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Rheghead
19-Sep-08, 12:23
I just wondered how male and female parents feel about men taking their children to playgroups and helping out with the kids where those activities are still predominantly female orientated?

balto
19-Sep-08, 12:27
as long as the gentleman in question has gone through a disclosure scotland then i wouldnt have a problem with it.

Rheghead
19-Sep-08, 12:30
as long as the gentleman in question has gone through a disclosure scotland then i wouldnt have a problem with it.

No problem, I'd only fill one out if the women had to also.

alanatkie
19-Sep-08, 12:32
If it is just for the a day visit so that you can see what things your child gets up to - there is not a problem - they do not have to have a disclosure as they are not allowed to take the other children to toilets etc.

Bad Manners
19-Sep-08, 12:34
I would not find it strange at all. After all children have a mother and father and as such would be quite balanced if men were to assist with play group etc.
If someone has the time and the inclanation to assist then it should not matter what sex,colour or creed they may be.

balto
19-Sep-08, 12:34
If it is just for the a day visit so that you can see what things your child gets up to - there is not a problem - they do not have to have a disclosure as they are not allowed to take the other children to toilets etc.
i assumed it was to work in the playschool, not just for a visit.

balto
19-Sep-08, 12:36
No problem, I'd only fill one out if the women had to also.
everyone whether male or female, if they are working with kids even as a volunteer, have to do a disclosure.

router
19-Sep-08, 12:37
in this feild of work they all have to be police checked if working with a registered organisation.
i don't have a problem with it.

justine
19-Sep-08, 12:44
I dont have a problem at all with men working around kids.:)

It got me thinking though about the fact that alot of people talk about men working with children in playgroups, but you take a child to a doctor,or they end up in A&E, they get a male nurse, or they take the child to the consultants, optitians, mainly men and we never think if the man is ok to be doing this job, so why is it when it comes to playgroups we automaticaaly think, have they been vetted?Strange how we have split thoughts when it comes to men working with kids..

The midwife that delivered my twins was a man, i had no problem with that, but then it could have been a lumberjack and i wold not have cared:Razz

Julia
19-Sep-08, 13:35
I've asked my boy's dad to come along to toddlers with us but he won't go as he knows he would be the only man there, I think I've only ever seen one dad attend mother and toddlers but he was there with the mother also, that was quite a few years ago.

Thumper
19-Sep-08, 13:38
I am all for this,pity more men werent like you rheggers!Its time Dads took a more active role in the childrens life when they can x

northener
19-Sep-08, 13:40
I'd be happy to worki in a playgroup and it's pleasing to see that women don't appear to have a problem with it either - looking at the poll results.

Having said that, if I go in a public toilet and there is a small child using the communal urinal I start to feel very uneasy about using it at the same time. It wouldn't have bothered me at all 20 years ago.

Rather a sad reflection on the current 'percieved' state of society.....

5050sarah
19-Sep-08, 13:50
I think this would b fantastic because afterall a father loves a child just as much as a mother and should be encouraged to socilise with their children just as much as the mother.

I also think a lot of these comments are rediculous a woman could be just as bad to a child as man could why not give them a hard time 2!! who knows whos out their, thats why we cant take our eyes off our children for 1 second.

pat
19-Sep-08, 13:51
have a friend who helps run one, the youngsters absolutely love him (so do the mums!), he is absolutely fantastic with the youngsters. He really loves his work, his spare time is spent running a youth group which is extremely well attended, talking to the youngsters there they go because there is always different things to do and it is fun.
Think he is really a little boy in an adults body! - youngsters certainly talk to him as if he is their age.

I certainly have no worries about men or women working with youngsters once they have been through Disclosure Scotland clearance.

hotrod4
19-Sep-08, 14:33
I have taken my kids to things and it doesnt bother me in the slightest. If its all women not a problem doesnt fase me in the slightest. Why not have males? After all it gives some of the boys a male role model that some of them may not have in their life and vice versa with women.

wifie
19-Sep-08, 15:01
Really would not have a problem with this - heck surely we all socialise with our peer groups so that will mean Dads playin with kids - why should playgroup be any different? If it was a job with children obviously all staff would have to have their disclosure done but I don't think that is what Rheggers is gettin at.

Ricco
19-Sep-08, 15:46
I don't have children but have been a teacher for more years than I can remember. I think patriarcal participation in playgroups is an essential part of a child's development; otherwise would men be seen as not fun, or perhaps even threatening?

The Swedish Chef
19-Sep-08, 16:43
I took my kids to playgroup and never felt weird about it all. I think men should be actively encouraged to get involved in childcare, mainly because we are little more than children ourselves and can relate. I cant speak for anyone else but I always felt that as a father walking into a room full of mothers and their children I was automatically analysed by all the women present as if I was some kind of deviant on the prowl.

