View Full Version : Do we have to standby and watch our bus service disappear?
I find it very worrying to read in The Journal that buses north of Keiss may soon cease to run. Several questions come to mind:
1) Are the people making these decisions car owners, below retirement age, with good salaries? ....I guess that's probably a yes. Hmmmmm!
2) Where is the competition so that Stagecoach do not have a monopoly that can prevent young people getting to their work (eg Natural Retreats) older people getting into the hospital, or to the shops?
3) If Andrew Banks can run the Pentalina at a profit, without a subsidy, then surely someone could run a bus service locally even if it was non profit making?
4) Why should Stagecoach be allowed the ability to increase social isolation in our community?
5) Can Highland Council do anything? Are they subsidising this threatened service? In which case can the subsidy savings be used to fund an alternative, at least in part, or am I being naive here?
6) What is the point of giving pensioners free bus passes if there are no buses?
Just a few of my thoughts for now.
Janey
We have to realise that we don't count until it comes to election time.
Where is our SNP MSP Gail Ross in all this as far as I am concerned they are trying to de-populate the Highlands and have us all move down to the central belt.
We pay the same as everyone else but over a period of time we see our services decline more and more.
We are becoming a wasteland.
Perhaps you should try to organise a demonstration outside the bus station in Thurso.
orkneycadian
13-Jun-18, 22:46
2) Where is the competition so that Stagecoach do not have a monopoly that can prevent young people getting to their work (eg Natural Retreats) older people getting into the hospital, or to the shops?
I would strongly suspect that even 1 operator is not making money. Hence why they are pulling out, and why there are not 2 operators or more
3) If Andrew Banks can run the Pentalina at a profit, without a subsidy, then surely someone could run a bus service locally even if it was non profit making?
The Pentalina is "stowed oot" most of the time. So much so that, to quote the infamous Roy Scheider in Jaws - "You're gonna need a bigger boat" - I somehow doubt that the Stagecoach buses north of Keiss are running with folk sitting on the roof.
4) Why should Stagecoach be allowed the ability to increase social isolation in our community?
Its not compulsory for them to run the service at a loss, if folk are not using it.
5) Can Highland Council do anything? Are they subsidising this threatened service? In which case can the subsidy savings be used to fund an alternative, at least in part, or am I being naive here?
Should public money be spent on a loss making service? Yes, to a point. But below a certain threshold, its not good use of public money.
6) What is the point of giving pensioners free bus passes if there are no buses?
Even more of a loss maker if no-one is paying for it.
Mr P Cannop
14-Jun-18, 07:45
this is what i have been saying for years about the buses
Highland Clearances II. The evidence is there, whether its busses, health services or jobs; those who have the power will not be happy until the land north of Inverness is depopulated to make way for wind turbines and marauding motorhomes.
Caithness a sinking ship
https://thepsychedelicsewingroom.files.wordpress.com/2018/06/caithness-sinking-ship.jpg
orkneycadian
14-Jun-18, 19:58
Caithness a sinking ship
Don't worry, the rest of the country are with you, and us over here. All the time, folk don't make use of a service or a facility, then bleat when it closes down.
Folk that buy a case of lager and sit in watching Love Island or other bruck - Then complain when the pub down the road closes - The one they go to every few years.
In Kirkwall there was a huge hoo haa when they took away the 2 red phone boxes of Broad Street a couple of years ago. Did those making the hoo haa use them? Heck no, they would rather use a £600 mobile than use a phone box - "But they have always been there, and I don't like the look of the street without them".....
Folk that sit in and shop for everything online - Then complain that the local shop that they were last in in 2007 has closed down.
Folk that sign up to expensive Sky TV packages, then complain when the cinema closes down.
And folk that don't use the bus services. Then complain when they get stopped.
Happening nationwide, in a locality near you.
Mr P Cannop
15-Jun-18, 13:18
Don't worry, the rest of the country are with you, and us over here. All the time, folk don't make use of a service or a facility, then bleat when it closes down.
Folk that buy a case of lager and sit in watching Love Island or other bruck - Then complain when the pub down the road closes - The one they go to every few years.
In Kirkwall there was a huge hoo haa when they took away the 2 red phone boxes of Broad Street a couple of years ago. Did those making the hoo haa use them? Heck no, they would rather use a £600 mobile than use a phone box - "But they have always been there, and I don't like the look of the street without them".....
Folk that sit in and shop for everything online - Then complain that the local shop that they were last in in 2007 has closed down.
Folk that sign up to expensive Sky TV packages, then complain when the cinema closes down.
And folk that don't use the bus services. Then complain when they get stopped.
Happening nationwide, in a locality near you.
whats this got to do with buses ???? !!!!
orkneycadian
16-Jun-18, 11:05
And folk that don't use the bus services. Then complain when they get stopped.
In particular - The rest was drawing comparisons to other services and facilities that close down through lack of support. And drawing comparisons to everywhere else in the country that is suffering the same thing, to counter the suggestion that this was a conspiracy plot against solely Caithness.
Hope that clears it up for you.
Mr P Cannop
17-Jun-18, 16:12
2 x99 buses book down yesterday at 8.20am
Most people now have cars and yes ... I agree with orkneycadian we are all guilty of online purchasing to the detriment of our community!
I was in our local bike shop recently ... yes I am related to them! ... and someone who had purchased 'online' expected to get their bike problems fixed for free because the shop sold the same make of bike ... really!
Most people now have cars and yes ... I agree with orkneycadian we are all guilty of online purchasing to the detriment of our community!
I was in our local bike shop recently ... yes I am related to them! ... and someone who had purchased 'online' expected to get their bike problems fixed for free because the shop sold the same make of bike ... really!
To be fair, thy have probably been used to working with franchised car dealers which would work in that manner, alas that isn’t the case with other things.
