Local high schools mentioned in "Daily Record" online today

[ecb]

There is an article in the "Daily Record" online today titled "Scotland's schools ranked from best to worst by Higher results".

Percentage of five higher passes shown in brackets.

287. Wick High School, Highland (23)

304. Thurso High School, Highland (22)

Source:

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/scotlands-schools-ranked-best-worst-21981461

[aqua]

Wasn’t there a time not so long ago when Thurso High School was atop, or nearly atop, of the list? Maybe back in the heyday of Dounreay?

[ecb]

I don't know if it was at the top, but I believe it was a relatively good school. I was shocked that it now has such a low placing in the league table.

[orkneycadian]

It is, unfortunately, an ongoing trend in the devolved countries of the UK. The following graphic from https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-50642855 Pisa test result averages in scienceScores of 15-year-old pupils, UK nations

35227

Where attainment, in this case in Science in the devolved nations has consistently fallen further than in England. Scotland used to be "well up there", but its very clear to see what devolution is doing to the education systems of Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland. Of course, England is falling too, just not as much as the others. Perhaps an indication that modern education isn't cutting it, and there should be a return to some of the ways that we know worked.

[Corky Smeek]

It is, unfortunately, an ongoing trend in the devolved countries of the UK. The following graphic from https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-50642855 Pisa test result averages in science

Scores of 15-year-old pupils, UK nations

35227

Where attainment, in this case in Science in the devolved nations has consistently fallen further than in England. Scotland used to be "well up there", but its very clear to see what devolution is doing to the education systems of Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland. Of course, England is falling too, just not as much as the others. Perhaps an indication that modern education isn't cutting it, and there should be a return to some of the ways that we know worked.

I find it extremely sad when a Scot reacts with such joyous, indeed malicious, glee when s/he perceives a failing in something for which the SG has responsibility. What kind of mindset do you have to have to go trawling for stories so that you can then derive pleasure from denigrating your own country? It is particularly galling that the person in question hankers for a bygone age and "...a return to some of the ways that we know worked.", yet appears not to know when to use an apostrophe.

[orkneycadian]

What is quite striking for Scotland in the above graphic is the steepest decline of any of the UK nations from 2012 onwards. This is of course after the SNP success in the 2011 election and their immediate shifting of focus to the independence referendum. But still they think they are doing a good job on education. Unfortunately, the statistics prove otherwise. :(

[Corky Smeek]

What is quite striking for Scotland in the above graphic is the steepest decline of any of the UK nations from 2012 onwards. This is of course after the SNP success in the 2011 election and their immediate shifting of focus to the independence referendum. But still they think they are doing a good job on education. Unfortunately, the statistics prove otherwise. :(

Schadenfreude is an unfortunate trait at the best of times but this obsession with finding ways to make Scots feels bad about their country really needs to end. To find some statistics that you feel shows the country in a bad light and then joyously publish them on a web forum really takes a particular kind of twisted thinking. I cannot think of another country in the world where such a sizeable proportion of the population constantly seek to demean the country of their birth and actually seem to want it to fail.

The implication in both of the BritNat-in-Chief's previous posts is that he wants devolution to end and all power to be restored to Westminster. The mere prospect of every aspect of our lives being in the hands of that incompetent bunch doesn't bear thinking about. Evidence from recent events should be a warning to us all that they couldn't run a raffle.

[aqua]

The steep decline coincided with the introduction of the so-called Curriculum for Excellence in Scotland. All or most of the teachers I know blame the CfE.

[aqua]

I don't know if it was at the top, but I believe it was a relatively good school. I was shocked that it now has such a low placing in the league table.
I’m fairly sure THS’s Higher results were amongst the best of all state schools in the country way back in the 1970s. Maybe a retired teacher could confirm this.

[ecb]

I was at THS in the mid to late 1970s, if I remember correctly, the school performed particularly well in Science and Engineering subjects then.

[ecb]

The steep decline coincided with the introduction of the so-called Curriculum for Excellence in Scotland. All or most of the teachers I know blame the CfE.


I have heard the same about CfE. But the thing that dismayed me most, is the relatively poor placing of THS (three hundred and fourth out of a total of three hundred and forty four secondary schools) in the table.

