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No wonder there are so many people unemployed in Caithness (personally Wick)
My friend, due to getting paid off at the end of January has had to "Sign on" Since then she has handed in numerous application forms and also handed in her CV to places. She has only ever received one reply from a company comfirming they received her application. Others jobs which she applied for didnt even have the decency to tell her the jobs had been filled and 1 local who said they would arrange an interview for her the following week never got back to her!
They wonder why there is so many un-employed, I no I would get fed up applying for numerous jobs and they cant even be bothered to let you know your application has been received! No wonder her self-esteem has hit rock bottom!!
I no there aren't enough jobs going for everyone but a little acknowledgement wouldn't go a miss.. She has been to college/uni and got qualifications she can't get a job for which she is trained so is therefore willing to accept anything meantime. But even anything seems impossible at the moment.
Is it now a case of who you know in this community and not what you know?
No wonder there are so many people unemployed in Caithness (personally Wick)
My friend, due to getting paid off at the end of January has had to "Sign on" Since then she has handed in numerous application forms and also handed in her CV to places. She has only ever received one reply from a company comfirming they received her application. Others jobs which she applied for didnt even have the decency to tell her the jobs had been filled and 1 local who said they would arrange an interview for her the following week never got back to her!
They wonder why there is so many un-employed, I no I would get fed up applying for numerous jobs and they cant even be bothered to let you know your application has been received! No wonder her self-esteem has hit rock bottom!!
I no there aren't enough jobs going for everyone but a little acknowledgement wouldn't go a miss.. She has been to college/uni and got qualifications she can't get a job for which she is trained so is therefore willing to accept anything meantime. But even anything seems impossible at the moment.
Is it now a case of who you know in this community and not what you know?
My son is having the same problem, and yes i think it is who you know:(
Not everyone enjoys doing nothing through the week, she is nearly ripping her hair out!! :lol: she did enjoy being a lady of leisure for the 1st week but it does become a bore.
Kevin Milkins
26-Mar-08, 23:04
It is disheartning when you go to the trouble of applying for a job and you get no reply at all.It takes no time at all to email phone or write a short letter to thank you for expressing an interest in a position. It is nothing short of rude .
In the past, when I have been looking for a job, I have found the same problem here - it is who you know, not what you know.
It can be very difficult to find a job here, and I sympathise with anyone in this situation.
At one point, I was unemployed for a few months, and it was hell!
There just doesnt seem to be enough interest in helping people get back to work up here.. I just think as soon as you are "Signing on" your are shuvved into a category and become nothing more than a statistic
Whitewater
26-Mar-08, 23:17
Lilly, your friend will have to keep trying. It is very disappointing and disheartning when you apply for work and get no response, every prospective employer should at least acknowledge your application.
Has your friend tried the employment section on the forum?
Yes, she checks daily not only on this forum but newpapers and other job forums.
Having exactly the same problem!!
Nothing worst than when the employers don't seem interested in getting back to you. Especially when your told you will be gettng an interview!
I can assure you it is not just a problem up there. not long after i moved down my temp job was ended. i was then unemployed for 9 months! the ONLY reason i got my job was because the then manager gave me a chance.
being unemployed is so horrible, esp when you actually want to work!
No wonder there are so many people unemployed in Caithness (personally Wick)
She has been to college/uni and got qualifications she can't get a job for which she is trained so is therefore willing to accept anything meantime. But even anything seems impossible at the moment.
Maybe a bit off topic but what did she study at uni?
5 people in my year at Thurso went to Napier to study "Marketing". 5 People in one year from a town the size of Thurso!
I was belittled at the time for getting an apprenticeship and learning a trade.
Amazingly the biggest feeling of rejection at the time was from my guidance teacher who thought by not going to uni I was "wasted".
There is a BIG problem in british society where trades and apprenticeships are seen as jobs for the ignorant, poor or unachievers. Those who go to uni are seen as successful regardless of their ability, achievements or real skills.
I really do sympathise with anyone who is unemployed, but university credentials mean nothing if there isn't a market for them.
KILTIECAULDBUM
27-Mar-08, 01:27
I remember a few years back I was desperate to get a job after being paid off. I bought the Courier one Wednesday & there was a job advertised that I thought I was well qualified to do. At last I thought, the breakthrough I had been waiting for, it really got my hopes up. Although it was in Wick, & meant a bit of travelling I didn't mind it was a job. It said to apply in writing, but I thought I would show a bit of initiative & phoned first, this was the Wednesday afternoon. I was told just to send in my CV. Again, trying to show that I was very keen I worked on updating my CV to suit the job on the Wednesday night/Thursday morning, printed it off & drove through to Wick on the Thursday afternoon to hand deliver it. I even got "suited up" hoping that I might even get interviewed there & then, but I didn't they just took my CV from me & said they would be in touch with everyone.
On the Friday I bought the Groat. In the jobs section there was a note from this well known Wick Company, thanking all applicants who applied, but the vacancy had been filled??
I contacted the newspaper & asked them when the cut off was to put a "job filled" article in the vacancies section of the Journal & was told early Wednesday afternoon at the very latest. This means that when I made the first phone call to the Company on the Wednesday afternoon, the job was already taken & yet they still encouraged me to apply & send in my CV & even still accepted it from me on the Thursday afternoon? No wonder I didn't get an interview. It is not a nice place to be being unemployed, never mind these such Companies giving you false hopes...!!!!!
Going by the remarks on this post, things up here haven't got any better.
I wish your friend the very best of luck in finding employment.
No wonder there are so many people unemployed in Caithness (personally Wick)
My friend, due to getting paid off at the end of January has had to "Sign on" Since then she has handed in numerous application forms and also handed in her CV to places. She has only ever received one reply from a company comfirming they received her application. Others jobs which she applied for didnt even have the decency to tell her the jobs had been filled and 1 local who said they would arrange an interview for her the following week never got back to her!
They wonder why there is so many un-employed, I no I would get fed up applying for numerous jobs and they cant even be bothered to let you know your application has been received! No wonder her self-esteem has hit rock bottom!!
I no there aren't enough jobs going for everyone but a little acknowledgement wouldn't go a miss.. She has been to college/uni and got qualifications she can't get a job for which she is trained so is therefore willing to accept anything meantime. But even anything seems impossible at the moment.
Is it now a case of who you know in this community and not what you know?
Caithness is the type of place if u get a job u have to had onto it because there is not a lot of jobs going about like in citys i guess thats just the way it is small communitys.
I moved away form caithness when i was 21 because i couldnt get a job im glad because were im now if i ever got payed of its easy enough to get another job.If u take somewere like caithness and if u have a technical job if u ever got payed of its not so easy to get a similar job in these types of jobs dont come vacant very often.
I think u would be suprised at the amount of caithness people that leave caithness every year for that reason
Maybe a bit off topic but what did she study at uni?
5 people in my year at Thurso went to Napier to study "Marketing". 5 People in one year from a town the size of Thurso!
I was belittled at the time for getting an apprenticeship and learning a trade.
Amazingly the biggest feeling of rejection at the time was from my guidance teacher who thought by not going to uni I was "wasted".
There is a BIG problem in british society where trades and apprenticeships are seen as jobs for the ignorant, poor or unachievers. Those who go to uni are seen as successful regardless of their ability, achievements or real skills.
I really do sympathise with anyone who is unemployed, but university credentials mean nothing if there isn't a market for them.
Totally agree. I know a few young people who have been out of Uni for a couple of years and nowhere near on the career path they want and are now in jobs having to do vocational qualifications with the employer and their friends who did apprenticeships are earning far more than them. So you have a head start. I also think there is far too much emphasis on degree's and too many people studying things like Media, Marketing and Psychology because they don't really know what they want to do. Employers want people trained to do the job the way they want it done. I think you made a good choice.
Interesting, as an employer we have had the opposite in the past, in that we have had very few applicants for positions.
In fact we now have a part time opening, so please feel free to apply, we are are looking for flexible people interested in learning, and will provide opertunities where we can.
Andrew
northener
27-Mar-08, 10:18
Maybe a bit off topic but what did she study at uni?
5 people in my year at Thurso went to Napier to study "Marketing". 5 People in one year from a town the size of Thurso!