Then again calling playgroups "Mothers and Toddlers" is hardly encouraging Men to attend is it ??, if someone started a "Fathers and Toddlers" group it wouldnt be long before some "right on" feminist employed in a council "Diversity Team" would be banging on about "sexism", "discrimination" and "rights for wimmin" etc etc.

changilass
19-Sep-08, 18:11
Hubby takes the wee man to nursery more often than I do, no one thinks anything of it, they are used to him being around.

_Ju_
19-Sep-08, 19:21
as long as the gentleman in question has gone through a disclosure scotland then i wouldnt have a problem with it.

Do you ask the other mothers at the playgroup to do a disclosure as well?

tracy ann
19-Sep-08, 19:56
At Bower playgroup I would say it is about 50-50 when it comes to the parents dropping off and picking up the kids. Though at any mother and toddler groups I have attended I think it is only once I have seen a dad attend.

Maybe a father and toddler group could be started in one of the towns at the weekend, say a sunday as I think most people would agree that this would be the best time to get as many dads as poss to come. At least the conversation would be more to their liking not the birthing stories etc new mums tend to talk about!! LOL:eek:

northener
19-Sep-08, 20:12
Why not just call the groups 'Parent and Toddler'?

That would remove the impression that it's Mothers and Sprogs only.

tracy ann
19-Sep-08, 20:15
Yes thats a good idea - although during the week I would say the majority of families have the mother at home or working part time. I know this is not always the case but just see why the groups do have so much more mums than dads attending

balto
19-Sep-08, 20:34
Do you ask the other mothers at the playgroup to do a disclosure as well?
if you read the whole thread you would have noticed that i said both men and woman have to do a disclosure, anyone working with kids have to.

Venture
19-Sep-08, 20:51
everyone whether male or female, if they are working with kids even as a volunteer, have to do a disclosure.

I think you are missing the point balto. Rheghead asked about helping out in his capacity as a parent with a child at the playgroup not as a separate volunteer. He would not need a disclosure in his role as a parent.

I for one think more Dads should become involved in taking and staying with their children at playgroup. It dosen't have to be only Mums. Maybe even have a session just for Dads to let them know what its all about and then combine the two sessions together. Children need the male species around them too. There are so many single mums nowadays that kids don't get the chance to interact with men as much as they do with women. As someone already posted on here the majority of professions like doctor, dentist etc are men. There probably would be more men willing to work amongst children if it wasn't for the fact that too many people see it as not being the norm and that there must be some other motive behind it. To me that's ridiculous. Men can do just as good a job of looking after children as women, in fact I'd say in some cases they have more patience and understanding and don't get as stressed out as women do when it comes to dealing with children. People are becoming so paranoid about pedophiles etc that they are suspicious of anything that isn't the "norm". Why is it always the male species that is the target of suspicion?

More and more men are becoming stay at home Dads so let's stop making them feel so odd out and isolated when it comes to doing things that Mum's would normally do. First on the list should be doing away with the name "Mother and Baby/Toddler Group" and changing it to "Parent and Baby/Toddler Group". Maybe then more Dads would feel welcome and come along. This is 2008. Times have changed and having to deny your child the chance to interact with other children just because you are a Dad instead of a Mum is so unfair on the child. At the end of the day a parent is male or female and should be treated equally.

balto
19-Sep-08, 20:56
I think you are missing the point balto. Rheghead asked about helping out in his capacity as a parent with a child at the playgroup not as a separate volunteer. He would not need a disclosure in his role as a parent.

I for one think more Dads should become involved in taking and staying with their children at playgroup. It dosen't have to be only Mums. Maybe even have a session just for Dads to let them know what its all about and then combine the two sessions together. Children need the male species around them too. There are so many single mums nowadays that kids don't get the chance to interact with men as much as they do with women. As someone already posted on here the majority of professions like doctor, dentist etc are men. There probably would be more men willing to work amongst children if it wasn't for the fact that too many people see it as not being the norm and that there must be some other motive behind it. To me that's ridiculous. Men can do just as good a job of looking after children as women, in fact I'd say in some cases they have more patience and understanding and don't get as stressed out as women do when it comes to dealing with children. People are becoming so paranoid about pedophiles etc that they are suspicious of anything that isn't the "norm". Why is it always the male species that is the target of suspicion?