[aqua]

Yes, it’s a staggering decline. Mind you, Wick, Golspie, Dornoch and Tain are all in pretty much the same lowly position in the table, surrounded by schools in some of the most deprived areas in the country, which sadly are expected to be down there. Dingwall isn’t a lot better at number 252. What’s gone wrong in the north?

[orkneycadian]

The steep decline coincided with the introduction of the so-called Curriculum for Excellence in Scotland. All or most of the teachers I know blame the CfE.

Thanks for the pointer - I didn't realise. I have tried to Google Curriculum for Excellence for the rest of the UK to see how that compares, but all I can find is Curriculum for Excellence for Scotland. I note its overseen by Education Scotland, an executive agency of the Scottish Government, and was implemented in 2010-2011, so just ahead of the SNP government gaining a majority in 2011. So why has nothing been done about it since then, when it so obviously does not work? It would be "normal" for the present Government to say they inherited this problem from the previous one, but why has the Government since 2011 done nothing?

[aqua]

CfE is a purely Scottish thing. IIRC, it was implemented by the SNP government despite warnings by just about everyone. The SNP have been in government since 2007.

Orkneycadian schools performed a bit better:

168. Kirkwall Grammar School, Orkney Islands (33)
202. Stromness Academy, Orkney Islands (31)

The best performing school north of (or in) Inverness was:

31. Fortrose Academy, Highland (54)

[Fulmar]

Lets hope that they can all go back as if not, what then?

[aqua]

I worry that the lockdown is easing before the number of active cases is sufficiently low. I would have preferred to see the UK daily infection rate below a few hundred cases a day, which would likely be soon with strict lockdown conditions. If the numbers start going up again significantly, the schools won’t be opening fully in August, and children’s education will really suffer.

No one has offered an explanation for THS’s dramatic decline in exam performance over the decades. I could speculate, but it wouldn’t help anyone. :(

[orkneycadian]

Its concerning as well that teachers are reporting that they are setting online lessons for classes of 30, and only 2 even bother to log on from home to do them. Some kids haven't told their parents that they have online lessons to be doing. I spoke to 1 parent who has kids home from school and she says that will not get up before midday, and then only play computer games - They will not do online lessons. And to cap it all, many folk say they don't have a good enough internet connection to do home schooling or working. But yet, they can figure out a way to get online gaming working.

anyone who is at school in 2020 is really going to struggle finding a job later on. They will be known as the Coronavirus Generation, who will blame Coronaviris for their lack of education, when in reality they, like so many of their furloughed parents are simply milking the system. Whilst there are of course some who get up and log onto lessons first thing in the morning, reports from teachers are that those amount to about 7% of the class. Employers will be avoiding the class of 2020 like the, well, virus.

[Corky Smeek]

Its concerning as well that teachers are reporting that they are setting online lessons for classes of 30, and only 2 even bother to log on from home to do them. Some kids haven't told their parents that they have online lessons to be doing. I spoke to 1 parent who has kids home from school and she says that will not get up before midday, and then only play computer games - They will not do online lessons. And to cap it all, many folk say they don't have a good enough internet connection to do home schooling or working. But yet, they can figure out a way to get online gaming working.

anyone who is at school in 2020 is really going to struggle finding a job later on. They will be known as the Coronavirus Generation, who will blame Coronaviris for their lack of education, when in reality they, like so many of their furloughed parents are simply milking the system. Whilst there are of course some who get up and log onto lessons first thing in the morning, reports from teachers are that those amount to about 7% of the class. Employers will be avoiding the class of 2020 like the, well, virus.

A while back it was folk from the central belt. The other day it was public transport workers. Today it's schoolchildren. It's always women. Just to save us all the problem of trying to work it out please could you tell us who occupies the small list of people who get the Orkneycadian seal of approval. I have a postage stamp here and can provide a broad-nibbed felt pen for you to write it out.

[orkneycadian]

Lets hope that they can all go back as if not, what then?

Seems like they are to go back after the holidays (holidays? From what? They have been on holiday for the last 2 months!) to a "blended model". So time at school, some time online (playing games them) and some time on homework (more computer gaming).

Looks like we are going to need freedom of movement after all, so that Scottish employers will be able to recruit educated employees with a work ethic.