I was belittled at the time for getting an apprenticeship and learning a trade.
Amazingly the biggest feeling of rejection at the time was from my guidance teacher who thought by not going to uni I was "wasted".
There is a BIG problem in british society where trades and apprenticeships are seen as jobs for the ignorant, poor or unachievers. Those who go to uni are seen as successful regardless of their ability, achievements or real skills.
I really do sympathise with anyone who is unemployed, but university credentials mean nothing if there isn't a market for them.
Hit the nail on the head.
There's too much emphasis placed on soft-option courses at 'Uni' as opposed to skills that are really required in the workplace up here.
There is definitely a culture of arrogance and disdain regarding perception of the traditional 'trades'. Teachers and the education system (most of whom had never had any experience outside the world of Academia) were encouraging all and sundry to go to 'Uni' and throw off the workers shackles....ha!
In Caithness, who are the ones with the useful life skills now? The ones who took the more taxing and relevant routes for our area.
Three years of pretending to be a tree or 'Media Studies'/Art/Klingon language will only help you in an area dominated by media industry.
Well, apart from Klingon, you would be understood in Camp's bar after a few drams.....
Rant over.
.
I have had the opposite I have been unemployed sice beginning of March and have applied for every job in the paper and have so far had 2 interviews and am awaiting word on my 3rd application. Ok I havent got a job yet had to turn one down as the hours were no good for me and the other one I didnt get but I am just applying for every job I could do and hoping for the best.
Try Ackergill Tower... I went there and asked, filled out a form and was phoned up about an interview about 4 days after .. Try there, they are looking for office or dining assistant staff.
I was belittled at the time for getting an apprenticeship and learning a trade.
Amazingly the biggest feeling of rejection at the time was from my guidance teacher who thought by not going to uni I was "wasted".
There is a BIG problem in british society where trades and apprenticeships are seen as jobs for the ignorant, poor or unachievers. Those who go to uni are seen as successful regardless of their ability, achievements or real skills.
I really do sympathise with anyone who is unemployed, but university credentials mean nothing if there isn't a market for them.
Many firms are now crying out for youngsters to take up "Trades" but still Schools Career Advisers are puting a stigma on any thoughts of pupils wanting to go down this road, I have a 16 year old grandaughter who has enough qualifications to go to Uni, but she does not want to do anymore studying, she just wants to get a job!! I hope she succeeds and things are looking good at the moment.
But just to put a point I have come across in the past when I was a CPO in the RNR and was New Entry Trainer, I had to train Officer Candidates as well as the normal ratings, now many of the OC's had all been at or were in Uni, and many I found were smart and as we used to say in the Navy, "They can work out the cubic capacity of a jar of pickled onions, but ask them how to open the same jar"....well!!
anneoctober
27-Mar-08, 13:14
I heartily agree with the poster who said it's rude not to reply to an application for a position within a company. We get lads phoning, turning up at the garage ( this is how we got our present "prent") or sending in a CV. Written applications/enquiries are always answered. We can only employ one lad at a time, and we are IN FAVOUR of apprenticeships!! :D OR " getting their hands dirty!" Hands in the pockets are a NO NO![lol]
percy toboggan
27-Mar-08, 18:30
Northener and 'the one' are absolutely right of course.
When times are dire you have to be pro-active and go knocking on knockers. Do not wait for newspaper or job-centre ads. If, after months of searching in vain then single folk have to move to an area where there IS work unless they want to languish on the dole. A year or two on benefit is unacceptable in an island which houses a million Eastern Europeans who are grafting.
I didn't like Norman Tebbit but he was right...and today bikes are fashionably green too.
Even in a relatively small community like Wick , and given it's isolation..there is surely never going to be enough work to go around....but then again many people are too fussy. If I'd been unemployed for months on end I'd consider anything at all.
I totally agree with you, i was looking for a job last year. Over Christmas i applyed for 4 jobs in Wick, and not one of them got back to me to let me know that they had received the application or to tell me i was'nt successful. I eventually got a job through someone i knew.
I reckon a lot of folk are unemployable as well. Employers want people who will turn up on time, get on with others, do the task the way they want it done and be reliable and willing. It's easier to take someone on recommendation, friend of friend, family members etc because they have an inkling of what the person will be like. After all if they are paying someone they want the goods.
Remememeber reading an emplyer survey done by case a few years ago and it said that 74% of jobs were filled by word of mouth.
Think there may be some confusion about advertising vacancies as well, with employers thinking they have to do it even if they have someone lined up. BUt do agree at least they could communicate with applicants.
northener
27-Mar-08, 21:52
I agree 100% with at least having the courtesy to acknowledge receipt of a Cv or inform the applicant they were unsuccessful.
There is another side to this, of course.
I've had to take time out to sit in on interviews with people who, at best, were hopelessly unsuitable for the job and on further investigation have found out that their CV wasn't worth drying my backside with. Up to a point I can cope with that.
What I cannot cope with is the endless stream of waisters sent by the DSS who have effall interest in taking the job and are only there so they can continue to be funded by the DSS to sit and watch daytime television.
I've even thrown out a couple of these losers with some rather choice comments on their parasitical nature and threats to put a size 10 Doc Marten print on their arse. Funnily enough, I don't think they complained to the DSS about their treatment - why would that be?
There's no excuse for Employers not acknowledging peoples' genuine efforts. But sometimes, I can understand it.
.
Many firms are now crying out for youngsters to take up "Trades" but still Schools Career Advisers are puting a stigma on any thoughts of pupils wanting to go down this road, I have a 16 year old grandaughter who has enough qualifications to go to Uni, but she does not want to do anymore studying, she just wants to get a job!! I hope she succeeds and things are looking good at the moment.
But just to put a point I have come across in the past when I was a CPO in the RNR and was New Entry Trainer, I had to train Officer Candidates as well as the normal ratings, now many of the OC's had all been at or were in Uni, and many I found were smart and as we used to say in the Navy, "They can work out the cubic capacity of a jar of pickled onions, but ask them how to open the same jar"....well!!
I agree. There is nothing wrong with learning a trade. I don't think it is the schools fault. If I remember correctly the government set up one of their league tables to ensure so many students went to university.
School is very important, but as you say Uni is not the only way to get a good education.
I agree. There is nothing wrong with learning a trade. I don't think it is the schools fault. If I remember correctly the government set up one of their league tables to ensure so many students went to university.
School is very important, but as you say Uni is not the only way to get a good education.
Well I disagree. I nailed my honours degree from Aberdeen Uni and ended up nowhere. My mate Eyore is a total thicky. Bummed about doing heehaw studying art/textiles or touching cloth and still ended up doing the same job. I hate him. He's like a whelk.
Well I disagree. I nailed my honours degree from Aberdeen Uni and ended up nowhere. My mate Eyore is a total thicky. Bummed about doing heehaw studying art/textiles or touching cloth and still ended up doing the same job. I hate him. He's like a whelk.
What is it you are disagreeing with?
What is it you are disagreeing with?
Good education at Uni. Doesn't teach anything required for the real world. Too be honest, you learn everything you need at work to do the job you require
Just need to watch The Apprentice to see that you can have degrees coming out your ears but if you don't have the personal skills or common sense then it isn't worth the paper it's written on.
Good education at Uni. Doesn't teach anything required for the real world. Too be honest, you learn everything you need at work to do the job you require
Which is the point Golach and I were making. Learning a trade, doing and aprentiship are all good things and university is not the only way to get a good education.
My point was the obsession with going to uni is a government not a school driven initiative.
As to your comment "you learn everything you need at work to do the job you require" I would agree up to a point. A good university degree can get you a good job.
I disagree about school and traditional jobs. There is no money in working for anyone. Your money is taken from you by the government before you recieve it, unlike if you set up a business where tax is paid after you have been paid.
Schools teach standard outdated curiculum which teaches you nothing. If you think outwith the box or show signs of what is not classed as normal way of thinking then you are classed as disruptive or thick. School do not want mavericks in their class. In Britain we supress flair and creativity. We should teach that more, encourage it. We should be teaching children how to make money and to rise away from the drinking class mentality.