More and more men are becoming stay at home Dads so let's stop making them feel so odd out and isolated when it comes to doing things that Mum's would normally do. First on the list should be doing away with the name "Mother and Baby/Toddler Group" and changing it to "Parent and Baby/Toddler Group". Maybe then more Dads would feel welcome and come along. This is 2008. Times have changed and having to deny your child the chance to interact with other children just because you are a Dad instead of a Mum is so unfair on the child. At the end of the day a parent is male or female and should be treated equally.
and as i said in a previous post, i assumed he ment working at a playschool, i know that when my youngest daughter was t palyschool, it was decided that some parents who were willing would agree to have a disclosure done, incase it ever happened and a parent was needed to stand in and help, 3 of us did this myself included, male or female should undergo this.

as for mother and toddler groups, our gelic one in thurso is called parent and child group, i agree there more dads should tke an active roll in these activities, but unfortunatly lot of dads are at work.

mccaugm
19-Sep-08, 21:00
No problem, I'd only fill one out if the women had to also.

I agree why should women be automatically be trusted and men not.

percy toboggan
19-Sep-08, 21:06
Kids of all ages need more male role models. If not role models then just decent men around them providing advice, support and innocent fun and games.
The femininisation of Primary education is to be regretted.

We live in a strange society where all manner of issues around childhood are becoming distorted.

I fear it will need a sea-change over a generation to encourage more males into the field. Today I listened to the mother of a sixteen year old boy who was on a nursery care course with twenty five girls!! Some people had called him dreadful names though - not much imagination required - credit to the kid he was sticking with it.

I have crystal clear memeories of all my Primary school teachers and still harbour respect for the two men I can recall. One in particular was quite strict, and he did me no end of good. He was honest, forthright and strong. He picked me for the school team a year early and it was the proudest day of my young life. He'd also pull some performances to bits.

Simply put..we need more men like Mr.Howarth teaching nine year old kids.

balto
19-Sep-08, 21:06
I agree why should women be automatically be trusted and men not.
aye everybody should fill in one, better to be safe than sorry.

Cattach
19-Sep-08, 21:10
I just wondered how male and female parents feel about men taking their children to playgroups and helping out with the kids where undoubtedly it is female dominated?

Seems like a pretty daft question in this day and age of equality. Does it imply that while women can get equality in all spheres men are still not allowed to take on what was previously considered to be a female role. Yes a sexist and ridiculous posting and I can hardly credit I bothered reading it let alone answer it.

Cazaa
19-Sep-08, 21:36
If it is just for the a day visit so that you can see what things your child gets up to - there is not a problem - they do not have to have a disclosure as they are not allowed to take the other children to toilets etc.


everyone whether male or female, if they are working with kids even as a volunteer, have to do a disclosure.

So at what stage is a Disclosure needed? A day visit? A drop-in every so often?

Does someone working in Tesco (for example) need disclosure on the off-chance that a child might ask them where an item is in shop?

I'm not trying to cause an argument . . . just interested.

balto
19-Sep-08, 21:39
So at what stage is a Disclosure needed? A day visit? A drop-in every so often?

Does someone working in Tesco (for example) need disclosure on the off-chance that a child might ask them where an item is in shop?

I'm not trying to cause an argument . . . just interested.
personnally i dont know, suggest you go to the social work and ask them.

blowfish
19-Sep-08, 22:32
I dont have a problem at all with men working around kids.:)

The midwife that delivered my twins was a man, i had no problem with that, but then it could have been a lumberjack and i wold not have cared:Razz


If it was I'm sure he'd be a good feller

tigger2u
20-Sep-08, 01:40
Seems like a pretty daft question in this day and age of equality. Does it imply that while women can get equality in all spheres men are still not allowed to take on what was previously considered to be a female role. Yes a sexist and ridiculous posting and I can hardly credit I bothered reading it let alone answer it.

Now where do I start....

This is quite a valid question. It isnt that men arent allowed to go into this profession we are, the post isnt sexist or ridiculous, Its just a matter of fact that this area is female dominated. Even if its about men taking their children to a group its still very valid as we guys do get the looks.

on the disclosure question, anyone working with children, male and female fulltime, parttime, students and yes, even volunteers MUST go though an Enhanced Disclosure. If it doesnt happen then it is bad practice and against all the Standards set out. Schools can be the worse for this btw.
Also from the end of last year anyone working in contact with children must also register yearly with the SSSC, which is the Scottish Social Services Council.
So there is no IF men or IF women dont get it..we must ALL go through it

I have found it amazing how many times people ask about men in this job and even about dads taking their children to the toddlers groups, cause I am both. I started as a dad attending a toddler group with my son and I am now a Nursery Nurse working in a Nursery 0-5's as well as managing an Out of School Care service 5-12's, here in Glasgow and have been in the job 14 years now. i also volunteered and trained for 5 years before being qualified.

It should be encouraged, yet a small number of people men and women cant open their minds to it cause of course any guy that wants to be around children MUST have another motive or they are gay, they cant see past whats in the press or their own prejudice, especially when it comes to the men changing nappies etc. yes, it still happens today, believe me I know it well.

