View Full Version : Speaker Cab Project
Hey Folks need a bit of advice
Building a compact 1x12 speaker cabinet out of an old combo amp.
My amp heads that i would like to use on it are a Marshall AVT150 (for rock music) and a Crate powerblock (for acoustic gigs).
Now, Im needing advice on what the best speaker to use for this project is, and also where can i get the necessary parts from (speaker, wire, input jack etc).
PLUS im looking for suggestions on what material to use to customise the cabinet. Best suggestion so far is Denim with pockets for my plectrums/ slides etc lol.
The best speaker depends on the sound you want I guess. The speakers that you have in both cabs you use are Celestion G12T-75's. Use that as a reference point for your sound. Celestion also have clips on their website of the kind sounds their speakers cab achieve. Other speaker companies to look into are Eminence and JBL. I'm sure there's more. Remember to make sure that you get one with an ohm rating suitable for both amps (8 shoud probably be fine).
Watford Valves sometimes have good deals on speakers (www.watfordvalves.com), that's where I got my four Celestion Vintage 30's. You can pick up good quality inputs, cable and handles from eBay for pennies.
Make sure you use good thick strong wood. I'm sure nailing it together would be ok... but making wood joints would probably make it sound a whole lot better.
There's plenty of companies on eBay that sell vinyl covering for amps as well.
Oh aye, to remove purple, think paint stripper. How much is that thing selling for now?
The best speaker depends on the sound you want I guess. The speakers that you have in both cabs you use are Celestion G12T-75's. Use that as a reference point for your sound. Celestion also have clips on their website of the kind sounds their speakers cab achieve. Other speaker companies to look into are Eminence and JBL. I'm sure there's more. Remember to make sure that you get one with an ohm rating suitable for both amps (8 shoud probably be fine).
Watford Valves sometimes have good deals on speakers (www.watfordvalves.com (http://www.watfordvalves.com)), that's where I got my four Celestion Vintage 30's. You can pick up good quality inputs, cable and handles from eBay for pennies.
Make sure you use good thick strong wood. I'm sure nailing it together would be ok... but making wood joints would probably make it sound a whole lot better.
There's plenty of companies on eBay that sell vinyl covering for amps as well.
Oh aye, to remove purple, think paint stripper. How much is that thing selling for now?
Cheers for that, yeah found a couple of 8ohm ones that should do the trick as both ampheads have 8ohm impedance. The G12T-75 is sold out on that page so leaning towards the G12K-100 as it's more powerful as well (im just hoping that it will fit into the cabinet i've got lol).
May open up the back of my 2x12 later on to see what other parts i'll need but just now im assuming that i just need an input socket with the relevant wires to the speaker?
Oh and im not selling the cab at the moment, depending on how this turns out I may try to sell it later.
theweemidget
28-Jun-07, 14:59
moncur a G12T75 sounds crap imo for rock stuff yeah it might be good but acoustic stuff not really i would go for a lower frequency speaker if you are going to do acoustic stuff and the G1275t ain't' warm enough. I would actually put a bass guitar speaker in for acoustic and imo bass guitar speakers sound better for electric guitar they handle the lows better. I would use mdf for an acoustic cabinet 12mm thick but remember to allow room for the speaker and air flow
I suggest a G12T75 as a reference point anyhow. I am also not so keen on them. They lack definition if you ask me. They seem to have a huge gap in the mid range field. However, they supposedly sound good when mixed in a 4x12 with Vintage 30's(which are awesome for heavy rock music). Check out the sample on the internet though. Power isn't everything. Greenbacks are great speakers... however, opinions on good tone are radically different.
theweemidget
28-Jun-07, 16:32
greenbacks hmmm not really suitable you would be more apt to blow em G12T75s yes they have a very boosted midrange i don't think the new G12T75s are that good the older 1s are better. but for an acoustic cab you may want a tweeter/horn for the tops. i played a superbass and played guitar throught it with a g1275 loaded cab and it sounded like crap it didn't have the oomph and when i played through my 2x12 loaded with celestion powercells same power rating as the whole 4x12 and my 2x12 was better to my ears. I would say get a powercell but celestion don''t make em anymore
I wasn't suggesting that he get a Greenback, lol. Just that they are good speakers and that tonal preference is subjective.