Lets teach such things as real estate, stocks and shares etc at school. lets encourage the new line of entrepreneurs
For all those looking for work, good luck. I am sure your dedication and perseverance will pay off. Keep trying as you already know it is much better to make your own way in life than relying off the state. All I can say is don’t let it get you down and I hope you get the job you want soon.
its harder to get jobs because foreigners have now taken a ot of jobs in the county but before anyone says its not true it its fact the more competition the less chance of getting the job and the problem is in caithness when you apply for a job everyone in that workplace has there say about you " jobs for the boys " as some one already said:eek:
its harder to get jobs because foreigners have now taken a ot of jobs in the county but before anyone says its not true it its fact the more competition the less chance of getting the job and the problem is in caithness when you apply for a job everyone in that workplace has there say about you " jobs for the boys " as some one already said:eek:
thats nonsense. The truth of the matter is that there are too many lazy people in our own country who pick up the brew each week with no intention of getting a job.. They do this because they are better off on benefits and usually have incapacity benefit for their drug addiction or obesity. They get further benefits for their 8 children, who in turn follow in their parents footsteps and do nothing with their lives other than steal other peoples oxygen.
I am all for the forgein people coming over who are willing to work hard and contribute more to this country than a majority of the layabouts on the rock 'n' Roll.
The government need to sort out these benefit fraudsters and make them pick chewing gum of the pavements; mend fencing or road or pick up dog foul for their money.
Some people should be rightly embarrassed that the forgeiners are over here showing how hard work should be done
thats nonsense. The truth of the matter is that there are too many lazy people in our own country who pick up the brew each week with no intention of getting a job.. They do this because they are better off on benefits and usually have incapacity benefit for their drug addiction or obesity. They get further benefits for their 8 children, who in turn follow in their parents footsteps and do nothing with their lives other than steal other peoples oxygen.
I am all for the forgein people coming over who are willing to work hard and contribute more to this country than a majority of the layabouts on the rock 'n' Roll.
The government need to sort out these benefit fraudsters and make them pick chewing gum of the pavements; mend fencing or road or pick up dog foul for their money.
Some people should be rightly embarrassed that the forgeiners are over here showing how hard work should be done
Forgein people? Is that like blacksmiths and farriers? Too right. Horses will always need shoes.
Northener and 'the one' are absolutely right of course.
When times are dire you have to be pro-active and go knocking on knockers. Do not wait for newspaper or job-centre ads. If, after months of searching in vain then single folk have to move to an area where there IS work unless they want to languish on the dole. A year or two on benefit is unacceptable in an island which houses a million Eastern Europeans who are grafting.
I didn't like Norman Tebbit but he was right...and today bikes are fashionably green too.
Even in a relatively small community like Wick , and given it's isolation..there is surely never going to be enough work to go around....but then again many people are too fussy. If I'd been unemployed for months on end I'd consider anything at all.As you can see there are many people looking for work and it is not as easy for them to gain employment as it is for an eastern European. The stock phrase, "they are doing the work the British won't do", is fast becoming a stick with which to beat our own unemployed. Many of these so-called hard to fill jobs are actually jobs that there has been no problem filling in the past. These eastern Europeans are being exploited to the hilt and never really cared at first because the money they were on was vastly more than they could hope to get in their own countries. Now they know better and are fighting for their rights, well done to them.
northener
28-Mar-08, 15:58
As you can see there are many people looking for work and it is not as easy for them to gain employment as it is for an eastern European. The stock phrase, "they are doing the work the British won't do", is fast becoming a stick with which to beat our own unemployed. Many of these so-called hard to fill jobs are actually jobs that there has been no problem filling in the past. These eastern Europeans are being exploited to the hilt and never really cared at first because the money they were on was vastly more than they could hope to get in their own countries. Now they know better and are fighting for their rights, well done to them.
Unfortunately, there will always be those who choose to exploit others in the name of profit. But not all companies are involved in paying different wage levels to immigrants.
In areas of low unemployment there will always be a 'market' (for want of a better word) for immigrants who are keen to work for what we would call low pay. Up here, we aint got a lotta jobs and have a larger than average percentage of unemployed.
What puzzles me is why so many immigrants are being taken on by legit companies, paying the legal minimum wage and leaving the locals out of the equation completely.
I'm not convinced it's all monetary. If the company is playing by the rules - which most do - why ignore the local workforce? Is it genuinely because they feel the immigrants will work harder, or do the employers feel that they have better skillsets that our local unemployed?
This isn't a local phenomena, it's all way across the UK. Why?
Unfortunately, there will always be those who choose to exploit others in the name of profit. But not all companies are involved in paying different wage levels to immigrants.
In areas of low unemployment there will always be a 'market' (for want of a better word) for immigrants who are keen to work for what we would call low pay. Up here, we aint got a lotta jobs and have a larger than average percentage of unemployed.
What puzzles me is why so many immigrants are being taken on by legit companies, paying the legal minimum wage and leaving the locals out of the equation completely.
I'm not convinced it's all monetary. If the company is playing by the rules - which most do - why ignore the local workforce? Is it genuinely because they feel the immigrants will work harder, or do the employers feel that they have better skillsets that our local unemployed?
This isn't a local phenomena, it's all way across the UK. Why?Maybe they do feel that immigrants will work harder but that is just another fallacy and an affront to the British workforce. Some agency workers earn a lot less than full time permanent staff. How long are they supposed to work without being offered a full time contract,1, 2, 3 years? If there is enough work for them to be with a company for that long then why are they not offered contracts and payed at the going rate?
Welders here less than 2 years ago were demanding £13.50 per hour + shift allowance, along came some Polish welders happy to work for £7 per hour.
Who do you think became the main welders employees - the local welders are now in Holland, Germany, off shore and anywhere but here earning higher wages but missing out on family life - the Polish welders are still living here and happy with the wages obtained.
Depends on what you want out of life and what you are willing to accept - twice the wages but what is the quality of family life they now have and what expenses are they having to pay out to obtain twice the wage?
thats nonsense. The truth of the matter is that there are too many lazy people in our own country who pick up the brew each week with no intention of getting a job.. They do this because they are better off on benefits and usually have incapacity benefit for their drug addiction or obesity. They get further benefits for their 8 children, who in turn follow in their parents footsteps and do nothing with their lives other than steal other peoples oxygen.
I am all for the forgein people coming over who are willing to work hard and contribute more to this country than a majority of the layabouts on the rock 'n' Roll.
The government need to sort out these benefit fraudsters and make them pick chewing gum of the pavements; mend fencing or road or pick up dog foul for their money.
Some people should be rightly embarrassed that the forgeiners are over here showing how hard work should be done
the foreigners i worked with only had two gears slow and stop what you have said is backward and ignorant just like the uk workers you get good workers and bad workers the ones i worked with were bad workers but i cant judge them all on that.
You have just said all the people who have posted saying they find it hard to get work just want to sit on the brew i would not like you to be prime minister they would not have a chance have you forgoten about the genuine people who want work but cant find any
Welders here less than 2 years ago were demanding £13.50 per hour + shift allowance, along came some Polish welders happy to work for £7 per hour.
Who do you think became the main welders employees - the local welders are now in Holland, Germany, off shore and anywhere but here earning higher wages but missing out on family life - the Polish welders are still living here and happy with the wages obtained.
Depends on what you want out of life and what you are willing to accept - twice the wages but what is the quality of family life they now have and what expenses are they having to pay out to obtain twice the wage?Wages that British workers have fought hard to get are slowely being eroded, nothing great about that is there?
northener
28-Mar-08, 16:53
Maybe they do feel that immigrants will work harder but that is just another fallacy and an affront to the British workforce. Some agency workers earn a lot less than full time permanent staff. How long are they supposed to work without being offered a full time contract,1, 2, 3 years? If there is enough work for them to be with a company for that long then why are they not offered contracts and payed at the going rate?
Good point.
I've worked with employment agencies in the past in England, both taking on staff from them and working for them myself.
You're absolutely right about 'temps' and their lack of contracts,TBH. You're also right about the differential between full-time and temp pay levels.
There are some firms out there who use temps as a get-out clause when it comes to contracts. Run them for as long as they can and then bin them.
There are also those who use temps as a cheap source of labour.
