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sam09
23-Sep-13, 23:06
The Labour Party are scared of Scottish Independence as if/when it happens Westminster will always be ruled by the Tory Party. That is why the discredited chancer of the exchequer Darling is fighting so hard on the no campaign. Who in their right mind would listen to anything he said after the mess he made of the Westminster finances?

golach
23-Sep-13, 23:16
The Labour Party are scared of Scottish Independence as if/when it happens Westminster will always be ruled by the Tory Party. That is why the discredited chancer of the exchequer Darling is fighting so hard on the no campaign. Who in their right mind would listen to anything he said after the mess he made of the Westminster finances?

Me for a start, look at the mess Eck is going to get us in, promising old age pensions before 65, wheres the money coming from?

sam09
23-Sep-13, 23:22
Me for a start, look at the mess Eck is going to get us in, promising old age pensions before 65, wheres the money coming from?
Golach of all people you are the last person that I would have taken as gutless. Afraid to stand on your own two feet and make your own decisions. That is all we (the yes voters) in Scotland are asking for. We can support ourselves, a fact which all political parties fully endorse. So come on wee hairy beasty, what are you afraid of?

equusdriving
24-Sep-13, 10:16
Golach of all people you are the last person that I would have taken as gutless.
I would take gutless over clueless every-time[evil]

golach
24-Sep-13, 10:20
I would take gutless over clueless every-time[evil]

Ditto..............

ducati
24-Sep-13, 10:36
Born in the UKa Born in the UKa. [lol]

weezer 316
24-Sep-13, 10:37
I cannot believe what this independence "debate" has become. Its the clueless vs the more clueless.

ducati
24-Sep-13, 10:40
I cannot believe what this independence "debate" has become. Its the clueless vs the more clueless.

Well you can't debate so you might as well take the P. Any better ideas?

sids
24-Sep-13, 12:03
"Running scared" is a great phrase!

weezer 316
24-Sep-13, 12:53
I utterly despair. We have become a nation of the most ignorant people imaginable. Not one person seems to actually have a clue what Scotlands or the UKs actual fiscal position is, yet the info is there. When pressed for details the SNP say there are too many unknowns, yet are happy to trumpet oil figures (based on unknown future oil prices) and how this would fund all sorts of services...services they ant give a detailed breakdown of because of unknowns

Meanwhile unionists are preparing for gunmen on hadrians wall singing swing low sweet chariot.

Its utterly cringeworthy. How the hell can an informed choice be made when nobody seems to actually care what the facts are?

embow
24-Sep-13, 13:07
Fact or fiction?;)http://www.heraldscotland.com/comment/letters/how-labour-really-views-the-fight-for-scots-independence.22231521

rob murray
24-Sep-13, 14:28
Golach of all people you are the last person that I would have taken as gutless. Afraid to stand on your own two feet and make your own decisions. That is all we (the yes voters) in Scotland are asking for. We can support ourselves, a fact which all political parties fully endorse. So come on wee hairy beasty, what are you afraid of?

I would imagine like thousands of people a compete lack of the details involved, Salmond expects us Scots to believe in the land of milk and honey put our faith and trust in him and his agenda, making up sound bite policy on the hoof, his own finance minister has publicly raised concerns over several of Salmonella's recent pledges that an independent Scotland will / can deliver. Salmon is a liability, personally I have a lot of time for Swinney who has proved a very competent "scottish chancellor" and if he has concerns...a lot of people should take notice. Blind faith in the fuhrer isnt the way to go !

Gronnuck
24-Sep-13, 16:22
As has already been said on one of the many debates on this subject we cannot be sure what state the county is going to be in two, three or ten years from now regardless of who's in power. I've seen enough to become the archetype cynic; I feel it isn't going to make a blind bit o' difference how the vote goes since most politicians are only interested in what they can earn for themsleves while holding their seat. Trough, snout and pigs come to mind.

squidge
24-Sep-13, 17:35
There is loads and loads of information available to those who wish to look. There were some key points made in the pensions paper and Golach, not one of those was to reduce the pension age to below 65. Rob says there is a complete lack of details but in this he is wrong - take this most recent paper - the detail is there. There are several key pieces of detail and here they are

1. Scotland spends less on Welfare and pensions as a share of GDP than the rest of the UK - In fact Scotland spends less than any other country in Europe except the Netherlands - again as a share of GDP. The UK spends 42% of its GDP on Welfare and pensions and Scotland spends 38%

2. Scotland's GDP is at 99% of the rest of the UK WITHOUT its share of the oil revenue being included.

3. In an Independent Scotland Pensions will continue to be paid as they are now. The Scottish Government commits to the triple lock system for pension increases for at least the whole of the first term of an Independent Scottish Government.

