View Full Version : 3rd in line but NOT the front line
Royster1911
16-May-07, 19:04
It seems that things are too dangerous for Harry to go to the front line! Can someone tell me what makes him more important and precious than all our other troops being shot at and bombed in foregn places? Did he not take the Queens shilling and promise to defend his country and monarch?
Quite disgracefull in my opinion! One rule for them another for us! The desicion may have been taken out of his hands, but whats the point of having a soldier who cant fight????[evil] [evil]
percy toboggan
16-May-07, 19:11
This parasite should resign his Army commission immediately.
He has become an embarassment for many different reasons.
However.
This was a no-win situation. I'd convinced myself he would be killed out in Iraq, or worse (kidnapped first) what a propaganda victory for the insurgents. This latest decision not to send him is yet another one.
He'd obviously be targetted, bringing extra peril to those serving with him.
You might think me barking but I even think he may have been targetted by our own side (propaganda purposes - think about it) and to my mind he is a rather inconvenient Royal 'personage.' This expression depends on whether his father is who we are told he is.
Any clown with an ounce of foresight would have steered him toward the Royal Navy, where 'front-line' service is a rather different propostion.
I do honestly feel he will be disappointed by this decision, partly because I believe this young man to be half a bag short of a full load. He is definitely not the brightest button in the box.
It seems that things are too dangerous for Harry to go to the front line! Can someone tell me what makes him more important and precious than all our other troops being shot at and bombed in foregn places? Did he not take the Queens shilling and promise to defend his country and monarch?
Quite disgracefull in my opinion! One rule for them another for us! The desicion may have been taken out of his hands, but whats the point of having a soldier who cant fight????[evil] [evil]
Hardly harry's fault - he certainly does not like the decision. If you have to be rude and offensive then do to those who made the decision. Better still look in the mirror and see if you are any better than harry. Wonder if you would have the guts to join up let alone got to Iraq!!
Cinders392
16-May-07, 19:18
Harry Should not go to Iraq. Not that he isnt capable of doing the job but the danger he would put the rest of the British army/navy/RAF in as well as other nationalities out there!
Believe me it is bad out there right now as it is and sending Harry won't make matters better. The poor lad must be gutted but Im sure he has a good head on his shoulders and knows him going would risk the lives of many others out there who are like him and other unlike him who have young family at home.
Plenty other jobs for the young officer on the home front!
Royster1911
16-May-07, 19:18
How would they know Percy? You remove the rank insignia and dont place him in the lead position of any patrol. It would also be a good idea not to give him a radio. Lead from the rear. The Royals have been doing it forever.[disgust]
Royster1911
16-May-07, 19:21
Hardly harry's fault - he certainly does not like the decision. If you have to be rude and offensive then do to those who made the decision. Better still look in the mirror and see if you are any better than harry. Wonder if you would have the guts to join up let alone got to Iraq!!
Yup, been there, done that for 15 year. 5 tours in NI.
YOU????
Get your facts right. I did say it was not his desicion! A soldier who can not fight is not a soldier. FACT
Harrys my favorite to win the Upper Class Twit of the Year Award.
I wouldn't let him around firearms under any circumstaces.
We had a thread on this not that long ago, when it seemed as if Harry would be going to Iraq. At that time I thought his being in Iraq would only endanger other British soldiers, and make their daily lives harder.
This seems to be just another example of the MoD not knowing what they're doing from one day to the next, or possibly they are conceding that Iraq is now becoming even more dangerous.
I don't know Harry, the only impression of him I have is given by the media. Not altogether favourable I have to say!
If you don't like the Monarchy, fair enough, but this is not Harry's decision.
Royster1911
16-May-07, 19:28
We had a thread on this not that long ago, when it seemed as if Harry would be going to Iraq. At that time I thought his being in Iraq would only endanger other British soldiers, and make their daily lives harder.
This seems to be just another example of the MoD not knowing what they're doing from one day to the next, or possibly they are conceding that Iraq is now becoming even more dangerous.
I don't know Harry, the only impression of him I have is given by the media. Not altogether favourable I have to say!
If you don't like the Monarchy, fair enough, but this is not Harry's decision.