BUT, that isn't an immigrant issue. It actually affects as many British-born workers as immigrants. Certainly in the Midlands of England, temp agencies are thriving. Although they have a lot of immigrants on their books, they also have a lot of British nationals.
Regarding pay, In my experience, many companies are actually paying out top dollar for their temp staff. It is the agencies who rip off the workers by not passing on the money. Even to the point of paying those who complain more, providing they don't tell their colleagues.
Many companies choose not to get involved in what goes off between a temp and the Agency, so the poor old temp has to lump it or be told he/she 'is not required' for the next day. There are companies out there who are good with their temps and use them as a work-trial before offering them full-time jobs. But sadly, these are in the minority. (BTW taking on a temp from an agency can be very expensive for the company involved)
So to summarise, there are certainly immigrants getting a raw deal from temp agencies, but then again, so are the Brits.
My own personal experiences of working with different nationalities are that it doesn't really matter where someone is from. Most people are keen to get on with the job.
Sadly, the ones who were most likely to disappear on you or spend all shift dragging their heels all had British accents....
the foreigners i worked with only had two gears slow and stop what you have said is backward and ignorant just like the uk workers you get good workers and bad workers the ones i worked with were bad workers but i cant judge them all on that.
You have just said all the people who have posted saying they find it hard to get work just want to sit on the brew i would not like you to be prime minister they would not have a chance have you forgoten about the genuine people who want work but cant find any
I will correct youon that phrase "all the people who have posted on her...want to sit on the brew"
At no point did I say that. I have worked my whole life, changing jobs when it suited me. I worked hard in every job I did and still am in the job I a m doing. I have never found any problem finding work as there is plenty work out there for everyone. Instead of sitting on the ORG they could proactively go out and find work. You wont get anywhere sitting watching Jeremy Kyle through the day.
I would like me to be prime minister, I would restore a sense of pride in people and would get the country a cleaner place by making people work for their benefits. No task too small.
People who think positive and act positive have positive things bestowed upon them. Get out and make a difference.
\
Good point.
I've worked with employment agencies in the past in England, both taking on staff from them and working for them myself.
You're absolutely right about 'temps' and their lack of contracts,TBH. You're also right about the differential between full-time and temp pay levels.
There are some firms out there who use temps as a get-out clause when it comes to contracts. Run them for as long as they can and then bin them.
There are also those who use temps as a cheap source of labour.
BUT, that isn't an immigrant issue. It actually affects as many British-born workers as immigrants. Certainly in the Midlands of England, temp agencies are thriving. Although they have a lot of immigrants on their books, they also have a lot of British nationals.
Regarding pay, In my experience, many companies are actually paying out top dollar for their temp staff. It is the agencies who rip off the workers by not passing on the money. Even to the point of paying those who complain more, providing they don't tell their colleagues.
Many companies choose not to get involved in what goes off between a temp and the Agency, so the poor old temp has to lump it or be told he/she 'is not required' for the next day. There are companies out there who are good with their temps and use them as a work-trial before offering them full-time jobs. But sadly, these are in the minority. (BTW taking on a temp from an agency can be very expensive for the company involved)
So to summarise, there are certainly immigrants getting a raw deal from temp agencies, but then again, so are the Brits.
My own personal experiences of working with different nationalities are that it doesn't really matter where someone is from. Most people are keen to get on with the job.
Sadly, the ones who were most likely to disappear on you or spend all shift dragging their heels all had British accents....I can certainly understand the need for agency as certain business have a fluctuation in busy periods, seasonal work, etc, where the need for temps outweighs the need for anything but the bare minimum of permanent staff. No real laws are being broken as temps are entitled to minimum wage and the same protection afforded to full-time, permanent staff but my point is that a lot of temps are working for minimum wage when permanent staff are being paid much more. If a temp is working in the same company for a set period of time then they should be, by law, offered a permanent contract and the national average wage for the type of work they are employed to do. Agency workers are being exploited, the system is being abused and it has to be stopped.
I will correct youon that phrase "all the people who have posted on her...want to sit on the brew"
At no point did I say that. I have worked my whole life, changing jobs when it suited me. I worked hard in every job I did and still am in the job I a m doing. I have never found any problem finding work as there is plenty work out there for everyone. Instead of sitting on the ORG they could proactively go out and find work. You wont get anywhere sitting watching Jeremy Kyle through the day.
I would like me to be prime minister, I would restore a sense of pride in people and would get the country a cleaner place by making people work for their benefits. No task too small.
People who think positive and act positive have positive things bestowed upon them. Get out and make a difference.
\Whilst living in that ivory tower of yours it might be wise to equate that at some point in time you may bump into reality.
Whilst living in that ivory tower of yours it might be wise to equate that at some point in time you may bump into reality.
The Ivory tower I sit in is all paid for by hard work and proactively going out to better myself. I have taken risks and have taken jobs I did not want along the way. At no point was i sitting bumping my gums about being unemployed. Your destiny is in your hands only and it is your responsibility through life to make something of yourself.
It is the typical British mentality to blame someone else for their misfortune. It's the governments fault.....no it's the forgeiners.....no its all these capitalists fault.......Don't blame the man sitting in the Ivory tower. Everyone has the same opportunities in life to take that seat. If others want to sit and ruminate on how they haven't had a fare crack at life then let them. I'll sit here in my tower eating prawn sandwiches and sipping champagne.;) let people work for their benefits (oooh radical) why should they sit and do nowt and pick up a pay cheque of my back. if they had to do tasks such as sweep streets, cut pensioners gardens then I have no doubt they would miraculously find a job that they feel only "forgeiners" should be doing.
I pay more tax than most, I work, I have no criminal convictions, I vote, therefore being a good citizen I have a say in the way I think this country should be run. It is up to you if you want to take the liberal side of the fence. I'm voicing my view and I feel I'm not alone in having this view.
Penelope Pitstop
28-Mar-08, 22:18
Welders here less than 2 years ago were demanding £13.50 per hour + shift allowance, along came some Polish welders happy to work for £7 per hour.
In the present climate of Caithness I doubt local firms could afford to pay that wage out. £13.50 (2 years ago, so more now) plus 10 - 30% shift allowance, plus holiday pay, plus 13% employers NI contribution...they would price themselves out of the contract...contracting now cut throat, very cut throat.
An apprenticeship of any trade is an excellent career opportunity...put the work in and it will pay rewards.
A good university degree will also open opportunities to an excellent career. Engineering degree students are walking straight into jobs...the industry can't get enough of them.
Penelope Pitstop
28-Mar-08, 22:23
It is the typical British mentality to blame someone else for their misfortune. It's the governments fault.....no it's the forgeiners.....no its all these capitalists fault.......Everyone has the same opportunities in life to take that seat.
I agree ...life is what you make it. (feel a song coming on there[lol])
The Ivory tower I sit in is all paid for by hard work and proactively going out to better myself. I have taken risks and have taken jobs I did not want along the way. At no point was i sitting bumping my gums about being unemployed. Your destiny is in your hands only and it is your responsibility through life to make something of yourself.
It is the typical British mentality to blame someone else for their misfortune. It's the governments fault.....no it's the forgeiners.....no its all these capitalists fault.......Don't blame the man sitting in the Ivory tower. Everyone has the same opportunities in life to take that seat. If others want to sit and ruminate on how they haven't had a fare crack at life then let them. I'll sit here in my tower eating prawn sandwiches and sipping champagne.;) let people work for their benefits (oooh radical) why should they sit and do nowt and pick up a pay cheque of my back. if they had to do tasks such as sweep streets, cut pensioners gardens then I have no doubt they would miraculously find a job that they feel only "forgeiners" should be doing.
I pay more tax than most, I work, I have no criminal convictions, I vote, therefore being a good citizen I have a say in the way I think this country should be run. It is up to you if you want to take the liberal side of the fence. I'm voicing my view and I feel I'm not alone in having this view.
Totally agree, why should we pay for cling ons to get their dole check, hard labour is the way to go, get them cleaning the streets.Makes me mad when I open my pay slip and see how much goes in tax every month. On the subject of 'foreigners' when did we ever get better service in hotels and restuarants until now? I've never signed on in my life and done some really crap jobs to put food on the table. BUt the will to work has always been there. The majority of people on the dole are lazy, blood sucking cannon fodder!