I cannot even get my caravan serviced by the local dealer as I didn’t purchase from him and that is as a fully paying customer. But if he doesn’t want the business then It’s his call.
I don’t mind paying a little more to shop locally and get the product in my hand but I do baulk at paying 50% or more over other retailers.
I was in the market for a plastic Xmas tree and tried the local retailers, in one shop they were selling a nice one for a little over £200 I took the product number and googled it and found it could be bought online including delivery for £99.
I never bought that particular one but that ended my local search for one.
orkneycadian
18-Jun-18, 19:14
And so the race to the bottom continues.....
And so the race to the bottom continues.....
I have got to agree with orkneycadian: Use it or lose it. Why not just leave your car at home some days and take the bus? Enjoy life in the slow lane for once and doing so, maybe help save the bus service?
That’s ok if I wanted to walk 2 miles to the stop then get the one bus to town and one out per day that’s available, no handy for nipping to get milk
orkneycadian
19-Jun-18, 07:16
A round trip by car of at least 4 miles just to nip to get milk, shows indeed just what we have become.
A round trip by car of at least 4 miles just to nip to get milk, shows indeed just what we have become.
Milkaholics.
I canna get enough of the coo
FYI its circa a 4 mile round trip just to find a bus stop, a fair bit longer to get a shop
orkneycadian
19-Jun-18, 22:50
I don’t mind paying a little more to shop locally and get the product in my hand but I do baulk at paying 50% or more over other retailers.
I was in the market for a plastic Xmas tree and tried the local retailers, in one shop they were selling a nice one for a little over £200 I took the product number and googled it and found it could be bought online including delivery for £99.
I never bought that particular one but that ended my local search for one.
So heres how it goes.....
Local retailer buys in some top quality Christmas trees. They're not cheap, but the quality is brilliant. To make a modest profit, after paying for rent, rates, electricity, staff, National Living Wage, Pension Contributions, statutory paternity pay et al, she prices them at a little over £200. Local shoppers come in and admire the tree in the shop, where they can check it out in the flesh (plastic?). Then they go home and Google it. For £99, there is the same tree, for sale from a warehouse dahn sarf, run by Trotters Independant Trading. As they have less overheads, and employ Romanians in the warehouse on the QT, they can just about scrape a profit.
Next year, local retailer buys in some cheaper trees from China. Not near as good, but she can sell them for £75 and still make some profit. Though she had to let young Jenny go as things were gettling a bit tight. Meanwhile, dahn sarf, TIT are selling the same Chinese trees, with a CE mark (Chinese export) for £50.
The following year, on the brink of bankruptcy, the local retailer buys in a load of dodgy trees from the dark web. They have no labels, let alone CE markings. She manages to sell a few at £25 each. But within a week, there has been a spate of house fires all over Caithness as the cheap power supplies explode in the middle of the night and burn 'e hoose doon.
The next year, local shoppers are dismayed to find the shop closed. The retailer was sued, but had no money left anyway. Meanwhile, TIT moved onto the next big thing. Shoppers, both high street and online found the only way they could buy a Christmas tree was to send for it to China themselves. Having sent their money, they then wondered why no tree arrived, and why the local Trading Standards said they could do nothing for them.
So they all lamented how good things were in 'e good old days, when you could buy things on 'e High Street.
If you are needing a fake tree each year I’d question the quality of the product.
Do you think a markup in excess of 100% is perfectly acceptable then, would you be quite happy to pay your local car dealer £40,000 for a £20,000 car to keep the cash local you understand?
Hopefully the local trader is banged up for flogging non CE marked goods
orkneycadian
20-Jun-18, 19:06
100% mark up for a retailer is not out of the way. A typical retail mark up used to be, and probably still is double it and add the VAT.
Take for example, a bottle of whisky. Lets say Grouse. £14.00 in Tesco, probably averaging £2.50 a nip in a pub. There are 28 nips in a bottle, so the publican will sell it for £70 - A lot more than the differential in prices in your Christmas Trees
Margins will vary according to sectors. Some fashion mark ups will be in the order of 450%. All that shop floor space and costs of folk coming in to try on the merchandise have to be covered somehow. Cars I expect have lesser margins. But there still needs to be something in it for the retailer.
Not really comparing apples with apples with whisky comparison, Tesco sells you the bottle.
The pub sells you the dram, plus the loan of the glass, telly, light, heat, venue, servant etc etc.
Every business must make profit to survive of that I agree but it’s also the customers demand to obtain value for money.
If the two cannot find a balance then something has to give
orkneycadian
21-Jun-18, 19:01
With your above analogy, the local retailer, as well as the tree, sells you the space to examine it in and see really how big, or small it is, a space which is heated (unless you buy your tree in June), lit and accepts your choice of payment. If in the event your tree is faulty, they are there to swap it for you.
Whilst indeed consumers seek out value for money, many cannot see past that, and expect to pay ridiculously low prices, yet expect ridiculously high service levels. The example above of a consumer who bought a bike online, paying online prices, then expected high street service is a classic one. The end result there would have been disappointment. Whoop de doo, they saved 15% by buying online. But suddenly that pales into insignificance when they now have to try and deal with an online retailer 500 miles away who doesn't want to know.
Aside from all that, theres a reasonable chance that online retailers operate from domestic premises (depends of course on the size of the operation, and even the size of the merchandise), avoiding paying business rates. Those that do pay business rates, do so somewhere other than Caithness. So your hard earned coin is going to support local services in England, rather than Caithness.
So sure, you will get it cheaper elsewhere. But little use then bleating that Caithness is like a ghost town, no shops left and no jobs left (unless of course you are a delivery driver or a dole office clerk).
You won't hear me greeting about firms closing, that's life
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