I have stated TWICE that it was not his desicion but if you can not do your job because of others desicions, why try. Time to resign his commission. I have great respect for HRH and offspring. I served my time in HM Forces to help defend my (our?) country. Whare does it say in my thread that I did not like the monarchy?
I have stated TWICE that it was not his desicion but if you can not do your job because of others desicions, why try. Time to resign his commission.
True enough, but surely the MoD should have thought this through a while ago?
As I've said, I'm not a great Harry fan (from what I know of him) but he does seem to want to leave the Army if he can't go to Iraq.
As far as I can see, he's being discouraged from doing that because it would look as if he wasn't accepting orders.
I don't really think he can win here, damned whatever he does.
Maybe he shouldn't have been in the Army in the first place? :confused
Royster1911
16-May-07, 19:36
That, Angela is my (and Percys) exact point. He was ill advised. Should have went to sea.
I have stated TWICE that it was not his desicion but if you can not do your job because of others desicions, why try. Time to resign his commission. I have great respect for HRH and offspring. I served my time in HM Forces to help defend my (our?) country. Whare does it say in my thread that I did not like the monarchy?
Sorry, Royster, I replied to this post in its original form -before you edited it.
I took "Lead from the rear. The Royals have been doing it forever" in your other post to be an anti-Monarchist sentiment.
Apologies if I misunderstood.:(
We're probably all agreed that the Army is not the best place for him to be!
Royster1911
16-May-07, 19:42
Hardly harry's fault - he certainly does not like the decision. If you have to be rude and offensive then do to those who made the decision. Better still look in the mirror and see if you are any better than harry. Wonder if you would have the guts to join up let alone got to Iraq!!
I am still looking to see where I have been rude and offensive Cattach. Can you please enlighten me?
Royster1911
16-May-07, 19:44
Sorry, Royster, I replied to this post in its original form -before you edited it.
I took "Lead from the rear. The Royals have been doing it forever" in your other post to be an anti-Monarchist sentiment.
Apologies if I misunderstood.:(
We're probably all agreed that the Army is not the best place for him to be!
Not a problem. My fingers are not as quick as your eyes. Done it myself before :confused
i often wonder, if the media had not reported it so much, would he have been allowed then? because of the widespread info availble, they all knew he might be coming etc..
i nearly choked when i read 'it is too dangerous for harry to go'
well in that case it is too dangerous for my brother to go back again to Iraq or Afghanistan.
Royster1911
16-May-07, 19:46
i often wonder, if the media had not reported it so much, would he have been allowed then? because of the widespread info availble, they all knew he might be coming etc..
i nearly choked when i read 'it is too dangerous for harry to go'
well in that case it is too dangerous for my brother to go back again to Iraq or Afghanistan.
Well said. That was my original point of the thread.
He should never have been allowed into the Army. It is quite clear that he would never be able to be treated like all the other lads. It now makes him look like as much good as an Action Man toy and it strengthens the belief that it is OK for Joe Public to be Cannon Fodder but the Royalty are too precious to be in the firing line.
It's a bit of a pity because I reckon Harry could have held his own in hand-to-hand combat with any enemy photographers who got a bit too close for comfort ;o)
i often wonder, if the media had not reported it so much, would he have been allowed then? because of the widespread info availble, they all knew he might be coming etc..
i nearly choked when i read 'it is too dangerous for harry to go'
well in that case it is too dangerous for my brother to go back again to Iraq or Afghanistan.
It likely is............but as far as I can see, the decision was made more because of targeting of Harry's troop than Harry himself.
I do think the media should have kept their collective mouths shut........what on earth did they think would happen when they told the world that Harry would be going..and naming the Regiment he would be with, and what he would be doing? Or do they think nobody reads the papers/listens to the news on the TV/radio? :roll:
I hold no truck with Royalty.........but the MOD are being damned because he isn't going.............but they would be damned if they did let him go, and his troop was slaughtered!
It's a no-win situation for them...........and I'd rather they considered the possible consequences in the circumstances which pertain in Iraq at the present time.........and act in the best interests of the majority of Harry's command rather than what Harry wants.