The Ivory tower I sit in is all paid for by hard work and proactively going out to better myself. I have taken risks and have taken jobs I did not want along the way. At no point was i sitting bumping my gums about being unemployed. Your destiny is in your hands only and it is your responsibility through life to make something of yourself.
It is the typical British mentality to blame someone else for their misfortune. It's the governments fault.....no it's the forgeiners.....no its all these capitalists fault.......Don't blame the man sitting in the Ivory tower. Everyone has the same opportunities in life to take that seat. If others want to sit and ruminate on how they haven't had a fare crack at life then let them. I'll sit here in my tower eating prawn sandwiches and sipping champagne.;) let people work for their benefits (oooh radical) why should they sit and do nowt and pick up a pay cheque of my back. if they had to do tasks such as sweep streets, cut pensioners gardens then I have no doubt they would miraculously find a job that they feel only "forgeiners" should be doing.
I pay more tax than most, I work, I have no criminal convictions, I vote, therefore being a good citizen I have a say in the way I think this country should be run. It is up to you if you want to take the liberal side of the fence. I'm voicing my view and I feel I'm not alone in having this view.I have no doubt you have worked very hard in every job you have had and in your current job. When you are in that position it is very easy to criticise those less 'fortunate' than yourself and god forbid but you may find yourself in that position. Not bumping your gums is easy when you are 'the man' but remember that a lot of those claiming benefit have paid into the system for years, perhaps made redundant for refusing reduced t&c's and replaced by those that will be exploited.
I have no doubt you have worked very hard in every job you have had and in your current job. When you are in that position it is very easy to criticise those less 'fortunate' than yourself and god forbid but you may find yourself in that position. Not bumping your gums is easy when you are 'the man' but remember that a lot of those claiming benefit have paid into the system for years, perhaps made redundant for refusing reduced t&c's and replaced by those that will be exploited.
TBH, I have been there. I was brought up in a poor area. It did not stop me getting where I am now. I do not feel that "Im the MAN". I'm just another ordinary person who have strived to do better things. I know if my terms and conditions of my job was not acceptable then I would adapt and do something about it.
Richard Branson, Alan Sugar etc would not accept sitting on the unemployment conveyor belt. These were average guys with not much qualifications to speak of. They possessed one thing that some (not all) of the unemployed masses don't. A determination to achieve. I have worked first hand with a lot of unemployed people who don't won't to work, have no intention of ever working. Why should they, they are handed money free of charge. they are the ones who pay ten pounds a week for heating there home whilst the rest of the people who have contributed to society pay top dollar. These are the people who think society owes them a living....I'm sorry bud but the long term unemployed are oxygen thieves.
This country needs to change the policy for the unemployed. They need to stop the "chancers" applying for managerial jobs they know they are not going to get, just because they can tick the box and say they have made an effort to look for a job.
I have no beef with the people that are short term unemployed, who through circumstance been found out of a job for reasons which are not their fault. They will look for work, they will be determined enough to get work. When they do get work, part of their wages will be taken from them to feed the parasites in this country.
God forbid if I ever found myself unemployed I'd still get up at 7am and mend old wifies gates if I had to or I'd do something voluntary. You either have a work ethic in you or you don't.
TBH, I have been there. I was brought up in a poor area. It did not stop me getting where I am now. I do not feel that "Im the MAN". I'm just another ordinary person who have strived to do better things. I know if my terms and conditions of my job was not acceptable then I would adapt and do something about it.I didn't mean the man as being some sort of insult rather the man in possession. Many people forget how hard it is to gain employment and when they do they quite happily denegrate those less fortunate although just as fervent in the search for employment
Richard Branson, Alan Sugar etc would not accept sitting on the unemployment conveyor belt. These were average guys with not much qualifications to speak of. They possessed one thing that some (not all) of the unemployed masses don't. A determination to achieve.You are talking about a small minority there and far removed from the average person.
I have worked first hand with a lot of unemployed people who don't won't to work, have no intention of ever working. Why should they, they are handed money free of charge. they are the ones who pay ten pounds a week for heating there home whilst the rest of the people who have contributed to society pay top dollar. These are the people who think society owes them a living....I'm sorry bud but the long term unemployed are oxygen thieves.Absolutely right but there are people out there that are trying extremely hard to gain employment, have the right qualifications, not applying for jobs they have no chance of getting and are still being rebuked. I just got the feeling you are pigeon-holing them all as having the same mindset. Nothing seems to be further from the truth.
I will correct youon that phrase "all the people who have posted on her...want to sit on the brew"
At no point did I say that. I have worked my whole life, changing jobs when it suited me. I worked hard in every job I did and still am in the job I a m doing. I have never found any problem finding work as there is plenty work out there for everyone. Instead of sitting on the ORG they could proactively go out and find work. You wont get anywhere sitting watching Jeremy Kyle through the day.
I would like me to be prime minister, I would restore a sense of pride in people and would get the country a cleaner place by making people work for their benefits. No task too small.
People who think positive and act positive have positive things bestowed upon them. Get out and make a difference.
\
wrong there are not plenty of jobs pick up apaper man and have a look how many jobs there are and think about how many people there are who dont have jobs and since this post started with people saying how theretrying to find jobs but could not find any i think you saying people dont want to work is just rubbing in the fact that you have been lucky enough not to be unemployed .
And since you have not been unemployed you would not have a clue how hard it is to get a job when your not in one already ......:cool:
wrong there are not plenty of jobs pick up apaper man and have a look how many jobs there are and think about how many people there are who dont have jobs and since this post started with people saying how theretrying to find jobs but could not find any i think you saying people dont want to work is just rubbing in the fact that you have been lucky enough not to be unemployed .
And since you have not been unemployed you would not have a clue how hard it is to get a job when your not in one already ......:cool:
Dandod, the phrase "assumption is the mother of all.." You say I have never been unemployed, how do you know this. Do you know my employment history? I indeed found myself out of a job at a stage in my life. I however did not claim benefit but went actively seeking work outwith the area I lived. I found a job and quickly climbed the rungs of the company. There are jobs out there, if there was not then we wouldn't have people moving from other countries and gaining employment here.
So next time don't assume I don't know what it feels like to be out of work. Furthermore as i said in a previous post, I came from a deprived area and It did not hamper my determination for bettering myself.
Don't look for excuses look for a job. It is easy to blame others, your future lies in your hands and your hands alone
percy toboggan
29-Mar-08, 09:11
The majority of people on the dole are lazy, blood sucking cannon fodder!
What ? !
I'm unsure how you link the term 'cannon fodder' with lazy dole scroungers?
Either you are unsure of what the former means, or have not heard the description given to unwitting, unwary young men who sacrificed themselves in wars past for an ungrateful nation.
Could you please expand upon your choice of terminology here? Moreover..the term 'blood sucking' when applied to 'cannon' fodder' seems to be a clear case of antithesis, as any blood, in relation to said fodder was likely to be leeching out of their dying bodies in copious quantities.
If, you are using the term as a generic one to describe idle. shiftless sub-working class people who may at some future time be called upon to make the ultimate sacrifice then at best it's an anachronism...at worst an insult to those who have gone before.
Im my humble opinion.
Well what about the people who have paid into the system all their lives and can't claim a dime? I paid a significant % of my wage as a firefighter for years and had to retire with a knee injury. I cannot claim a bean as my pension is said to be too high. So why do I still have to contribute? I will never be able to claim yet the government does not reduce my NI because of this. At the same time many imigrants after a year in the country are able to claim. Sucks!
percy toboggan
29-Mar-08, 14:01
Well what about the people who have paid into the system all their lives and can't claim a dime? I paid a significant % of my wage as a firefighter for years and had to retire with a knee injury. I cannot claim a bean as my pension is said to be too high. So why do I still have to contribute? I will never be able to claim yet the government does not reduce my NI because of this. At the same time many imigrants after a year in the country are able to claim. Sucks!
I'm sure you are in a reasonable position as a retired fireman....and are in a position to do other, less physical work. Though I don't expect it will be as good a number as you've been used to.