4. The paper commits Scotland to reexamining the pension age increases because Life expectancy is less in Scotland. This is where Golach is mistaken. There is no promise to reduce the State Pension Age to less than 65. What the paper says is that an Independent Commission will be established to look at whether the State Pension Age needs to increase to higher than 66 in Scotland.

There is a whole section on Private Pensions and Public Sector Pensions.

It seems to me that those who say Scotland cant afford to be Independent simply are ignoring the evidence and refusing to see the details. The Information is there - go look for it. If you cant find it then ASK. Not me lol - I dont know everything - go along to a YES wscotland meeting - email YES Scotland - they will reply. Email better together and ask them too and then see what you think. There is NO evidence that Scotland is anything other than a wealthy country and the suggestion that somehow in 5 years or 10 years the SNP or Alex Salmond will have run the economy into the ground when they have balanced the books for the last few years in a way that the UK has failed to do seems to me also to fly in the face of the evidence that there is when you look.

ducati
24-Sep-13, 17:42
Trouble is, that SNP and (tarred with the same brush) the nationalists have shot themselves in the feet so comprehensively that it doesn't matter what facts or fiction they come up with, I and many many others don't believe them. The damage to the credibility is done and won't be undone. And yes, you can say the same for the unionists but they aren't trying to persuade people to change.

tonkatojo
24-Sep-13, 17:43
"Running scared" is a great phrase!

Also a good song.

tonkatojo
24-Sep-13, 17:45
I utterly despair. We have become a nation of the most ignorant people imaginable. Not one person seems to actually have a clue what Scotlands or the UKs actual fiscal position is, yet the info is there. When pressed for details the SNP say there are too many unknowns, yet are happy to trumpet oil figures (based on unknown future oil prices) and how this would fund all sorts of services...services they ant give a detailed breakdown of because of unknowns

Meanwhile unionists are preparing for gunmen on hadrians wall singing swing low sweet chariot.

Its utterly cringeworthy. How the hell can an informed choice be made when nobody seems to actually care what the facts are?



Here's a fact, Hadrians wall is not the Scottish/English border.

squidge
24-Sep-13, 18:09
Trouble is, that SNP and (tarred with the same brush) the nationalists have shot themselves in the feet so comprehensively that it doesn't matter what facts or fiction they come up with, I and many many others don't believe them. The damage to the credibility is done and won't be undone. And yes, you can say the same for the unionists but they aren't trying to persuade people to change.

How have they shot themselves in the foot Ducati? You dont beleive them despite the evidence - And often this is not SCOTTISH Government evidence but UK Government evidence. How is what they are saying fiction? Where is the made up stuff Ducati? There may be conflicting evidence on particular issues but that isnt fiction. I choose to beleive that the MMR injection doesnt cause autism - others disagree. I have plenty of evidence that it doesnt and the others have evidence that it does. That doesnt make them liars, or make what they say fiction. It makes us disagree.

I asked recently why people think Scotland will be bankrupt - the only answers I was given were because I dont beleive the UK provided figures - something isnt right sort of thing and That Scotland is too stupid to manage its own budget.

There doesnt seem to be an attempt to say Scotland will be a land of milk and honey. The pension paper does not seek to hide the fact that there will be challenges, it discusses the things that need to happen and need to be addressed over the next 5, 10 years and beyond in order to meet these challenges just like any other INDEPENDENT NATION will have to do. Why do you think these decisions are better being made in Westminster rather than in Scotland by a Government elected and accountable to Scotland?

ducati
24-Sep-13, 18:15
How have they shot themselves in the foot Ducati? You dont beleive them despite the evidence - And often this is not SCOTTISH Government evidence but UK Government evidence. How is what they are saying fiction? Where is the made up stuff Ducati? There may be conflicting evidence on particular issues but that isnt fiction. I choose to beleive that the MMR injection doesnt cause autism - others disagree. I have plenty of evidence that it doesnt and the others have evidence that it does. That doesnt make them liars, or make what they say fiction. It makes us disagree.

I asked recently why people think Scotland will be bankrupt - the only answers I was given were because I dont beleive the UK provided figures - something isnt right sort of thing and That Scotland is too stupid to manage its own budget.

