Army recruiting in schools

[AfternoonDelight]

Hello, I am new... and this is my first post. I thought I would be brave and start a new thread - nothing like jumping in at the deep end... :)

I read today in the P & J that MSP Christine Grahame is campaigning against the armed forces recruiting pupils from school. Where are they supposed to recruit from? Once upon a time it was seen as an honour to sign up to defend your country, now the numbers of new recruits are falling drastically.
I know it has a lot to do with Labour's dangerous obsession with invading countries, but surely pupils should be treated like the young adults they are and be given an honest outlook of the choices they have when leaving school. If they want to join up then they should be armed with all the information they need (pun not intended [lol]). Not everyone wants to or is able to go to university and our country needs as many of these brave young men and women as possible.

Or should we bring back national service?

[MadPict]

I think that the forces should be allowed to inform students of the options for a career in the Navy, Army or Air Force. It's not just about joining up to die. Only front line regiments or specialist branches are likely to have to do that.
A engineer in the services can find themselves near the front line but never hear a shot.
And with the state of industry these days the forces is a good place to learn a trade.


I'd let the young men and women in school decide whether a life in the military is for them and not some peacenik MP.

While I am on the subject of recruiting (or misleading advertising) what about the ads on the TV for teachers?
Is there any mention in them about the risks?
Stress, physical assaults, being spat at, cars being vandalised, verbal abuse, intimidation, excessive workload...


...even death..

All of these happen to teachers but oh no, the picture painted in the ads is of well behaved, attentive students - so before the government (or there representatives) start trying to restrict who can present career days (it's not chuffing recruiting) they need to look at their own attempts....

Oh and welcome to the Org...:)

[EDDIE]

Hello, I am new... and this is my first post. I thought I would be brave and start a new thread - nothing like jumping in at the deep end... :)

I read today in the P & J that MSP Christine Grahame is campaigning against the armed forces recruiting pupils from school. Where are they supposed to recruit from? Once upon a time it was seen as an honour to sign up to defend your country, now the numbers of new recruits are falling drastically.
I know it has a lot to do with Labour's dangerous obsession with invading countries, but surely pupils should be treated like the young adults they are and be given an honest outlook of the choices they have when leaving school. If they want to join up then they should be armed with all the information they need (pun not intended [lol]). Not everyone wants to or is able to go to university and our country needs as many of these brave young men and women as possible.

Or should we bring back national service?
Well whey usually have an office or a caravan in towns were they recruit from but i dont think they should be allowed to recruit from school because i think kids at a young age could easily be brainwashed into joining the army depending on how good a sales pitch they make.
The people that are in the army are brave people puting there lifes on the line for others and dont get paid enough for what they do and from what u hear in the news i dont think the army looks after the injured soldiers when they are no fit to continue i think thats something the recruitment teams wont tell potential recruits?
In this day and age the british army gets involved in other conflicts that has nothing to do with the uk its all about what america wants.

[MadPict]

Why does everyone make the mistake that for a career in the military the British Army is the only option?

We have a Royal Navy and a Royal Air Force too. Careers information is now all 3 of the services. I don't think that Army Careers Offices have existed on their own for many years now. So to turn around and say that careers advice should be banned is denying young people the chance to actually get good qualifications.

Claiming "kids at a young age could easily be brainwashed into joining the army" is complete bollocks. No-one is brainwashed.

[AfternoonDelight]

These kids are allowed to drink, smoke, drive, vote, marry etc - how is someone coming into the school to inform them of a possible career option "brainwashing"?

Give them a bit of credit...

(And I did say Armed Forces, not just the Army...) :)

[balto]

dont see what is so wrong with them going into schools just to see what interest they get, at least this way they would be able to get some of the teenagers, who without some sort of future would go of the rails.

[MadPict]

(And I did say Armed Forces, not just the Army...) :)

I know you did, but some seem to be under the impression that only the Army actually goes into the schools to give career advice .

[Kevin Milkins]

As a result of school visits by the armed forces recruitment personel my eldest son was inspired to join up, all be it 4 years after leaving school.
It was somthing I would have rathered he gave a wide berth ,but lads and dads hey. He went on to spend 14 years in the Royal Marines and came out with more qulifications he would have ever got at school. He has seen the world both as a Marine and a rugby player and started his own building company last year. He would recomend it to any young person.

[Venture]

All the armed forces are represented at the annual Careers Convention held for schools. The last one was held in Wick in March.

[bekisman]

Mad Pict: "A engineer in the services can find themselves near the front line but never hear a shot."

'First in last out' has resulted in Royal Engineer Sappers winning 55 Victoria Crosses.. Who clears the minefields prior to the infantry going in? First and foremost a fighting corps, the Sappers are soldiers and engineers. Maybe you are thinking of the REME (Engineers)?

This is the P&J link referred to by Afternoondelight: http://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/Article.aspx/635873?UserKey=0 (http://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/Article.aspx/635873?UserKey=0)
"called for a ban on such contacts with schools, particularly ones in deprived areas where youngsters have little career prospects" Huh?, what a stupid comment! - surely if no career prospects, the kids at least have a chance of getting out of the sink estates and making something of themselves? I'm proud to say three of my kids went into the Forces, one's just off for his third Iraq tour, he's done humanitarian work in Bosnia, Sierra Leone and Kosovo.
Christine Grahame SNP; 1956 - 1961 Secondary School. Uni up till 1995 then lawyer, then teacher, so yep, she knows what terrible things these poor deprived children will be subjected to - yea right!

