View Full Version : Cave Dwellers in Wick
Shabbychic
09-Sep-07, 16:38
I came across this and thought some might find it interesting.
Sir Arthur Mitchell describes some troglodytes in Scotland.
"In August 1866, along with two friends, I visited the great cave at the south side of Wick Bay. It was nine at night, and getting dark when we reached it. It is situated in a cliff, and its mouth is close to the sea. Very high tides, especially with north-east winds, reach the entrance and force the occupants to seek safety in the back part of the cave, which is at a somewhat higher level than its mouth. "We found twenty-four inmates--men, women, and children--belonging to four families, the heads of which were all there. They had retired to rest for the night a short time before our arrival, but their fires were still smouldering. They received us civilly, perhaps with more than mere civility, after a judicious distribution of pence and tobacco. To our great relief, the dogs, which were numerous and vicious, seemed to understand that we were welcome.
"The beds on which we found these people lying consisted of straw, grass and bracken, spread upon the rock or shingle, and each was supplied with one or two dirty, ragged blankets or pieces of matting. Two of the beds were near the peat-fires, which were still burning, but the others were further back in the cave where they were better sheltered. "On the bed nearest the entrance lay a man and his wife, both absolutely naked, and two little children in the same state. On the next bed lay another couple, an infant, and one or two elder children. Then came a bed with a bundle of children, whom I did not count. A youngish man and his wife, not quite naked, and some children, occupied the fourth bed, while the fifth from the mouth of the cave was in possession of the remaining couple and two of their children, one of whom was on the spot of its birth. Far back in the cave--upstairs in the garret, as they facetiously called it--were three or four biggish boys, who were undressed, but had not lain down. One of them, moving about with a flickering light in his hand, contributed greatly to the weirdness of the scene. Beside the child spoken of, we were told of another birth in the cave, and we heard also of a recent death there, that of a little child from typhus. The Procurator-Fiscal saw this dead child lying naked on a large flat stone. Its father lay beside it in the delirium of typhus, when death paid this visit to an abode with no door to knock at.
"Both men and women, naked to their waists, sat up in their lairs and talked to us, and showed no sense of shame. One of the men summoned the candle-boy from the garret, in order that we might see better, and his wife trimmed the dying fire, and then, after lighting her pipe, proceeded to suckle her child. "In the afternoon of the next day, with another friend, I paid a second visit to this cave, when we found eighteen inmates, most of whom were at an early supper, consisting of porridge and treacle, apparently well cooked and clean. One of the women was busy baking. She mixed the oatmeal and water in a tin dish, spread the cake out on a flat stone which served her for a table, and placing the cake against another stone, toasted it at the open fire of turf and wood. This was one of three fires, all situated about the centre of the wider part or mouth of the cave, each with a group about it of women and ragged children.
"There was no table, or chair, or stool to be seen, stones being so arranged as to serve all these purposes. There was no sort of building about the entrance of the cave to give shelter from the winds, which must often blow fiercely into it. Yet this cave is occupied both in summer and winter by a varying number of families, one or two of them being almost constant tenants. "I believe I am correct in saying that there is no parallel illustration of modern cave life in Scotland. The nearest approach to it, perhaps, is the cave on the opposite or north side of the same bay. Both of these caves I have had frequent opportunities of visiting, and I have always found them peopled. Only occasional use is made of the other caves on the Caithness and Sutherland coasts. Of these, perhaps the cave of Ham, in Dunnet parish, is the most frequented. It is the nearness to a large town which gives to the Wick caves their steady tenants. The neighbouring population is large enough to afford room for trading, begging, and stealing--all the year round.
"The occupants of the Wick caves are the people commonly known by the name of Tinkers. They are so called chiefly because they work in tinned iron. The men cut, shape, hammer, while the women do the soldering. "The Tinkers of the Wick caves are a mixed breed. There is no Gipsy blood in them. Some of them claim a West Island origin. Others say they are true Caithness men, and others again look for their ancestors among the Southern Scotch. They were not strongly built, nor had they a look of vigorous bodily health. Their heads and faces were usually bad in form. Broken noses and scars were a common disfigurement, and a revelation at the same time of the brutality of their lives. One girl might have been painted for a rustic beauty of the Norse type, and there was a boy among them with an excellent head. It is possible that one or both of these may yet leave their parents, from dissatisfaction with the life they lead." These cave-dwellers of Wick were the offscourings of society, such as might be found in any town slum. "Virtue and chastity exist feebly among them, and honour and truth more feebly still; they neither read nor write; they go to no church, and have scarcely any sort of religious belief or worship. They know little or nothing of their history beyond what can be referred to personal recollection."