I'd be more inclined to say that the G12T75's are actually LACKING in mid range, especially when compared with a Vintage 30.
man this is all getting a bit too technical for me lol.
Bear in mind folks that it is a VERY small cab. And once a 1x12 is in then I cant fit anymore tweeters horns etc into it.
Now.... has anyone got a 12" speaker i could borrow for the day? Doesnt matter if it doesnt work. All i'd like it for is to check that it wil fit (my cab measures 12x12" EXACTLY so not much room to play with lol)
Getting the thing in might be a pain. Is it completely open backed? 12" speakers are pretty big from front to back.
theweemidget
28-Jun-07, 17:08
moncur different 12" speakers have different mounting i e holes can be made different so really you need to use the speaker you are going to be putting in. my 2x12 had celestion G12ms in it and i wanted to put my powercells in the same cab but i couldnt' because the mounting was different so i ended up replacing the speaker board. just goes to show ya you think speakers are all the same when they ain't. Vintage 30's are not a bad speaker supposedly a more powerful version of the greenback but still not my cup of tea each to their own i suppose. moncur you got any pics of this cab yet
It is completely open backed. Im going to have to make a new speaker board anyway aswell. Dont have any pics of it at the mo as im on my works pc. Would vintage 30s be safe to use with 150w amplifiers?
Vintage 30's are 70 or 75 watt speakers. Get a 100 watt speaker
theweemidget
29-Jun-07, 11:37
vintage 30's are 60 watt speakers, moncur if you are using a 150 watt amp i would put in a 200 watt speaker for safety reasons as amps always put out more power than what they say well that is what i have always found i hope your cabinet sounds good as it appears you have done it a bit slapdash. when i was designing my 4x12 which i still ain't finished lol i designed it around the speakers i was going to be using and based roughly on marshall specs but i had to take into conscideration 2 the fact i am a bass player so i had to alter my design to make way for that but the design has turned out well i only need to fix the speaker boards and cover the cab now and i'm sorted.
Yeah im thinkin the small cab just aint gonna be big enough lol. I havent gone and bought any parts so far thankfully so im gonna have a wee think about what speaker to get then see what I can do around that. the cab isnt being made to replace my bigger cabs. I'd just find it good for ma wee pub gigs and jamming in ma room or at band practice so although ma amps are 150w I wont be going anywhere near that sort of volume.
theweemidget
29-Jun-07, 13:02
well pm me and i can help you design a cab, those amps would be 150 watts clean that is before you get to distortion which all us guitar players love. and with a more powerful speaker your sound remains crisp and tight well you know yourself with pa. i don't think an open back design will be that effective imo it may sound to flubby for acoustic but yet again i can be proved wrong. It's hard to beleive there is a science to this lmao
Chobbersjnr
29-Jun-07, 13:30
there's nothing to stop one putting in a 10" high powered driver........
theweemidget
29-Jun-07, 13:34
very true a 10 would be nice
Chobbersjnr
29-Jun-07, 13:43
very true a 10 would be nice
indeed having trawled through quite a number of drivers, celestion, eminence, jensen, JBL, Peavey, Electrovoice etc etc I have to say that EV is my favourite driver tone wise. I have a reconditioned EV 12 in my Musicman combo & it's clean most of the way up the volume
I'm a fan of 10s on guitar because of the tighter sound without so much bottom, I have a boss EQ which does a great job of removing 100 & 250 Hz on my musicman
hey H+H speakers are SURPRISINGLY nice.......................
yip a 10 would def fit my cab.
Anyone know where to get a 10" high powered speaker?
theweemidget
29-Jun-07, 13:57
h/h drivers are very nice why do you think laney bought em out hehe. i agree ev''s are nice. H/H are still in business and are owned by maj electronics well laney bought the speakers but maj do their own stuff.
for speakers where to start
www.appianacoustics.co,uk
www.majelectronic.co.uk
www.wembleyloudspeaker.com
wembley loudspeaker knows his stuff he rebuilds speakers
chobbers i prefer 12s to 10's imo cause i have always had 12s but it depends on the amp musicman amps are very clean and fenderesque
I've been looking at 10" eminence speakers and I think i've got 2 options.
Either a 100w guitar speaker or go into loudspeakers which can be 150 - 300w.