I cannot believe the sheer nastiness and spite of some of these posts. He did not ask to be born into the Royal family - none of them did. From the moment they're born until they die they have no privacy, no chance of doing most of the things the rest of us take for granted. Neither he nor his brother will ever know whether friends are really friends or just hangers-on. Any relationship with a girl is marred by the prospect of kiss-and-tell, to say nothing of the media feeding frenzy. He lost his mother at a vulnerable age amid huge publicity and has never for a moment been allowed to forget her weaknesses, even having his paternity publicly questioned. Any time he does what most young men take for granted, i.e. party, he hits the headlines. And when he makes some attempt at "normal" life by joining the army, obviously something he really wants to do, he is still not treated like others. The MoD or the Army, whichever, have made a mess of things by changing their minds - it was obvious that sending Harry to Iraq would be asking for trouble however much he wanted to go. Presumably he hoped he would be allowed to as his uncle served in the Falklands but that was in pre-terrorist times.
If I had the choice between their money, privilege and total lack of any possibility of a private life or being allowed to pursue a career I wanted, or living a humdrum and sometimes financially struggling but free life, I choose the latter any time. Harry didn't have that choice and never will. Leave him alone.
percy toboggan
16-May-07, 22:38
Any time he does what most young men take for granted, i.e. party, he hits the headlines.... .
Actually he often hits a photographer, not that I have much time for them either.
You say he didn't 'ask to be born within the 'Royal Family' well, to be quite honest with you I'm not sure he was 100%.
After Liz they should draw a line under the lot of this anachronistic nonsense. They are out of time and out of place in a modern democracy. Mono-cultural republic is the way to go.
Royster1911
16-May-07, 22:52
I cannot believe the sheer nastiness and spite of some of these posts. He did not ask to be born into the Royal family - none of them did. From the moment they're born until they die they have no privacy, no chance of doing most of the things the rest of us take for granted. Neither he nor his brother will ever know whether friends are really friends or just hangers-on. Any relationship with a girl is marred by the prospect of kiss-and-tell, to say nothing of the media feeding frenzy. He lost his mother at a vulnerable age amid huge publicity and has never for a moment been allowed to forget her weaknesses, even having his paternity publicly questioned. Any time he does what most young men take for granted, i.e. party, he hits the headlines. And when he makes some attempt at "normal" life by joining the army, obviously something he really wants to do, he is still not treated like others. The MoD or the Army, whichever, have made a mess of things by changing their minds - it was obvious that sending Harry to Iraq would be asking for trouble however much he wanted to go. Presumably he hoped he would be allowed to as his uncle served in the Falklands but that was in pre-terrorist times.
If I had the choice between their money, privilege and total lack of any possibility of a private life or being allowed to pursue a career I wanted, or living a humdrum and sometimes financially struggling but free life, I choose the latter any time. Harry didn't have that choice and never will. Leave him alone.
Oh Dear, Who is knocking the royals so much that warrants this post? The above named family members can go wherever and whenever they please as and when they want. That is their right. We pay for it. I am not complaining.
However, when I (and many other thousands of servicemen, serving and reserves and not forgeting our veterans of which I am one,) are asked our opinions of such an ill advised career for Harry, why do you think we are all wrong. We have established that it was not his desicion and Im sure he does not like it. BUT what place does he have in his regiment now? A soldier who has not soldiered. Does he wear the medal of the conflict like daddy without being their? I could go on and on but your post does not add up. sorry
Royster1911
16-May-07, 22:54
Actually he often hits a photographer, not that I have much time for them either.
You say he didn't 'ask to be born within the 'Royal Family' well, to be quite honest with you I'm not sure he was 100%.
After Liz they should draw a line under the lot of this anachronistic nonsense. They are out of time and out of place in a modern democracy. Mono-cultural republic is the way to go.
Are we the only two Percy? PLEEEZE free the .org two....:Razz
It seems that things are too dangerous for Harry to go to the front line! Can someone tell me what makes him more important and precious than all our other troops being shot at and bombed in foregn places? Did he not take the Queens shilling and promise to defend his country and monarch?
Quite disgracefull in my opinion! One rule for them another for us! The desicion may have been taken out of his hands, but whats the point of having a soldier who cant fight???? [evil]
You pick an easy target Royster IMO, he cannot defend himself in any way, not even in here, the laddies birthrite was not of his choosing, get off his back[disgust]
THere is no doubt that Harry wanted to go with his regiment - and like all Soldiers he was ordered to remain here, and must obey.