Nothing much changes then.
cuddlepop
09-Sep-07, 18:30
There's a photo to match the story.Tried to copy and paste but failed .
Check out page 5 of Old Wick photo's.
Brilliant picture for the story.:D
cuddlepop
09-Sep-07, 21:04
http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u217/southview7/tinklerscave.jpg
thats better:D
Scotsboy - are you too young??? Its good to know of the tinkers - another piece of history?
i heard that story before but wasnt sure if it was true but no i have seen the pictures does anyone know of anyone who had relations that lived like this
I had seen this picture before but didn't know the story behind it, it's nice to learn a bit more local history :D
i have just read the whole article am what interesting reading it makes, i cant imagine having to ive like that.
south view 7
10-Sep-07, 10:36
Shabbychic, thanks for the article on the cave dwellers of wick,i have printed it off to go with my post card, i am posteing one of the cave at the south head.....s.v.7
south view 7
10-Sep-07, 10:39
South head Wick...http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u217/southview7/cave0027.jpg
What an amazing story!It truely is so hard to belive that people lived like this and not all that long ago either!Nowadays the whole place would be in uproar about people having to live like this but at that time I suppose it was a case of "better than nothing".We all need to read things like this and see pics of it to truely realise how lucky we have it nowadays.Yes I know there are still a lot of homeless people and that is such a sad thing to happen in these times but we are quite sheltered from it up here and reading this makes you think it wasn't just then it is now as well,maybe not in caves but still without a place to call their own x
The difference is if you tried to live in a cave on the beach these days some pen pushing office worker would be after you with all sorts of health and safety legislation and the council would be chasing you for council tax :lol:
The difference is if you tried to live in a cave on the beach these days some pen pushing office worker would be after you with all sorts of health and safety legislation and the council would be chasing you for council tax :lol:
Ha ha, so so true.[lol]
LMAO that is Sooooo true corgiman!It might be worth us all giving it a try just to see what happens :D x
can you imagine the council tax band you would be in with the size of your garden :lol:
Yeah it would be a high band thats for sure BUT at least there would be no grass to cut lol x
Corgiman and Thumper, you are forgetting, what about the Water rates? I think they would be ASTRONOMICAL, don't you. te he. [lol]:lol:
hmmmmmmm nanoo you definately have a point, I couldn't afford to live in cave :lol::lol:
really it is just amazing to think people could live like that could you imagine the kids nowadays having to live in a cave.....
Yes balto it is amazing isn't it,we really don't know how lucky we all are!Kids nowadays get everything too easy....even since I was young things have changed so much,and it wasn't THAT many years ago lol!Hmmn on the water rate thing I reckon you have a point nanoo lol!Better hope that none of the big building companies are reading this or the next advert may be....coming soon...waterside cave with all mod cons!:D x
riggerboy
10-Sep-07, 12:49
the name tinker is incorrect the proper term is tinklers, derived from from when they travelled by horse and cart selling pots and pans, the noise that came from the pots and pans clattering was a tinkling sound and so the name the tinklers arrived,
Scotsboy - are you too young??? Its good to know of the tinkers - another piece of history?
i can just remember a tinkler family that lived in the cave under the old coastguard station in wick, think they only stayed there for a few weeks in the summer months. and i can recall a tinkler camp where the school in willowbank is now. it used to be an old quarry workings i think and it was full of old shacks that the tinklers built. then there was teddy banjo, he lived in a hut he constructed up past the old lifeboat shed. he was,nt a tinkler though, think he was just a recluse. word was that he was quite a learned ex naval officer and he just dropped out of society. then there was another recluse that used to live in the old battery placement at the north head just before you come to the water works. dunno what became of him, he just up & left one time
What an absolutely fascinating story, Shabbychic! I thoroughly enjoyed reading that! Thanks also to Cuddlepop and South View 7 for the interesting photos. It truly is amazing that some folk had to live like that, in the not terribly distant past. Makes me appreciate my home comforts all the more!
the name tinker is incorrect the proper term is tinklers, derived from from when they travelled by horse and cart selling pots and pans, the noise that came from the pots and pans clattering was a tinkling sound and so the name the tinklers arrived,
The term tinker is the usual term used, I have heard tinkler nowhere but Caithness. Tinker is an abbreviation of "tin worker".