Im not surprised by the voting on this but im a little disapointed that those who say they arent at ease or uncomfortable with it havent answered in a post, id be interested to know why not, without fear of being pounced on. but then again theres a few orgers thats good at pouncing lol[lol]

badger
20-Sep-08, 14:30
Must admit I was shocked anyone would say they were uncomfortable with it. We should have more fathers involved with all their children's activities and far more male nursery and primary teachers. It's no wonder so many boys drop behind in school and think being academic is cissy when the only teachers they see, at least until secondary level, are female. It's becoming more common in the south for nannies and au pairs to be male - why not?

Time the title Mother and Toddler Group was banned - how has it survived this long?

lynne duncan
20-Sep-08, 16:27
we changed the name of our playgroup a couple of years ago and are now the playbox playgroup and parent & toddler group to reflect the change in society and any parent or family member is welcome to come with the children the more varied the mix in family member the better to ensure the socialisation of the kids.
as far as i am aware our volunteers ie parents etc do not have to have the enhanced disclosure, though they are closely supervised by the staff and are not allowed to take any chiildren into the toilets

tigger2u
20-Sep-08, 16:55
when I was in training on the Nursery Nurse course ( HNC now) in my 1st nursery placement one of the staffs boyfriend heard about me starting there. His automatic thoughts were
1...is he a perv
2...whats my motives
3...he must be gay

She told him off i can tell you [lol]
nothing to do with the fact i was a father, changing occupations and getting a good education too. something I really didnt take to till i was much older as I loved school, but wasnt very good at it at that time lol.

I think the average national % of males in the childcare sector is still around 2% I still find it hard to see many more guys in the job even in Glasgow. I'm lucky enough that I work alongside with 3 other guys in my project of about 50 staff. so we're still outnumbered lol[lol]

changilass
20-Sep-08, 16:56
Even a full disclosure aint alus worth the paper its written on.

I have disclosures done every year and had to tell social work of a speeding ticket I had as it wasn't on one year even though it should have been.

I hate to think how many other more serious offences have been missed off.

tigger2u
20-Sep-08, 17:03
Even a full disclosure aint alus worth the paper its written on.

I had one done and had to tell social work of a speeding ticket I had as it wasn't on it even though it should have been.

I hate to think how many other more serious offences have been missed off.

It going to be harder now though with the introduction of the SSSC as thats going to be a yearly application to stay on their list and we wont be able to get a job if we arent on that list. the discloser you only have to do once with each employer if you move on.

I would have to look at the disclosure info but its not out to catch people that have little slaps on the wrists. Im sure many working with kids have had parking/speeding tickets etc it is the more serious ones and a pattern of violence that raises the red flags. but you would have to check it out

Ash
21-Sep-08, 08:10
my partner always takes my wee one to nursery... he loves being able to they way his shifts fall, he hates missing out... and no one finds it weird :D

_Ju_
21-Sep-08, 08:37
if you red the whole thread you would have noticed that i said both men and woman have to do a disclosure, anyone working with kids have to.

Actually I "blue" the whole thread because if anyone did not "red" it it might have been you: what was being asked was as clear as a primary colour! ;)

Tristan
21-Sep-08, 09:02
Why not just call the groups 'Parent and Toddler'?

That would remove the impression that it's Mothers and Sprogs only.

Very good point. If you think about it, it is surprising that the name has not been changed earlier.
I remember taking my daughter (6 months) to swimming. At first I was the only Dad in the water but later other Dads joined as well. It was a great experience for all the children and parents.

balto
21-Sep-08, 11:57
Why not just call the groups 'Parent and Toddler'?

That would remove the impression that it's Mothers and Sprogs only.
the gaelic group in thurso is alredy classed as a parent and child group.

rockchick
21-Sep-08, 12:16
My husband regularly took our daughter to the toddlers group, even if he was the only bloke, and I think he got alot out of it. There's a great deal of support at those groups, and it doesn't matter if you're male or female if you're trying to deal with colic or teething!

Welcomefamily
21-Sep-08, 13:24
Childrens Health, Child Care Issues are at the centre of much of todays policy issues, and as tigger2u said that all non professional workers will have to be registered with the SCCC along side professional social work staff.
This will also follow the other professional agencies such as the General Teaching Council Scotland, the British Psychological Society, the Nursing and Midwifery Council who have had these policies in place for many years.

honey
24-Sep-08, 10:22
i wpuld have no problems with dad at our mother and toddlers, in fact, a young dad of twin girls was there last week.

My nephew also had a male nursery nurse student at the nursery school he went to. nathan absolutely adored him, and he was great with the kids.

and now my son has a male teacher at school, and he thinks this is cool.

theres not enough men in the child care/education enviroment