However all the crap that is being spouted about it is obviously by people who know better than the Authorities.
We had Prince William of Gloucester and the Duke of Kent with our units in various locations, BUT WE DID NOT HAVE THE PRESS TELLING THE WORLD OF OUR MOVEMENTS ALL THE TIME.
Tonight on the news a Father that had lost a Son in Iraq said that if it was good enough for his son to die, then why not Harry.
If he had taken the trouble to see just what would have happened to Harry's troop, then he would probably think again.
The troops out there have enough problems without having an extra draw for the insurgents.
He will get over his disappointment, and a few more men will survive because of his absence.
No matter what the situation, there will always be those that are willing to criticise those that can't reply.
This parasite should resign his Army commission immediately.
Is he anymore of a "parasite" than the dole spongers who refuse to get a job?
Or those who come to the UK illegally for free healthcare and education and handouts?
Or those who break the law to feed their drug habits?
You may dislike him for being a Royal but at least he was willing to go to Iraq. He may yet serve elsewhere, so while he is in the Army I would hesitate to call him a parasite......
blueheart
17-May-07, 01:13
hello orgers / orgs / trolls / whatever you want to call yourselves
Well for those individuals who have not volunteered to offer anything insightful into this thread, Royster's point of view is more valid than most considering his 15 + years service in the armed forces, during which time patrolling some very dangerous places in the world. and to quote david brent that is fact. so he knows where he is coming from. (No, this isn't Royster under a different name and whilst we are related it does not mean I am totally subjective).
A SOLDEIR WHO CANNOT FIGHT IS NOT A SOLDIER!! there really is not a whole lot of point in someome being in the armed forces, expecially something as robust as the infantry, if they cannot join their commrades and fight. That is what they train for!!!!
think about it logically. Infantry soldiers spend all their time training for war, so when the bat phone goes you gotta go. He can't in his case, so it makes a mockery of the whole thing, whether it is his say or not.
Royal's really don't do a whole lot to justify their existence in these ages anyway. But that is another conversation for another time.
now can everyone just get along ! chill out people, see some of the real world.
Blueheart
Birminghams favourite adopted son (somewhere had to want me!).
dunderheed
17-May-07, 08:20
only in a country like britain would they let the press know of the movements of certain regiments. surely the answer to the harry on the front line problem is to deploy his regiment without alerting the press until after his "tour" is finished
the nomad
17-May-07, 09:16
Rant time.
Did anyone honestly believe that PH would ever be placed in an active combat situation? The whole thing makes a complete mockery of the armed forces, he cabn't go to Iraq as he is in danger and what about everyone else, and another thing how the hell did he become an officer, I wouldn't follow him to the chip shop. He's a classic example of spoilt, arrogant, useless and thick royality that we all seem to want...or do we????
I have to agree, Harry wanted to go, he was happy to serve his country (as he will have to do one way or another for his whole life) - he has to follow orders like any other soldier and if he's told he's not going it's not his fault. with all the impllications of terrorist attacks etc he and anyone around him would have been sitting ducks - how would you feel if you brother/husband/whatever was killed just because he was standing next to Harry? this is a no win situation for him - he's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't and none of it is his fault. It's time the media in this country were taken to task - if they did not give away so much the "enemy" would not know half of what was going on - to use a topical example, the police in Portugal were heavily criticised for not giving enough information on the search for little Madeline, under their laws they can't give out the information that our press are used to here, so when they did name a suspect the British press had him arrested, charged and pretty much sentenced before he was released, calling him another Ian Hunter - the press are out of control and it is only a matter of time before they are responsible for deaths in this country.
QUOTE=dunderheed;224328]only in a country like britain would they let the press know of the movements of certain regiments. surely the answer to the harry on the front line problem is to deploy his regiment without alerting the press until after his "tour" is finished[/QUOTE]But as any "trendy" will tell you, "The Public have a Right To Know!" You have to give your opponents ever opportunity to get prepared for your every move in advance, it's only fair to them!
Actually he often hits a photographer, not that I have much time for them either.
You say he didn't 'ask to be born within the 'Royal Family' well, to be quite honest with you I'm not sure he was 100%.
After Liz they should draw a line under the lot of this anachronistic nonsense. They are out of time and out of place in a modern democracy. Mono-cultural republic is the way to go.