[percy toboggan]

I left school in 1967...and cannot remember any recruiting campaigns in the classroom. In those benign times of the summer of love , when war involving Britain seemed an almost forgotten prospect...such an appearance would not have been welcome. (thank you Harold, for staying out of Vietnam)

I don't believe it's acceptable now if I'm honest. Given the eagerness with which this Government commits it's troops let them first recruit in the leafy shires...or even put forward their own kith and kin...oh yes! that's a prospect isn't it? Instead they'd rather trawl inner city classrooms and rural outposts where employment is elusive to tempt more cannon fodder into uniform.

If youngsters want to join the armed forces then fair enough...at seventeed or eighteen they can make up their own minds ...read ads. and visit the recruitment centres. School is no place for advertising b.s. hwich ofrten paints an unture picture anyway.

I speak as one who joined the RAF in '69...and bought meself out for £20 three months later...it was a pile of blue pants....but I respect all our Servicemen and Women...and their Commanders....it just was not for a truculent, independently minded sod like me.

Good first post Afternoon Delight...another deep end jumper...bravo!

[Lord Flasheart]

Unfortunately we live in a world today where the Forces have borne the brunt of public opinion due to a political decision that has ended us up in the conflicts we are embroiled in.

This MSP is talking utter piffle. A career in the Forces can be the making of a person, it need not be a lifetime thing but can be used to gain a valuable trade in civilian life. These days we use the word Hero far too easily but kids can learn a lot from the courage of say, the VC winners in Iraq for example, individuals who have risked their own lives, and in most cases sacrificed theirs to save their comrades. Or are we to teach them that David Beckham and the likes are to be emulated ??

I know some Universities stopped the Forces recruiting at the open days because the Student Union disagreed with the stance on say, Homosexuals in the Forces.

For me its just another sad example of a society where someone like a Big Brother winner can be called a "celebrity" and fawned over by the media, where David Beckham is somehow a "Hero" to millions and kids just want to be famous.

[bekisman]

c'mon Percy; "truculent, independently minded sod like me."

Folk reckon I'm a truculent, independent sod, just because I was in the forces for 15 years, does not make me a blind obedient follower of orders - there are ways to manipulate any system - maybe your own short visit did not give you time to evolve! but by the humour in your postings (which I enjoy immensely) you would fit in very well in an Engineer unit, pretty boring in the RAF anyway!
I mentioned above I had three sons in the Forces, one was also 'in' for 15 years and out of that time was 'cannon fodder' for 12 months.
You mention 17 or 18 year olds they can make up their own minds, I thought it was not much less than that anyway?.. what age were you in '69?

Anyway each to his own, you know more than that SNP lawyer.

[Fluff]

My brother is in the army ( currently serving in Afghanistan) and he joined up when he was 17. I applied for the Navy at 16 (didn't get in due to medical reasons) Our dad was in the TA's when we growing up and THAT influenced us. I can't speak for my brother but i did not pay any heed to the forces at the recruitment days. I had decided to join up of my own accord and because I had been a sea cadet.
I am SO fed up with these people whining about rubbish like this! The forces is a respectful occupation which is a good as any office job.

[MadPict]

bekisman, poor choice of word. I meant engineer as a catch all phrase for someone in say a technical trade (electronics engineer, vehicle engineer, aircraft engineer, marine engineer etc etc).

[percy toboggan]

c'mon Percy; "truculent, independently minded sod like me."

Folk reckon I'm a truculent, independent sod, just because I was in the forces for 15 years, does not make me a blind obedient follower of orders - there are ways to manipulate any system - maybe your own short visit did not give you time to evolve! but by the humour in your postings (which I enjoy immensely) you would fit in very well in an Engineer unit, pretty boring in the RAF anyway!
I mentioned above I had three sons in the Forces, one was also 'in' for 15 years and out of that time was 'cannon fodder' for 12 months.
You mention 17 or 18 year olds they can make up their own minds, I thought it was not much less than that anyway?.. what age were you in '69?

Anyway each to his own, you know more than that SNP lawyer.

I saw the basic training stage as a challenge, which I managed to rise to...the trade training was incredibly dull...and I could not take the regimentation I'm afraid. I don't knock it...just reckon they should leave schoolchildren alone.

I think blind obedience to orders a pre-requisite in battle conditions...otherwise what's the point? I do take your point about manipulating systems, certainly once you have yer feet under the table...a stage I never reached...I came out to drive a big van all over t'shop for twelve quid a week (a four quid rise)..two months later I was sacked for being...truculent *...the rest, as they say...is mystery! :confused

I was 18 in '69

* I was fussy enough to require a functioning braking system.
'Drive it your flippin' self ' was my final shot...I think.:lol:

[MadPict]

Wouldn't that be "truckulent"?

Let's stop with the accusations of pressganging kids into the military. I'm sure it was raised before in another thread and the point was made that any teenager who signs up is permitted to change their mind at any time before or during their training.