The details on the loudspeakers info say that it can be used for guitar and bass amps aswell so would I be aswell trying for one of them?
theweemidget
29-Jun-07, 18:56
like i said i will always go with a higher rated speaker than what you need just for safety i think you will be fine with those highwattage emmi's' what do you think chobbers
Moncur showed me a picture of the cab in the pub tonight, it's pretty small... tiny in fact. I think a 10" would be the best bet.
theweemidget
30-Jun-07, 16:36
sounds good what was the original size of speaker in the cabinet do you kno
Chobbersjnr
30-Jun-07, 17:49
like i said i will always go with a higher rated speaker than what you need just for safety i think you will be fine with those highwattage emmi's' what do you think chobbers
TBH I'm not a huge eminece fan I go more for Jensen in the comparisons I tried & IMO celestion didn't even enter the race. But certainly the high output emmis would be fine in so far that it will give you a clean sound at higher volume, I just prefer the tone of Jensens which is why we have two 2x12 alnico jensens & a fender pro fitted with ceramic jensens
& another factor that just kicked me in the head is the coil. Ceramic or Alnico................alnico always seems to be more revered??
What are you trying to achieve with this cab? Acoustic and electric would seem to have different needs particularly with a small cab like this. Using a 150 watts with a 10" driver would seem like trying to get a quart out of a pint pot (don't know the metric version!!!!). I wouldn't use a bass speaker, as someone suggested, as the cone is too slow for the higher frequencies and you will spend all your time trying to cut the bass frequencies to get your guitar to sit correctly with a band and you would risk cutting the punch of bass instruments as bass sounds conflict and cancel each other (sound mans nightmare). With solo guitar they can be very pleasing in my experience and I can see why some one would like a bass speaker with tweeter and squawker or, depending on the range of the speaker, just tweeter for acoustic. I would, without hesitation, avoid modern HH speakers. They tend to lack sparkle and depth. Although Laney used to fit them in their guitar amps (they now use Celestion) every one swaps them out eventually in search of better tone. I swapped the 10" in my LC15 for an Eminence legend (discontinued version, years ago). Although I would normally agree with Chobbesjnr about Jenson I tried their CQ10 in the amp but preferred the less farty (which can be a good thing ) Eminence with that amp.
It has to be a case of suck it and see.
I would be surprised if a 12"x 12" cab is not a little bit small even for a 10" and would think it more at home with an 8". At least partially close the back or you will be dialing in the bass and it will probably sound unnatural and age the speaker prematurely. Completely open it would loose projection and not have the balls to make up for it. Science is much less important than taste in a guitar speaker than a Hi-fi or PA speaker. In the latter you are striving to produce a pure, uncoloured tone, but in the former cabinet/speaker tone is as important and individual as that of the guitar and amp. I can find good tone in most boxes but, of course, the real tone is in the fingers but I have never got quite there!!!
If you do build a cabinet never nail. Either use carpentry joints or baton screw and glue.
theweemidget
01-Jul-07, 02:41
stratman it was me that suggested a bass speaker with the use of tweeters, I use bass speakers for guitar and tbh i really like em and the same goes for accoustic guitar with or without tweeters I found that my 2x12 with bass speakers sounded better than a mate's 4x12 with celestion G12Ts but modern speakers sound crap (can i say that) because the speakers have not been broken in properly i prefer the older speakers cause they are easier to break in than these modern1s imo. My bass speakers are as old as the hills yet they are still very tight so maybe that is how they sound good to my ears. but cabinet construction wise i agree with you
I guess the best idea is trial and error.
stratman it was me that suggested a bass speaker with the use of tweeters, I use bass speakers for guitar and tbh i really like em and the same goes for accoustic guitar with or without tweeters I found that my 2x12 with bass speakers sounded better than a mate's 4x12 with celestion G12Ts but modern speakers sound crap (can i say that) because the speakers have not been broken in properly i prefer the older speakers cause they are easier to break in than these modern1s imo. My bass speakers are as old as the hills yet they are still very tight so maybe that is how they sound good to my ears. but cabinet construction wise i agree with you
You surprise me theweemidget. What style are you playing and in what sort of setting.? I could imagine with a big jazz guitar they would be a winner. What make/model are the drivers? I have heard 15" bass speaker used with beautiful effect with Celtic harp, but that's another story. Sound is a very subjective thing but I would worry about those lower frequency cancellations and a pleased you are happy with your sound. I have spent nearly 40 years trying to get the perfect sound at the expense of learning to play properly!!!