I can see you fitting right in there Percy.
hello orgers / orgs / trolls / whatever you want to call yourselves
Nice opener...
Thanks for your insightful view of the Armed Services which contributed so much to the thread.
A SOLDEIR WHO CANNOT FIGHT IS NOT A SOLDIER!!...
Hmmm, then the young lady who was recently awarded a medal for her gallantry under fire working as a medic was not a soldier?
The Royal Army Medical Corps over the years has gained 31 Victoria Crosses, including two awards of a bar to the VC.
...there really is not a whole lot of point in someome being in the armed forces, expecially something as robust as the infantry, if they cannot join their commrades and fight. That is what they train for!!!!
Medics are non-combatants - I guess that means they shouldn't be there either?
Your knowledge of the Armed Forces is obviously so much better than anyone else here, as you know where 'Royster1911' is coming from!
...think about it logically. Infantry soldiers spend all their time training for war, so when the bat phone goes you gotta go. He can't in his case, so it makes a mockery of the whole thing, whether it is his say or not.
"Infantry" serves in other places -
Troops Deployed/Stationed Outside UK Mainland (September 2004)
Germany 21,250
Northern Ireland 11,180 (including Royal Irish Regiment)
Bosnia-Herzegovina 720
Macedonia 10
Gibraltar 490
Brunei 800
Falklands Islands 1,270
Belize 30
Kenya 10
Canada 210
Cyprus 3,510
Sierra Leone 20
Afghanistan 650
Iraq and the Gulf 9,070
So he may not be allowed to go and become a target for the fine upstanding individuals who are gallantly defending their homeland from the lacky footsoldiers of the evil neo-con oil barons of the USA - he can serve elsewhere as an officer.
And if he didn't make the grade in officer training do you think he would have been allowed to pass out? Perhaps he should have done the honourable thing like his Uncle and resigned to follow a thespian career?
...Royal's really don't do a whole lot to justify their existence in these ages anyway. But that is another conversation for another time.
I think your post is tinged with dislike and contempt for the Royals. Unfortunately, when 'Royster1911' and everyone else who joined up, they pled allegiance to the King/Queen - so if they find the institution of the Monarchy so distasteful then perhaps they should follow a different path.
...now can everyone just get along ! chill out people, see some of the real world.
For what it is worth, I am chilled and I have seen a good part of the "real world"....
Rant time.
Did anyone honestly believe that PH would ever be placed in an active combat situation? The whole thing makes a complete mockery of the armed forces, he cabn't go to Iraq as he is in danger and what about everyone else, and another thing how the hell did he become an officer, I wouldn't follow him to the chip shop. He's a classic example of spoilt, arrogant, useless and thick royality that we all seem to want...or do we????
It's so easy isn't it to hit someone who can't hit back - bullies do it all the time. How do you know he is all those things? Do you know him personally? Yes he's behaved unwisely sometimes but don't all young people? Were you ever young? Did you never behave badly on occasion or make mistakes? He is like all young men - growing up - but at least he was willing to risk his life for his country.
Other members of the royal family have been in active combat in the past and no doubt when he joined up Prince Harry assumed he would do the same. He made it clear that was what he wanted. The MoD and army should have had the sense to see much sooner that this is a completely different situation where terrorists will target anyone they can use to their advantage. Why else are thousands of US troops currently searching for their three missing comrades? Every time someone is taken hostage it causes chaos or even, as in the case of the Israeli soldier, a disastrous war in Lebanon. Harry would have been such an obvious target that no-one near him would have been able to do their jobs properly.
As for joining the navy, look what happened to them when they apparently strayed a bit. More hostages, more incompetence from the MoD and, this time, the Navy - yes they can sell their stories, oops no maybe not.
blueheart
17-May-07, 13:55
Nice opener...
Thanks for your insightful view of the Armed Services which contributed so much to the thread.[/quote
Hmmm, then the young lady who was recently awarded a medal for her gallantry under fire working as a medic was not a soldier?
The Royal Army Medical Corps over the years has gained 31 Victoria Crosses, including two awards of a bar to the VC.
I did laugh at that post as you more than likely spent over an hour searching around online for the dulge of quite frankly unnecessary information you included in your last post. One must compliment the passion expressed in the individuals involved in these debates
You missed the point entirely. I am not speaking of any other regimant or division. I am talking about the Infantry who fight on the front line. Sure, soldiers are on peace keeping duties etc in many other parts of the word, and everyone plays their part, but you can't possibly compare them to Iraq !
He is not an Army medic, (so going off on a tangent informing us all of the Army Medic's contribution to military service is quite unnecessary). he is not anything other than an officer in an Infantry Regiment. So his job is to fight.
He can't continue to have any kind of career as this would always be a blight on his record if he can't go, and as a matter of fact he has said in the past that he does not wish to be in the Armed Forces if he is not allowed to fight i.e. do the job he is trained to do.
so, it came from the 'horse's mouth;' so to speak. end of.
Blueheart
and as a matter of fact he has said in the past that he does not wish to be in the Armed Forces if he is not allowed to fight i.e. do the job he is trained to do.
Blueheart
The last I heard was that he won't resign his commission if he wasn't sent and his decision was made before the announcement made that he won't go.
If he doesn't go then he's a usless waste of space and if he does go then he's only putting putting those he serves with in unacceptable additional danger.
Sounds about right that some people would want to try to discredit his behaviour either ways. It's nice trying to have your cake and eat it at the same time! :roll:
changilass
17-May-07, 14:56
I for one would not want him anywhere near any of my loved ones, the troops are in enough danger as it its without making them even bigger targets.
If there was not such media coverage of what the minor royals got up to then maybe he could have gone, but the publics need to know that royalty aint just sitting on their backsides taking from the public purse, does not allow for this.
The boy is doing what all soilders are taught to do, he is following orders, I don't see why he should resign for doing what he has been trained to do.
If he doesn't go then he's a usless waste of space and if he does go then he's only putting putting those he serves with in unacceptable additional danger.
Sounds about right that some people would want to try to discredit his behaviour either ways. It's nice trying to have your cake and eat it at the same time! :roll:
As said in an earlier post to Royster1911 , an easy target that cannot defend himself
I did laugh at that post as you more than likely spent over an hour searching around online for the dulge of quite frankly unnecessary information you included in your last post. One must compliment the passion expressed in the individuals involved in these debates
I barely wasted a few minutes - when you know where to look it's really quite easy....
You missed the point entirely. I am not speaking of any other regimant or division. I am talking about the Infantry who fight on the front line. Sure, soldiers are on peace keeping duties etc in many other parts of the word, and everyone plays their part, but you can't possibly compare them to Iraq !
You missed the point too - you stated A SOLDEIR WHO CANNOT FIGHT IS NOT A SOLDIER!!... so I merely pointed out that not all soldiers fight (and also not all soldiers on the front line fight either...)
He is not an Army medic, (so going off on a tangent informing us all of the Army Medic's contribution to military service is quite unnecessary). he is not anything other than an officer in an Infantry Regiment. So his job is to fight.
No, he's not a medic. Well spotted.
He can't continue to have any kind of career as this would always be a blight on his record if he can't go, and as a matter of fact he has said in the past that he does not wish to be in the Armed Forces if he is not allowed to fight i.e. do the job he is trained to do.
so, it came from the 'horse's mouth;' so to speak. end of.
Blueheart
I think he is in the best position to decide as to whether he can have a career in the services, not you....
I'll let you get back to reading "Soldier of Fortune"....
Any clown with an ounce of foresight would have steered him toward the Royal Navy, where 'front-line' service is a rather different propostion.
what difference does it make what service he joins. being a serving sailor in the RN having just returned from a gulf trip i know that if he was in the RN on the front line at sea with us then he'd also be a just as open target where insurgents would take to the seas in fishing boats and iht a ship of maybe 250/350 people and take it out as well him?!?!?!?
does it really make a difference what forec he is in?!?!?!?!?!?
maybe more people that are letting rip into him should join up one of our forces and see how things are on the inside................
Royster1911
17-May-07, 16:57
Madpict, unless things have changed from my days in HM Forces, it was allways...Soldier first, regiment second. Therefore, a medic, cook, mechanic etc will have been trained as an infantryman as well as his chosen career. Like I said, it was a fair while ago since my service days.
