New Labour, New Lies

[brokencross]

So our friends in New Labour were seriously considering trying to dig the country out of the financial mess it is in by raising VAT to 18.5%. How do we find out...because the document was posted on a website by "mistake". Our future is in these idiots hands!!

They are denying it vigourously, categorically, strenuously etc etc, what a joke.

We have been taxed to the hilt over the past 11 years and they have frittered most of it away on poorly thought out policies and projects, so there is absolutely nothing in reserve "for a rainy day".

They have announced SOME of the proposed tax increases for after the next election to appear to be above board and the honest broker...............or is it spin

Heaven help us if this lot get back in for the historic 4th term. What fiendish taxes await?

They have nearly succeeded in making the country broke with tax and spend and spend tax borrow and spend, spend.........if we let them back in they will finish the job and Britain will be Great no more.

[Gizmo]

Do you rememer what things were like under the Tories?, would you rather we go back to that?, the current government might be full of muppets, but they have to be better than having that blithering public schoolboy twit David Cameron in charge.

[brokencross]

but they have to be better than having that blithering public schoolboy twit David Cameron in charge.

Let me see now Tony Blair spent much of his childhood in Durham, where he was a day pupil at the fee-paying Choristers School and then attended an exclusive Edinburgh boarding school Fettes. Well he was certainly one of the boys, working class and one of us!! Not sure when he attended the Teflon University so that nothing bad would stick to him.

So you can't really diss Cameron for his background.

When the Tories were ousted they handed over a strong economy. They had brought in laws which reigned in some of the powers of the Trade Unions.
Without those law changes and economic foundations New Labour would have foundered much earlier.

Blair and Brown came in on the crest of a wave promising us the earth and all we have got is dirt. When anything went wrong for Labour for the first 7/8 years or so they continued to blame 17 years of Tory rule.

They treat us like fools, lie to us, introduced stealth tax after stealth tax, robbed your pension funds and appeared to have squandered this money. They rob the National Lottery blind to fund New Labour pet projects. Ministers sacked and resigning right left and centre for indiscretions then within a short period of time getting a new better job.

They make policy up PURELY to get elected; whether it be "family friendly" or just plain populist. THEN when in power with their large majority they railroad through the unpopular policies which were not vaunted in the populist manifesto.

I do have some sympathy for Brown, Blair left him a pup. But Brown was at the coal face with Blair for 10 years and had his chance to influence things then.

He and his mate Prudence can't claim all the praise for all that went right financially and then have a "Not me Gov" attitude and blame the rest of the world solely for the position the country is in now.

[Kenn]

Some good points raised there and call me an old cynic if you will but I just don't get the ecomic principals behind the government's thinking unless they have re-writen those laws too!
I am waiting to see when the government will call the banks to task over interest rates, think it could be a long vigil.
All in all a right mess and although there are global factors in the equation why were they not listening when the warnings were issued by various financial institutions over the last few years?
Some honest answers are to be desired but the chance of that is less likely then winning The Euro Millions.

[badger]

That's what we'd all like to know Lizz - how could they not see this coming? Boom has been followed by Bust for as long as anyone, except apparently the Govt., can remember. And since when was the way out of debt to get into more debt or are they just compulsive gamblers?

We're in this mess because too many people borrowed more than they could repay (for all sorts of reasons but that's what it boils down to). So now the Govt. is setting us an example by borrowing more than it can repay (as it has been for years) and exhorting us all to spend, spend, spend so we all get into even more debt. Don't think I quite follow the logic but if anyone would like to explain .....

[muffin]

I'd like to know where all the money went, especially that from North Sea oil, did normal hard working folk benefit, I didn't, did pensioners benefit, I think not judging by their complaints.
It seems to have gone on all those benefits for the unemployed who make a creer out of it and single parents which just encourages them to stay unemployed or have more children to get more benefits.
Every time Labour get in they increase burocracy and the number of Civil Servants who lose our data and hound us for taxes etc. and dream up more underhand ways to get more tax from us.

[purplelady]

Do you rememer what things were like under the Tories?, would you rather we go back to that?, the current government might be full of muppets, but they have to be better than having that blithering public schoolboy twit David Cameron in charge.
here here Gizmo we all forget what it was like under the tories it was bloodly awful i for one will stay with labour thank you

[brokencross]

When Blair came in, I really did have high hopes, but his elequent rhetoric was not followed up by positive actions. In football parlance "he talked a good game".