theweemidget
01-Jul-07, 13:03
i play through an old marshall valve head with my sg in to the ugliest looking 2x12 you have ever seen these have celestion powercells they have 150 watts a piece. I play bass through them as well. I play a lot of rock'n'roll to jazz to country to classic rock and they produce the magic everytime. bass wise i play everything and it sounds sweet. Hmmm place settings i just play in my room just now but i have played with bands and it really was the icing on the cake. I have been playing 8 years and i have found my sound.
I wonder what is going on with speaker makers over here i mean they reissue all the old stuff yet they can't do it as good as the americans. the americans can do it right and i have heard the proof.
powercells are a unique speaker and i think celestion discontinued them bout 20 years ago they are a very heavy duty speaker solid cast iron frames huge magnets that weigh about 5kg each.
Bass speakers have changed over the years the 1s up until 20 years ago handled higher frequencies better than these new ones so yeah i do agree that the modern cones are slower heck the old 15 i used to have sounded superb with guitar.
I can't really comment on new bass speakers are mine are very old but the old speakers sound real good.
jeid trial and error is usually not the best way to go but in this case it might be more suitable
Chobbersjnr
01-Jul-07, 13:54
AHEM, I erred. Pointed out by Stratman
alnico & ceramic magnets.................I realised the misteke as soon as the ol' man said it after I got back from the wedding I played
ATC speakers........................they got rep, lots of it as well
theweemidget
01-Jul-07, 22:40
ahhh this has become an interesting thread atc are good. Moncur i bet ye are hevin your doubts now. You think speaker cabinets are simple but i think i took this thread off track man sorry bout that and the fact i thought your cabinet was for 12" speakers, maybe we should have a speakers etc thread
Okay what i've done is bought a 10" Eminence speaker which is capable of 150w (the 250 and 300w ones were out of stock). Im going to go for a closed back design aswell. Remember folks all im wanting to do is see if my wee project is do-able or not.
So.... next question......
What type of cable and jack socket do i need to buy to hook the whole thing up? are there any other parts I should know about which I need to buy?
Good move on the closed back. Use heavy duty single mains cable (preferably different colours for identification. As short a length as possible and a normal 1/4 inch jack socket. Alacam could probably sort you out if you are up here or Maplins or any music shop or ebay. Socket and plate from an old scrap les paul type axe? Solder the ring of the socket to neg. and the tip to pos. (poitive os usually shown by a red dot or + sign) You will probably need a recess plate for the socket and and solder of course. Hope it does what you want.
I've spoken to Duress' soundman and he says he'll sort me out with the wiring on it.
Now all i need is some suggestions to customise the cab!!!!! lol
theweemidget
03-Jul-07, 17:41
tartan, flaps on the side for holding beer glasses, u could have a mic stand attached to it, oh the possibilities
I believe certain sporran embellishments are about to be banned. get them on. I have no idea what they are and would probably find the offensive but there you go.
Jeemag_USA
03-Jul-07, 23:26
I actually think the Denim idea is a very good one, you could have pockets on their and buttons and so on, put plecturms and so forth in the pockets or some smokes if you smoke. The Tartan idea is a good one too.
Im liking the tartan idea lol! Think the sporran laws is to do with types of furs and leathers being used if its been purchased within the last few years or something. Mother used to hire out kilts so im sure il find something old/tatty/suitable up in her loft.
Chobbersjnr
04-Jul-07, 13:58
aye apparently the 2 cross dressers in Whisky are going to have to either lose the sporrans or pay for a license to wear some deid animals fur......
theweemidget
05-Jul-07, 01:40
are you serious omg what is going on you can't sing ba ba blacksheep with out people thinking it's racist but aren't sporrans of today made out of other things anyway. anyhoo let me know how the speaker box turns out moncur i am gonna look through my stash to see if i can find some jack sockets cause i kno i did have some but where i don't know
just to let y'all know,
got the wood cut and screwed together with the speaker fitted. all i need to do now is get an input jack and wire it up the put the snakeskin tolex and silver grill cloth on. its been a while in the making but im a lazy so-and-so lol.
