View Full Version : Peter Tobin
God, that programme just made me weep. My wee cousin works for Reliance going back and fore to Glasgow Sheriff Court and he said to me last year he had Tobin in his van and "he was a quiet, unassuming man" someone you wouldn't give a second thought too. How freaked out I was when Vicki Hamilton's family said the same of him at the trial.
Aren't programes like this frightening?:(
Melancholy Man
10-Dec-08, 23:26
Vicky would have been ages with me. Paedophiles and sex offenders have passed through hospitals in which I've worked, and they were always highly charming with the young female staff!
Tobin was far from a charming paedophile. He was a brutal psychopath. Thats how i see him. Maybe thats why he has convinced me that sometimes capital punishment needs to be a choice.
Vicky would have been ages with me. Paedophiles and sex offenders have passed through hospitals in which I've worked, and they were always highly charming with the young female staff!
Eh not sure what you mean, did you nurse Bible John or something?
Tobin was far from a charming paedophile. He was a brutal psychopath. Thats how i see him. Maybe thats why he has convinced me that sometimes capital punishment needs to be a choice.
Totally with you there.
Melancholy Man
11-Dec-08, 00:01
I'm normally loath to use txtpsk, Sweetpea, but I did laugh out loud there! Bit before my time, I have to say [1]. However, as to Gleeber, this ain't cartoon violence in which the evil dooers at recognizable ugly. Tobin would have avoided detection both from the Police and, horribly, from Vicky because he was, in some way, charming.
[1] And that Tobin has not... yet... been identified as Bible John.
peter tobin looks just like a monster to me！ but i know there are a lot of criminals,who look too good to be evil people like themseves!:D
Well perhaps thats one of the problems with people like Tobin. Too much credit is given to this charming side. Think about his moments of madness. The terror of his victims. I dont see any humanity in Tobin. Perhaps it would be better for people to consider that. The absolute terror of his victims.
George Brims
11-Dec-08, 01:19
With people like that, the charm is all a facade. Prime example is mass murderer Ted Bundy. He was being considered for political office in his home state at one point.
Aaldtimer
11-Dec-08, 04:07
This may be of some interest... http://scotlandonsunday.scotsman.com/scotland/Was-Peter-Tobin-Bible-John.4769105.jp
Vicky would have been ages with me. Paedophiles and sex offenders have passed through hospitals in which I've worked, and they were always highly charming with the young female staff!
thats is a main part of the problem. MOST offenders dont look like paedophiles, and they are not always poor, un-educated, or even male.
you cant tell by chatting to someone of they are a danager to you or your kids, thats why in this day and age, we have to be carefull with everyone, even people you THINK you know and love
Valerie Campbell
11-Dec-08, 11:17
Tobin may come across as mild mannered but who remembers him kicking the photographer or reporter during the Angelika Kluck case? I'm just pleased the Vicky Hamilton case is now closed so the family came move forward. Her face will be imprinted on my mind forever.
Melancholy Man
11-Dec-08, 11:21
Tobin may come across as mild mannered but who remembers him kicking the photographer or reporter during the Angelika Kluck case?
He was cornered at that point. The charm had failed, now the rage started.
thats is a main part of the problem. MOST offenders dont look like paedophiles, and they are not always poor, un-educated, or even male.
you cant tell by chatting to someone of they are a danager to you or your kids, thats why in this day and age, we have to be carefull with everyone, even people you THINK you know and love
i am completely agree with you!
With people like that, the charm is all a facade. Prime example is mass murderer Ted Bundy. He was being considered for political office in his home state at one point.
If you met Ted Bundy outside of his serial killing episodes you would have thought he was a charming and intelligent guy, even his trial judge Edward Cowart thought so and said after sentencing Bundy to death....
"Take care of yourself, young man. I say that to you sincerely; take care of yourself, please. It is an utter tragedy for this court to see such a total waste of humanity as I've experienced in this courtroom. You're a bright young man. You'd have made a good lawyer, and I would have loved to have you practice in front of me, but you went another way, partner. Take care of yourself. I don't feel any animosity toward you. I want you to know that. Once again, take care of yourself."
Ted Bundy was an articulate intelligent and charming person, but on the inside he was a complete monster.
Bad Manners
11-Dec-08, 13:52
Tobin was just one of hundreds of sick individuals that prey on children. he has only come to light because he was caught. How many more Tobins are still out there? You never realy know someone their past and what they have been upto people travel alround the country and start a new life how many neighbour know the background of the new people in the street? You would only know what they told you. not that everyone new is a bad apple heaven forbid. these people hide behind a mask of charming politeness.
Melancholy Man
11-Dec-08, 17:44
thats is a main part of the problem. MOST offenders dont look like paedophiles, and they are not always poor, un-educated, or even male.
you cant tell by chatting to someone of they are a danager to you or your kids, thats why in this day and age, we have to be carefull with everyone, even people you THINK you know and love
i am completely agree with you!