Neither term is correct if applied to someone who is not an itinerant who works with tin.
dirdyweeker
13-Sep-07, 02:01
then there was teddy banjo, he lived in a hut he constructed up past the old lifeboat shed.
I well remember walking out that road on a Sunday. Always used to see him. Years later there was a caravan business round there. Cannot remember the name though.
im sure i seen pics of this
Tighsonas4
01-Oct-08, 19:48
LMAO that is Sooooo true corgiman!It might be worth us all giving it a try just to see what happens :D x
thiscave is still there if you fancy a go [lol]
theres a larger photo on here quite some time ago someone has said where even more distinct
dont know of a cave at the south head butat broadhaven on the wick side of that bay the cave is still there and can just remember them in it theres a YARN that it goes back as far as noss
done family tree but didnt find any of mine there [lol]
Tighsonas4
01-Oct-08, 20:37
some of this might interest saveman as he had an interest in this type of thread tony
The term tinker is the usual term used, I have heard tinkler nowhere but Caithness. Tinker is an abbreviation of "tin worker".
Neither term is correct if applied to someone who is not an itinerant who works with tin.
Hello fred, glad you are still alive.
I am sure that, a few years ago, a woman had part of her book about Tinklers published in The Groat. More was supposed to follow but some person/people complained to the Paper that the article was disrespectful to "Tinks"
The rest of the intended material never followed. Fair do's, let's pretend History never happened. Never allow the past to be examined in order that we can learn about prejudices that were in place at the time, but which have no place in the modern world. Don't bother educating readers about people who came from a different background to themselves. Brush it under the carpet in the name of political correctness.
I couldn't agree more, scorrie. provided the information is accurate and is not misleading or intended to inflame feelings then why should such stories be silenced.
The very act of making a fuss and censuring such things can create a situation where people's imaginations run amok. The only thing that does is allow people to create demons where there are none on the grounds that there must be something dreadful which has to be kept secret and we all know how dangerous that can be.
Fred, thanks for that. It's always good to know the correct origin of a name or term especially when it has come to be changed to mean something else over a period of time.
Hi Shabbychic,
I was very interested to read about the cave dwellers as i am researching my family history. My ancesters lived in caves and were tinkers.
Cathy
Tighsonas4
02-Oct-08, 12:24
Hello fred, glad you are still alive.
I am sure that, a few years ago, a woman had part of her book about Tinklers published in The Groat. More was supposed to follow but some person/people complained to the Paper that the article was disrespectful to "Tinks"
The rest of the intended material never followed. Fair do's, let's pretend History never happened. Never allow the past to be examined in order that we can learn about prejudices that were in place at the time, but which have no place in the modern world. Don't bother educating readers about people who came from a different background to themselves. Brush it under the carpet in the name of political correctness.
knew the one who had consented to give them the story but they up set him and he just clammed up tony
I imagine people seen this in the sun earlier this year!!
LIFEBOAT crews today revealed they found a house built into a cliff face while searching a stretch of coastline.
The surprise find was made by Arbroath RNLI lifeboat crew while responding to reports of cries for help coming from the caves.
They discovered the house, within a cave, complete with wooden floor, seats, painted walls and tea tree lights.
No one was found within the house, and the coastguard is currently investigating further.
The lifeboat team was sent out at the request of the coastguard following the emergency call on Tuesday afternoon.
During their coastline search to the north east of Arbroath, in Angus, Scotland, they came across a rope ladder bolted to a cliff face.
A crew member discovered the ladder led to a wooden wall and a locked door – complete with porthole window – sealing off a cave.
Allan Russell, mechanic for the Arbroath RNLI lifeboat, said: “This is certainly the most unusual thing I have come across during my ten years as a lifeboat man.
“There was a well-laid wooden floor, tea tree lights and parts of the walls have been painted.
“We are all wondering who has gone to such time and effort to build this.”
Advertisement
He added that he could not divulge the exact location of the cliff house “to prevent the curious from seeking it out and potentially putting themselves at risk”.
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/article1590001.ece
Valerie Campbell
02-Oct-08, 18:22
Hello fred, glad you are still alive.