Did I state that? I replied to your buddies remark that "A SOLDEIR WHO CANNOT FIGHT IS NOT A SOLDIER!!... " - that implies that a soldier trained as an infantryman, who then chooses a non combatant role is not a soldier. Plainly incorrect on your mates behalf.
Royster1911
17-May-07, 17:30
BUT, The said young lady was awarded the medal for being heroic. Well deserved it was too. What medal for HRH, sitting behind a desk, and yes, when in the early days of Sandhurst, he DID say that if he could not be deployed with his troops then he would reconsider his career. Times change as does the conflict but he should start reconsidering now. The millitary are already reconsidering his position. A bit late but there you go
Why should he "reconsider"?
So he resigns then becomes another useless Royal?
At least if he is serving his country, in whatever capacity, is that not better than endless rounds of golf on the taxpayers money (as Uncle Andrew seems to do)?
The lad should be applauded for doing something useful - would we prefer him to act like Pete Doherty?
Why should he "reconsider"?
So he resigns then becomes another useless Royal?
At least if he is serving his country, in whatever capacity, is that not better than endless rounds of golf on the taxpayers money (as Uncle Andrew seems to do)?
Prince Andrew does a lot of networking/complimentary work for securing work for British business contracts. And top business men usually fall for that sort of rubbish. So Andy might earn his coin, nice work if you can get it. Mind you, it took some guts to fly his helicopter into all that black smoke.
Andrew is another soft target for the Anti Monarchists - he served his country in a time of war (funnily enough in the Royal Navy - now who said they never get to the front line?) and the networking may well earn contracts for Britain but that doesn't stop them picking holes in how he gets up to St.Andrews, does it?
If you sign up whoever you are you go and do your duty like everyone else. No exceptions
If you sign up whoever you are you go and do your duty like everyone else. No exceptions
You obey orders, and Harry has been told he is not going.
BUT, The said young lady was awarded the medal for being heroic. Well deserved it was too. What medal for HRH, sitting behind a desk, and yes, when in the early days of Sandhurst, he DID say that if he could not be deployed with his troops then he would reconsider his career. Times change as does the conflict but he should start reconsidering now. The millitary are already reconsidering his position. A bit late but there you go
Royster, why are you attacking him, Attack the Generals in the MOD, they are calling the shots, and by the way if you were in HRH's platoon, and he went to Iraq, you would be crapping it like me, because you would be an instant target :(
Royster1911
17-May-07, 19:51
Royster, why are you attacking him, Attack the Generals in the MOD, they are calling the shots, and by the way if you were in HRH's platoon, and he went to Iraq, you would be crapping it like me, because you would be an instant target :(
I am not attacking him or any other HRH as such, just the gaping hole he leaves in his regiment by not being deployed. Yes, they actually do need officers. The desicions being made on his behalf by his bosses are doing him no favours. If I was in his platoon, I would do my job as expected, and yes, I would be crapping myself, as I was on my NI tours with my regiment being shot at etc, but that was my job!
What medal for HRH, sitting behind a desk, and yes, when in the early days of Sandhurst, he DID say that if he could not be deployed with his troops then he would reconsider his career. Times change as does the conflict but he should start reconsidering now.
Is this not attacking him? IMO I think so :~(
Royster1911
17-May-07, 20:22
That to me was stating facts. Show me where I have not stated a fact and I will withdraw that statement. I started this thread to draw peoples attention to the fact that their loved ones in HM Forces are treated as cannon fodder compared to Harry. It apparently is too dangerous for him!!!! Like it is not for Joe Soap? That is my point and I am sticking to it. When you have been in the burial party to 7 or 8 comrades from the highlands, it brings home the reality of the conflict, no matter where it is. Here endeth the lesson (hopefully)
The simple fact is Prince Harry can do nothing about the situation, he is willing to go, but others have chosen not to let him do so. From the coverage I have seen on the news it has statd that insurgents would go out of their way to target him and those under his command - so it is not just PH that was considered when the powers that be made the decision.
Royster1911
17-May-07, 20:48
The simple fact is Prince Harry can do nothing about the situation, he is willing to go, but others have chosen not to let him do so. From the coverage I have seen on the news it has statd that insurgents would go out of their way to target him and those under his command - so it is not just PH that was considered when the powers that be made the decision.