However, the power, the trappings of power, his control freakery, his fascination with celebrity and his penchant for spin came to the fore very early and his head was turned away from the real business of Government.
He surrounded himself with other sycophants, "yes men" (and women) and of course we all know of Tony's cronies. Everything had to be the Blair New Labour way or no way.
He treated the House of Commons with contempt.
Meetings where important decisions were made were not minuted, so no records, no paper trail, no accountability.
Any inquiry into alleged Goverment failings or indiscretions were limited by the terms of reference set for the inquiry so they couldn't dig too deep and get to the real truth.

As Blairs tenure progressed it was soon obvious he was not the political messiah he professed to be and my hope turned to despair. Browns "election" as Prime Minister has changed nothing except the deception and spin is not as slick as it was under Blair.


here here Gizmo we all forget what it was like under the tories it was bloodly awful i for one will stay with labour thank you
You sound like exactly the sort of voter the Labour lot rely on. Blind loyalty. Loyalty is commenable, a good thing; but unquestioning blind loyalty is rather dangerous. It allows any party to "govern" with impunity. Some of Labours values are really good but surely you agree there needs to be checks and balances along the way.

No matter what mistakes they make, what taxes they increase, what wars they have got us in to, what freedoms they take away, what unfair laws are made, how much money they have wasted..... it would appear that to keep the Tories out, you will always put your cross in the box marked Labour, even if it was a monkey that was standing.
(my sincere apologies to all monkeys everywhere)

[Kenn]

Think I must have been living in a different country as under The Conservatives we managed to buy a house. our son got free university tuition and we had a flourishing business .
What chance any of that now with all the back door taxes?

[MadPict]

Blair pledged to end sleaze and corruption - not embrace it.
They are all getting fat on tax payers money and do everything they can to prevent the public finding out just how fat they really are. Individuals found guilty are forced to resign but you can always be sure they will be back before long - Mandelson is a prime example of their teflon ways...

Politicians of every hue are guilty but those painted red are worse than the rest...

____________________________
The John Lewis List - Never Knowingly Under Claimed...

[badger]

This govt. is really beginning to scare me after the latest nonsense arresting a tory front bencher. Are we really supposed to believe no ministers knew what was going on? Talk about overkill - searching everything, confiscating computers etc., holding him for 9 hours. They knew where he was, why not just talk to him if they had concerns? They claim to support whistleblowers but obviously don't like it when the whistle is blown on them.

How far will they go? They lost the 42 day detention for now but I'm sure it will come back. CC TV everywhere, car nos. logged, mobile and email messages now also logged. Snailmail scanned. I'm beginning to wonder what all the new prisons are for.

Incompetence is one thing but if we lose our freedoms what is left?

[percy toboggan]

I just caught the title of the thread...

New Labour is dead! Time to realise it.
It sank without trace with the pre-budget statement.
Gorson is back where he belongs - on the bridge of an old Labour battleship under siege from an unforgiving capitalism which is turning down. Disaster lurking below the surface. They have never dealt well with this stage of the cycle.

Up periscope!

[Kenn]

All very well percy but do we have a submarine with a sericable periscope for you to purloin?

[percy toboggan]

Sadly not , but I'd love to torpedo Hazel Blears , and I bet that's not been said too often !

[Tom Cornwall]

did anyone see Scottish first minister questions last week? Wee Alex passed the buck on every question, mostly blaming the councils..nothing to do with him and his government. When Alistair Darling was giving the statement last week in the House of Commons, it was packed but, conspicuous in his absence, I didn't see Alex there. I thought he was still getting paid as a member of parliament, or has he given that up now? So it's not just the Labour Party you should be complaining about.

[badger]

They're all as bad as each other. Home buyers' reports (or whatever they're called - can't remember) have been a disaster in England but has that stopped A Salmond? Not a bit, he introduces them when the housing market is at a standstill. Clever.

As for the VAT reduction, did Alistair stop to think for one moment what effect that would have on small businesses having to re-price everything? Must be a complete nightmare. Big stores can presumably program their computers but what about small shops with everything priced? And for what? They claim it would save the average person around £280 pa so we're all going to start spending madly. Most people don't think like that and 2.5% off individual purchases makes so little difference they might just as well not have bothered.

[Fly]

It's long past time the present lot in both the British and Scottish parliaments were consigned to history. I don't know who would be best to replace them, but one thing is for sure, they can't make a bigger mess of Britain than the current lot. "Such a parcel of rogues in a nation" with apologies to Burns for possible misquote.

[domino]

Name an honest politician?

[golach]

Winston Churchill, Harold Wilson, Benjamin Disraeli, William Pitt the Younger, Henry Dundas........they have to be honest, they are all dead[lol]