Benefits are a safety net for those genuinely in need...the line has to be drawn somewhere. I do not believe any immigrant should be able to claim any state benefit without a qualifying work period of at least five years...if they cannot pay their way they should be removed, except in the most acute of circumstances.
Depends on what you call a reasonable position.My pension is around £500 pcm. Can you live on that if you were unemployed and not able to claim other benefits to which you had paid into? The point I am making is that I was paying around 13% of my wage into my pension fund for 16 years and still paying normal NI contributions. Had I known at the time I would be unable to claim any sort of benefit in the future I may well have looked at binning paying the 13%. You seem to be advocating that working people should be paying into a system for the benefit of others. I take exception to the fact that regardless of the amount I have paid in, I am unable to take out if I become unemployed. As I said in my previous post, there are people allowed to make legitimate claims who have made little or no contributions to the benefit system. Still sucks!
I'm sure you are in a reasonable position as a retired fireman....and are in a position to do other, less physical work. Though I don't expect it will be as good a number as you've been used to.
Benefits are a safety net for those genuinely in need...the line has to be drawn somewhere. I do not believe any immigrant should be able to claim any state benefit without a qualifying work period of at least five years...if they cannot pay their way they should be removed, escept in the most acute of circumstances.
Percy cant see how u think a fireman has good number a fireman puts his life at risk doing there job would u?
And as for immigrants they should not be able to claim anything until they have worked here for a long period of time its only fair that they should contribute a certain amount of tax and ni tax before the claim and they should be able to just walk in to council house before any other local and to be quite honest about they should not be allowed in the country unless they speak very good english
Depends on what you call a reasonable position.My pension is around £500 pcm. Can you live on that if you were unemployed and not able to claim other benefits to which you had paid into? The point I am making is that I was paying around 13% of my wage into my pension fund for 16 years and still paying normal NI contributions. Had I known at the time I would be unable to claim any sort of benefit in the future I may well have looked at binning paying the 13%. You seem to be advocating that working people should be paying into a system for the benefit of others. I take exception to the fact that regardless of the amount I have paid in, I am unable to take out if I become unemployed. As I said in my previous post, there are people allowed to make legitimate claims who have made little or no contributions to the benefit system. Still sucks!
It sometimes david makes you think whos better of the person that works all there life pays all there bills and has savings and a pension for when they retire or the person that doesnt want to work and claims for everthing and goes out and get drunk and doesnt care about savings and pensions when they retire and then gets a free ticket into the nursing home living next door to the guy who doesnt qualify for free nursing home entitlement because he worked all his life and has savings and a good pension and has to shell out £500 a week to stay at a nursing home it really makes you wonder sometimes
percy toboggan
29-Mar-08, 14:32
[quote=david;366265] You seem to be advocating that working people should be paying into a system for the benefit of others. quote]
This is what's called a 'welfare state.'
N.I contributions are not not a 'savings club' type system.
The money you claim into old age as your right will be paid by others who are working at the time...likewise you and I have paid the pensions and benefits of others as we have been working.
Of course any good system will be abused. The state should pursue the abusers and apply rigorous restrictions but the safety net should always be there for those who need it.
You asked the question about £500 - I agree it would be a difficult sum to survive on each month but as a bottom line you will never starve...you always have that amount coming in. I assume it's index linked.
Presumably, like me you have savings that will in the event be whittled away...this is galling I agree, but when you reach a certain level of financial sufficiency nobody can expect the state to pick up the tab until those reserves have gone.
Thanks Eddie, I gave up many holidays away because I was paying so much of my wage to my pension, while other peeps were enjoying themselves safe in the knowlege that the benefit system would come to their rescue. Perhaps I should have had less regard to my future finances also?
percy toboggan
29-Mar-08, 14:38
It sometimes david makes you think whos better of the person that works all there life pays all there bills and has savings and a pension for when they retire or the person that doesnt want to work and claims for everthing and goes out and get drunk and doesnt care about savings and pensions when they retire and then gets a free ticket into the nursing home living next door to the guy who doesnt qualify for free nursing home entitlement because he worked all his life and has savings and a good pension and has to shell out £500 a week to stay at a nursing home it really makes you wonder sometimes
I agree Eddie. It does 'make one wonder'...but then there is the matter of self-respect as a driver for self sufficiency.
To fritter ones money away has always been an option... but what do we do for those who have done so? Leave them in aged squalour, or neglect their health old age. Leave their children to roam for food, begging, and worse? The system we have is full of anomalies and unfairness, yet there are few better ones thta I know of.....we do seem to have a larger minority of feckless folk than most countries in the devloped world....only long term planning can change that.
So Percy, do you agree then that in my predicament it is fair for me to have contributed to the welfare state all my life without ever being in a position to be able to benefit from it whereas imigrants after a year are allowed to make such claims?
percy toboggan
29-Mar-08, 15:18
So Percy, do you agree then that in my predicament it is fair for me to have contributed to the welfare state all my life without ever being in a position to be able to benefit from it whereas imigrants after a year are allowed to make such claims?
First...old age pension is not means tested...you will qualify for that.
...life is many things David but it is never 'fair'...I'm sure as an ex-firefighter you will have dwelt upon that in very many situtations of life...and death.
I've already said that immigrants (a huge catch all term for so many different categories) should NOT be able to claim anything until they have worked for five years minimum. I am actually very anti-immigration as any regular here will testify...my attitude toward immigrants has been pilloried on occasion...however the two problems - your predicament & immigration - are not necessarily linked.
If we're going to debate immigration (and I'm not minded to at the moment) it must be on sensible terms, & not seen in such a subjective context. In general terms immigrants are holding down my wage too....which again, is not fair !
Hi Percy, from what you have said it seems to me that you are suggesting that is ok for imigrants to be able to claim say after 5 years but I have paid into the system since I was 18-now 42. So that is 24 years and I am unable to claim a cent. Yes life is not fair, but it seems to be a lot fairer to those individuals who have contributed least to this utopian welfare state that you allude to. Sucks, sucks
Easier to get a job if you have one already.:roll:
Nothing to stop people improving your qualifications while employed and climbing up the ladder.
Penelope Pitstop
29-Mar-08, 22:01
It sometimes david makes you think whos better of the person that works all there life pays all there bills and has savings and a pension for when they retire or the person that doesnt want to work and claims for everthing and goes out and get drunk and doesnt care about savings and pensions when they retire and then gets a free ticket into the nursing home living next door to the guy who doesnt qualify for free nursing home entitlement because he worked all his life and has savings and a good pension and has to shell out £500 a week to stay at a nursing home it really makes you wonder sometimes
From personal experience Eddie, the person who works hard all their life, saves hard for that rainy day is the one worst off.:(
Penelope Pitstop
29-Mar-08, 22:03
Thanks Eddie, I gave up many holidays away because I was paying so much of my wage to my pension, while other peeps were enjoying themselves safe in the knowlege that the benefit system would come to their rescue. Perhaps I should have had less regard to my future finances also?
David, in the current benefits system that would appear to be the approach to adopt... Very sad indeed isn't it.:confused
Penelope Pitstop
29-Mar-08, 22:05
Easier to get a job if you have one already.:roll:
Nothing to stop people improving your qualifications while employed and climbing up the ladder.
Even if you can't get a job....nothing to stop anyone doing voluntary work is there...better than sitting at home watching day time TV:( At least they would feel as if they had earned their benefits.....or at least I would.
Good luck job hunting. Lifes a bitch. Remain positive at all times, go get it
Penelope, yes very sad indeed when someone has worked all these years only to be told that as he/she has made provision for their future by paying into a pension fund that they are entitled to zip. But like Percy says " life is not fair " I for one was not ever looking to sit back on benefits longterm, however it would surely be common sense that if you had paid 24yrs of stamp then you would have been entitled to something. Seems not.
Hi, my name is Petre from Poland. My inglish not too goood so hopfully u understands. I am thinking of wurking in ur country for just over a year and then mabeys on benefits. I am told u have a verry good system where peeps in ur country work for long time and get nothing but we can come and get lots. Can some peeps explain how this is possible? It seems very strange policy, maybe my freind in Caithnesss make up? Maybe I join the Fire Service?
