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View Full Version : Unbelievable!



Big Gaz
17-Feb-14, 09:27
I am just now listening to Radio 4 and there is a discussion about refusing drugs to Elderly, disabled and those on benefits if they have a life shortening illness or are close to death because they are not contributing to society? Who the hell thought this one up??

RagnarRocks
17-Feb-14, 09:42
On the merit of that logic you could refuse drugs to everyone with an illness as they can all be life shortening. No better than the Liverpool Care Pathway, don't give someone food or drink as they are going to die, well if you don't give them food or water they will. The mentality of these so called care professionals terrifies me.

Mrs Bradey
17-Feb-14, 09:52
I am just now listening to Radio 4 and there is a discussion about refusing drugs to Elderly, disabled and those on benefits if they have a life shortening illness or are close to death because they are not contributing to society? Who the hell thought this one up??quite ironic that we can put our dogs to sleep if they are in pain or terminally ill, yet this is illegal if the animal is human! if you do not give your animal food and water, or drugs required for pain relief, you fall foul to the animal welfare acts! and yet it is being discussed a in relation to humans! I agree, unbelievable!

jax
17-Feb-14, 10:01
Must be the next step in creating the perfect NHS, no drugs required for anyone as we all have a life threatening illness. Heard it all now, whako plans to save money.

Ballymore
17-Feb-14, 10:37
The Liverpool Care Pathway (LCP) is used during the last few hours/days of life when death will be the only outcome, it is signed by a doctor and part of a team decision. The decision of the LCP can be reversed/cancelled.
Relatives/carers should be involved in the discussion of starting the LCP.
It does not state not to give someone food or drink, it is to ensure the patient is comfortable and pain-free during the dying process. Not all drugs are withheld!
Medication for pain, nausea, excessive saliva, breathing, anxiety, agitation can be given though a fine needle under the skin.
The sensation of thirst can be alleviated with a wet sponge or an oral saliva spray.
Hunger is something which is difficult to assess but popping a feeding tube down into someones stomach when the body is in the process of shutting down is cruel and many will pull out the tube with the risk of the liquid food going into the lungs and cause breathing difficulties and can lead to pneumonia.
To eat and drink is for survival.
If you worked on a ward where dying and death happens you would understand more about the LCP and the reasons for using it for end-of-life care.

Google LCP and you will find a lot of information on it including pros and cons.

RagnarRocks
17-Feb-14, 12:29
I don't need to google it I've witnessed it with my father. Funny how we have people being reported as being put on the LCP then surviving.

Big Gaz
17-Feb-14, 12:39
OI! stop hijacking my thread! [lol]

RagnarRocks
17-Feb-14, 12:41
OI! stop hijacking my thread! [lol]Sorry Boss :0))

Ballymore
17-Feb-14, 12:49
Sorry - wasn't hijacking Big Gaz - just replied to RagnarRocks about the LCP.

I don't agree on not giving prescribed medication to anyone whether they contribute to society or not. It is a horrible thought that if someone becomes disabled and a burden on society - that's it, no more pills! Stupid idea thought up by ignorant people.

Big Gaz
17-Feb-14, 13:09
no apologies necessary :-).

This discussion hit me personally this morning as i lost my father to cancer several years back. He was given painkillers and meds on a daily basis right to ease his suffering and pain up until the end and i think if the situation was as discussed on the radio this morning, i would have had a few words in between giving the lamebrain who thought this up a good smack. If this is considered further and actually gets implemented, this will open a serious can of worms! What's next? have compulsory abortions if babies have any illnesses or genetic faults?. It just beggars belief. I thought a certain crackpot dictator and his scary ideas were put to rest 70 years ago!

ducati
17-Feb-14, 15:32
I am just now listening to Radio 4 and there is a discussion about refusing drugs to Elderly, disabled and those on benefits if they have a life shortening illness or are close to death because they are not contributing to society? Who the hell thought this one up??

Who was discussing it and more important, who would you like to blame?

shazzap
17-Feb-14, 20:08
On the merit of that logic you could refuse drugs to everyone with an illness as they can all be life shortening. No better than the Liverpool Care Pathway, don't give someone food or drink as they are going to die, well if you don't give them food or water they will. The mentality of these so called care professionals terrifies me.
These care pathways are supposed to be abolished now. How they could call them care plans in the first place, is beyond me.

shazzap
17-Feb-14, 20:09
I am just now listening to Radio 4 and there is a discussion about refusing drugs to Elderly, disabled and those on benefits if they have a life shortening illness or are close to death because they are not contributing to society? Who the hell thought this one up??

Well that's me done for then.

Ballymore
18-Feb-14, 09:54
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2561657/Too-old-lifesaving-drugs-Anger-plan-deny-treatment-youve-fair-innings.html

Read here - this is what Big Gaz's thread is about.

Big Gaz
18-Feb-14, 11:12
Who was discussing it and more important, who would you like to blame?

It was on yesterday's "Today" programme on Radio 4. Didn't catch the names of the presenter/discussers though. Where do you get the idea that i am trying to find someone to blame? I merely pointed it out and thought it was an appalling idea by anybodys standards. Ballymore has linked the article in the paper from yesterday so it's probably that what was being discussed on the show

orkneycadian
23-Feb-14, 14:37
Welcome to what it will be like once we become a third world country. This is what present third world countries have to put up with. Will be no different when we become one.