Anyone got recommendations for adhesives to use for tolexing the cab?
http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/5345/dsc00269wo5.jpg
http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/4250/dsc00270ah6.jpg
http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/9161/dsc00314vx9.jpg
http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/3664/dsc00316ok9.jpg
so thats the pics of the finished item up (sorry that they're so large!). Its working and sounding pretty good (and LOUD) so far!
Thanks to: My dad for cutting the baffleboard. Studio 66's dad for cutting the speaker hole. The wee midget for wiring the speaker. Kerrie Munro for tolexing the cab. And lets not forget REEEEEEEEEV for forgetting to ask his mate for the amp back 7 years ago.
Jeemag_USA
16-Oct-07, 22:29
Looks sexy by the way!!
Good job!! ;)
PS get rid o that carpet, its clashin :P
Bobinovich
17-Oct-07, 13:24
If everyone else did those bits...what did you do! [lol][lol]
Does look good tho'!
If everyone else did those bits...what did you do! [lol][lol]
Does look good tho'!
lol i know what you mean. em i put the input jack cup on and put the beading on the baffle board and the grille cloth on. apart from that i just pointed at stuff and gurned and moaned until it got done
Looks sexy by the way!!
Good job!! ;)
PS get rid o that carpet, its clashin :P
yeah it aint carpet, its old towels. Dont be stressing ma towels man, thats just rude!
Tbh, that looks horrible
tbh, i disagree
You've posted a picture, I think it looks crap. If you're not happy, tough. I'm not in the business of trying to please anyone.
Snakeskin should be left to cowboys... they can pull it off.
Thats ok if you don't like it. I just thought when choosing the vinyl 'hmmmm, black, white, cream, green, purple, red? yawn' Snakeskin clearly looked the most pimping!
And most gay ;)
Ah well its gonna have the 'Pink Lighter' effect. if it looks remotely gay then theres no fear that someone will nick it! Im off to bed, nite peeps!
Jeemag_USA
19-Oct-07, 01:01
You wouldn't see a cowboy dead wearing snakeskin, you're more likely to see snakeskin on pimps and mexicans ;) Because its pimpin :P
My first ever bass amp, bub was only meant to use it for a few parties, he never gave it back......................now it looks like a ymca stage show amp................when do i get it back?
As an outside observer who has been following this thread for almost 4 months, I ask you Reev, do you want it back?
I vote to keep the carpet though.
id take it back to annoy him as afterall, it IS mine
still, i got a new one about a week ago witn a 1200 watt cab, soooooooooo i dont really think i need it, then again, it IS mine, thoguh i think he will have a hardtime looking through the bins to find that which is mine from what wa sin it, sigh :lol:
A 1200watt cab is great... but if you only have say, a 500watt head, it's still only going to deliver 500watts, which makes the other 700watts pointless
I am aware of that Jeid, though i dont see what that has to do with my old practice amp..........:confused
I am aware of that Jeid, though i dont see what that has to do with my old practice amp..........:confused
I've just realised something. If ben aint had his PRACTICE amp for about 7 years does that explain why his bass playing hasnt improved since? lol just kidding ben
Improved......its gone down hill, but hey, ive got the gift of the gabb, that gets me through it :lol:
I am aware of that Jeid, though i dont see what that has to do with my old practice amp..........:confused
True... but I don't get what you slevering about your 1200watt cab has to do with it either?
Slevering, uhhuh, its like that is it, i was talking to canuck, read the post, see if you can figure it out [disgust]
Aye, but you're asking me what relevance talking about your cab has to do with the thread when you've done the same thing.
speaking about the 1200watt cab was to say, i dont need my old 15 watt amp (as thats what it was) back as i have a new one, thats what i did
i didnt mention anything about the size of the head or go into any more detail than that, Canuck said would i want it back, i answered not really as i have this instead, so it had a relevance to what i was saying
..........why am i explaining myself?!? :confused
lol
I mentioned your cab as you seem to think it's relevant ;)
Not the ins and outs of it though
what i do know, CANT EVEN TURN IT TO ONE WITHOUT ROOMS SHAKING AND THINGS FALLING DOWN AND OFF OF WALLS OH YEAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
:lol:
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