forget what you are being fed here, if the abuser is not even admitting guilt then you are a long way from even considering forgiveness.

Furthermore, it is beyond reason to suggest you should forgive an unrepentant abuser who put you through hell and back again when they could have confessed.

It is for no one but the victim to choose whether forgiveness is even a concept involved here.

[Metalattakk]

That's uncalled for, Boozeburglar. People are only trying to help.

[Rheghead]

I'd like to see the word paedophile to become obsolete because they don't love children.

[oldmarine]

I'd like to see the word paedophile to become obsolete because they don't love children.

Reghead: I believe pedophile's love for children is in the wrong manner. Certainly not like a parent should love their children.

[Boozeburglar]

That's uncalled for, Boozeburglar. People are only trying to help.

The day I look to you for approval I will let you know.

If you have anything relevant to say about my remarks, let us hear it.

I stand by what I say.

[Metalattakk]

The day I look to you for approval I will let you know.
I would have it no other way.


If you have anything relevant to say about my remarks, let us hear it.
I said what I said, I don't really think I need to say it again. Have a read of my post up there ↑ if you're still feeling confused.

[sids]

Did anyone read the letter from Stuart Leggat to Mark Cummings Mother in the NOTW today?

[Stavro]

Paedophiles come from all walks of life. The majority are male, but there are female abusers too. The true picture is unclear, and if the perpetrator is female it's even more so.
As it often the case convictions are thin on the ground. :roll: