View Full Version : Chickens
the second coming
09-Jan-08, 09:10
Has anyone been watching the program by Hugh Fearnley Wittingstall on free range verses battery chickens? I can't make up my mind. Theres so many arguements for free range but at the end of the day I feel it comes down to what you can afford and whether your conscience can let you afford it.
Anyone got anything to add?
I usually buy whats cheapest, unless I have time to go to the butchers.
My mum always buys locally produced free range chickens and boy does the difference in quality show!! The free range is so much jucier/tastier/tender ...... and although more expensive, I've seen smaller turkeys ;)
I think I'll be converted!! I agree with Hayley though, the conditions aren't much different to what I'd have thought, just I'd never thought about it. The same goes for all meat though, the quality of butcher meat far outweighs what you can buy in the supermarket.
I don't think that the 'strict standards' that the supermarkets look for is much of an excuse either - there aren't many standards in the first place! The fact that all the supermarkets are reluctant to meet with him speaks volumes IMO.
Also, his 'farm hand' John was told if he took part in the programme, he'd never work in the industry again. Good on him for not backing down!!
j4bberw0ck
09-Jan-08, 10:10
I thought the editing let down the point he was trying to make; just after being seen weeping about not wanting to kill another bird, he's seen in the next shot walking out of the shed and the voiceover says "I've added another two birds to the 45 million which die without reaching the production line".
OK, so perhaps no one gets a kick out of killing chickens but weeping over two of them might be thought a little OTT for a healthy psyche. Perhaps they filmed that particular sequence at a different time.
Interesting also that nowhere was he seen doing the same "weeding out" in the free-range section. A contact involved in the food industry assures me the attrition rate will be at least as great; the flip side of the free range coin is greater stress on the birds - predation (raptors, rats, crows), temperature and weather (getting wet and cold).
The most balanced point of view on there is Hayley, the single parent. Setting the kids up to weep buckets by letting them in only after they'd seen friends' mothers come out weeping was as blatant a piece of TV brainwashing as I've seen in a long time. Psychological game-playing.
I have to confess Ive worked in one of the most disgusting places on earth....Battery hen houses. For cruelty it is 1st rate. 6/8 more sometimes hens crammed into wire cages, beaks clipped as not to cause damage to other birds, dead birds left in for hours until "the dead man " used to do his rounds to remove them, no day light , force fed, it just goes on and on.
On the other hand we owned a smallholding in Lincs and i had 100+ chooks running about doing what chooks do.
Its definitely much better quality meat raising your own or buying free range , the eggs are different as well, a dark yellow yoke and much tastier. jan x
I have to confess Ive worked in one of the most disgusting places on earth....Battery hen houses.
<snip>
Its definitely much better quality meat raising your own or buying free range , the eggs are different as well, a dark yellow yoke and much tastier. jan x
I think Jamie Oliver covers the battery hen aspect of chickens.
What amazed me was when Hugh showed the families how to make a meal for 5 or 6 from the leftovers. The families obviously never used the bird to its full potential, but complained that a free range bird was too expensive :roll:
Have to agree with you 100% about the quality of eggs/meat from free range.
J4bberw0ck, I agree that they should have shown some of the losses from the free range side - but it was mentioned that the same treatment was given to both sides if the birds were underdeveloped etc.
I think the point Hugh was making about killing the hens was that, in his own circumstances, he would never sacrifice a hens life purely because it was underweight.
The question put to Hayley was a very good one: given the choice to live the free range life or the intensive fed life, which would you choose? If humans were treated the same as the intensive animals, there would be hell to pay!!
Edit: I also don't agree with sending the children in.
It used to be years ago that our food bills were a much higher percentage of our income.I don't understand why parents rule price over quality when feeding their children ,and when you think about it the majority of the population buy so much processed food that end up being far more expensive and not very good for you anyway so why not buy fresh?
the second coming
09-Jan-08, 12:20
I don't disagree with any of these arguements and comments above. I find myself in a weird situation that I get all my beef and lamb from known farms or butchers but pork and foul I get from the supermarket. I don't know why this is, or how it has occurred.
Like some, I grew up with my folks keeping chickens, mainly for eggs which has a quality second to none, and after approx 3 years when they stopped laying as well we culled them. We ate the chicken breasts and the dogs got the rest. It wasn't great meat, a bit chock and a bit akin to rabbit. I think this was more to do with the breed than anything else.
I think the taste of a free range/corn fed/organic chicken is by far superior to battery reared but the cost difference is considerable and it is only on rare occasions that I can afford this. Little gets wasted when bought, a couple of meals and then a soup from the leftovers and carcass.
I found some of the marketing and packaging a little distasteful such as pretty looking corn fields and blue skies on blatent battery farmed hens and I think that every meat eater should know and appreciate the origin and life cycle of the meat he/she consumes, the same goes for fish.
The program hasn't put me off eating chicken in the slightest but it's made me question whether to take up the cheaper offers, better in the knowlegde of the history of the bird or whether to eat a better reared bird less often so I can afford it. I've no problem with the killing side of it as I've hunted and shot all types of game and fowl. It always tasted better when you've hunted, prepared and cooked a meal from scratch along with home grown veg!!:Razz
Since we apparently throw away one third of the food we buy, it seems to me it would cost about the same if we bought less meat, made sure it was at least "Farm approved" and did not waste it. I'm sure the reason so much food is wasted is simply because it is cheap. There are also the BOGOFs so you feel you actually haven't even paid for half of it. I buy much less meat now than I used to, partly due to the various tv programmes there have been, and just make sure I don't waste any of it. It can be quite time consuming though, just reading the labels. I vowed never again to buy anything containing EU pork after seeing the way pigs, which are intelligent animals, are kept in some EU countries. It is amazing how many products in supermarkets, which you think are British produced, actually contain meat from the EU but you need a magnifying glass to see it.
I do admire those who only buy from local butchers and know the meat is reared locally as am sure if we all did this the supermarkets would have to get the message. Think I feel a late New Year's Resolution coming on as, unlike many, I have no excuse for not doing this. Obviously for busy mums with families it's a different story.
I feel the programs that have been on lately have been pushing people off the meats, if they cant afford the free range etc then they are not going to go for the battery chiken if they havent liked the way they are breed.
Its a mind over matter thing I feel. what you dont see you dont mind
I had one of the tesco buy two chicken for £5 the other night and it was very good. In our house chicken is the main meat eaten so I am not going to change.
I do however go to my butcher for red meats knowing they r hung properly and local, but where up here do you get a local chicken.
look how many cooked chicken wick and thurso tesco go through, and you cant tell me they are free range, and I bet the ones going on that they wont eat battery chickens have purchased a good few of the tesco cooked ones???
Since we apparently throw away one third of the food we buy, it seems to me it would cost about the same if we bought less meat, made sure it was at least "Farm approved" and did not waste it. I'm sure the reason so much food is wasted is simply because it is cheap. There are also the BOGOFs so you feel you actually haven't even paid for half of it. I buy much less meat now than I used to, partly due to the various tv programmes there have been, and just make sure I don't waste any of it.
I do admire those who only buy from local butchers and know the meat is reared locally as am sure if we all did this the supermarkets would have to get the message. Think I feel a late New Year's Resolution coming on as, unlike many, I have no excuse for not doing this. Obviously for busy mums with families it's a different story.
I only eat free range chicken - I just eat less than I used to. It was actually reading a novel "Two Caravans" by Monica Lewycka, that finally put me right off anything else. :eek:
With your local butchers -it's a case of use it or lose it, I think. I used to use the local butcher in our village until I moved back to the city a couple of years ago. The meat was locally sourced and each animal identified, and it was actually cheaper, as well as so much better, than the supermarket. As were the free range eggs they sold.
Here I have no butcher within easy reach - since the arrival of Tesco nearby, they have all vanished. Consequently I eat very little red meat - I have to make a special trip, which would be difficult for busy working parents.
I agree with you, badger, we probably all buy far too much food because we're tempted by BOGOFs and ssupermarket special offers -then we end up either binning it, or eating more than is good for us. :roll:
i have been watching it. also kill it cook it eat it on bbc3 at 10:30pm.
i am going to start looking where to buy chickens to rear for meat. then i wont have to buy any meat at all. anyone know where i can get good chickens that are reared for meat.
the second coming
09-Jan-08, 15:18
i have been watching it. also kill it cook it eat it on bbc3 at 10:30pm.
i am going to start looking where to buy chickens to rear for meat. then i wont have to buy any meat at all. anyone know where i can get good chickens that are reared for meat.
My folks get their laying hens from a supplier on Skye (they deliver them to the Mart in Oban). I don't know what types of breed of fowl they supply though whether it is only egg producing or meat! I'll ask next time i'm on the phone and PM if relevant.
I'd get chickens too but my wife point blank refuses to have anything to do with them and I work away a lot so I'd not look after them right. I've got enough ground for a coop as well which is a shame.
Way back in the 90's we decided to start up as a free-range egg supplier 'out west'. Found at that time we were the only one on the North coast.. did it all under the regulations; the right density in the hen house, the right square footage per bird in the run, only we doubled these measurements (soft gits)..
Went down to Kinross and purchased 150 day-old Muirfield Blackrocks (these birds were ideal for the Far North's harsh conditions).. bit of a surprise - but obvious - that they were not the Easter-egg little golden chick, but pure black..
Got them home and put them in the shed under the heat and lights with food and water (funny how chickens feed themselves as soon as they come out the egg?).. During the earlier phrase we only lost one bird which we were told was pretty good.. anyway as we were the first living thing they had seen, they must have thought we were mum & dad and would, as they grew up follow us around and, I kid you not, about 7 or 8 would answer to their names. No we did not give 'em all names, but one of them a few weeks old looked a bit poorly and had a slightly bent claw, so put her in a box and into the vet - felt a right pair of prats sat there in the waiting room with other folk with dogs and cats "what you got in the box"? they'd ask, oh just a baby chick we'd reply - getting funny looks - well no way could we ring it's neck.
The Vet said it was a vitamin deficiency and gave her a jab, and she was right as rain after that and would run to the fence on the shout of 'Hoppy'. Another was 'Greed' - this one was an egg-eater, and would nip into other hens boxes - and by the way each - of these boxes had a piece of material across the front, as hens like their privacy - and nick their eggs - in full view of us. So we took an egg, make a hole in each end and blow it, filled it with mustard. Take all the eggs out of the boxes and put a couple of these dummy eggs in and wait - sure enough in comes the hen, jumps up onto a perch across into a box and eats the egg, after a few minutes it then wanders off looking rather confused - never did it again..
We'd get broody hens, put them in a large wire-bottom cage - the airflow cools their underneath and they give up - of course still providing them with food and water..
We were getting up to 30,000 eggs a year and were inspected regularly by the Ministry who were very impressed with our husbandry! We'd get our boxes in bulk sent over from Northern Ireland.
These eggs were delivered to most of the hotels and shops along the Far North, we also supplied the Butchers in Thurso and every Thursday old George would come trundling down on his ancient tractor to pick up his usual 'half dozen'..
But in the end it was continuous work, they lay in two 'flushes' one in the morning and one in the afternoon and we would have to clear the boxes to stop breakages, so finally after a few years we decided to call it a day.. "they'll make good broilers" we're told. No way! they still years of laying.. so over the period of a few weeks we gradually gave them away! on the understanding that they would not be put down - and right now we can look out of our window and see the refection of light on the feathers of the descendents of 'our' chicks!
Okay we were soft, but they did us well, we looked after them and they looked after us..
Is anyone watching Hugh's Chicken Run?
Being a single parent with only one wage I have to buy cheap but I am going to be either going for free range or veggie.
I have always known that the food on my plate was once in a field but up until now I have managed to not think about it too much.
seen it last night and going to watch the next part on channel 4 plus 1.we are going free range from now on aswell,possibly veggie once we watch the jamie oliver programme about what goes into chicken burger and such things.
I am very disappointed at Tescos attitude [evil]
Now I am crying at them killing their pet chickens :~(
changilass
09-Jan-08, 22:51
Watching it and will stick to Tesco cheep and chearfull
I am going to go back to the butchers if I am buying any, sod tescos.
Intensively raised poultry is so pumped full of antibiotics and other chemicals to ensure they survive the conditions they live in for the short time they do live you might not want to eat another one. I would not want to feed my kids with this chemical cocktail...
While organic food may cost a bit more the difference in taste is quite noticeable. And worth the extra IMO...
Being someone who doesn't often watch television, (as 99% of it is 'reality' garbage) i was very impressed with the point made in both Hugh's Chicken Run, and The Lie of the Land, on channel 4 this week.
Starting with Hugh's programme, i think the stark difference between the two types of chicken rearing he undertook, should be enough to convert even low-income households. The fact that the intesively reared chickens are deformed to such level that they can't stand up, and the ones that can will then tramble over them, covering them with waste, just so they can be fattened up in the shortest time possible, is barbaric.
If a family have enough money to buy a chicken in the first place, surely the choice between miserable 'special' offers, and a few pound more for a much higher quality firstly of life for chicken, (not to mention quality of meat!) can easily be made.
In general, I really do think it about time people started thinking about where the food is coming from. It is disgusting that these morphed branches of supermarkets compete with each other over prices, whether it be milk or meat, without thinking how it will affect the living of the farmers who produce it.
If anybody watched 'Lie of the Land' last night, it'd be great to hear opinions on it.
Yoda the flump
09-Jan-08, 23:51
Is there anything really new in these programmes though?
Isn't it fairly obvious that cheap food will be cheap to produce and conditions for the animals will be far from ideal, barbaric even?
We as a society have got used to cheap food, fuel etc. and on the whole now react badly when we are asked to pay the true cost of production.
After watching this I will be going for the free range, didn't really think about it before but after seeing this don't think I'll go for the cheaper ones again.
Margaret M.
10-Jan-08, 03:36
Go Veggie!! No suffering. No dilema.
I like mine eggs in threes and I don't give a cuss where they come from. I eat very little chicken but that is not for any moral reason etc. it's just that I'd rather eat other meats.
As for the "Shock/Horror" programmes on TV? Haven't watched them because they have been done to death so many times before. Without the presenters playing up to the cameras, from what I hear, by following the modern trend of public figures falling into floods of tears at every available opportunity.
"Stop the slaughter. Save the Carrot!"
I agree that there's nothing new in what they are airing and I am surprised that he managed to get 60% of chicken sales to be free range (I also thing this figure will drop after the show)
What I find ironic is Hayley - the single mother on a budget - buying a £2.50 chicken and eating half of it and throwing it out. Surely buying a dearer chicken and using it to its full potential levels out the cost??
Also, all the men sitting in the pub: 'we are on a tight budget, we can't afford to pay more for a chicken' - should that not be interpreted as: 'buying a dearer chicken would mean I get 1 pint less a week and thats not on!'. Its all a case of priorities.
I'm going to go free range, but more because I've managed to free up my days off so I can actually get to the butchers instead of grabbing whatevers in the supermarket.
skinnydog
10-Jan-08, 09:28
I have to admit it makes me laugh when you watch a programme and there are people on supposedly "low income" and they are the very ones who are always in the pub, smoking and at the bookies!!
But yes, surely the best thing to do would be buy a dearer free range chicken and use the whole thing instead of chucking half a cheap one out.
I like mine eggs in threes and I don't give a cuss where they come from.
Real eggs, from real chickens taste sooooooo much nicer than the insipid things you buy off the shelf.
If you know someone who keeps hens which are free range/organic ask to try one of their eggs.
One of the reasons I refuse to eat KFC is due to this very question about intensively raised chickens - while hounding the supermarkets to go organic/free range did he approach KFC?
I have to admit it makes me laugh when you watch a programme and there are people on supposedly "low income" and they are the very ones who are always in the pub, smoking and at the bookies!!
But yes, surely the best thing to do would be buy a dearer free range chicken and use the whole thing instead of chucking half a cheap one out.
Normally he case - moan about not having enough money but always find the cash for the fags and pints...
If she had been interested she could have made soup out of the leftovers. But another example of the buy it cheap chuck it out mindset. I expect all those raised when food was stretched to last 3 or 4 days would be gobsmacked at her attitude.
Real eggs, from real chickens taste sooooooo much nicer than the insipid things you buy off the shelf.
If you know someone who keeps hens which are free range/organic ask to try one of their eggs.
One of the reasons I refuse to eat KFC is due to this very question about intensively raised chickens - while hounding the supermarkets to go organic/free range did he approach KFC?
No, he never approached KFC, but he did get the restaurants/take aways in Axminster to provide a free range option on the menu. The chipper vowed to go free range as it was so popular, but again, I'm sceptical about the long term affect he has had.
If she had been interested she could have made soup out of the leftovers. But another example of the buy it cheap chuck it out mindset. I expect all those raised when food was stretched to last 3 or 4 days would be gobsmacked at her attitude.
All of the group that were involved in rearing their own chickens seemed genuinly gobsmacked that you could eat more of the chicken than just the breast :roll:
Dog-eared
10-Jan-08, 12:24
A few thoughts -
Perhaps some healthy living / cooking education at school to prepare pupils for life would be good.
Kids are brainwashed into eating "Dino Burgers " or whatever from a very young age by clever TV advertising etc.
Unfortunately things are now at the stage where the parents went through the same brainwashing.
But then the government has a vested interest in junkfood as the junkfood producers are very well connected, and money is everything. Never mind the health of the population.
In most countries you prepare and cook your food.
Buying a chicken, eating the breast and binning the rest......jeeesh.
I'm sure there will be a big problem with the amount of antibiotics fed to battery chickens causing consumers to become resistant to the antibiotics and when their health starts to go (through eating junk )the antibiotics won't work.
I dont think programmes such as these are designed to scaremonger but more to try to educate people. It is very true dog-eared that children are brainwashed into eating "dino burgers" and I bet if you looked at the content of such items it would contain very little meat. Look at when Jamie Oliver went on his School Dinners campaign and tried to educate against Turkey Twizzlers - I had never heard of Turkey Twizzlers at that time seeing as I didnt have any children then but I have seen them since and checked the ingredients and its not something that I would feed to my children now. Nor would I feed them fish fingers or cheap hamburgers or anything like that. Fish Fingers are made from literally boiling down fish bones and heads and all the leftover bits and cheap hamburgers are bulked up with other ingredients to make them appear better value when the meat content is very little. People might think I am weird but my children prefer fruit to chocolate and crisps and they eat what myself and my husband eat. I make food from scratch, if we have hamburgers I go to the butchers get the mince and make them myself, if we eat fish I go to the fishmongers and buy fish then bread it for the kids I cut it into smaller chunks and bread it and its just like fish fingers but much better and far more healthier. The meat in Tesco's tends to be a somewhat slight brown colour which fresh meat should not be, and over New Year that I noticed the only fish they were selling apart from salmon was breaded fish - if a shop is selling breaded fish this is because the flesh is bruised or the fish is old and yellow - the breading covers this. In a good butchers the meat is red and a fishmonger with any experience would not display breaded fish on their counter. It does not work out all that more expensive but it gives me a better piece of mind that I know what they (my family) are eating.
And no I am not all high and mighty, I do not have an a fancy high paid job (far from it in fact) and I am no Delia Smith in the kitchen but a little effort goes a lot further in giving my kids a good start in life.
http://www.chickenout.co.uk/banners/Chicken_out_407x250.gif
Thanks for that link mccaugm - it fairly passed a boring afternoon at work reading through the forum on there!! :lol:
luskentyre
11-Jan-08, 01:34
Watching it and will stick to Tesco cheep and chearfull
I'm not quite sure where the "chearfull" (sic) comes in... unless you're referring to your smugness at your "bargain".
changilass
11-Jan-08, 01:42
Its just a saying, but my hubby and my bank manager are always cheerful when I get bargains and don't spend too much.
connieb19
11-Jan-08, 09:50
Its just a saying, but my hubby and my bank manager are always cheerful when I get bargains and don't spend too much.
Is quality not more important than cost when people are feeding children?
rockchick
11-Jan-08, 11:17
<snip> over New Year that I noticed the only fish they were selling apart from salmon was breaded fish - if a shop is selling breaded fish this is because the flesh is bruised or the fish is old and yellow - the breading covers this. <snip>
There isn't too much fresh fish landed between Christmas and New Year, as the boats take holidays too. Shops can't sell fresh fish if they aren't being supplied it...so all you would get is farmed salmon (as you've noticed).
BTW I agree with everything else in your post!
I'm sorry but I simply don't understand how anyone can support an industry that rears animals in disgusting conditions. I eat less meat so I can buy free range and when the meat is off chicken bones, then the bones make excellent stock for soup. For a while I was veggie but then started to think what the countryside would be like without farm animals. If everyone in the country bought British free range meat, even if it's from the supermarket, maybe we could stop this dreadful cruelty and the nonsense of importing meat. If the supermarkets couldn't sell it, they wouldn't supply it - simple.
All animals, even chickens, have individual personalities if they're allowed to develop them. Some countries eat dogs. I wonder how many people on here who say they don't care where there meat comes from so long as it's cheap, would be happy to see a barn full of dogs or cats crammed together with no space to run around, force fed till their legs can't support their bodies, biting each other out of boredom.
For a while I was veggie but then started to think what the countryside would be like without farm animals.
Oh Badger
That's my OH's favourite carnivore argument. However, it's only been 50 years since we stopped using horses for transport and draft. Are they extinct? No, mostly they're now fairly happy in their fields, getting excercised and ridden and fed well, and are no longer flogged or worked to death or killed in battle - in this country at least. Farm animals wouldn't become extinct if we all suddenly ceased abusing/exploiting them.
Watching it and will stick to Tesco cheep and chearfull
Just a pity that the poor chickens won't be very 'chearfull' or feel like 'cheeping'. Can't understand why anyone can happily tuck into a meal knowing that the animal who died to provide it lived such a horrible life before it was killed!
Kids are brainwashed into eating "Dino Burgers " or whatever from a very young age by clever TV advertising etc.
Unfortunately things are now at the stage where the parents went through the same brainwashing.
Exactly. When I was my grandchild's age we still had meat rationing in this country and you had a tin of fruit between 4 people on Sundays bla bla bla, but you can't turn the clock back - as if you'd want to. But why can't people eat half as much chicken and make it free range? I think they'd survive.
Me? - I've not eaten pork in years, haven't eaten chicken and turkey in quite a while. I've decided I'm going to really try hard and eat nothing with a brain (which can presumably feel pain) from now on. I feel it's the only way for me. Fish is out the window too, but I think I'll still eat mussels. Not eating lamb chops has always been and will continue to be my biggest challenge. I've been veggie before for very lengthy periods and sometimes you just want to tear your teeth into meat, like you still want a fag even if you've not had one for years.
And what about leather shoes? Surely to goodness someone can tell me leather is simply a by-product of the meat industry and alleviate my sense of failure at never accomplishing anything 100%?
never been much of a meat eater was always usualy chicken but now dont think i could eat one!!! looks like an extra spoonful o veg for me :D
http://www.vegetarian-shoes.co.uk/default.aspx
http://www.vegetarian-shoes.co.uk/default.aspx
Thanks Mad P, I know you try to be helpful but - these shoes just suck. You're obviously not a shoe fetishist.
Was in Tesco earlier and the free range chickens had been cleaned out. Plenty of people must have seen the show.
Was in Tesco earlier and the free range chickens had been cleaned out. Plenty of people must have seen the show.
I couldn't find any in the co-op - luckily my mum has some in the freezer, so it'll be a FREE free range chicken for me :D
I have just discovered that you can buy condoms suitable for vegans. I am amazed at the things I don't know [disgust]
Thanks Mad P, I know you try to be helpful but - these shoes just suck. You're obviously not a shoe fetishist.
Thankfully I don't have any fetishesesessss...
Cinderella's Shoe
12-Jan-08, 17:55
I have just discovered that you can buy condoms suitable for vegans. I am amazed at the things I don't know [disgust]
At what point are you supposed to ingest them????????
Was in Tesco earlier and the free range chickens had been cleaned out. Plenty of people must have seen the show.
I can report the same situation here in Falkirk.
Think they'll get the message?:D
I hae avidly watched both of Hugh's programmes and also Jamie's first one. I knew that battery conditions were bad but was still shocked at much of what I saw. I am also horrified at the bilge that goes into a lot of our prepared foods - I will be examining these closely in future.
I was reasonably impressed by the 'barn' concept - it seems something of a half-way house that will keep prices down. Conditions weren't too bad. Personally, we shall continue to buy free range wherever knowingly possible. I do acknowledge that there are people, families out there who are desperately balancing their budgets and there has to be a system to cater for them but it IS possible to maintain an animal friendly farming practice following the RSPCA guidance codes but also keep costs down.
We would love to keep chickens but have realised that they would destroy a beautiful and loved garden within no time. Someone local once kept chickens on the allotments but it was only weeks before they got nicked!
Cinders392
13-Jan-08, 21:18
Im a veggie of 10 years after watching a program on broiler houses. Horrible stuff. I only eat fresh eggs from my girls who live in the garden. However there is tonnes of food out there that has battery eggs in them, like quiche etc
Its a hard life but every little helps!!
Still eat chicken as normal regardless of the conditions as after all we breed them for food.Its been the same way for years so wont change now.
I know some people will think thats wrong but I am not going to suddenly "see the light" and become a veggie(you dont wanna be near me after sprouts!).
Alot of cosmetics were tested on animals which I dont agree with.Animals for food is fine but I disagree with using them for "pleasure" purposes.
Still eat chicken as normal regardless of the conditions as after all we breed them for food.Its been the same way for years so wont change now.
.
Try looking at it selfishly..do you really want to eat the flesh of a creature that has been genetically coerced into having a body bigger than it's legs can handle and lives its(short) life in a stressful state?
Don't you think that the hormones produced by such an existence and then ingested by you will have some negative effect on your own health somewhere down the line?:(
Margaret M.
13-Jan-08, 22:40
Still eat chicken as normal regardless of the conditions as after all we breed them for food.
My, what a big heart you have -- an animal can live a painful, cruel existence but you don't care. All that matters to you is that they are there for you to devour when their miserable existence is over!
Its been the same way for years so wont change now
Actually, yes, it can change now. Great strides have been made to improve their lot in life, obviously without your participation.
Try looking at it selfishly..do you really want to eat the flesh of a creature that has been genetically coerced into having a body bigger than it's legs can handle and lives its(short) life in a stressful state?
Don't you think that the hormones produced by such an existence and then ingested by you will have some negative effect on your own health somewhere down the line?:(
Didnt bother generations of people and still wont stop me eating succulent juicy chicken(including hormones,after all i use MSG in my cooking and I am still OK).
I appreciate and respect your point but afraid I loves my meat too much. so will Never change,sorry :(
Didnt bother generations of people and still wont stop me eating succulent juicy chicken(including hormones,after all i use MSG in my cooking and I am still OK).
I appreciate and respect your point but afraid I loves my meat too much. so will Never change,sorry :(
That is my point!
I love my meat too and a free range and corn fed chicken is a delight..if you think the 'broilers' are succulent you would be in for a huge treat.
I say this purely out of selfish taste based reasons.
My, what a big heart you have -- an animal can live a painful, cruel existence but you don't care. All that matters to you is that they are there for you to devour when their miserable existence is over!
I am sorry you feel that way but at least I am being honest and not bowing to some second rate chef who thinks he can dictate what people can and cant eat.
Food is through choice(I know the chickens dont have a choice) I will continue to eat what I want and wont force my opinions on other people.
The answer is simple you make your own informed choice and run with it.
I dont personally do anything to the chickens I just buy them and eat them like millions of other people and a documentary about practices weve known about for years wont sudenly change me.
If they make better conditions for them(I hope they do) and it costs more than I will still buy them,but I wont be a hypochrite and suddenly change because Jamie oliver tells me to.
That is my point!
I love my meat too and a free range and corn fed chicken is a delight..if you think the 'broilers' are succulent you would be in for a huge treat.
I say this purely out of selfish taste based reasons.
I eat all kinds and grades of chicken but must admit I prefer Halal as i find it the best tasting of all, but some people dont like the method of killing so I suppose I cant win either way ;)
the_big_mac
13-Jan-08, 23:54
We tend to buy organic only when it comes to poultry, and consider free range to be a compromise where organic isn't available.
A whole roast chicken should be considered a special meal. With effort and care put into the whole meal, it makes it much more enjoyable. Infact, every meal should be treated as such.
However I appreciate that many will not agree, and will argue that their budget would not allow to stretch as far as organic. Fair enough, I dont have to feed a whole family, but I happily make the sacrifice of cash to have an excellent meal that im not afraid to prepare just cooked.
I always feel guilty when having a curry and the like, and now try to order lamb instead ( cant intensively or indoor rear sheep ). I think the fast food industry is where the real challenge lyes in changing the nations eating habits. Sadly I dont see any major changes from these industries in the near future.
Cedric Farthsbottom III
14-Jan-08, 00:22
Have no worries when it comes to chickens.If it goes well with the curry sauce,then its a guid chicken to me.The only thing I hate about chickens is their too Americanised.One came up to me the other day and said"buck-buck"...........its pounds we use here ye feathery freak.Honestly-nae respect at aw.:lol:
the second coming
14-Jan-08, 22:52
Have no worries when it comes to chickens.If it goes well with the curry sauce,then its a guid chicken to me.The only thing I hate about chickens is their too Americanised.One came up to me the other day and said"buck-buck"...........its pounds we use here ye feathery freak.Honestly-nae respect at aw.:lol:
Aye, these foreign immigrant birds, come over here.. flutter a few feathers... flick their crowns... I don't know. So long as they aren't covered in that foul fowl Sweet and Sour sauce someone recently recommended me!!!!:lol:
I eat all kinds and grades of chicken but must admit I prefer Halal as i find it the best tasting of all, but some people dont like the method of killing so I suppose I cant win either way ;)
Halal is fine with me.
if you are so interested in its manner of death...I cannot understand your lack of interest in it's manner of life.
Genuinely no argument here at all..just curious to see if I have missed something...always learning!
Try looking at it selfishly..do you really want to eat the flesh of a creature that has been genetically coerced into having a body bigger than it's legs can handle and lives its(short) life in a stressful state?
Don't you think that the hormones produced by such an existence and then ingested by you will have some negative effect on your own health somewhere down the line?:(
Had to smile at your answer here, Karia... since all of our vegetables have more genetic engineering than any of our animals. Try investigating the original sweetcorn, wheat, cauli, carrots, marrows, etc. In fact, all of our understanding of genetics is based on the studies of a monk called Gregor Mendel from the middle ages. He fiddled with peas and this led to our current day pea, which bears no relationship to its ancestors. A fascinating subject and a highly recommended read. :)
Have no worries when it comes to chickens.If it goes well with the curry sauce,then its a guid chicken to me.The only thing I hate about chickens is their too Americanised.One came up to me the other day and said"buck-buck"...........its pounds we use here ye feathery freak.Honestly-nae respect at aw.:lol:
Ah! A chicken with a lisp - wow! ;)
Does anyone know where the local butchers get their chickens and chicken breasts from?
:eek:
Had to smile at your answer here, Karia... since all of our vegetables have more genetic engineering than any of our animals. Try investigating the original sweetcorn, wheat, cauli, carrots, marrows, etc. In fact, all of our understanding of genetics is based on the studies of a monk called Gregor Mendel from the middle ages. He fiddled with peas and this led to our current day pea, which bears no relationship to its ancestors. A fascinating subject and a highly recommended read. :)
Totally agree Ricco...but this thread is about chickens!:confused
Tesco were still sold out of free range last night and the standard chickens were marked down in price.
did any one watch jamie oliver's foul chicken and did it changes any of your views on battery chickens?
[quote=dandod;324359]did any one watch jamie oliver's foul chicken and did it changes any of your views on battery chickens?[/quote
Yes..but I think we have covered all the points on the 'chicken' thread !
never seen chicken thread?
I didn't see the TV programme or the thread, oops! I never buy anything but free range eggs. Is a chicken that is for sale in the chiller typically a battery chicken then? If so would it be safe to for me to assume the hot deli chicken is also battery hens? :confused
never seen chicken thread?
A week or so ago this was argued at length...it has just slipped onto page 2.
Loads of info there!:D
I didn't see the TV programme or the thread, oops! I never buy anything but free range eggs. Is a chicken that is for sale in the chiller typically a battery chicken then? If so would it be safe to for me to assume the hot deli chicken is also battery hens? :confused
Sorry Julia but ..yep!:(
If I can afford a ethical one and have time to cook it, fair enough;) f
Well, I cooked my FREE free range chicken on Sunday (thanks mum) and fed 4 with it that day and myself & OH had full meals from it on Monday and Tuesday - there's still enough for full meals tonight and possibly another night - if not, I can make a risotto with it. Plus I've chicken stock for making soup with. So, 12 meals plus soup, not bad!!
I must add - it was a local free range chicken, not a supermarket one, so it was probably a piece dearer, but for the taste difference it would have been worth the price!
northener
16-Jan-08, 09:16
Does anyone know where the local butchers get their chickens and chicken breasts from?
:eek:
Harrolds in Wick
The breasts are imports (if I remember correctly) and i think the whole birds come from Dingwall, I think the whole birds are free range.
.
There is no category for those who don't use battery chickens.....
Lavenderblue2
16-Jan-08, 11:13
I've been buying free-range chicken as much as possible for about the last year or more, the taste is definitely better. I hated seeing those poor creatures crammed into Hugh F-W's sheds and his weren't as crammed as they could have been.
I would never buy anything other than free-range eggs.
Up until a few years ago I kept my own Black Rock chickens for eggs but they were such a tie – we could never have a break away without relying on others. I really miss having such fresh eggs on hand all of the time – I’m so tempted to get some more hens.
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e322/maggie1947/chickens2.jpg LB
There is no category for those who don't use battery chickens.....
True, I can't vote - nowhere to say that I've not changed, since I only bought free range in the first place.....:confused
True, I can't vote - nowhere to say that I've not changed, since I only bought free range in the first place.....:confused
Well Angela, we will just have to assume that anyone who does not vote has always bought (or reared) free range chicken! ;)
I'm with Angela and Torvaig! Programme was interesting though - seeing the parallels between free range and battery. If you are to eat meat - I think it is only right that you see what is involved in the process. In fact these days probably anything you eat - not just meat.
Tesco were still sold out of free range last night and the standard chickens were marked down in price.
No doubt Tescos will be reviewing their ordering quantities to cope with the increased demand for Free Range/Organic chickens. I hope so anyway. I've not seen Free Range chicken for sale over the past 10 days, though I did manage to purchase Organic once.
It seems that Jamie Oliver has ended up with egg on his face going by this article :-
http://uk.news.yahoo.com/itn/20080116/ten-oliver-boiling-over-egg-gaffe-ea4616c_1.html
How extremely embarrassing.
No doubt Tescos will be reviewing their ordering quantities to cope with the increased demand for Free Range/Organic chickens. I hope so anyway. I've not seen Free Range chicken for sale over the past 10 days, though I did manage to purchase Organic once.
It seems that Jamie Oliver has ended up with egg on his face going by this article :-
http://uk.news.yahoo.com/itn/20080116/ten-oliver-boiling-over-egg-gaffe-ea4616c_1.html (http://forum.caithness.org/go.php?url=http://uk.news.yahoo.com/itn/20080116/ten-oliver-boiling-over-egg-gaffe-ea4616c_1.html)
How extremely embarrassing.
Oh poor Jamie....another case of do as I say not do as I do.....:lol:
Yoda the flump
16-Jan-08, 20:29
never had a problem eating battery hens before and still don't. There was nothing new in the programme, all the 'revelations' have been around for years
True, I can't vote - nowhere to say that I've not changed, since I only bought free range in the first place.....:confused
Same here. Have occasionally slipped eating out because you can hardly ask but would never buy battery myself. Does mean you can't buy cooked chicken either.
JamesMcVean
17-Jan-08, 14:23
Seen the show and now bought the Tshirt LOL
Cost £20 though - that is a lot of Chickens!
Hearing that 17 chickens live in one square metre and never ever see the light of day has fairly put me off PERMANENTLY, free range for me from now on! I spent 13 years of my life as a vegetarian, now I remember why. :(
noticed that the coop has stopped selling eggs from caged hens. and the deli was selling free range chicken, bought eggs but why they soo expensive £2.78 for 12 eggs, anyone know someone local who sells them abit cheaper
noticed that the coop has stopped selling eggs from caged hens. and the deli was selling free range chicken, bought eggs but why they soo expensive £2.78 for 12 eggs, anyone know someone local who sells them abit cheaper
They are more expensive BECAUSE they are not from a place that crams the hens in like sardines. As long as the British public keep buying cheap eggs from places that have chickens living on their own excrement, then people who don't give a monkeys about welfare will keep piling the hens high and leave them to suffer. £2.78 for 12 eggs, you can make a 4 egg omelette for less than a quid!!
Buttercup
29-Jan-08, 16:37
noticed that the coop has stopped selling eggs from caged hens. and the deli was selling free range chicken, bought eggs but why they soo expensive £2.78 for 12 eggs, anyone know someone local who sells them abit cheaper
I buy them in McColls in Ormlie. They have the local (Armitage's) Free Range one's at £2.40 (large) £2.60 (ex large) per dozen. You can't beat them ~ no pun intended! :D
They are more expensive BECAUSE they are not from a place that crams the hens in like sardines. As long as the British public keep buying cheap eggs from places that have chickens living on their own excrement, then people who don't give a monkeys about welfare will keep piling the hens high and leave them to suffer. £2.78 for 12 eggs, you can make a 4 egg omelette for less than a quid!!
i was just asking,im sorry but to me that is expensive, im on a very low income
and i was wondering if the coops is the most expensive, no need to have go!
i was just asking,im sorry but to me that is expensive, im on a very low income
and i was wondering if the coops is the most expensive, no need to have go!
Who is having a go? I am simply stating the facts. I don't have a lot of money either but I won't buy anything other than free range eggs.
You shouldn't be so touchy, I am merely putting an opinion forward and nothing more.
Hi Ash,
M & L Armitage & Son, Lochquoy Farm, Castletown sell Caithness Free Range Eggs. Telephone 01847 821 417 and they will be pleased to tell you where you can get them. I know they deliver in Thurso; not sure where else. They charge £1.10 per half dozen delivered.
We get our free range eggs from watten shop, they come from Halkirkburn holdings,sibster.I pay under £2 a dozen for xl.Im sure they must supply other shops . Their phone number is 01847831081.
eggs may have got more expensive due to the price of chicken feed as well. i used to be about £9 for a bag of grain and bag of corn, im now about £15.
Prices of feeds have definately risen, and as the old saying goes you get what you pay for.
On Saturdays in the wick market there is a lady that sells the best eggs I have ever tasted. Farmed local too. She sells in some shops, but I am not sure which.
Buttercup
29-Jan-08, 20:34
On Saturdays in the wick market there is a lady that sells the best eggs I have ever tasted. Farmed local too. She sells in some shops, but I am not sure which.
Think that'll be Liz Armitage. :lol:
Hi Ash,
M & L Armitage & Son, Lochquoy Farm, Castletown sell Caithness Free Range Eggs. Telephone 01847 821 417 and they will be pleased to tell you where you can get them. I know they deliver in Thurso; not sure where else. They charge £1.10 per half dozen delivered.
And they are the best eggs you can get IMO x
Has anyone else noticed that despite Jamie Oliver's programme the supermarkets (including Sainsbury) have not increased their stocks of free range and they sell out quickly. I tried Tescos and Sainsbury today to no avail - will try first thing tomorrow.
danc1ngwitch
02-Feb-08, 19:27
Oh dear, dear, dear... Its chickens:roll:
go hungry for a while then debate [lol]
Now please don't think I'm cruel, but its food and food is food.
We are to well of here, and we don't even know it.
Has anyone else noticed that despite Jamie Oliver's programme the supermarkets (including Sainsbury) have not increased their stocks of free range and they sell out quickly. I tried Tescos and Sainsbury today to no avail - will try first thing tomorrow.
The problem with free range chickens is it takes a while to build up stocks of birds when there is a sudden big demand. The supply chain can't come up with them quick enough so it's possible the supermarkets simply can't get enough. On the other hand they may not have increased their orders in the hope that it will soon be yesterday's news. I prefer the former reason though. :)
Oh dear, dear, dear... Its chickens:roll:
go hungry for a while then debate [lol]
Now please don't think I'm cruel, but its food and food is food.
.
Actually no, it's not food is food. It's animals are food (to some). There is no need to be cruel to an animal you are eating. No predator, except the human being, deprives the animals from which it obtains food, of a natural life. Chickens and any other animal that we might choose to consume or use for production feel pain along the same phisiological path ways that we do. They hurt the same way we do when hit/cut/stressed. Because we do not understand their expressions of suffering, does not mean that they do not feel it. If you are going to take the line that food is food and keeps us from starvation, I would put to you that raising animals for food is a luxury that is very inefficient. It would be much better, to prevent starvation, to commit the resources used to feed the animals to feeding human beings. But the chicken/milk/eggs/meat that we all choose to consume as the priveledged and food secure westerners that we are, are a luxury. A Luxury that comes dirt cheap to us at the expense of the suffering an animal that is totally avoidable.
danc1ngwitch
03-Feb-08, 17:47
.
Actually no, it's not food is food. It's animals are food (to some). There is no need to be cruel to an animal you are eating. No predator, except the human being, deprives the animals from which it obtains food, of a natural life. Chickens and any other animal that we might choose to consume or use for production feel pain along the same phisiological path ways that we do. They hurt the same way we do when hit/cut/stressed. Because we do not understand their expressions of suffering, does not mean that they do not feel it. If you are going to take the line that food is food and keeps us from starvation, I would put to you that raising animals for food is a luxury that is very inefficient. It would be much better, to prevent starvation, to commit the resources used to feed the animals to feeding human beings. But the chicken/milk/eggs/meat that we all choose to consume as the priveledged and food secure westerners that we are, are a luxury. A Luxury that comes dirt cheap to us at the expense of the suffering an animal that is totally avoidable.
well, errrrr, oooooo..... dana preach ta me[lol] tell it to the people who are starving in this world. I would throw em a battery chicken or two. :roll:
j4bberw0ck
03-Feb-08, 20:47
I would throw em a battery chicken or two. :roll:
You'd be a lot better throwing them the means to farm the chickens (or anything else) and then removing the EU policies which prevent us buying the produce.
That way they wouldn't be dependent on your largesse for very long.
And no, I don't mean Fair Trade which sounds great to the urban doing-coffee brigade, but in which in reality destroys markets and makes whole nations dependent on aid.
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