There doesnt seem to be an attempt to say Scotland will be a land of milk and honey. The pension paper does not seek to hide the fact that there will be challenges, it discusses the things that need to happen and need to be addressed over the next 5, 10 years and beyond in order to meet these challenges just like any other INDEPENDENT NATION will have to do. Why do you think these decisions are better being made in Westminster rather than in Scotland by a Government elected and accountable to Scotland?

Yawn. I thought it was rude on a forum to address individuals?

weezer 316
24-Sep-13, 18:36
How have they shot themselves in the foot Ducati? You dont beleive them despite the evidence - And often this is not SCOTTISH Government evidence but UK Government evidence. How is what they are saying fiction? Where is the made up stuff Ducati? There may be conflicting evidence on particular issues but that isnt fiction. I choose to beleive that the MMR injection doesnt cause autism - others disagree. I have plenty of evidence that it doesnt and the others have evidence that it does. That doesnt make them liars, or make what they say fiction. It makes us disagree.

I asked recently why people think Scotland will be bankrupt - the only answers I was given were because I dont beleive the UK provided figures - something isnt right sort of thing and That Scotland is too stupid to manage its own budget.

There doesnt seem to be an attempt to say Scotland will be a land of milk and honey. The pension paper does not seek to hide the fact that there will be challenges, it discusses the things that need to happen and need to be addressed over the next 5, 10 years and beyond in order to meet these challenges just like any other INDEPENDENT NATION will have to do. Why do you think these decisions are better being made in Westminster rather than in Scotland by a Government elected and accountable to Scotland?

Eh I did answer you before on the bankrupt question, you either didnt see it or ignored it. Here it is again: http://forum.caithness.org/showthread.php?211120-Nor-Scot&p=1048016#post1048016

squidge
24-Sep-13, 18:39
What does that mean? Is it a euphemism for "I dont have any answers to the questions you ask"? Surely not!

weezer 316
24-Sep-13, 18:49
What? The response I linked you to?

sam09
24-Sep-13, 19:08
What is missed here is: The S.N.P. will only be in power if the people of Scotland elect them after Independence. For once the people of Scotland will have a say in the government of Scotland.
What happens to the S.N.P. after the vote if/when its yes is still to be determined. Salmond I hope will vanish into oblivion.

sam09
24-Sep-13, 19:12
By the way, have none of the Labourites no comment to make?

squidge
24-Sep-13, 19:50
What? The response I linked you to? No Ducati's response. You are right Weezer i had forgotten you replied - I have been away and I read it late one night.

I have said several times that I think an Independent Scotland would be better with its own currency. However I do not beleive that using the pound puts us on a par with Greece. Scotland is a strong and varied economy - unlike Greece. Scotland will be a huge export market for the rest of the UK and it will be in the interests of the UK to ensure that the partnership works. I do not beleive that the Uk will make things difficult or try to damage the economies of either country. The eyes of the whole world will be looking to see how Britain makes the transition and both Scotland and the UK will want to be seen to be doing things Right.

weezer 316
24-Sep-13, 22:08
No Ducati's response. You are right Weezer i had forgotten you replied - I have been away and I read it late one night.

I have said several times that I think an Independent Scotland would be better with its own currency. However I do not beleive that using the pound puts us on a par with Greece. Scotland is a strong and varied economy - unlike Greece. Scotland will be a huge export market for the rest of the UK and it will be in the interests of the UK to ensure that the partnership works. I do not beleive that the Uk will make things difficult or try to damage the economies of either country. The eyes of the whole world will be looking to see how Britain makes the transition and both Scotland and the UK will want to be seen to be doing things Right.

No one saying the BoE would go out of its way to hurt and independent Scotland, are you? The point is england is much bigger than us, with an economy 10x our size. At present thats irrelevant in all spheres, but upon independence it will do what england needs. Now do you recognise what would happen you our economy of the BoE pumped a hundred of 200 billion into the economy in the event of a recession in england, whilst we needed an interest rate cut? It would be greece, no amount of diversification would solve it. Its the exact same issue in the EU, with germany and france demanding monetary prudence, when in reality the greeks needed a huge plump of dosh printed and needed to have their currency devalue itself, maybe by 25% or more? Thats whats caused the huge issues the in the past few years.

We would be best with out own currency. Given that wont happen, and your already complaining about decision in London not taking into account Scotland when they do, surely that scenario should scare you? or is it a case of heart over head?

ducati
25-Sep-13, 07:22
What does that mean? Is it a euphemism for "I dont have any answers to the questions you ask"? Surely not!

Questions and answers don't matter to me. As I said, we can't have a debate from entrenched positions. Apart from the ones I ask that no one answers.

Fly
25-Sep-13, 23:09
"If it ain't broke, don't fix it"
I don't believe any of the four countries can do without the other three, we have been a united kingdom for too long.

squidge
25-Sep-13, 23:23
What if we think it is broken though?

equusdriving
25-Sep-13, 23:26
What if we think it is broken though?
then you can exercise your right to vote for Independence, :confused

Rheghead
25-Sep-13, 23:44
What if we think it is broken though?

That's the thing, if you think it is broken then you've got to explain to us numpties in convincing terms why you think it is broken. But you haven't. In the face of so much conflicting evidence then reasonable persons will dump hopes and dreams for the devil you know. And when Johanne Lamont thinks that in an independent Scotland Alex Salmond will convince her that she'll be a size 10 and have George Clooney on her arm then you've got to suspect the credibility of the SNP et al.

squidge
25-Sep-13, 23:50
Dear god i have explained to you time and time again why I believe it isnt working. You dont agree because it is ok for YOU! By all means disagree Rheg but you cant say I havent explained why its not working time after time after time. Its not my fault you cant see further than your own comfy life.

Rheghead
26-Sep-13, 00:00
Dear god i have explained to you time and time again why I believe it isnt working. You dont agree because it is ok for YOU! By all means disagree Rheg but you cant say I havent explained why its not working time after time after time. Its not my fault you cant see further than your own comfy life.

No you haven't explained anything clearly. You still haven't explained why independence will result in more bread on the table. I believe we will be poorer. We will have more beaurocracy (sp) than the UK. That will need to be paid for. You and your ilk will send this country to the dogs.

Rheghead
26-Sep-13, 00:06
SNP admits company pensions will be in jeopody if Scotland goes independent due to strict EU rules. Yes, that means your pension if the admin HQ is in England.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/431658/SNP-admits-EU-role-in-resolving-pensions-puzzle

Thankfully, former Health MSP Nicola Sturgeon thinks that scotlands poorer life expectancy will bale out her monetary problems in relation to pensions by insisting better pensions would be “affordable” because Scottish life expectancy was lower! :eek:

squidge
26-Sep-13, 00:09
No you haven't explained anything clearly. You still haven't explained why independence will result in more bread on the table. I believe we will be poorer. We will have more beaurocracy (sp) than the UK. That will need to be paid for. You and your ilk will send this country to the dogs.And you and your ilk will sit happily by congratulating yourselves on a job well done whilst people kill themselves because we have a cruel and heartless welfare system, whilst people are consigned to the scrap heap cos the companies paid millions to get them back into work dont... They simply line the pockets of the shareholders; whilst queues at foodbanks get ever longer; whilst the sick, the carers, the mentally ill get poorer and poorer. But then who cares that there was a chance to change things which you didnt take, why does it matter if Scotland cowers from its opportunity to change lives and make different choices, why should we care after all you're all right Jack, and thats all the matters ....

squidge
26-Sep-13, 00:15
SNP admits company pensions will be in jeopody if Scotland goes independent due to strict EU rules. Yes, that means your pension if the admin HQ is in England.http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/431658/SNP-admits-EU-role-in-resolving-pensions-puzzleThankfully, former Health MSP Nicola Sturgeon thinks that scotlands poorer life expectancy will bale out her monetary problems in relation to pensions by insisting better pensions would be “affordable” because Scottish life expectancy was lower! :eek:Lol lol lol... Here is the link again, read it yourself and make your own mind up. http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Resource/0043/00434502.pdf

Rheghead
26-Sep-13, 00:15
And you and your ilk will sit happily by congratulating yourselves on a job well done whilst people kill themselves because we have a cruel and heartless welfare system, whilst people are consigned to the scrap heap cos the companies paid millions to get them back into work dont... They simply line the pockets of the shareholders; whilst queues at foodbanks get ever longer; whilst the sick, the carers, the mentally ill get poorer and poorer. But then who cares that there was a chance to change things which you didnt take, why does it matter if Scotland cowers from its opportunity to change lives and make different choices, why should we care after all you're all right Jack, and thats all the matters ....

It seems your beef is with rightwing capitalism rather than with the Union. Go on, jump ship if you want to, this Briton is not for jumping....

squidge
26-Sep-13, 00:25
Im not jumping ship Rheg, Im striding forward looking for something better for all of us even you, and our children. Im not running from the past, im looking Towards the future. Independence isnt about shirking responsibility - its about taking it. Its not a freedom FROM some imaginary shackles its a freedom TO do something different. Its a chance to be better than we are and for me thats a chance worth taking, worth striving for, worth voting for.

equusdriving
26-Sep-13, 00:27
And you and your ilk will sit happily by congratulating yourselves on a job well done whilst people kill themselves because we have a cruel and heartless welfare system, whilst people are consigned to the scrap heap cos the companies paid millions to get them back into work dont... They simply line the pockets of the shareholders; whilst queues at foodbanks get ever longer; whilst the sick, the carers, the mentally ill get poorer and poorer. But then who cares that there was a chance to change things which you didnt take, why does it matter if Scotland cowers from its opportunity to change lives and make different choices, why should we care after all you're all right Jack, and thats all the matters ....So even if your unfounded ridiculous fluffy and pink vision of an Independent Scotland was even remotely true, YOU and YOUR ILK will sit happily by congratulating yourselves on a job well done whilst British people (still) kill themselves because they (still)have a cruel and heartless welfare system, whilst people are (still)consigned to the scrap heap cos the companies paid millions to get them back into work dont, why should we care after all you're all right Jack, and thats all that matters, but heaven forbid anyone who is happy with their lot and wants to vote No[evil]

squidge
26-Sep-13, 00:40
So even if your unfounded ridiculous fluffy and pink vision of an Independent Scotland was even remotely true, YOU and YOUR ILK will sit happily by congratulating yourselves on a job well done whilst British people (still) kill themselves because they (still)have a cruel and heartless welfare system, whilst people are (still)consigned to the scrap heap cos the companies paid millions to get them back into work dont, why should we care after all you're all right Jack, and thats all that mattersAhhhhh equus a point worth responding to at last..... There is nothing pink and fluffy. It will be bloody hard work. It will require imagination, intelligence and bottle. It will be full of wrong turnings and dead ends and will need vision and commitment from the politicians and voters alike. There will be things we want to do but cant, it perhaps wont change in my lifetime, im 50. But my daughter is 4. I hope she will grow up in a country that is fairer better and greener than we have now. As for abandoning the rest of the UK to their fate well lets see, does scotlands votes make any difference to thr results of westminster elections? I have already shown on this forum that it doesnt. The only way to influence what happens in westminster is to show that there is a different way to do things. To let people see that there are alternatives to the system they have and the decisions they make. If we stay as part of the UK we truly abandon everyone to the things I describe. Scotland can show a different way, it cannot do that and nor is there the impetus to do that within the UK. We have no influence as things stand.

equusdriving
26-Sep-13, 00:59
it perhaps wont change in my lifetime, im 50. But my daughter is 4. I hope she will grow up in a country that is fairer better and greener than we have now.

well I am pleased for you. that you are happy to take such a massive gamble with your daughters future[disgust]
how about double or quits for her pension on what fly lands first:lol:
http://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/referendum-news/snp-reveals-pensions-proposals-but-report-criticised-for-glaring-gaps.22236272

squidge
26-Sep-13, 11:37
How about double or quits on the possibility there will be NO state pension for her when she reaches retirement age if we continue with the UK? Either way its a gamble Equus cos neither way offers guarantees .... I am prepared not only to take the chance and the opportunity that Independence offers but also to work strive and campaign to make the changes happen.... What are you prepared to do? What chances are you prepared to take? Oh thats right.... None... Just sit there cos better the devil you know eh? Thats fine but Thats not good enough for me Equus and its not good enough for my children either.

equusdriving
26-Sep-13, 11:57
Thats fine but Thats not good enough for me Equus and its not good enough for my children either. unfortunately for you, its also good enough for the majority of the people of Scotland:D

squidge
26-Sep-13, 13:18
Lol... We'll see.

weezer 316
26-Sep-13, 14:44
You seem t have sidestepped the point I made earlier squidge, here it is again, Care to answer?