Hi peeps, life very unfair... I tried nice job with fire service to putwater on big flames. Got nice job but no good. They say I have to put lots of small pay into big fund for pension and then no benefits. Think I stay here for now and drink vodka.
Im my humble opinion.[/quote]
And in mine, I have to fly in the face of adversity, just like those before me, attach a label to me if it pleases you xxx
This is what's called a 'welfare state.'
Eh! Don't you mean 'Nanny State'?
First...old age pension is not means tested...you will qualify for that.
..
'Well from what I've been told there won't be enough money to go round by the time I reach that age, so where's ma share of the pension pot?
but then there is the matter of self-respect as a driver for self sufficiency.
Exactly what I have said, just not so eloquently? as you Percy.
Nothing to stop people improving your qualifications while employed and climbing up the ladder.
No, that's true if you live anywhere else but Caithness. Try Thurso college to further your quals and see how many courses do not require full time study.
Or
......
No, that's true if you live anywhere else but Caithness. Try Thurso college to further your quals and see how many courses do not require full time study.
Or
......
Have to agree with you on this. The course selection is really poor.
I did my higher English (hard going after 10 years away from school) but there has been very little to choose from since. It was my aim to do a course each year or term depending on the scale of it, but the subject choices didn't give me any enthusiasm. :roll:
percy toboggan
30-Mar-08, 09:36
Percy cant see how u think a fireman has good number a fireman puts his life at risk doing there job would u?
I tried to join when I was eighteen in 1969 Eddie, but partial colour blindness precluded me. Pay then was not great, not even good.
If I'd joined then, and been retired now with a nice nest egg and good pension pot..having missed out on two rendundancies in the commercial world during recessions beyond my control.
The cameraderie of the job appealed to me at a younger age(not now)...teamwork and all that. Not to mention decades of earning extra money when I wasn't down at the station - many Firemen had second jobs.
There are long , long waiting lists for this job Eddie...it's a relative corker in a world of insecurity. I have every respect for David and his ilk, and I'm sorry his career was cut short. Fire-fighters, as they are called now are generally good blokes...dependable salt of the earth types.
percy toboggan
30-Mar-08, 09:41
... life is not fair, but it seems to be a lot fairer to those individuals who have contributed least to this utopian welfare state that you allude to. Sucks, sucks...
...I never alluded to 'utopia'...please do not put words into my mouth.
Your slightly self-pitying attitude, and one track, stuck in a groove blame-the-immigrant routine is beginning to grate enough without mis-quoting one who had at least some sympathy...it's beginning to evaporate fast.
percy toboggan
30-Mar-08, 09:45
This is what's called a 'welfare state.'
Eh! Don't you mean 'Nanny State'?
I presume you are quoting me ??
If so...
No...but they are two distinct sides of an admittedly similar coin.
cuddlepop
30-Mar-08, 12:46
No, that's true if you live anywhere else but Caithness. Try Thurso college to further your quals and see how many courses do not require full time study.
Or
......
Try living on Skye where we have no college to improve your education.[disgust]
percy toboggan
30-Mar-08, 15:40
'Well from what I've been told there won't be enough money to go round by the time I reach that age, so where's ma share of the pension pot?
Sadly , and I have no idea how old you are sweetpea...you will probably have to make more provision for yourself. Along with relying partly on the children of recent immigrants to pay such pension as you will be entitled to.
Start building up your pot very early...do not wait until you're 47, as I did:(
although beforehand I could scarcely afford to save up anyway. A two grand windfall from some Halifax shares kick started me in that direction.
Good luck...despite our ocassional differences, maybe because of 'em... I wish you well.
...I never alluded to 'utopia'...please do not put words into my mouth.
Your slightly self-pitying attitude, and one track, stuck in a groove blame-the-immigrant routine is beginning to grate enough without mis-quoting one who had at least some sympathy...it's beginning to evaporate fast.
Percy, I can asure you that I am neither full of self pity or in any way trying to blame immigrants for the benefits system and I am not looking for anybodys sympathy. I apologise if I have communicated this to you in previous posts. What I am saying is there is something clearly wrong with a system which should be fair to all which clearly is not.
percy toboggan
30-Mar-08, 17:51
Percy, I can asure you that I am neither full of self pity or in any way trying to blame immigrants for the benefits system and I am not looking for anybodys sympathy. I apologise if I have communicated this to you in previous posts. What I am saying is there is something clearly wrong with a system which should be fair to all which clearly is not.
David: please read comments carefully...I never suggested you were 'full of self pity' did I?
Yes, the system is flawed...there can never be a system which is 'fair to all' as we've agreed, life isn't like that.
I don't know your circumstances but you've been public with some of them....can you work at all?
At £500 a month I'd guess you're already halfway to the average net Caithenessian wage....if you have a family there are tax credits which might apply if you can work...you can obviously write and express yourself so a desk job with communications involved might appeal...I'm not trying to cajole you, or rub you up the wrong way here but when you float predicaments and problems on an open forum then support is not always 100% guranteed.
In closing..those Poles you mentioned are mostly doing jobs you wouldn't have looked twice at when you were a fit firefighter...it seems someone has to do them.....and bone-idle Brits won't...I'd have a pop at them first.
Percy, it never crossed my mind that you were trying to cajole me or rub me up.
©Amethyst
30-Mar-08, 19:48
I'm having the same problem as Lilly's friend.
I had a temporary contract and I only took the job because I was assured that the contract would be extended until I got a permanent contract. Where I was working before this one, it was a promising job but I wasn't treated well - after collapsing at work, I was left to my own devices to get to hospital and no one asked if I was alright, I was just told to get back to work or they'd send me a P45. Made a phone call and was practically told over the phone I'd have a job by the next week - I agree that it's who you know these days.
Contract ended 31/12/07. I worked, and no one told me whether it would be extended or not, so I started looking for a new job on 2nd January. On the 16th of January I received a letter saying that the decision had been made to let me go due to misconduct for my prolonged absence. I was confused to say the least because as I understood it, I didn't have a contract.
Since then, I have had 3 interviews and applied for hundreds of jobs. I'm applying for full time, part time, jobs I could do with my eyes closed, jobs I am underqualified for... every job I can do I am applying for. Still, no one wants to give me a job.
Inverness, these days, seems to be no easier than Caithness to get a job.
In closing..those Poles you mentioned are mostly doing jobs you wouldn't have looked twice at when you were a fit firefighter...it seems someone has to do them.....and bone-idle Brits won't...I'd have a pop at them first.You are not totally wrong but you neglect to mention the fact that eastern Europeans are also doing the jobs that a lot of not so bone-idle Brits would do and have done for years so let's keep things in perspective.
So whats the problem here? Having had numerous reply posts from Percy Tobbogan I now understand that life is just not fair, just put up and shut up. Listen to Percy- he knows best. Just get on with it. Get onto the rest of the idle Brits instead of moaning on and on.
David
So whats the problem here? Having had numerous reply posts from Percy Tobbogan I now understand that life is just not fair, just put up and shut up. Listen to Percy- he knows best. Just get on with it. Get onto the rest of the idle Brits instead of moaning on and on.
DavidThe idle Brits thing is just an insult used to justify mass immigration, rise above it.;)
The idle Brits thing is just an insult used to justify mass immigration, rise above it.;)
Hi TBH, I am tempted to agree with you but again, I urge you to look through the previous threads posted by Percy Tobbogan.This person is obviously an expert on these matters.Read these posts and you will quickly understand how wrong your understanding is of things. This is what is so good about this forum, it makes you realise how ignorant you can be on certain matters! Thanks Percy
David
Penelope Pitstop
31-Mar-08, 10:31
There is no money in working for anyone. Your money is taken from you by the government before you recieve it, unlike if you set up a business where tax is paid after you have been paid.
Not sure where you're coming from here?
It is disheartning when you go to the trouble of applying for a job and you get no reply at all.It takes no time at all to email phone or write a short letter to thank you for expressing an interest in a position. It is nothing short of rude .