Tobin was just one of hundreds of sick individuals that prey on children. he has only come to light because he was caught. How many more Tobins are still out there? You never realy know someone their past and what they have been upto people travel alround the country and start a new life how many neighbour know the background of the new people in the street? You would only know what they told you. not that everyone new is a bad apple heaven forbid. these people hide behind a mask of charming politeness.
Oh, dear. This is *precisely* what I was driving at when I linked to Bea Campbell's disgraceful article in the Sharon Matthews thread. The reason that there appears to be so many normal people out there may not be because the paedophiles are good at hiding. It may simply be... hush!... that they are normal people.
As we saw with Meehan, contemporary sex-offenders are very quickly identified. Even if Tobin is Bible John, his crimes commenced long before the current pre-occupation with paedophiles and sex-killers. It is reasonable to assume there are still individuals not yet apprehended for old crimes. To assume there is a horde of predators being added to day-in day-out is the first step to witch-hunts (in Campbell's case, literally) and blameless parents being pinned to the ground by armed-police as their children are dragged away like Orpheus' Eurydic.
percy toboggan
11-Dec-08, 19:29
I'd hesitate before suggesting paedophiles are 'normal people' as you have done MM but concede they may assume an air of 'normality'.
Whilst we do need to be careful who we trust around our children we can do more harm than good sometimes by imagining there is an offender, or potential offender on every street or in every neighborhood. Though the latter might likely be so. One lived near me - merely yards away throughout my Son's childhood and I was blissfully unaware of his deviancy until offences came to light later on. To think I almost registered my Lad for his football team.
The man was outwardly 'normal' and harmless. The truth was very different but luckily my family were oblivious to it. Vigilance is required but paranoia isn't.
Monsters like Tobin deserve nothing less than swift despatch on the end of a short rope.
Melancholy Man
12-Dec-08, 00:40
Actually, I was not saying that paedophilia is a natural urge for those in question. My point was that by far the most likely explanation that the normal looking bloke talking to children is that he *is* normal, and not a paedophile who is very good at disguise. In 2000, a gay couple who ran a bookshop in Sutherland were the target of a poison-pen campaign which alleged they were paedophiles; and the Police actually issued a formal statement that they were not, under any circumstances, suspects.
Predatory paedophiles do exist, but, of course, Shannon was not preyed upon by a stranger.
You are absolutely right melancholy man. I remember years ago working with an unassuming unmarried man who ran a scout troop. He wasnt very old - mid thirties and although not openly gay was widely assumed to be so. Although not everyone's favourite colleague he was largely liked. Until, however someone pointed out that they wouldnt be registering their son with a particular scout troop as it was " a bit odd" that this person ran it. Tea room gossip developed as it tends to do and it was soon apparent that people had begun to link this man with homosexuality and as a result with a liking for young boys. It was APPALLING. I remember being horrified and on the day i overheard this conversation I took out my soap box from under my desk and I very loudly one day and very angrily told this group of nasty minded people what I thought about them and their theories. Poor man was beginning to be gien the cold shoulder. There was NOTHING - no history nothing to suggest that this man was anything other than an ordinary guy doing his best for a group of kids. If we allow ourselves to suspect everyone without giving a thought to anything then we are the poorer for it and so are our children. If everyone is a suspect then how do they identify real danger when they see it
percy toboggan
12-Dec-08, 18:47
Actually, I was not saying that paedophilia is a natural urge for those in question. My point was that by far the most likely explanation that the normal looking bloke talking to children is that he *is* normal, and not a paedophile who is very good at disguise. In 2000, a gay couple who ran a bookshop in Sutherland were the target of a poison-pen campaign which alleged they were paedophiles; and the Police actually issued a formal statement that they were not, under any circumstances, suspects.
Predatory paedophiles do exist, but, of course, Shannon was not preyed upon by a stranger.
For one who claims (and sometime demonstrates) a level of intelligence you are mixing up up 'natural' with 'normal'
Your first sentence clearly demonstrates this. Some paedophiles are pre-programmed from birth in my opinion....hence this is a 'natural' but clearly (and thankfully) an abnormal condition. It defies the standards of a civilised society. Anthropologists will know better than I when it became unacceptably abnormal but I suspect it was very early in the development of mankind...even allowing for life expectancy in the mid-twenties.
I will concede that some who prey on children only do so because their developmental failings have limited their abilities to form relationships with adults and they see kids as easier prey. This is brought about by circumstance and cannot be deemed natural, or normal.
I'm not one to split hairs, but normal and natural are two very different concepts and I genuinely hope you will not object to be pointing this out.
What might be 'natural' is most certainly not 'normal' .
........I'm now trying to work out whether what's normal is always natural? (I'll let you know)
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