View Full Version : The insipid and callow Independence debate
Why is that here, as a microcosm, and almost everywhere in the wider community, that the debate on Independence seems to be one of childish name calling and point scoring by BOTH sides ?
Most of the threads on Independence on here come to down that after a couple of posts (sometimes its even the intention of the opening one).
It's like listening to something from the playground, or like two football supporters arguing.
This is why politics turns off so many people, and gives the general impression that an important issue can't be discussed without lowering to insult trading. None are more masters at it than politicians themselves, but when the armchair politicians here try to emulate it, it's all rather embarrassing, unconstructive, and irrelevant.
Why is that here, as a microcosm, and almost everywhere in the wider community, that the debate on Independence seems to be one of childish name calling and point scoring by BOTH sides ?
Can you quote an example from the last thread that discussed Monarchy and an independent Scotland? I have read through it and found no childish name-calling.
It is no point saying it, prove it.
I have stopped. My advice is get out, stay away from the myriad of horrible mean minded sites and do your campaigning with REAL people. It's miles more fun, lots of fun and people are less likely to adopt the sneering insulting and patronising manner they use online
Can you quote an example from the last thread that discussed Monarchy and an independent Scotland? I have read through it and found no childish name-calling.
It is no point saying it, prove it.
"Fat Eck" Post no. 27
Would you like me to catalogue the examples from all the other threads ?
I have stopped. My advice is get out, stay away from the myriad of horrible mean minded sites and do your campaigning with REAL people. It's miles more fun, lots of fun and people are less likely to adopt the sneering insulting and patronising manner they use online
Oh! You are campaigning now are you Squidge? :lol:
"Fat Eck" Post no. 27
Would you like me to catalogue the examples from all the other threads ?
Ah right, I thought you meant between members of this forum.
To me Fat Eck is political banter/satirism, he is a politician afterall, such jibes shouldn't offend him too much.
What's it to you if he gets called Fat Eck?
it's all rather embarrassing, unconstructive, and irrelevant.
So? Why bother with this thread except to wind up the people you are referring to?:confused
"Fat Eck" Post no. 27
Would you like me to catalogue the examples from all the other threads ?
"Fat Eck" could be a term of affection as is "Fat Bob" , Oor Wullie's pal in the Sunday Post.
What's it to you if he gets called Fat Eck?
"Fat Eck" could be a term of affection as is "Fat Bob" , Oor Wullie's pal in the Sunday Post.
Exhibit A and B M'Lud.
So? Why bother with this thread except to wind up the people you are referring to?:confused
Exactly so [disgust]
Oh! You are campaigning now are you Squidge? :lol:No Ducati I have been quite ill since October and Im busy being Lady Randolph this weekend but have managed along to a couple of other people's things and its much more fun so that's my advice such as it is. When I start I'll let you know.... Although why you are interested I'm not sure lol
No one here will legitimately change their mind so I've just given up. I've grown tired of arguing with astroturfing sock puppets (trust me, I can tell) and dogmatic commentators. If anyone does make a point that deserves further investigation most of the people opposed to that point usually respond with insults, or facetious attempts at humour.
I've recently come to the conclusion that people haven't advanced, sure the technology has got better but most are still the same as medieval peasants just replacing the religion and witches with other things. People don't want compromise or enlightened debate. They want political attacks, to have their biases reinforced, they want fearmongering by the media and politicans, they want the blatant hypocrisy of the opinions they claim to hold.
I am often vexxed by the behaviour of people, you do your best to help them and they make you wonder why you even bother. Why do battle with ignorance when ignorance usually wins.
Why is that here, as a microcosm, and almost everywhere in the wider community, that the debate on Independence seems to be one of childish name calling and point scoring by BOTH sides ?
Most of the threads on Independence on here come to down that after a couple of posts (sometimes its even the intention of the opening one).
It's like listening to something from the playground, or like two football supporters arguing.
This is why politics turns off so many people, and gives the general impression that an important issue can't be discussed without lowering to insult trading. None are more masters at it than politicians themselves, but when the armchair politicians here try to emulate it, it's all rather embarrassing, unconstructive, and irrelevant.
Agree 100%.
secrets in symmetry
12-Dec-12, 00:39
Slickly, you overestimate the secessionists if you think you can reason objectively with them. The normal rules of civilised debate don't apply - you have to grit your teeth and post in terms they can reach out and grab with their own hands. It's a bit like having a conversation about the Renaissance with Helen on I'm a Celebrity....
M Swanson
12-Dec-12, 10:46
What does this mean, exactly Secrets? Especially when applied to a blatantly transparent wind-up merchant? :D
secrets in symmetry
12-Dec-12, 11:26
Go and read the drivel the arch-secessionists write. There are unjustified opinions presented as facts, they ignore economics (mostly because they don't know or understand it), they can't count, and their posts are full of anger, usually aimed at anyone who doesn't agree with their nonsense, and at the English. They like quoting what they see as authoritative tomes - which are usually as inward looking as they are. They are isolationist and inward looking, despite protesting to the contrary. We Scots are The people - we just need to be set free from the evil imperial English and we will rule our own back garden like Gods. :cool:
This cuddly Green fairy tale relies on the black gold known as oil.