[aqua]

I have heard the same about CfE. But the thing that dismayed me most, is the relatively poor placing of THS (three hundred and fourth out of a total of three hundred and forty four secondary schools) in the table.
THS’s poor placing in the table dismayed me too. What has happened to the school? Is there a shortage of teachers? Has the culture in the school changed? Has the attitude towards education in Thurso changed? Surely the youth of Thurso hasn’t become much less intelligent over the years!?

I suspect people with kids of school age would think twice before moving to Thurso if they saw that table. :(

[orkneycadian]

You can read a lot into it, especially from the graph further up the thread. Scotland used to be well above the OECD average and on a par with England. England has dropped a bit, but is stilll well above the OECD average. Meanwhile, the other 3 countries of the UK have dropped sharply and are now on a par with the OECD average.

Education needs to be "revolved" (in that its devolved status needs to be reversed) and should become a UK Matter again. This experiment on the devolution of education has obviously failed, and we need to stop playing politics with kids education, and restore it, at least back to the standard it was at, and close to the standard in England.

But it needs to go further than that. England's standard has declined as well, and once education is a UK wide matter again, then the standards need to be driven up. Employers all over the UK are fed up with school leavers with poor literacy and numeracy skills (but a degree in something), who are ill prepared for the working environment, and who are unable to get through a full 60 second period without needing to check their social media.

Caithness and Thurso need not feel guilty about where their school lies in the league table. This is a Scotland wide issue. Its perhaps no accident that the southern belt are well up in the league (though there are plenty of southern belt schools well down it as well). But it just goes to show how southern centric some policies are in Scotland.

[aqua]

As far as I’m aware, education has never been a UK wide matter. Scotland’s system was different from England’s system before devolution.

Thurso’s place in the table is deeply worrying to me. Most/many other schools in such lowly positions are in deprived areas of the country where educational achievement has never been high. THS used to be at or near the top of the pile. Now it’s almost at the bottom. Why?

[Corky Smeek]

Education needs to be "revolved" (in that its devolved status needs to be reversed) and should become a UK Matter again. This experiment on the devolution of education has obviously failed, and we need to stop playing politics with kids education, and restore it, at least back to the standard it was at, and close to the standard in England.

I know he is only trying to wind us up but I'm bored so here goes.

How much do you have to hate your own country to prefer having another country run its education system? What is it about these BritNats? They think so little of their own country and the people who live and work here that they would rather hand over control of every aspect of our lives to another country to run.

They say these things as though that other country was a paragon of virtue, a bright shining beacon of enlightened and informed government. Of course, as we all know from current experience they are a bunch of self-serving, mendacious, incompetents who have proved and continue to prove every day that they should not be trusted to run a whelk stall.

More importantly, however, this suggestion of giving control of Scottish education back to Westminster would have serious implications for Scottish culture, heritage, customs and language. When I was at school doing my O-Grades and Highers I studied history. The only problem was, I wasn't taught any Scottish history at all. I was taught English history disguised as British history. During my entire history education at school, Scotland was barely mentioned at all whereas Wales and N. Ireland might as well not have existed. The syllabus was almost entirely about England. Can you imagine a situation where kids living in Southampton only get taught French history? No, of course not; it's ridiculous, yet that was basically my experience.

This occurred prior to devolution at a time when Scottish education was run by the Scottish Office under the control of Westminster. In other words the SO presided over and approved a situation where the history of Scotland was not included in the history syllabus available, at my school at least. Where else in the world would that happen?

So if, we allow our education system to be placed under Westminster control we might as well say goodbye to the notion of Scottishness for ever. That could be part of the plan, of course. Educate the Scottishness out of them as soon as they go to school. A couple of generations down the line and Robert the Bruce, William Wallace, The Covenanters; the Jacobites, Culloden etc, etc all disappear from our national consciousness. And don't think they wouldn't do it. They have form when it comes so social engineering on a grand scale as the history of the Ulster Scots shows.

Scottish education needs to be run from Scotland. Simple as that.

[orkneycadian]

As far as I’m aware, education has never been a UK wide matter. Scotland’s system was different from England’s system before devolution.

Thurso’s place in the table is deeply worrying to me. Most/many other schools in such lowly positions are in deprived areas of the country where educational achievement has never been high. THS used to be at or near the top of the pile. Now it’s almost at the bottom. Why?

Yup, you're right. I forgot about that! As someone who got O Grades and Highers, whilst England got O Levels and A levels, I should have minded on about that!