Spot on. But it was the same situation for HRH Andrew when he was deployed to the Falklands. The enemy threatened to target him and his ship. Very specific threats to him and his comrades were ignored by MOD and he was deployed. Why was the danger acceptable for Andrew and not Harry?
changilass
17-May-07, 21:02
Go ask the MOD[evil]
It aint that he is worth more than anyone else, they are not sending his so as not to put his lads in danger.:confused
Spot on. But it was the same situation for HRH Andrew when he was deployed to the Falklands. The enemy threatened to target him and his ship. Very specific threats to him and his comrades were ignored by MOD and he was deployed. Why was the danger acceptable for Andrew and not Harry?
The Argies were not religious zealots, on a Jihad (sp) and Argie planes were bigger targets than a suicide bomber or a roadside bomb, you must know that if you served in Northern Ireland as you say
The Argies were not religious zealots, on a Jihad (sp) and Argie planes were bigger targets than a suicide bomber or a roadside bomb, you must know that if you served in Northern Ireland as you say
With respect Golach, but does it really matter if they are religious zealots or not? A bomb is a bomb and any enemy is an enemy. Argentina's airforce was more than a match for UK forces and they killed more British servicemen in their time. The risk to Andrew was a lot greater imo. Do you think that the MOD is suffering from our new-age reluctance to delegate responsibility onto the young? I think he should have been allowed to go, myself. It is a coup for the insurgents.
Royster1911
17-May-07, 21:51
The Argies were not religious zealots, on a Jihad (sp) and Argie planes were bigger targets than a suicide bomber or a roadside bomb, you must know that if you served in Northern Ireland as you say
The enemy are the enemy. You do not know who they are until they strike unless they are uniformed. Religion has nothing to do with it unless you are the sad sod chanting it on behalf of your beliefs. When you are hit by a bullet, it does not have a religious slant to it but it does have the same effect as any other bullet that would hit you.A bomb does not have to be strapped to a body to kill people. One of the most common in NI was torches bought from Army and Navy stores, filled with PE and set off when a squaddie picked it up, thinking it was dropped by another patrol. In other words, size does not matter. Oh, and yes, I do know that.
percy toboggan
17-May-07, 22:06
what difference does it make what service he joins. being a serving sailor in the RN having just returned from a gulf trip i know that if he was in the RN on the front line at sea with us then he'd also be a just as open target where insurgents would take to the seas in fishing boats and iht a ship of maybe 250/350 people and take it out as well him?!?!?!?
does it really make a difference what forec he is in?!?!?!?!?!?
maybe more people that are letting rip into him should join up one of our forces and see how things are on the inside................
I respect your job and your position within the RN but surely he'd be safer on a warship in the gulf of wherever, than sat in an armoured personnel carrier on some dusty Basra B road? He would not be an 'open target' as you describe him. Anyway why would not a warship of the British fleet blow any approaching fishing boats with dodgy intentions out of the water? If you're really suggesting a British warhsip would be vulnerable to 'insurgents in fishing boats' then you might as well all pack it and come home, mothball the entire fleet and do something else.
Anyway, as a poster already said why the hell are the press given so much information.
Whatever happened to 'D' Notices?
North Rhins
18-May-07, 00:18
It’s not the lads fault; I think he genuinely wants to go. I mean a tour in Iraq would have done his nightclub credibility no end of good.
The fault lies fairly and squarely with which ever pratt let him join up in the first place. Did they not realise we currently have two rather sticky theatres of operations? Idiots.
The whole thing is now a PR nightmare, a no win situation. He stays at home guarding the mess silver, whilst poor old Tommy Atkins gets the brown end of the stick as usual. [disgust]
hey percy, what's a D notice??:confused
http://www.dnotice.org.uk/index.htm
http://www.dnotice.org.uk/index.htm
So what is the benefit of it all?:confused
percy toboggan
18-May-07, 21:35
I remember them from decades ago. I'm not an expert but anything sensitive to the MOD they can have virtually banned from any reportage in the media. Tabloid editors risk B & B in the Tower of London if they transgress a 'D' notice. Or at least they used to. Maybe the whole process has been changed.
There is far too much media intrusion, and frankly far too much info out there.
We don't need half of it....it only serves to unsettle. Sometimes ignorance is bliss I think.
(what dya mean....I should know)
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