Their fantasy lives in a bubble, unaffected by everyone (and everything) else in the world.There are no wars, no evil bankers, no economic crises, no scheming capitalists treading on the poor or the unemployed or the disabled. In fact we give all our spare cash to the unemployed and the disadvantaged with big smiles on our faces. There are no Scrooges, no benefit scroungers, and indeed no nasty people at all in a seceeded Scotland... It's really nice - you should try it. :cool:
I like how people are basically invoking the very thing the post is complaining about in their replies but at the same time saying they don't do it, that it's always the other side.
secrets in symmetry
12-Dec-12, 12:15
Do you know anyone that goes to a meeting, and at the end they perk up and say something that reveals they have not understood the events they have just witnessed?
If so, it may now have dawned on you what you just did. :cool:
M Swanson
12-Dec-12, 12:23
Go and read the drivel the arch-secessionists write. There are unjustified opinions presented as facts, they ignore economics (mostly because they don't know or understand it), they can't count, and their posts are full of anger, usually aimed at anyone who doesn't agree with their nonsense, and at the English. They like quoting what they see as authoritative tomes - which are usually as inward looking as they are. They are isolationist and inward looking, despite protesting to the contrary. We Scots are The people - we just need to be set free from the evil imperial English and we will rule our own back garden like Gods.
This cuddly Green fairy tale relies on the black gold known as oil.
Their fantasy lives in a bubble, unaffected by everyone (and everything) else in the world.There are no wars, no evil bankers, no economic crises, no scheming capitalists treading on the poor or the unemployed or the disabled. In fact we give all our spare cash to the unemployed and the disadvantaged with big smiles on our faces. There are no Scrooges, no benefit scroungers, and indeed no nasty people at all in a seceeded Scotland... It's really nice - you should try it.
LOL. I'm obliged for this life-changing post, Secrets.
From this day forward, I am resigning from the ranks of those pulling the wagon and joining the secessionist champions of the moochers, looters and thoroughly good Scotch eggs. I am saved.! :lol:
Besides which, 'though yours is a fact-based message, it is also probably one of the most humourous posts I've ever read on a Forum. :cool:
Once upon a time ............ ! :D
secrets in symmetry
12-Dec-12, 12:38
Welcome to the fluffy-pink fantasy, kind lady. :cool:
I forgot to add the good news that the North Sea will be teeming with cod and herring once more (there are no Spanish or Icelandic cod killers in this fantasy).
Fluctuations in oil prices and profits will be a thing of the past. We won't waste (or burn off) gas from our North Sea rigs - we will generate our own Green, Green Gas of Home.
Even science will be better in this paradise....
The wind will blow at its optimum uniform speed for 90% of the time (so the annoying v3 rule for power generation is irrevelant), all new wind turbines will be the silent "stealth" variety that you can't see without special goggles or hear without sensitive equipment, all ocean waves will be an ideal uniform height for wave-power generators, and the science minister (with his oh so relevant PhD in Scots language) will pass a law requiring the tides to stop taking extended tea breaks twice a day. Energy loss in high voltage power transmission will be outlawed in Scotland for the benefit of the People of Scotland. :cool:
If any of that fails, Eck will repeal (and reverse) the Second Law of Thermodynamics so that pumped storage systems with no natural water feed will generate more electricity than they consume. :cool:
Come join us - we are the people!
M Swanson
12-Dec-12, 12:55
LOL. LOL. LOL.
It just gets better all the time, Secrets. You're preaching to the converted here. Who could resist? :lol:
What does this mean, exactly Secrets? Especially when applied to a blatantly transparent wind-up merchant? :D
A blatantly transparent wind-up merchant like secrets in symmetry, you mean?
secrets in symmetry
12-Dec-12, 23:35
LOL. LOL. LOL.
It just gets better all the time, Secrets. You're preaching to the converted here. Who could resist? :lol:No-one can resist when I'm on a roll. RIF! :cool:
M Swanson
13-Dec-12, 08:46
No-one can resist when I'm on a roll. RIF! :cool:
:lol: Count me in! MTFBWY. :lol:
Do you know anyone that goes to a meeting, and at the end they perk up and say something that reveals they have not understood the events they have just witnessed?
If so, it may now have dawned on you what you just did. :cool:
Ah it's another Poe's Law (http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Poe's_Law) thing, they're getting harder and harder to spot. Basically when you can't tell the different between satire or humour and a real opinion because the people or group spouting the real opinion have been known to say stuff similar to the humourous and satirical in the past but being completely serious.
M Swanson
13-Dec-12, 10:44
A blatantly transparent wind-up merchant like secrets in symmetry, you mean?
Indeed not, OQ. I was not referring to the highly intelligent, articulate and comic genius, Secrets. One must look elsewhere to find the donkey to pin the tail to. SiS is innocent. ;)
A blatantly transparent wind-up merchant like secrets in symmetry, you mean?
Now who is indulging in personal attacks now?
Indeed not, OQ. I was not referring to the highly intelligent, articulate and comic genius, Secrets. One must look elsewhere to find the donkey to pin the tail to. SiS is innocent. ;)
Blimey! I didn't sus that sock puppet [lol]
M Swanson
13-Dec-12, 11:41
:lol: Oh! Puleeeeeeze! I should be so clever! Too silly! :lol:
secrets in symmetry
14-Dec-12, 01:07
Ah it's another Poe's Law (http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Poe's_Law) thing, they're getting harder and harder to spot. Basically when you can't tell the different between satire or humour and a real opinion because the people or group spouting the real opinion have been known to say stuff similar to the humourous and satirical in the past but being completely serious.You can flatter yourself as much as you like, but you have absolutely no idea how closely I can read your mind. :cool:
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