So, areas like Caithness and Orkney are doing worse than they used to within Scotland. Orkney used to be pretty much up there with the top ones in Scotland if I mind right (not doing the best on the minding this morning.....). On top of that, Scotland is doing worse than England.

A potential remedy must be to look back to how we in Scotland did it 10 or more years ago, both to redress the imbalance between North and South, as well as how we have slipped relative to England. The more I hear about it, this Curriculum for Excellence is not a good thing.

[aqua]

I suspect the CfE is not the cause of THS’s long slide down the table. There are more likely to be local educational, economic or sociological causes. All in my personal opinion of course.

I find it sad, whatever the causes. :(

[ecb]

I couldn't find any data about spending per pupil. Does anybody know if spending on schools in Caithness, is as generous as in some other parts of Scotland?

I currently live in the central belt and some local high schools which were built in the 1960s (some built in the 1970s) have been or are going to be replaced in the next few years. Wick got a new high school a few years ago, but I haven't seen any suggestion that Thurso should get a new high school, from memory it was mostly built in the late 1950s. I haven't been in it for many years, is it still in good condition? Are there any plans to replace Thurso High School?

[orkneycadian]

I don't think its so much the age of the building, more what you do inside it. The former Kirkwall Grammar School was likely built in 1800 and something, and ceased to be used as a school in about 1975. Its still in use to this day as the council offices and is a fine building.

Meanwhile, the school that opened in 1975 or thereabouts was demolished about 5 years ago, as it apparently "simply was not good enough for modern schooling" - A shame as it was only 40 years old. But yet, managed to produce very highly attaining pupils in national league tables.

The "new" Kirkwall Grammar school was opened in 2014. A new build, so should be churning out pupils at the top of the national league. But whats that? It isn't? KGS is slipping down the league table? How can that be? It has the most modern school building that Orkney could want for. Surely that means that attainment should be high?

Nope, I am afraid there's more to schooling than having a modern building.

No doubt in another 35 years, or less, this one will be condemned by teachers as "not being fit for purpose", just like the last one. Will be odd that the only building that remains fit for purpose is the one built in the 19th century.

[aqua]

THS was higher in the table last year, while WHS was a tad lower:

182 Thurso High School, Highland (32)
305 Wick High School, Highland (20)

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/4020266/scotland-secondary-schools-results-chart-worst-best-glasgow-edinburgh/amp/

[ecb]

THS was higher in the table last year, while WHS was a tad lower:

182 Thurso High School, Highland (32)
305 Wick High School, Highland (20)

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/4020266/scotland-secondary-schools-results-chart-worst-best-glasgow-edinburgh/amp/

That's much better. There seems to be quite a fluctuation between years, if one year the percentage of pupils attaining five higher passes at THS is 32% and the next year it is 22%. Looking at the league table, increasing the percentage of pupils attaining five higher passes by a few percent can give a school a much better placing in the table.

[aqua]

Yes, yearly fluctuations can be large. Some schools’ percentages went up (or down) even more than THS’s between years.

I recall seeing the table about a decade ago, and IIRC THS was placed higher than last year, but I don’t remember how much higher.

[ScottishWalrus]

Schadenfreude is an unfortunate trait at the best of times but this obsession with finding ways to make Scots feels bad about their country really needs to end. To find some statistics that you feel shows the country in a bad light and then joyously publish them on a web forum really takes a particular kind of twisted thinking. I cannot think of another country in the world where such a sizeable proportion of the population constantly seek to demean the country of their birth and actually seem to want it to fail.

The implication in both of the BritNat-in-Chief's previous posts is that he wants devolution to end and all power to be restored to Westminster. The mere prospect of every aspect of our lives being in the hands of that incompetent bunch doesn't bear thinking about. Evidence from recent events should be a warning to us all that they couldn't run a raffle.

The official line from the SNP is that they want us to follow rules and regulations from outside the UK, specifically Brussels. I do agree however that to point out the failure of the SNP flagship policy of Curriculum for Excellence is underhanded and political point scoring of the lowest kind. We should place the blame where it truly belongs...

In the meantime we should celebrate success - Andy Murray and the 1990 grand slam in rugby! We gave the world haggis, Irn Bru, RunRig and Rabbie Burns - whaes like us?

[orkneycadian]

We should place the blame where it truly belongs

And that is.......?