I am sure that, a few years ago, a woman had part of her book about Tinklers published in The Groat. More was supposed to follow but some person/people complained to the Paper that the article was disrespectful to "Tinks"
The rest of the intended material never followed. Fair do's, let's pretend History never happened. Never allow the past to be examined in order that we can learn about prejudices that were in place at the time, but which have no place in the modern world. Don't bother educating readers about people who came from a different background to themselves. Brush it under the carpet in the name of political correctness.
How right you are Scorrie!
Apologies for resurrecting such an old thread, but I was wondering if any of the new orgers who've joined since this thread have any information about the former cave dwellers in Wick?
Interesting...In addition of course there is the story of the Badbea Dwellers.....badbeafamilies.com.
Thet were thrown off their land and ended down on the cliffs just South of Berriendale, and likely they would have been better in a cave.
Terrible terrible conditions....just so that the land could be used for sheep.
Lots of research went into that. I know...My Mother's family were part of it....they had to tie the children with a rope around them and tied to a Backie!...A steel spike with a ring in it used to tether animals..
There have been terrible times in life.....
Hope this is interesting to someone and not repeated information
http://www.ambaile.org.uk/en/item/item_illustration.jsp?item_id=17945
And more detailed description from Wikisource:-
Sir Arthur Mitchell describes some troglodytes in Scotland.[10] "In August 1866, along with two friends, I visited the great cave at the south side of Wick Bay. It was nine at night, and getting dark when we reached it. It is situated in a cliff, and its mouth is close to the sea. Very high tides, especially with north-east winds, reach the entrance and force the occupants to seek safety in the back part of the cave, which is at a somewhat higher level than its mouth.
"We found twenty-four inmates—men, women, and children—belonging to four families, the heads of which were all there. They had retired to rest for the night a short time before our arrival, but their fires were still smouldering. They received us civilly, perhaps with more than mere civility, after a judicious distribution of pence and tobacco. To our great relief, the dogs, which were numerous and vicious, seemed to understand that we were welcome.
"The beds on which we found these people lying consisted of straw, grass and bracken, spread upon the rock or shingle, and each was supplied with one or two dirty, ragged blankets or pieces of matting. Two of the beds were near the peat-fires, which were still burning, but the others were further back in the cave where they were better sheltered.
"On the bed nearest the entrance lay a man and his wife, both absolutely naked, and two little children in the same state. On the next bed lay another couple, an infant, and one or two elder children. Then came a bed with a bundle of children, whom I did not count. A youngish man and his wife, not quite naked, and some children, occupied the fourth bed, while the fifth from the mouth of the cave was in possession of the remaining couple and two of their children, one of whom was on the spot of its birth. Far back in the cave—upstairs in the garret, as they facetiously called it—were three or four biggish boys, who were undressed, but had not lain down. One of them, moving about with a flickering light in his hand, contributed greatly to the weirdness of the scene. Beside the child spoken of, we were told of another birth in the cave, and we heard also of a recent death there, that of a little child from typhus. The Procurator-Fiscal saw this dead child lying naked on a large flat stone. Its father lay beside it in the delirium of typhus, when death paid this visit to an abode with no door to knock at.
"Both men and women, naked to their waists, sat up in their lairs and talked to us, and showed no sense of shame. One of the men summoned the candle-boy from the garret, in order that we might see better, and his wife trimmed the dying fire, and then, after lighting her pipe, proceeded to suckle her child.
"In the afternoon of the next day, with another friend, I paid a second visit to this cave, when we found eighteen inmates, most of whom were at an early supper, consisting of porridge and treacle, apparently well cooked and clean. One of the women was busy baking. She mixed the oatmeal and water in a tin dish, spread the cake out on a flat stone which served her for a table, and placing the cake against another stone, toasted it at the open fire of turf and wood. This was one of three fires, all situated about the centre of the wider part or mouth of the cave, each with a group about it of women and ragged children.
"There was no table, or chair, or stool to be seen, stones being so arranged as to serve all these purposes. There was no sort of building about the entrance of the cave to give shelter from the winds, which must often blow fiercely into it. Yet this cave is occupied both in summer and winter by a varying number of families, one or two of them being almost constant tenants.
"I believe I am correct in saying that there is no parallel illustration of modern cave life in Scotland. The nearest approach to it, perhaps, is the cave on the opposite or north side of the same bay. Both of these caves I have had frequent opportunities of visiting, and I have always found them peopled. Only occasional use is made of the other caves on the Caithness and Sutherland coasts. Of these, perhaps the cave of Ham, in Dunnet parish, is the most frequented. It is the nearness to a large town which gives to the Wick caves their steady tenants. The neighbouring population is large enough to afford room for trading, begging, and stealing—all the year round.