I spent 6 months looking for a job up here before I moved up full time (whilst I was in Edinburgh) and came up for several interviews. Having applied for over 60 jobs I hardly got any responses from anyone, got messed about by a lot of company's. Have not been to Uni but have worked ever since I left college had a wealth of experience to bring to any firm but got no-where. I quickly learned that it is very much who you know up here even was told that by the local job agency's. Having been up here nearly 3 years you are still an outsider till you have several generations here! I eventually managed to secure a job at Tesco's, not my ideal role but nothing else going.
percy toboggan
31-Mar-08, 17:15
So whats the problem here? Having had numerous reply posts from Percy Tobbogan I now understand that life is just not fair, just put up and shut up. Listen to Percy- he knows best. Just get on with it. Get onto the rest of the idle Brits instead of moaning on and on.
David
Well David,
as you seem intent on personalising this debate I'm at least glad that you're coming around to my way of thinking.
Seems to me you're used to folk agreeing with you all the time and this discourse has come as something of a shock to you.
TBH: If you do not think we have a problem with an element of indigenous Brits who would rather while away their time on benefit than put in a days work you are deluding yourself....
Penelope Pitstop
31-Mar-08, 18:03
If you do not think we have a problem with an element of indigenous Brits who would rather while away their time on benefit than put in a days work you are deluding yourself....
It is my opinion as well that there are far too many people (Brits ...as well as all the other makes and models:confused) indulging themselves at the tax payers expense.
No Percy infact I am very used to people disagreeing with my views. People like the benefit office, the "keep the Gurkhas out brigade" etc and of course yourself. Maybe, just maybe you could be wrong on this one but I doubt it as much as you.
percy toboggan
31-Mar-08, 19:00
No Percy infact I am very used to people disagreeing with my views. People like the benefit office, the "keep the Gurkhas out brigade" etc and of course yourself. Maybe, just maybe you could be wrong on this one but I doubt it as much as you.
Well, that's clear as mud then. Thanks.
The discourse is done as far as I'm concerned...I might meet you on another thread sometime...until then good luck.
Well, that's clear as mud then. Thanks.
The discourse is done as far as I'm concerned...I might meet you on another thread sometime...until then good luck.
Percy, thanks for all your advice. You won't hear from me for a while. Going abroad to check out foreign benefit systems. Might try Nepal.
Many thanks
David
TBH: If you do not think we have a problem with an element of indigenous Brits who would rather while away their time on benefit than put in a days work you are deluding yourself....Of course we have a problem with long-term unemployed people that have no wish to work and would rather bleed the system dry but we also have unemployed people willing to work but Eastern Europeans are being given preference, you seem to neglect that issue.
Also, this phrase, "only doing the jobs lazy Brits do not want", is bending the truth slightly and an apology to companies now not willing to give British workers a chance. As I have said they are also in positions that companies had no problem filling in the past, that's not delusional.
[quote=blowfish;366167]Dandod, the phrase "assumption is the mother of all.." You say I have never been unemployed, how do you know this. Do you know my employment history? I indeed found myself out of a job at a stage in my life. I however did not claim benefit but went actively seeking work outwith the area I lived. I found a job and quickly climbed the rungs of the company. There are jobs out there, if there was not then we wouldn't have people moving from other countries and gaining employment here.
So next time don't assume I don't know what it feels like to be out of work. Furthermore as i said in a previous post, I came from a deprived area and It did not hamper my determination for bettering myself.
Don't look for excuses look for a job. It is easy to blame others, your future lies in your hands and your hands alone
porkys porkys
your my hero...
Try living on Skye where we have no college to improve your education.[disgust]
I'd compare Skye an Thurso then..... For all we've got we'd be better with nothing.....
I tried to join when I was eighteen in 1969 Eddie, but partial colour blindness precluded me. Pay then was not great, not even good.
If I'd joined then, and been retired now with a nice nest egg and good pension pot..having missed out on two rendundancies in the commercial world during recessions beyond my control.
The cameraderie of the job appealed to me at a younger age(not now)...teamwork and all that. Not to mention decades of earning extra money when I wasn't down at the station - many Firemen had second jobs.
There are long , long waiting lists for this job Eddie...it's a relative corker in a world of insecurity. I have every respect for David and his ilk, and I'm sorry his career was cut short. Fire-fighters, as they are called now are generally good blokes...dependable salt of the earth types.
Try joining the Maryhill brigade then, they're calling out fo recruits every week due to being a man down every time they go out. Bit like the WAR you were on about earlier. The firefighters I know are treated disgustinlgy and don't they know it!
Just had a look at my payslip and I was nearly sick when I looked at the 'total deductions bit' Most of my money is going on tax and N.I with a tiny amount going into my pension. Can I not tell someone that I want it to be the other way round with most of the money going into my pension?
Penelope Pitstop
01-Apr-08, 12:15
Just had a look at my payslip and I was nearly sick when I looked at the 'total deductions bit' Most of my money is going on tax and N.I with a tiny amount going into my pension. Can I not tell someone that I want it to be the other way round with most of the money going into my pension?
Unfortunately it is the Inland Revenue that decides how much PAYE and NI your employer must deduct from your wages. Your employer is an unpaid tax collector.
percy toboggan
01-Apr-08, 17:50
If 'most of your money is going on tax and N.I. then something is very wrong.
Have a word with your accounts....pay roll dept.
I too usually fork out upwards of eighty or ninety quid a week stoppages but seldom think about it.
Tax is about the only cohesion left that binds a society together. So long as the broadest backs bear the heaviest load I don't have a problem with income tax.
I do object to paying tax on savings interest though...I feel it's an injustice...having been taxed as I was earning it...and then again later on.
If 'most of your money is going on tax and N.I. then something is very wrong.
Have a word with your accounts....pay roll dept.
I too usually fork out upwards of eighty or ninety quid a week stoppages but seldom think about it.
Tax is about the only cohesion left that binds a society together. So long as the broadest backs bear the heaviest load I don't have a problem with income tax.
I do object to paying tax on savings interest though...I feel it's an injustice...having been taxed as I was earning it...and then again later on.
But heh, lifes not fair!
percy toboggan
01-Apr-08, 17:55
But heh, lifes not fair!
Difference is ...I can cope with the unfairness....all you seem to do is bleat about it.
Difference is ...I can cope with the unfairness....all you seem to do is bleat about it.
Gotcha again !
percy toboggan
01-Apr-08, 18:05
Gotcha again !
If it makes you happy David...but I don't know what you're on about.
Sun reader perhaps?...of a certain vintage? c. '1982
Get a life...even on one knee it's possible...I'm managing on two knackered hips...no pension to bail me out.
If it makes you happy David...but I don't know what you're on about.
Sun reader perhaps?...of a certain vintage? c. '1982
Get a life...even on one knee it's possible...I'm managing on two knackered hips...no pension to bail me out.
Didn,t realise fishing was so easy! Go on, reply again!!
Have to agree with you on this. The course selection is really poor.
I did my higher English (hard going after 10 years away from school) but there has been very little to choose from since. It was my aim to do a course each year or term depending on the scale of it, but the subject choices didn't give me any enthusiasm. :roll:
Is there anything you would really like to see available at the College?
northener
02-Apr-08, 21:08
I spent 6 months looking for a job up here before I moved up full time (whilst I was in Edinburgh) and came up for several interviews. Having applied for over 60 jobs I hardly got any responses from anyone, got messed about by a lot of company's. Have not been to Uni but have worked ever since I left college had a wealth of experience to bring to any firm but got no-where. I quickly learned that it is very much who you know up here even was told that by the local job agency's. Having been up here nearly 3 years you are still an outsider till you have several generations here! I eventually managed to secure a job at Tesco's, not my ideal role but nothing else going.
I've got to ask....
You wanted to move to an area with some of the highest rates of unemployment in Scotland and then you wonder why you find it difficult to get a job? Competition can be bloody fierce up here for any job that's half-decent.
If you've got skills that can't be met locally - you'll get the job. If you haven't got skills that are in demand - you won't get it. Same as anywhere else.
I admire your enthusiasm, CurlyTop, but I think maybe you were being a bit over optimistic.
Regarding getting jobs by knowing the right people. Well, you're absolutely right. But what's wrong with that?
If someone knows someone locally who has the right skillset and comes with recommendations from people in the local community, then surely this would make sense.
Up until relatively recently, there were no hot-shot Agencies. Most jobs were filled by the method you're commenting on. Not just in Caithness but across Britain.
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