######################################

No one saying the BoE would go out of its way to hurt and independent Scotland, are you? The point is england is much bigger than us, with an economy 10x our size. At present thats irrelevant in all spheres, but upon independence it will do what england needs. Now do you recognise what would happen you our economy of the BoE pumped a hundred of 200 billion into the economy in the event of a recession in england, whilst we needed an interest rate cut? It would be greece, no amount of diversification would solve it. Its the exact same issue in the EU, with germany and france demanding monetary prudence, when in reality the greeks needed a huge plump of dosh printed and needed to have their currency devalue itself, maybe by 25% or more? Thats whats caused the huge issues the in the past few years.

We would be best with out own currency. Given that wont happen, and your already complaining about decision in London not taking into account Scotland when they do, surely that scenario should scare you? or is it a case of heart over head?

squidge
27-Sep-13, 08:13
Sorry Weezer I did type out a response - no idea why its not posted. So here you go.

I have said before that I believe Scotland would be better using its own currency and that is one of the issues which will influence who gets my vote in 2016. However, whilst that is the case, there are a couple of points I think are worth making.

Firstly comparing Scotland to Greece is as little use as comparing Scotland to Nigeria and not just cos of the weather. Scotland has economic strength across several sectors even without oil. Greece does not. That is probably the key difference. So negotiations with Westminster within a type of monetary union would be from this position and not from a weak, narrow economic position. In addition an independent Scotland would be important to the rest of the UK in terms of imports and exports of goods and services to and from the rest of the UK. It would not be in the interests of the rest of the uk for Scotland to crash and burn.

There seems to be this concern that westminster would make things as difficult as possible during the negotiations. I dont believe that will be the case. The eyes of the whole world will be on Great Britain and, as we are often told Britain is proud of its reputation. That does not mean that I think Scotland will get whatever it asks for but more that I believe that Westminster will be fair in its negotiations because to be anything other than fair would damage the reputation of Westminster and that will not be allowed to happen.

Finally back to the point I made at the start. I believe Scotland needs its own currency to grow and develop its economy. There are however benefits to using the pound inthe short term. The scottish government has said

"The Scottish Government is clear that post-independence it will always be up to the people of Scotland, and their elected government, to decide what our currency should be. However, the present Government has the responsibility of negotiating what the best starting point would be for an independent Scotland."

And so here is the crux of the matter. If the pound ceases to be the best option then in an Independent Scotland we can change it when the time is right for Scotland.

So am I scared? No. It will be challenging for sure but I have confidence that Scotland has strength and wealth without oil and that contrary to what has been said recently, we do have the intellect within our parliament and our civil service to manage the budget and carry out the negotiations in a way that is best for Scotland.

PantsMAN
27-Sep-13, 14:13
Nice little item from the Census - two-thirds of us living in Scottish see ourselves as Scottish (NOT British).

Might make next September a little bit more interesting .

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-24282271

golach
27-Sep-13, 15:51
Nice little item from the Census - two-thirds of us living in Scottish see ourselves as Scottish (NOT British). Might make next September a little bit more interesting .
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-24282271

I consider myself Scottish, but I for one will not be voting yes, no time for the secessionists, Bring on the Union!!!!

PantsMAN
27-Sep-13, 16:42
I consider myself Scottish, but I for one will not be voting yes, no time for the secessionists, Bring on the Union!!!!

I assume therefore that you are one of the minority who consider themselves Scottish and British?

golach
27-Sep-13, 18:54
I assume therefore that you are one of the minority who consider themselves Scottish and British?

Where did I say that? Please do not try to speak for me. Bring on the Union!!!!

ducati
27-Sep-13, 19:38
I assume therefore that you are one of the minority who consider themselves Scottish and British?

A good proportion of the people who will be voting, won't consider themselves Scottish or British. So ethnicity is not an issue..presumably.

squidge
27-Sep-13, 20:19
Ducati is absolutely right to say ethnicity is not an issue. There is no suggestion that people who are voting for the union are somehow less Scottish. If that was the case then where would I fit. I dont consider myself Scottish at all. I am English, a northern lass from Lancashire and British too. I dont see any contradiction in Golach's statement that he is Scottish and supports the union just like there is no contradiction in being English and supporting Independence. Its about democracy not nationality.

PantsMAN
28-Sep-13, 00:10
Where did I say that? Please do not try to speak for me. Bring on the Union!!!!

Woah, keep the heid!

I stated that I made an assumption - I never said I was speaking for you.

Just like I made an observation about a report concerning the census and suddenly folk are getting exercised over nationality.

Jings we're getting awfy touchy...