"The occupants of the Wick caves are the people commonly known by the name of Tinkers. They are so called chiefly because they work in tinned iron. The men cut, shape, hammer, while the women do the soldering.
"The Tinkers of the Wick caves are a mixed breed. There is no Gipsy blood in them. Some of them claim a West Island origin. Others say they are true Caithness men, and others again look for their ancestors among the Southern Scotch. They were not strongly built, nor had they a look of vigorous bodily health. Their heads and faces were usually bad in form. Broken noses and scars were a common disfigurement, and a revelation at the same time of the brutality of their lives. One girl might have been painted for a rustic beauty of the Norse type, and there was a boy among them with an excellent head. It is possible that one or both of these may yet leave their parents, from dissatisfaction with the life they lead."
These cave-dwellers of Wick were the offscourings of society, such as might be found in any town slum. "Virtue and chastity exist feebly among them, and honour and truth more feebly still; they neither read nor write; they go to no church, and have scarcely any sort of religious belief or worship. They know little or nothing of their history beyond what can be referred to personal recollection."
In Herbert Sinclair's book 'Over the Ord'' he speaks about the tinkers. ( Fred, you will be interested to know that we bairns in the backside always called them Tinklers !)
Herbert Sinclair thought very highly of the MacPhees and was indeed asked to 'give away the Bride' at one of the MacPhee weddings.
He also tells us that it was Maggie MacPhee who saved his life when choking as a child.
FYI....I think the name McPhee got a raw deal over the years....
I have a friend, who is of the same name and is an eminent Doctor & Surgeon. I think his family was from the West Coast.
Perhaps we sometimes lump all those of the same name, religion, etc., etc., together without differentiating!
tonkatojo
08-Jul-10, 22:07
the name tinker is incorrect the proper term is tinklers, derived from from when they travelled by horse and cart selling pots and pans, the noise that came from the pots and pans clattering was a tinkling sound and so the name the tinklers arrived,
Well my, I thought it was because of the way they now pronounce t h i n k as in think, even Terry Wogan has found the "t h ink" way of saying think LOL.
Tighsonas4
08-Jul-10, 22:10
In Herbert Sinclair's book 'Over the Ord'' he speaks about the tinkers. ( Fred, you will be interested to know that we bairns in the backside always called them Tinklers !)
Herbert Sinclair thought very highly of the MacPhees and was indeed asked to 'give away the Bride' at one of the MacPhee weddings.
He also tells us that it was Maggie MacPhee who saved his life when choking as a child.
spot on trinkie had that the book at one time but cant be got now
as for them in hillhead quarry i went to school in staxigoe with some of them. there was one quite big familyand each one of them served in the forces during the war
as for teddy banjo who ended his days out at the south head. iremember when he had his own little house at staxigoe
yes he was a military man too but came home to london only to discover his house and all his kith and kin had all gonenever judge others unless you have the FACTS tony
Tighsonas4
09-Jul-10, 10:13
spot on trinkie had that the book at one time but cant be got now
as for them in hillhead quarry i went to school in staxigoe with some of them. there was one quite big familyand each one of them served in the forces during the war
as for teddy banjo who ended his days out at the south head. iremember when he had his own little house at staxigoe
yes he was a military man too but came home to london only to discover his house and all his kith and kin had all gonenever judge others unless you have the FACTS tony
my memory is not what it was but think ted was a mr corbett tony
Nothing wrong with your memory T.....
Ted was indeed Mr. Corbett and his banjo one of the rare McVitie and Price biscuit tins..... but he fair amused us in the picturehoose queue !
But we're going off track here I fear.
Cheers
Trinkie
I well remember walking out that road on a Sunday. Always used to see him. Years later there was a caravan business round there. Cannot remember the name though.
As children we often played down at the lifeboat shed and I too remember Teddy Banjo living along from there. The caravan business was called Northvans.:)
Tighsonas4
10-Jul-10, 10:38
yes the caravans was run by nicolson and someone .cant mind who
memory again trinkie tony
Tighsonas4
10-Jul-10, 10:41
yes the caravans was run by nicolson and someone .cant mind who
memory again trinkie tony
pm think it was wood t
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